Putin Urged to Deploy Nuclear Weapons to Expedite War and Sever NATO Supply Routes

[craigt3365]

14 hours ago, khunken said:

Wrong again. Quite a few countries agreed with the UN sanctions but a number of them certainly aren't happy with the way both sides are refusing to talk without preconditions. So, no, the blame doesn't only rest with NK.

As I suspected you're so hung up with US support that you can't admit that it was partially to blame in the root cause of the crisis. Arrogance personified.

Quite a few?  How about close to 50.  Who certainly aren't happy with the way NK is becoming a nuclear nation.  Along with a bunch of other stuff they are doing.

 

Human rights violations, manufacturing illegal/fake drugs...and selling them via their embassies, hacking financial institutions, etc, etc, etc.

 

Arrogance?  I think more like calling them out.  It's well known you are anti-US.

[stevenl]

46 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Quite a few?  How about close to 50.  Who certainly aren't happy with the way NK is becoming a nuclear nation.  Along with a bunch of other stuff they are doing.

 

Human rights violations, manufacturing illegal/fake drugs...and selling them via their embassies, hacking financial institutions, etc, etc, etc.

 

Arrogance?  I think more like calling them out.  It's well known you are anti-US.

"It's well known you are anti-US."

 

Very fitting in a thread like this, provocations from the US.

[craigt3365]

1 minute ago, stevenl said:

"It's well known you are anti-US."

 

Very fitting in a thread like this, provocations from the US.

Provocation from the US?  Seriously?  Asking NK to stop firing off missiles over it's neighbors?  Wow...yes, horrible thing Tillerson is requesting. LOL

[stevenl]

11 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Provocation from the US?  Seriously?  Asking NK to stop firing off missiles over it's neighbors?  Wow...yes, horrible thing Tillerson is requesting. LOL

Whoosh, over your head.

[craigt3365]

8 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Whoosh, over your head.

Please explain.

[Scott]

Stop trolling and get back on the topic.  

[smutcakes]

2 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

Provocation from the US?  Seriously?  Asking NK to stop firing off missiles over it's neighbors?  Wow...yes, horrible thing Tillerson is requesting. LOL

 

Yes North Korea, stop firing missiles. Because we would never do it........ unebelievable.

[craigt3365]

4 minutes ago, smutcakes said:

 

Yes North Korea, stop firing missiles. Because we would never do it........ unebelievable.

You're right.  We'd never do it.  And bringing up the one time they were used, in totally different circumstances, is...well...unebelievable.

[smutcakes]

Just now, craigt3365 said:

You're right.  We'd never do it.  And bringing up the one time they were used, in totally different circumstances, is...well...unebelievable.

How many countries has NK dropped bombs in, in the past 20 years? How many have the US and its allies?

[craigt3365]

1 minute ago, smutcakes said:

How many countries has NK dropped bombs in, in the past 20 years? How many have the US and its allies?

You're comparing an extremely small country to the one of the largest in the world?  How about comparing it to Zimbabwe.

 

Anyway, hard for their military to do much when the top generals keep disappearing. LOL

http://edition.cnn.com/videos/world/2017/12/15/kim-jong-un-high-ranking-official-gone-missing-todd-dnt-tsr.cnn

North Korean high-ranking official missing

Reports that North Korea's second most high-ranking official to Kim Jong Un has vanished.

[farq]

23 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

I believe Tillerson got taken down by the White House.  Trump apparently didn't like his approach.  Sadly.

 

But, talks have been going on for decades.  It's always been up to North Korea to come to the table.  But as we know, the Kim family has no desire.

 

Perhaps it's time to get more aggressive with them.  Talks have gotten us nowhere.  As officials have said, North Korea knows where the door is to start negotiations.  It's up to them to walk through it.  It's been there for decades.

The ongoing aggressive stance and obfuscation by the US has done nothing to encourage North Korea to any talks. The "talks" are always biased against their right to self defence and the recent "show of force" on the seas and in the air over the peninsula does nothing to ease their fears. They have clearly stated that they are willing to cease their nuclear tests on the condition that the  US and other forces discontinue the military "exercises" along their border. The US broke the previous agreement, hence DPRK resumed their testing. Now, Tillerson the talks would be without preconditions, then starts issuing preconditions?! It is no wonder that DPRK couldn't be bothered "walking through the door"!

[craigt3365]

1 minute ago, farq said:

The ongoing aggressive stance and obfuscation by the US has done nothing to encourage North Korea to any talks. The "talks" are always biased against their right to self defence and the recent "show of force" on the seas and in the air over the peninsula does nothing to ease their fears. They have clearly stated that they are willing to cease their nuclear tests on the condition that the  US and other forces discontinue the military "exercises" along their border. The US broke the previous agreement, hence DPRK resumed their testing. Now, Tillerson the talks would be without preconditions, then starts issuing preconditions?! It is no wonder that DPRK couldn't be bothered "walking through the door"!

Too funny.  North Korea has been playing this game for decades.  Dozens of countries have been involved with the negotiations.  Nothing has worked.  Can't blame the West for that, though many try.

 

As far as aggression, please research the number of times NK has attacked the South over the years.  It's a long list.  Perhaps if they stopped the attacks the war games would end?  Or, start to dismantle the 3,000 pieces of artillery they have pointed at Seoul?  I'd call that aggression.

 

I know, I know....it's all the fault of the US.

[stevenl]

4 minutes ago, farq said:

The ongoing aggressive stance and obfuscation by the US has done nothing to encourage North Korea to any talks. The "talks" are always biased against their right to self defence and the recent "show of force" on the seas and in the air over the peninsula does nothing to ease their fears. They have clearly stated that they are willing to cease their nuclear tests on the condition that the  US and other forces discontinue the military "exercises" along their border. The US broke the previous agreement, hence DPRK resumed their testing. Now, Tillerson the talks would be without preconditions, then starts issuing preconditions?! It is no wonder that DPRK couldn't be bothered "walking through the door"!

Exactly.

[Morch]

30 minutes ago, smutcakes said:

How many countries has NK dropped bombs in, in the past 20 years? How many have the US and its allies?

 

Even if this was relevant, how does it make North Korea's (or rather, Kim's) actions "right"?

It ought to be possible to engage in US-bashing without ongoing defense and justification of North Korea (read Kim).

[farq]

26 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Too funny.  North Korea has been playing this game for decades.  Dozens of countries have been involved with the negotiations.  Nothing has worked.  Can't blame the West for that, though many try.

 

As far as aggression, please research the number of times NK has attacked the South over the years.  It's a long list.  Perhaps if they stopped the attacks the war games would end?  Or, start to dismantle the 3,000 pieces of artillery they have pointed at Seoul?  I'd call that aggression.

 

I know, I know....it's all the fault of the US.

Correct , it is the fault of the US, but you refuse to acknowledge the fact!  Just out of interest, how about you naming a couple of dozen of the countries who you claim have been involved in these negotiations, of their own volition?

 

While you are talking about aggression, what about the US doing likewise with all the artillery, rockets, and aircraft in Europe that they and NATO have pointed at Russia?! Or doesn't that count in your view?!

[Morch]

26 minutes ago, farq said:

The ongoing aggressive stance and obfuscation by the US has done nothing to encourage North Korea to any talks. The "talks" are always biased against their right to self defence and the recent "show of force" on the seas and in the air over the peninsula does nothing to ease their fears. They have clearly stated that they are willing to cease their nuclear tests on the condition that the  US and other forces discontinue the military "exercises" along their border. The US broke the previous agreement, hence DPRK resumed their testing. Now, Tillerson the talks would be without preconditions, then starts issuing preconditions?! It is no wonder that DPRK couldn't be bothered "walking through the door"!

 

North Korea's (Kim's) stance can be described as nothing but aggressive. Some posters seek to justify this based on their own standing anti-US stance. The same goes for whatever passes for "obfuscation". What actions had North Korea (Kim) taken in order to encourage talks, or even a less volatile atmosphere?

 

There's a whole lot of talk from some posters about North Korea's (Kim's) "right for self defense". These "views" ignore the many occasions in which North Korea acted belligerently or as an aggressor.  These "views" go on about the supposed USA's "show of force" and  whatnot, as if these are disengaged from North Korea's actions. Guess that them artillery barrels aimed at Seoul are "defensive" as well. That is, apart from topics in which the same are touted as credible, grave threat. Hardly a mention, as well, of North Korea's army conducting exercises, guess these are all defensive in nature. That is, again, apart from topics in which it is explain how the North Korean army is poised to invade and defeat South Korea.

 

In some posters minds not living up to treaties arbitrarily stops according to whichever point they are trying to make. Same goes for whether such supposed infractions are associated with related actions.

 

 

 

 

[craigt3365]

3 minutes ago, farq said:

Correct , it is the fault of the US, but you refuse to acknowledge the fact!  Just out of interest, how about you naming a couple of dozen of the countries who you claim have been involved in these negotiations, of their own volition?

 

While you are talking about aggression, what about the US doing likewise with all the artillery, rockets, and aircraft in Europe that they and NATO have pointed at Russia?! Or doesn't that count in your view?!

Read it and weep.  Europe and Australia are all in full support.  Russia?    Can you please stick to the topic?  But yes, Russia and China voted for the sanctions.  I guess they were ordered to do so by the US.  LOL

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanctions_against_North_Korea

[stevenl]

8 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Read it and weep.  Europe and Australia are all in full support.  Russia?    Can you please stick to the topic?  But yes, Russia and China voted for the sanctions.  I guess they were ordered to do so by the US.  LOL

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanctions_against_North_Korea

Europe does not really care, and Russia and China are asking the US to stop with military exercises and other provocations.

 

Yes, those sanctions are there and those countries moved in favour, but unlike the US other countries are now looking for a solution, whereas the US says 'do as you're told' and in the mean time we will do what we please, I don't care how you feel about that.

[craigt3365]

1 minute ago, stevenl said:

Europe does not really care, and Russia and China are asking the US to stop with military exercises and other provocations.

 

Yes, those sanctions are there and those countries moved in favour, but unlike the US other countries are now looking for a solution, whereas the US says 'do as you're told' and in the mean time we will do what we please, I don't care how you feel about that.

Right.  That's why they just expanded sanctions on NK.  Great way of showing they don't care! LOL

 

https://www.whitecase.com/publications/alert/eu-expands-sanctions-against-north-korea-well-russia-and-libya

 

Quote

 

North Korea – further expansion of sanctions

On 16 October, the EU Council adopted autonomous sanctions measures against North Korea (going beyond current UN sanctions).

 

 

[Morch]

5 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Europe does not really care, and Russia and China are asking the US to stop with military exercises and other provocations.

 

Yes, those sanctions are there and those countries moved in favour, but unlike the US other countries are now looking for a solution, whereas the US says 'do as you're told' and in the mean time we will do what we please, I don't care how you feel about that.

 

I don't think you are Europe's spokesman, or that your views accurately reflect Europe's views, if there's even such a unified point of view, that is. Russia and China have their own vested interest in this matter, their rivalry with the USA notwithstanding, treating their positions and pronunciations while ignoring the context is misleading, at best.

 

 

Edited December 17, 2017 by Morch

[farq]

22 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

What's that got to do with this topic?  Another anti-US rant? LOL

No Craig it is just to balance your flag waving pro US ranting!  And the unnecessary US hydrogen bombing of Japan has a lot to do with this topic. Your opinion seems to be that it is OK for the US to do it but not for anybody else to have a similar capacity.

 

[stevenl]

2 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

Right.  That's why they just expanded sanctions on NK.  Great way of showing they don't care! LOL

 

https://www.whitecase.com/publications/alert/eu-expands-sanctions-against-north-korea-well-russia-and-libya

 

 

Apparently a friend of Europe finds it important, so friends should help eachother.

[farq]

2 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

Read it and weep.  Europe and Australia are all in full support.  Russia?    Can you please stick to the topic?  But yes, Russia and China voted for the sanctions.  I guess they were ordered to do so by the US.  LOL

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanctions_against_North_Korea

But where are the "dozens" of countries you spoke of earlier? Having trouble coming up with the goods, eh!? I am sticking to the topic! It is you who are trying to divert the topic, as usual,  because you can't provide the facts to back up your statements! LOL!!

 

[farq]

2 hours ago, stevenl said:

Europe does not really care, and Russia and China are asking the US to stop with military exercises and other provocations.

 

Yes, those sanctions are there and those countries moved in favour, but unlike the US other countries are now looking for a solution, whereas the US says 'do as you're told' and in the mean time we will do what we please, I don't care how you feel about that.

You are right, stevenl, but Craig can't seem to grasp exactly what the problem is! Sad, really.

 

[Morch]

10 minutes ago, farq said:

No Craig it is just to balance your flag waving pro US ranting!  And the unnecessary US hydrogen bombing of Japan has a lot to do with this topic. Your opinion seems to be that it is OK for the US to do it but not for anybody else to have a similar capacity.

 

 

It is also unnecessary, for some, to stick with facts...

 

There's a major difference between a hydrogen bomb and an atomic bomb

http://www.businessinsider.com/how-nuclear-weapons-work-2016-1/?r=AU&IR=T

 

[farq]

3 hours ago, Morch said:

 

North Korea's (Kim's) stance can be described as nothing but aggressive. Some posters seek to justify this based on their own standing anti-US stance. The same goes for whatever passes for "obfuscation". What actions had North Korea (Kim) taken in order to encourage talks, or even a less volatile atmosphere?

 

There's a whole lot of talk from some posters about North Korea's (Kim's) "right for self defense". These "views" ignore the many occasions in which North Korea acted belligerently or as an aggressor.  These "views" go on about the supposed USA's "show of force" and  whatnot, as if these are disengaged from North Korea's actions. Guess that them artillery barrels aimed at Seoul are "defensive" as well. That is, apart from topics in which the same are touted as credible, grave threat. Hardly a mention, as well, of North Korea's army conducting exercises, guess these are all defensive in nature. That is, again, apart from topics in which it is explain how the North Korean army is poised to invade and defeat South Korea.

 

In some posters minds not living up to treaties arbitrarily stops according to whichever point they are trying to make. Same goes for whether such supposed infractions are associated with related actions.

 

 

 

 

PFFFFFFFT!!!!!!!

[farq]

7 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

Provocation from the US?  Seriously?  Asking NK to stop firing off missiles over it's neighbors?  Wow...yes, horrible thing Tillerson is requesting. LOL

 

Cherry picking again, Craig! The provocation from the US goes a little bit further back than Tillersons hypocritic grandstanding! The US has been provoking NK for decades with the manic displays and "exercises" on NK doorstep, and failing to keep agreements with NK then trying to shift the blame!! You seem to have missed a few of the relevant details in your version of thins.  LOL!!

[farq]

3 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

Read it and weep.  Europe and Australia are all in full support.  Russia?    Can you please stick to the topic?  But yes, Russia and China voted for the sanctions.  I guess they were ordered to do so by the US.  LOL

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanctions_against_North_Korea

 

I actually asked you to name those countries who voted of their own volition and not as they were dictated to by other parties! You failed to do that!  LOL 

[craigt3365]

23 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Apparently a friend of Europe finds it important, so friends should help eachother.

And what's wrong with that?  China and Russia are helping NK.  Right?

[craigt3365]

16 minutes ago, farq said:

You are right, stevenl, but Craig can't seem to grasp exactly what the problem is! Sad, really.

 

Right back at ya.  Luckily, the leaders of the majority of Western nations agree with me.  NK is the problem.