Several people killed by vehicle on New York City bike path

[alex8912]

4 hours ago, seahorse said:

What you don't seem to understand is that if Islam did not exist, this terrorist incident (and others) would not have taken place.

Don't forget your ignore function on TVF!!  Then posts by the most irrational won't be seen.  There was a note in this losers car and he was pledging allegiance to ISIS. They say he is a lone wolf but I don't see how someone in Tampa knows this bike path is probably the most popular one in the whole city ( the only one my friends and I have ever used) also right near the new tower where the twin towers were located. There was some help this guy had and I hope they find out who, even if mommy and daddy. They  need serious punishment. Obamas program let him into the USA in 2010 so he can become an uber driver and terrorist. I am anxiously awaiting his response  and apology to the citizens of New York City. Even though he was from Uzbekistan which is not currently on the list of banned countries but hopefully will be added we don't really know how many terrorist attacks HAVE been avoided by this ban. Probably a few. 

[Orton Rd]

36 minutes ago, jvs said:

It's not all Muslims

But it's all of Islam, the killers do not get their inspiration from the readers digest do they. Polls in the UK have found around 50% of Muslims would not turn anyone in that they knew was involved in Jihad

[brewsterbudgen]

2 minutes ago, RickBradford said:

I want it to tell the truth, openly and objectively, which is what it is paid to do to the tune of $4 billion per year. 

I agree.  "Islamic terrorism" is not objective, any more than saying "Christian terrorism" or "Jewish terrorism" would be.   The BBC is doing its job.

[RickBradford]

Well, if you don't think "Islamic terrorism" was behind this New York attack, or the attacks in Manchester, London, Munich, Paris, Brussels, Barcelona, Stockholm and Berlin, then there is really no more to say.

[alex8912]

3 minutes ago, brewsterbudgen said:

I agree.  "Islamic terrorism" is not objective, any more than saying "Christian terrorism" or "Jewish terrorism" would be.   The BBC is doing its job.

The BBC is not doing its job properly. Most British and world citizens know this. For nicer words they beat around the bush more than any news team on earth. 

[MaeJoMTB]

23 minutes ago, RickBradford said:

Imagine if this had been a white male mowing down ethnic minorities -- it would have been news fodder for months.

I'm gonna try it while shouting 'Seig Heil', I'm betting nobody will comment on it.

[Jingthing]

I don't see any big problem with calling Islamic terrorism Islamic terrorism. 

But that's not the same thing as saying all Muslim people are involved in that.

They aren't. 

[MaeJoMTB]

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I don't see any big problem with calling Islamic terrorism Islamic terrorism. 

But that's not the same thing as saying all Muslim people are involved in that.

They aren't. 

But doesn't 'everyone' blame all white folk for slavery? and all white folk for racism? and all white men for rape culture? and all white folk for Hitler?

Edited November 1, 2017 by MaeJoMTB

[transam]

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I don't see any big problem with calling Islamic terrorism Islamic terrorism. 

But that's not the same thing as saying all Muslim people are involved in that.

They aren't. 

Correct, but the naughty ones are the ones taking the book they follow to the letter...

[vogie]

It would be nice at these sombre times for some people to feel a little sympathy for the victims rather than telling us how wonderful Muslims are.

[ilostmypassword]

1 hour ago, Grouse said:

Well, I've just started to read the four pages of replies. I wonder how soon the apologists will be out with the usual refrain: "it's not all Muslims" ?

I hate those usual refrains. Especially when they're true. I guess you don't have a problem with some of the false ones like "they all hate us."

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, vogie said:

It would be nice at these sombre times for some people to feel a little sympathy for the victims rather than telling us how wonderful Muslims are.

Sympathy for the victims and five dollars will get you a latte at Starbucks.

Sorry, I don't find your post sincere.

It seems a cheap shot. 

Everyone that isn't a monster feels sympathy for the victims of terrorism or any other less politicized tragic event. 

[vogie]

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

Sympathy for the victims and five dollars will get you a latte at Starbucks.

Sorry, I don't find your post sincere.

It seems a cheap shot. 

Everyone that isn't a monster feels sympathy for the victims of terrorism or any other less politicized tragic event. 

I don't reminding how wonderful these people are, I just don't buy it! 

[alex8912]

2 minutes ago, vogie said:

It would be nice at these sombre times for some people to feel a little sympathy for the victims rather than telling us how wonderful Muslims are.

Agreed! At least 8 innocent perfect humans were killed and a dozen injured. You have the first post I read letting me wake up and think more seriously about how each and every relative, friend, co worker , lover of these innocent people enjoying the day have to suffer tonight and the rest of their lives.  All for such a cowardly act of violence based on extreme ideas. 

RIP. No one deserves this. 

[ilostmypassword]

6 minutes ago, vogie said:

It would be nice at these sombre times for some people to feel a little sympathy for the victims rather than telling us how wonderful Muslims are.

I read all the comments and I didn't read anything that corresponds to "telling us how wonderful Muslims are." One of us has a serious case of dyslexia. 

[sanemax]

18 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I don't see any big problem with calling Islamic terrorism Islamic terrorism. 

But that's not the same thing as saying all Muslim people are involved in that.

They aren't. 

Has anyone said that all Muslims are involved in terrorism ?

[nasanews]

This is has nothing to do with Islam as a religion, this is about an ideology called Wahhabism.

[impulse]

18 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Has anyone said that all Muslims are involved in terrorism ?

 

Perhaps not, but we often see TVF posters advocating shipping them all back home, keeping them all out, or even nuking them out of existence.  Maybe not on this thread, but you don't have to look too hard at the hundreds of previous threads. 

 

And if nobody took up the case for treating them as individuals, good and bad, there would be more.

 

[ilostmypassword]

4 hours ago, Dagnabbit said:

 

Cowardly liberal misdirection.

 

Nobody is demonizing all Muslims. 

 

 

Just 50% of them.

5 hours ago, ChiangMaiLightning2143 said:

I’d reckon it’s time to consider in America the preventive detention of Muslim males.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, KarenBravo said:

Why not skip that part and go straight to Kristalnacht?

Much too harsh

 

No need for extreme measures 

 

Just be slightly and increasingly less welcoming.

 

If you like, ban halal meat in prisons, schools and hospitals first.

 

Go from there 

 

I'm serious; Muslims have not integrated and don't fit in with western cultural norms.

[Grouse]

2 hours ago, TEFLKrabi said:

Maybe you could try living in a Muslim country and see if you change your stance. 

Why on earth would I want to do that? Muslims can do what they like in their homelands. In the west they should fully integrate or bugger off

[Baerboxer]

5 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Much too harsh

 

No need for extreme measures 

 

Just be slightly and increasingly less welcoming.

 

If you like, ban halal meat in prisons, schools and hospitals first.

 

Go from there 

 

I'm serious; Muslims have not integrated and don't fit in with western cultural norms.

 

A great many Muslims do try and integrate, without compromising their own religious beliefs. I know many that happily live in Western countries and contribute a great deal to their chosen society.

 

The difference is often from which county they or their parents / grandparents originate from and the cultural and social norms from those countries. 

 

There are big differences.

 

Any that won't integrate, show the tolerance and respect for their new host societies should be expelled. And I agree that pandering to "demands" to promote their culture and beliefs as a right forced on the host country is wrong.

[Baerboxer]

2 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Why on earth would I want to do that? Muslims can do what they like in their homelands. In the west they should fully integrate or bugger off

 

The problem, certainly in many European countries is that the opposite has happened. Politically correct politicians in power have pandered to their demands. Christmas, non halal food, might "offend" them so better ban them from schools etc etc.

Tolerance has been replaced by active promotion; and promotion above the host country traditions, cultures and values.

 

Now we reap the consequences. Tolerance and promotion have been viewed as weakness.

[brewsterbudgen]

29 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Much too harsh

 

No need for extreme measures 

 

Just be slightly and increasingly less welcoming.

 

If you like, ban halal meat in prisons, schools and hospitals first.

 

Go from there 

 

I'm serious; Muslims have not integrated and don't fit in with western cultural norms.

You're obviously not from the UK, where the vast majority of Muslims have fully integrated and there are many Muslim police officers, firemen, doctors/nurses, soldiers etc etc.

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, ilostmypassword said:

I hate those usual refrains. Especially when they're true. I guess you don't have a problem with some of the false ones like "they all hate us."

Who do?

[hawker9000]

9 hours ago, Jingthing said:

I don't think very many people here are going to defend terrorists, extremist Islamist, or any other flavor of terrorists. 

If you're suggesting it's OK to demonize all Muslim people because of Islamist terrorism, I don't see how that is fair or rational. 

Have there been any clues yet on the motivation of this recent event? 

Not reported here AT ALL as fully as it's being reported in the U.S. (and I expect you well know it).  Witnesses did actually hear the perpetrator yell "allah 'akbar!", and his name and immigration status have been released.  There is NO question, including by the mayor, of it being Muslim-inspired terror - except maybe by you.  The only question is whether there was any wider involvement (i.e., by Islamist actors elsewhere directing or conspiring with him) - so far no evidence of it that's been reported.  He was shot but taken to the hospital and is now in custody.

 

Muslims generally have a great deal to answer for WRT Islamist terrorism in the world today.  We all get a regular dose of "these are just a very few extremists", but these "very few extremists" in Muslim-dominated countries support intolerant, brutal regimes with ties to and sponsorship of many powerful terrorist groups around the world.  These terror groups - al Qaeda, Abu Sayyaf, Al-Shabaab, Boko Haram, Hamas, Hezbollah,,,, scores more -  simply could not exist and persist without strong support coming from some public somewhere.  One only has to follow elections in places like Egypt, Pakistan, Iran, etc., etc., etc. to observe this obvious and undeniable dynamic.  They only have to request immigration/"asylum", then get vetted by immigration authorities, then successfully immigrate, and are in the end but a webcast away from being radicalized, assuming they really weren't that way to begin with.  I'm not sure I see how pretending it doesn't exist is a "fair or rational" reaction to the threat.  It's instead just empty-headed denial of a stark reality.

 

Edited November 1, 2017 by hawker9000

[Grouse]

5 minutes ago, brewsterbudgen said:

You're obviously not from the UK, where the vast majority of Muslims have fully integrated and there are many Muslim police officers, firemen, doctors/nurses, soldiers etc etc.

I lived in Rotherham. Do talk to me about Muslims!!!! ?

 

Why should I have a nurse tend me in fancy dress?

 

Why should my kids have to eat halal food?

 

Why should my daughters risk Muslim taxi drivers

 

Why should I be disturbed by the call to prayers in my own land

 

Look, I tolerate all sorts and integrate reasonably well in Thailand. However, I don't feel entirely welcome thanks to government regulations and a lack of decent sherry!

 

 

[Caps]

2 hours ago, TEFLKrabi said:

Maybe you could try living in a Muslim country and see if you change your stance. 

Change the stance on what?   That women are oppressed...mind you some can drive from next year and whoope do they can now go in Stadiums to watch Sport...I must admit its mighty Islamic of them for letting them do that.  Or could it be that you will always be Kafar.  Or is it the fact that stoning/killing a woman for talking/looking to/at another man is acceptable.  Or maybe that women cant be educated in some areas because men/leaders wont allow it.  Or could it be the backward rules on freedom on things like been gay, drinking, going out on your own as a woman........Yes i can see the attraction!

Lived and worked in Iraq for years and nothing will change the way a Muslim thinks or acts and as a Kafar you will always be way down on the pecking order no matter how nice they are to your face.  The sooner people realise this the better things will be. 

[brewsterbudgen]

I lived in Rotherham. Do talk to me about Muslims!!!! [emoji3]
 
Why should I have a nurse tend me in fancy dress?
 
Why should my kids have to eat halal food?
 
Why should my daughters risk Muslim taxi drivers
 
Why should I be disturbed by the call to prayers in my own land
 
Look, I tolerate all sorts and integrate reasonably well in Thailand. However, I don't feel entirely welcome thanks to government regulations and a lack of decent sherry!
 
 

Because you live in a multi-cultural society and you're a tolerant person. Why not embrace multi-culturalism instead of fearing it? You wouldn't have been much good in the Empire.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Grouse]

5 minutes ago, brewsterbudgen said:

Because you live in a multi-cultural society and you're a tolerant person. Why not embrace multi-culturalism instead of fearing it? You wouldn't have been much good in the Empire.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

I'm NOT an islamophobe by the correct definition. I am not afraid of Muslims but I dislike them. I gave a list of 42 reasons why a long time ago.