4 minutes ago, 1duckyboy said:

Do anti-lock brakes leave "braking traces"?

He was recorded at 93km/h 5 mins before the accident (based on the vehicles GPS). It could well have hit at full force. 

These vehicles are supposed to be kept below 80 km/h - I bet this company is going to have all its GPS data collected from all vehicles to see who exceeds the speed limit. I see more fines coming this companys way. 

2 minutes ago, patyh said:

Perhaps it's time for the land transport department to require all public vehicles such as these vans or the new mini bus with come equipped with driver aids? At least some sort of system to help might have mitigate such accidents from happening? 

The driver "aid" could be proper training in the first instance followed by draconian penalties (you cause a death, you go to jail) for any infringment of road rules and responsible driving of a public service vehicle.

 

No amount of electro/mechanical devices will replace driver responsibilities.

One assumes that the companies licence to operate has been suspended until inspections and driving re-education is complied with ........That would hurt more

 

11 hours ago, NanLaew said:

Bring all your vans here for inspection now!

 

Imperious demands sure beats the hell out of getting off your criminally-culpable, government-salaried, lard-asses and DOING YOUR JOB by going to wherever this 'transport company' calls their head office, check the vehicles in-situ and see what sort of van maintenance facilities and driver verification and test procedures they have.

 

That 50k baht fine is really gonna hurt too.

"Bring all your vans here" gives ample time to bring the good ones first and execute some quickie repairs on the bad ones. After all, inspecting 84 busses could (should) take more than just a couple of days.

Such a sad story, 4 tourists and a local guide, needlessly snuffed out. Why weren't these vans inspected before? (yeah, I know already). And why weren't the drivers put through a safety course before, not after this calamity? (yeah, I know already).

22 minutes ago, DavisH said:

He was recorded at 93km/h 5 mins before the accident (based on the vehicles GPS). It could well have hit at full force. 

These vehicles are supposed to be kept below 80 km/h - I bet this company is going to have all its GPS data collected from all vehicles to see who exceeds the speed limit. I see more fines coming this companys way. 

You do?

 

I see 83 sets of GPS data mysteriously erased, unreadable or otherwise totally unavailable.

24 minutes ago, DavisH said:

He was recorded at 93km/h 5 mins before the accident (based on the vehicles GPS). It could well have hit at full force. 

These vehicles are supposed to be kept below 80 km/h - I bet this company is going to have all its GPS data collected from all vehicles to see who exceeds the speed limit. I see more fines coming this companys way. 

Anti-lock breaks definitely leave traces. Anti-lock does not mean "no lock up". It means non continuous lock up, ie on/off on/off on/off.

1 minute ago, Khun Paul said:

One assumes that the companies licence to operate has been suspended until inspections and driving re-education is complied with ........That would hurt more

 

Driver re-education could be a whack around the head with a piece of 4x2 plank of wood? That would hurt! Doubt if it would work though - stupid is as stupid does, despite all the best intentions in the world. 

I know they are not related but i use this to highlight a major problem here in Thailand:

 

Threatening people with machetes or guns = small fine and public apology.

Killing four tourists gets a maximum allowed 50,000 bht fine

 

BUT....

Newly enforced laws kaching, kaching! such as don't 'feed the fish' and 'don't smoke on the beach are threatening fines of up to 100,000bht and a year in jail...

 

Priorities are wrong in Thailand.... or is it just that human life is worth far far less than money making environmental protection??

 

If vehicles are involved in accidents then a new government body should check the crash vehicles (including boats!) and faulty or poorly maintained vehicles should see the owner/operator being HEAVILY fined.

Same for drivers - not fit to drive - lose your license and big fine.

We are going round in circles here 

nothing will change the drivers of most of the Mini buses companies are paid per trip 

so the more trips they do the more they get paid 

Hence  the speeding driving with undue care  

we will be reading about accidents  week in and out 

cant foresee any changes  in the near future

hmmm....thais clearly don’t value their own lives and other nationalities even less I suspect..... and the carnage continues

Lets be honest They are doing this by ordering the company to bring in all the mini vans from this company to show everybody they are serious about doing something about these mini vans If they are serious about these vans get the bloody drivers and train them properly to drive a van But they wont I was surprised the company got a 50,000 baht fine for killing 4 people 10,000 would of been more apropiate But i am sure the envelopes they will be handing over will have  more in them as gratitude

NEVER!  EVER!  Get into a passenger minivan in this country!

I did this once in Phuket from the hotel to the airport.

I told the moron to stop and explained to him that he should slow down before the corner, not during it when out of control!!!!

The driver found it very funny, which is not surprising due to the immaturity of the male population here.

I sat next to the prick and made him drive safe........but never again......

 

12 hours ago, tominbkk said:

No amount of maintenance will help if you are speeding and tailgating.

Or sleeping  (latest reports). 

1 minute ago, nickmondo said:

NEVER!  EVER!  Get into a passenger minivan in this country!

I did this once in Phuket from the hotel to the airport.

I told the moron to stop and explained to him that he should slow down before the corner, not during it when out of control!!!!

The driver found it very funny, which is not surprising due to the immaturity of the male population here.

I sat next to the prick and made him drive safe........but never again......

 

You were lucky.  

Most attempts I've seen to control the driver end up antagonizing them, and the driving gets worse.  Now you've got an incompetent + crazy + enraged human at the wheel who must now demonstrate that he can compensate for losing face in front of the other passengers.  

Speak up and take your chances.  

With non skid brakes what do you expect?

The details missing from the accident report are not available as they are firmly embedded

in the stupid Thai drivers brain (or what there is of it)

Transport Dept closing the stable door again after the horse is long gone.

Just what is wrong with the Thai mentality when they get behind the wheel??

What a joke. When you can be fin d 100,000 baht plus 1 year in prison for smoking on a beach in Phuket.

Car inspections - what a joke. I collect old Volkswagen vehicles.

In Banglamung near Regent school they insisted in adding the missing bench on a VW Bus T2. Showing them that you could not even get in/sit with another bench nor fix the bench onto the vehicle's floor they said that the van would not pass. 

On a Karmann Ghia inspection they insisted to open the bonnet to inspect the engine. When told that the engine is in the back they all laughed until I opened the trunk. Car did not pass (Banglamung near Regent that was) for illegal alteration of vehicle. 

Ever since I go to Morchit/Bangkok; the inspectors look at the cars and enjoy seeing a vintage vehicle once in a while. 

15 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

LTD Officials in cooperation with the Ayutthaya provincial transport office and Bang Pa-in police went to the scene of the accident in Bang Pa-in district to examine the scene as well as the ill-fated van.

 

LTD deputy director-general Kamon Buranapong said that the team did not find any braking traces at the scene, indicating that the driver did not apply the brake when the vehicle slammed into the 10-wheel truck.

Ill-fated? . . . I think the word is WRECKED. But, more worryingly, these van drivers that often seem to be a law unto themselves, need to be looked at by the LTD, with a view to testing and improving the driving standard across the board.

9 minutes ago, Ossy said:

Ill-fated? . . . I think the word is WRECKED. But, more worryingly, these van drivers that often seem to be a law unto themselves, need to be looked at by the LTD, with a view to testing and improving the driving standard across the board.

Agreed, but is not going to happen as long as your butt and mine points to the ground, unfortunately.

 

Governments have had many years to improve the system (apart from their regular "talkfests" about it) but do absolutely nothing. Bereft of ideas, bereft of action but full of incompetence. 

14 hours ago, robblok said:

Have you owned a car in Thailand, if so you know that all inspection is done at the goverment office. Why change procedure and why even try to inspect there if its not even sure if they have the facilities there (they probably let someone else do the maintenance).

 

I

You must be joking, the maintenance checks here are laughable.

I own 1989 and 2006 cars, The only check I've seen performed is on a dynanometer for braking.

I've never seen anyone check steering or shock absorbers. I've never seen anyone take  a wheel off to see if the brake cylinders are weeping. I doubt they even check the tyres for tread depth. 200 baht, and off I go.

I'm a bit fanatical about maintenance, so my vehicles are roadworthy. However, if I relied on the annual check alone, they would become deathtraps - as many vehicles on Thai roads are.

It's not much different in terms of driver training. Based on my experience watching my GF get her car licence, the driving instructor should have been returned to planting rice. It took me several months to convince her car mirrors are for more than brushing her hair.

 

A good job they didn't smoke on a beach, 1 years jail and 100,000 baht fine, but kill people no only 50k and no jail time....what is wrong with the law here? 

12 hours ago, wakeupplease said:

A ten minute MOT test done by those who do not know the back or front end of a vehicle from what I saw on my last visit to an office.

 

You will not stop this carnage until you get the police out on the roads policing traffic, not a chance in hell things will change until they do the job, its been proved in other countries, look at the UK and its death rate on the roads then ask why its so high here.

10 minutes!!!!! When I took my bike to the test station I noticed that only the indicators, wipers and lights were being checked on cars.... I asked a Thai lady waiting for her test...." why they weren't using the rollers to check the brakes? "....she said "look at the length of the queue....that is why" 

I rolled my eyes......she said.   "exactly....and that's why we have so many accidents "

Edited November 11, 20178 yr by DD13
Missed word

5 hours ago, AJBangkok said:

Kill 4 people and get fined 50k, smoke on a beach and get fined 100,000.

 

Makes sense.

That 50k apparently is the maximum allowed according to the article!

8 hours ago, NanLaew said:

 

If these DLT guys just sit in their offices signing and filing paperwork and doing bugger all about actually checking for compliance and enforcing the few rules and regulations regarding public transportation, then I reckon they are very much responsible for the abuses by individuals and companies that set themselves up as providers of public transport. Thus they have a direct responsibility for deaths and injuries that are enabled by their lack of diligence and inability to do their job properly.

 

If you consider slapping a 50k baht fine on the company, pulling the drivers license and asking for a convoy of minivans to come to the office for 'inspection' is the proper course of action, that's fine. What you see as 'another 100% positive report' is just another knee-jerk opportunity to grandstand and appear to be doing something positive.

 

In this latest, lower body-count accident, with no reported evidence of braking, the inference is that this driver too fell asleep at the wheel.

 

"If these DLT guys just sit in their offices signing and filing paperwork and doing bugger all about actually checking for compliance and enforcing the few rules and regulations regarding public transportation, then I reckon they are very much responsible for the abuses by individuals and companies that set themselves up as providers of public transport."

If that was anything other than uninformed conjecture you may have a point, but it wasn't, so you do not.  And LTD officials do not have any responsibility for the deaths in this case.  None.

 

"If you consider slapping a 50k baht fine on the company, pulling the drivers license and asking for a convoy of minivans to come to the office for 'inspection' is the proper course of action, that's fine".

I'm so grateful that you condescend to concede that my having an opinion would be "fine" in your eyes.  But, that is not necessarily my opinion, I made no comment about that at all. 

 

"What you see as 'another 100% positive report' is just another knee-jerk opportunity to grandstand and appear to be doing something positive".

i.e. a 100% positive report.

 

"In this latest, lower body-count accident, with no reported evidence of braking, the inference is that this driver too fell asleep at the wheel".

It is not an inference, the driver has admitted that he fell asleep.  LTD officials are off the hook (your hook) again.

Edited November 11, 20178 yr by Just Weird

4 hours ago, lvr181 said:

"Whatever Thai authorities do there is always someone here who will go out of their way to denigrate another 100% positive report, isn't there?"  (my italics).

 

While it is indeed welcome that the LTD are investigating this crash vis-a-vis maintenance, it would seem most likely that, as in any many other crashes, that driver behaviour is likely to be the most important factor.

 

This is about priorities and is NOT 'denigration', by other TV posters. In a country of very little personal accountability and responsibility there always seems to be the wish to shift 'blame' elsewhere.

 

'...driver behaviour is likely to be the most important factor."

The driver has admitted that he fell asleep, that is a known factor, it has been reported and it is not just "likely".  By doing that he was taking responsibility, making himself accountable and definitely was not shifting blame anywhere else.

 

"This is about priorities and is NOT 'denigration', by other TV posters".

It was abut denigration because that is what it was.  The other poster to whom I was responding, whoever he was, can't remember his name, was not making any case about priorities.

The slaughter on Thailand’s roads now one of the highest in the world shows a country indifferent to its tourists and its citizens. They could do so much more. 

8 hours ago, ChrisY1 said:

The LTD, like most other government departments, don't know what they're doing!

They refuse to address the main problems with these drivers....They don't seem to understand the basic issues with these drivers....

The van company, of course, is culpable. The drivers are often suicidal maniacs and need extreme education and training....but repeatedly, the LTD can't see!

Exactly.     Until drivers understand what 'Reaction times" means they will go through life (and its rapid end) by thinking they can travel at 100kmh, and react and stop safely in 10 metres.

 

Impossible!

1 hour ago, DD13 said:

10 minutes!!!!! When I took my bike to the test station I noticed that only the indicators, wipers and lights were being checked on cars.... I asked a Thai lady waiting for her test...." why they weren't using the rollers to check the brakes? "....she said "look at the length of the queue....that is why" 

I rolled my eyes......she said.   "exactly....and that's why we have so many accidents "

I guess they were lucky they even did that judging by the number of cars and bikes driving around with no lights on or no indication  when turning they must not check to hard Or is that plain stupidity from Thais who dont know how to drive properly

3 hours ago, biggles45 said:

A good job they didn't smoke on a beach, 1 years jail and 100,000 baht fine, but kill people no only 50k and no jail time....what is wrong with the law here? 

What is wrong? . . . I could answer you, but not without being booted off TV for obscene, offensive and forking terrible language. Who writes the bloody laws? . . . how's that for a clue. It's the shout-first-think-later tribe . . . that's what's wrong with the law, like nearly everything else.

Edited November 11, 20178 yr by metisdead
Please do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes or wording.