Cambidia Visa Run Warning - Corruption

[The Big Kangaroo]

Typical Thailand.  The Cambodia border run which 99% of runs from Pattaya do is a thing to see to believe.  The people you will see in "plain clothes" running around directing you to certain places are NOT with immigration and the entire place is a co-ordinated Corruption Center. You are told you need a TM-6 form (departure Card) and when I said I have one, I was told it needs to be stamper by immigration and you can get that done for 100 baht.  This is despite the sign saying TM-^ can be obtained for free.  I was told that this only applies to people coming into Thailand.  This is only 1 example of the net of integrated corruption.  I paid the 100 baht as a test and asked at the window why I need to pay 100 baht when a sign says it is free.  No comment from him but he waves the "big knob" in full uniform.  When I ask him the question, he stares at me and sarcastically say, "I dont know...I will ask".  He walks over the where all of the "civilian" people are and talks to them all.  They all start staring at me and laughing including him as a means to intimidate me...it did not work.  He returns and again is a sarcastic way gives me my money back and says "they make a mistake".  One of the civilian's had a wad of 1000 Baht notes so there is serious corruption happening here and it is obvious the Visa Run organizations are all a part of it as are their bus drivers.  When you ask where duty free is you are shuffled 15 meters to a crappy shed and given a book which lists all the alcohol and cigarettes but of course there are no prices.  In short, you place an order, they send someone to the border who gets your order and they rip you off huge amounts.  All of the drivers get "significant" amount of cigarettes which I suspect they sell back in Pattaya tax free.  I have had the pleasure of this journey 3 times and it pisses me off so much I am going to ride my motor bike there next time and do it all myself.  The blatant corruption (shock .. horror..not) and attitude of these people are disgusting.  Anyway, be warned and dont subscribe to this corruption

[scubascuba3]

Must be you. I did one yesterday no problem at all nor on previous border runs. Not having a departure card is a schoolboy error anyway.

 

Also i would avoid creating waves they could deny entry back in, most people tread carefully, i even had 20,000 baht on me, did you?

 

Also,the bus drivers and plain clothes staff are well organised, behind the scenes filling in all the visa and cards, directing people to the right queue, speeds the process up

[oldhippy]

By doing the formalities yourself, you will save the facilitation money that is charged by those civilians.

Next the Khmer immigration will rip you off for more.....

You can't win, easiest is to let yourself be ripped off by the Thais, rather than walking to the other side and be ripped off by the Khmers.

Oh, and immediately check your passport, I was once handed back the passport of somebody else, fortunately I checked -  big panick.... - but "the civilians" fortunately found the other guy.

This is Asia.

 

 

 

 

[KiChakayan]

I don't understand how people resorting to visa runs, to stay in Thailand for whatever reasons, can complain when they are being (a little) taken advantage of? 

 

What can you expect if you put yourself in a "semi-legal" situation. Just get yourself a proper visa matching your needs and situation. You might still have to handle immigration queues, but can get away with paying only the official fees.

 

See, it is like drugs, there wouldn't be any pushers if there weren't any consumers, dodgy stayers will give ideas to dodgy visa operators.

[faraday]

Well, don't do Visa runs,  & do as the above poster suggests.

Then you won't have to bore people with being charged 100 baht.

[oldhippy]

10 minutes ago, KiChakayan said:

I don't understand how people resorting to visa runs, to stay in Thailand for whatever reasons, can complain when they are being (a little) taken advantage of? 

 

What can you expect if you put yourself in a "semi-legal" situation. Just get yourself a proper visa matching your needs and situation. You might still have to handle immigration queues, but can get away with paying only the official fees.

 

See, it is like drugs, there wouldn't be any pushers if there weren't any consumers, dodgy stayers will give ideas to dodgy visa operators.

I have a "non immigration O" year visa, obtained in my home country, at a price of 150 euros.

Every 3 months I have to do a "visa run".

Every 3 months I am confronted with Thai / Khmer corruption at the border.

I do think I have a reason to complain.

Maybe YOU should get your facts straight, before whining about complainers.

 

Edited December 1, 2017 by oldhippy
spelling

[JackThompson]

2 hours ago, The Big Kangaroo said:

You are told you need a TM-6 form (departure Card) and when I said I have one, I was told it needs to be stamper by immigration and you can get that done for 100 baht.

True at Ban Laem.  I offered the guy 20-Baht (generous, since it is free), and he refused, so I pestered Immigration for a free one.  They will give you one if you ask.  Ignore ALL Touts.

 

The Cambodian side is where the major corruption is - for your rip-off VOA.  Again, ignore the touts, go to the VOA office, and negotiate directly using USD for the "real" price ($30).

 

2 hours ago, The Big Kangaroo said:

I have had the pleasure of this journey 3 times and it pisses me off so much I am going to ride my motor bike there next time and do it all myself. 

The visa-run services usually (should) handle all this garbage as part of their fee (you pay them the extra money, instead of the touts).  But, yes, doing it yourself is the best option, in my view.

[scubascuba3]

The visa-run services usually (should) handle all this garbage as part of their fee (you pay them the extra money, instead of the touts).  But, yes, doing it yourself is the best option, in my view.

I paid 2300 baht to a visa run company, 30$ for visa (around 1750 baht) that leaves 550 for the 6-7 hour journey incl light Thai lunch, i think that's a good price. Would be interesting to know how much they charge in baht for the visa at the border if you went yourself

[JackThompson]

55 minutes ago, KiChakayan said:

I don't understand how people resorting to visa runs, to stay in Thailand for whatever reasons, can complain when they are being (a little) taken advantage of? 

 

What can you expect if you put yourself in a "semi-legal" situation. Just get yourself a proper visa matching your needs and situation. You might still have to handle immigration queues, but can get away with paying only the official fees.

 

See, it is like drugs, there wouldn't be any pushers if there weren't any consumers, dodgy stayers will give ideas to dodgy visa operators.

This behavior is not limited to those doing "visa runs."  The "green" first-timers / short-term Tourists get hammered worst of all.  "Dodgy stayers" has nothing to do with this issue at all.

 

Those who enter and return using legal means are not doing anything "semi-legal".  One may receive 2x visa-runs for visa-exempt by land per calendar year per a ministerial order from Thai Immigration.  Multi-Entry Visas are also legal, as are Visas obtained at a consulate.  Longer-stayers who follow the laws to stay here using Visa-Exempts and/or Visas (Tourist, Multi, etc) are one class of foreigners in Thailand who do not have a "corrupt" option. 

 

The "Dodgy Stayers" are the ones using Thai Visa Agents (working with 'official' counterparts) to get extensions for which they do not qualify, and those who are driven to use Agents by roadblocks put up by their local immigration office, even when they do qualify.  Got an out-of-area landlord?  You're out of luck for an extension, unless you pay an agent.  Want a conversion?  We have some new made-up rules to stop you, unless you use an agent. 

 

This blatant corruption is right out in the open, and nothing is done.  Reality shines a different light on why some IOs don't like the 100% legal options, if you think about it and follow the money.  The "drug dealers" in your analogy, are the Agents and their 'official' buddies.

Edited December 1, 2017 by JackThompson

[JackThompson]

2 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Not having a departure card is a schoolboy error anyway.

Where would one get one?  You have to ask the IOs, who may send you from one window to the next, then finally hand you one.  They seem to want you to buy the 100-baht ones from the touts, for some strange reason.  I can't imagine why.

 

6 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

I paid 2300 baht to a visa run company, 30$ for visa (around 1750 baht) that leaves 550 for the 6-7 hour journey incl light Thai lunch, i think that's a good price. Would be interesting to know how much they charge in baht for the visa at the border if you went yourself

$30 USD + 300 Baht "same day return fee" = ~1300 Baht for the Visa if returning same-day.  Travel-cost varies by origin and destination. 

From Bangkok, most of the way (to Chanthaburi) could be in a more-comfortable bus, vs a van - which would be more of an incentive to me than the baht.  If your van has a few captain's chairs in it (an option from one Pattaya service), that's a good deal.  But if a typical mini-van, not so much.

[scubascuba3]

$30 USD + 300 Baht "same day return fee" = ~1300 Baht for the Visa if returning same-day.  Travel-cost varies by origin and destination. 

From Bangkok, most of the way (to Chanthaburi) could be in a more-comfortable bus, vs a van - which would be more of an incentive to me than the baht.  If your van has a few captain's chairs in it (an option from one Pattaya service), that's a good deal.  But if a typical mini-van, not so much.

Your exchange rate looks very high for $30 / 1300 baht.

As for where you get the departure card, you get one on arrival? Staple it in the passport

[stud858]

1 hour ago, oldhippy said:

I have a "non immigration O" year visa, obtained in my home country, at a price of 150 euros.

Every 3 months I have to do a "visa run".

Every 3 months I am confronted with Thai / Khmer corruption at the border.

I do think I have a reason to complain.

Maybe YOU should get your facts straight, before whining about complainers.

 

Can you please say why you were able to obtain a non O 1 yr 3mth at a time visa. I used to be able to get the same but then thought it was replaced by METV visa.

[JackThompson]

4 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Your exchange rate looks very high for $30 / 1300 baht.

Just under 1000 Baht for the VOA.  Then 300 Baht "extra fee" for "same day return".  If not doing a same-day-return, 100 Baht "extra fee" for not having to haggle (even longer) and wait a long time.

 

Quote

As for where you get the departure card, you get one on arrival? Staple it in the passport

No - this is when returning to Thailand and getting a new TM-6 form.  There is a scam at Ban Laem to sell the empty forms for 100 Baht.

Edited December 1, 2017 by JackThompson

[scubascuba3]

No - this is when returning to Thailand and getting a new TM-6 form.  There is a scam at Ban Laem to sell the empty forms for 100 Baht.

Ok i don't understand the $30, how does that equate to 1000 or 1300 baht. $30 is around 1750 baht, or are you saying it isn't $30?

[JackThompson]

4 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

8 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

No - this is when returning to Thailand and getting a new TM-6 form.  There is a scam at Ban Laem to sell the empty forms for 100 Baht.

Ok i don't understand the $30, how does that equate to 1000 or 1300 baht. $30 is around 1750 baht, or are you saying it isn't $30?

$30 x ~32.5 exchange-rate = 975 Baht.  That's the actual cost for a VOA for Cambodia.

Edited December 1, 2017 by JackThompson

[gk10002000]

1 hour ago, oldhippy said:

I have a "non immigration O" year visa, obtained in my home country, at a price of 150 euros.

Every 3 months I have to do a "visa run".

Every 3 months I am confronted with Thai / Khmer corruption at the border.

I do think I have a reason to complain.

Maybe YOU should get your facts straight, before whining about complainers.

 

Maybe I missed something.  If I had the non immigration O with retirement extension reason (over 50 years of age), does one really have to do a visa run every 90 days?  I thought one just had to go to immigration every 90 days to file the report or do it online? 

[scubascuba3]

$30 x ~32.5 exchange-rate = 975 Baht.  That's the actual cost for a VOA for Cambodia.

Yep i was being thick there, I'll get my coat

[JackThompson]

3 minutes ago, gk10002000 said:

Maybe I missed something.  If I had the non immigration O with retirement extension reason (over 50 years of age), does one really have to do a visa run every 90 days?  I thought one just had to go to immigration every 90 days to file the report or do it online? 

It sounds like you have a 1-year "Extension of Stay" - issued based on retirement, from your local immigration office - so you are correct - no need for runs.

 

The 90-day run, referred to earlier in this thread, is for someone on a 1-year Multiple-Entry "Visa" obtained by reason of marriage to a Thai from a Thai Consulate.

[ubonjoe]

7 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

$30 is around 1750 baht,

Using today's selling rate of 32.95 to the USD it is 988.5 baht to get $30.

 

[oldhippy]

44 minutes ago, stud858 said:

Can you please say why you were able to obtain a non O 1 yr 3mth at a time visa. I used to be able to get the same but then thought it was replaced by METV visa.

1/ I always obtain these visas in my home country

2/ the basis for "O" (= other) for me was first marriage, now retirement

There is a financial requirement though:

For retired, same as in Thailand: 1500 euro income or 20 000 euro in european bank.

For married, I am not sre, but the amount is less.

PS This visa can be stretched to 15 months, or even 17 months if married

 

 

[JackThompson]

42 minutes ago, oldhippy said:

1/ I always obtain these visas in my home country

2/ the basis for "O" (= other) for me was first marriage, now retirement

There is a financial requirement though:

For retired, same as in Thailand: 1500 euro income or 20 000 euro in european bank.

For married, I am not sre, but the amount is less.

PS This visa can be stretched to 15 months, or even 17 months if married

When based on marriage to a Thai, a Non-O Visa from a Thai consulate rarely has a financial requirement.  Exceptions include Malaysia, where showing 40K/mo income OR 400K Baht in the bank is needed.  Financials are not required for this visa in Vietnam, Laos, and most other countries.  Some locations offer the 1-Year Multiple-Entry version - which grants 90-day permissions-of-stay on each entry - and others only offer the Single-Entry version.

 

A Non-O Visa based on retirement is another story - usually the same 65K/mo OR 800K in the bank, or a combination of the two which adds up to 800K / year.  But there are 2 types of Non-O Visa (retirement) options - Non-O and Non-OA - covered in other discussion-threads.

Edited December 1, 2017 by JackThompson

[stud858]

I thought retirement and marriage visas did not require visa runs. Can anyone elaborate? The only thing I can imagine is that the non o option can be used for reason of ret./marriage but most go for the fully processed visa where no border runs are necessary.

[baansgr]

Years ago i hsd a new passport. The cambos threatned me with a 'bad' stamp if i didnt pay 300....with 48 clean pages i didnt csre. Lo and behold they stamped my pp right in the middle of page 2. Yrs, corrupt. 

[ubonjoe]

9 minutes ago, stud858 said:

I thought retirement and marriage visas did not require visa runs.

I think you are calling a one year extension of stay issued by immigration a visa which they are not.

A multiple entry non-o visa issued by an embassy or consulate only allows a 90 day entry

[sarayoot]

I did a visa run trip in Ban Laem / Duang (drive car myself) in July 2017.

In Thailand no problem. I pay a cambodia man 250 Bahts because I transfer my old to my new passeport. 

Then I ask for a Cambodia visa, "official agent immigration" ask me 1500 Bahts and I told him I pay in USD so 30 USD and have no bahts, and no Credit Card. Finally I agree to pay 30 USD and 200 bahts a tip for him....

and when I have to come back in Thailand, "official agent immigration" say I have to stay one night in Cambodia or pay 500 THB ....

All my expense

30 USD visa and 950 THB ...

Cambodia !!!

[KiChakayan]

1 hour ago, stud858 said:

I thought retirement and marriage visas did not require visa runs. Can anyone elaborate? The only thing I can imagine is that the non o option can be used for reason of ret./marriage but most go for the fully processed visa where no border runs are necessary.

They do not. The poster who created this confusion, is one of those who stretch the system, or smooth out some requirements, if you prefer. Typically the population I was referring to in my previous post. Interestingly he suggested I should get my facts straight, while demonstrating they were, indeed.

[oldhippy]

40 minutes ago, KiChakayan said:

They do not. The poster who created this confusion, is one of those who stretch the system, or smooth out some requirements, if you prefer. Typically the population I was referring to in my previous post. Interestingly he suggested I should get my facts straight, while demonstrating they were, indeed.

Talking about me?

I ask you again: Where is the stretching in getting a visa from the Thai embassy in my home country?

And how did I create confusion? I described my situation: 1 year non imm O visa, leaving the country every 3 months?

I find your post insulting.

Get your facts straight before you post.

[oldhippy]

48 minutes ago, KiChakayan said:

They do not. The poster who created this confusion, is one of those who stretch the system, or smooth out some requirements, if you prefer. Typically the population I was referring to in my previous post. Interestingly he suggested I should get my facts straight, while demonstrating they were, indeed.

QUOTE: They do not. (they = retirement & marriage based visas)

 

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

YES THEY DO!

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Retirement and mariage EXTENSIONS, obtained WITHIN Thailand, do not require border runs.

 

Retirement and mariage based VISAS (O visas), obtained OUTSIDE Thailand, do require border runs.

 

I hope this helps you to get the facts straight. The cheeck to argue on a visa thread without understanding the difference between those 2 !!!!

 

 

 

)

 

[KiChakayan]

20 minutes ago, oldhippy said:

Talking about me?

I ask you again: Where is the stretching in getting a visa from the Thai embassy in my home country?

And how did I create confusion? I described my situation: 1 year non imm O visa, leaving the country every 3 months?

I find your post insulting.

Get your facts straight before you post.

The facts are that you don't have to do these visa runs. You get your Non O and then you do your extensions of stay. Technically you need only one non O, or non O/A, to  initiate your stay, subsequently, if you leave thailand, you need re-entry permits to keep your extension alive. Indeed, in some cases duration of absence and timing of subsequent extension may force you to refresh with a new Non O. Any other facts you would like to have sir?

Edited December 1, 2017 by KiChakayan

[pieeyed]

We went thru Aranprathet border crossing on our way to Siem Reap the first week of last October. After clearing the Thai Imm we were walking along on our way to the Cambodia Imm. Some street bum grabbed my 6 year old son by his shoulder. I was carrying the usual overload of luggage. I stopped and told the guy to let go of my son. Our son is thai and he was scared shitless. My wife was right behind our son and I thought the bum was going to end up beaten to death by the curb. Only good thing that came from the experience was my son stayed very close to me after that. There are alot of touts, but usually take no for a answer. Worse thing you can do is stop or even pretend like you need their help as they will descend on you like a pack of vultures.