Thailand Suspends All High-level Meetings With Singapore

[Dakhar]

As the interview was given to cnn ...will thailand stop talking to the US as well ????

Oh Mannnnn

[hardy1943]

As the interview was given to cnn ...will thailand stop talking to the US as well ????

I better go and watch CNN I got the pirated satellite from the Philippines and nothing is blocked out there.

[mitrapaap]

Isn't it amazing how the junta is so paranoid about Thaksin coming back that they wantongly block and censor an international news source while then turning around and picking a fight with a local economic power like Singapore. This shows complete madness and the unwillingness to even think about potential consequences of their actions.

At the beginning I thought the coup would actually make things better but the junta has proven by now beyond any reasonable doubt that they have completely lost control and they are by now in complete panic-mode.

Looks a lot like the endless circular arguments and manic actions of the North Korean junta to me, just in its early stages -- good luck, that the Thais are just not diligent enough engineers to ever successfully build a nuke... :-)

Maybe we could find out what and how much goods Thailand exports to Singapore and what and how much Thailand imports from Singapore. I don't know the answer, but it might give us an idea who depends more on whom or how important it is to love each other. To me Singapore looks like a fully airconditioned island with not much own resources other than brain that allows to make money with money.

[onethailand]

Very interesting developments, especially in Singapore, home of the government who twice kicked out the Far Eastern Economic Review, most recently in September, for publishing stories it didn't agree with... it's plainly apparent that the political game has been kicked up a notch. Don't forget that Temasek, who bought AIS, is the investment arm of the Singaporean government... this could easily be construed as a retaliatory action... next step the ambassador gets sent home...

[mongoose]

How many billion baht have they lost at present on the Temasek deal?

Many many many. T would not be down there to try to take the blame of himself and put it on the current BKK power folks would he? Those S folks can not be happy about the losses with the prospect of more to come. They gotta be hot.

[Plus]

No country in ASEAN would lend platform to any politician, let alone ousted by the coup, to critisize his own government. It's called meddling in domestic affairs.

I don't remember Ranaridh of Cambodia talking to press anywhere in ASEAN about Hun Sen, for example. It's a no no.

Jeez, Singaporeans won't allow opposition leaders to talk to their domestic media, let alone raise some stink in Malaysia, for example.

What was Singapore thinking? Smart as they are, they've been swindled billions by Thaksin first, and now they are paying political price as well!

Thailand 1 - Singapore 0.

As for the face - remember how they lectured Thailand on democracy afther they coup and then two weeks laters asked Sorayud to "help out" with Shin deal. He just recited back the same democracy lessons about "the rule of law" they've been teaching him.

[rcm]

Isn't it amazing how the junta is so paranoid about Thaksin coming back that they wantongly block and censor an international news source while then turning around and picking a fight with a local economic power like Singapore. This shows complete madness and the unwillingness to even think about potential consequences of their actions.

At the beginning I thought the coup would actually make things better but the junta has proven by now beyond any reasonable doubt that they have completely lost control and they are by now in complete panic-mode.

Looks a lot like the endless circular arguments and manic actions of the North Korean junta to me, just in its early stages -- good luck, that the Thais are just not diligent enough engineers to ever successfully build a nuke... :-)

Maybe we could find out what and how much goods Thailand exports to Singapore and what and how much Thailand imports from Singapore. I don't know the answer, but it might give us an idea who depends more on whom or how important it is to love each other. To me Singapore looks like a fully airconditioned island with not much own resources other than brain that allows to make money with money.

It doesn't matter who has the resources if you have the money to buy , which Singapore clearly have . So Singapore is not neccesarily depending on Thailand. I think their relation to China is better anyways plus products/resources are more than likely cheaper too there....

I think the comment given from Thailand was silly and completely unnessecary .

i found this article on Channelnewsasia:

Singapore regrets Thailand's decision to suspend civil service exchange programme

Posted: 16 January 2007 2155 hrs

SINGAPORE : Singapore says it regrets that the Thai government has decided to suspend the Singapore-Thailand Civil Service Exchange Programme (CSEP)

It also regrets that Thailand is cancelling the CSEP Coordinating Meeting, scheduled to take place in Bangkok from January 29-31, and rescinding the invitation to Foreign Affairs Minister George Yeo to attend the CSEP meeting.

The Foreign Affairs Ministry says the Singapore government notes that the position taken by the Thai government is a response to the recent private visit of former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

It says the Singapore government hopes that Thailand can appreciate Singapore's position on the visit.

MFA says the Thai government did not notify Singapore that Dr Thaksin has been charged with any offence.

There is also no restriction on which countries he can travel to.

The ministry says Dr Thaksin had chosen to make a visit to Singapore on his own.

He had asked to meet Deputy Prime Minister Professor S Jayakumar, who is an old friend.

MFA says it was purely a social and private meeting. No official calls or meetings were arranged.

Thai nationals do not require visas to visit Singapore.

MFA says there is no reason for Singapore to turn Dr Thaksin away.

Prior to Singapore, Dr Thaksin had also visited several other countries without any protest by the Thai government.

The ministry says it is therefore saddened that the Thai government has chosen to take this course of action.

It hopes Thailand will respect Singapore's position as that of a sovereign country.

It says Singapore values the long-standing friendly relations with Thailand. - CNA /ls

[pipchatel]

I really cannot understand why Mr Thaksin does not return to Bangkok, How could they stop him, what would they do? Probably Shit themselves, go for it Thaksin!

[lannarebirth]

How many billion baht have they lost at present on the Temasek deal?

Many many many. T would not be down there to try to take the blame of himself and put it on the current BKK power folks would he? Those S folks can not be happy about the losses with the prospect of more to come. They gotta be hot.

Yes, they're down a few baht alright. They conspired to meddle in the affairs of a soverign state and are now "seemingly" continuing. I would not be surprised if the next step was the suspension of trading in Shin shares, with the threat of nationaizing the company. Temasek/Singapore have a way out, which will still cost them some money, but they are clearly backing the wrong horse now. Continuing to do so will cost them alot more IMO. Sure they'll get their revenge in the end, but I don't think they'll let these billions get away.

[jts-khorat]

I just read in the Bangkok Post, Thaksin gave a second interview in a Hong Kong Newspaper: http://www.bangkokpost.com/topstories.php?id=116064 -- much more critical of the Junta.

I guess that means cutting all ties with Hong Kong as well is in order now...

[Martin]

When I worked there for six years, I was fascinated by the way Singapore "punches above its weight".

There was only four-and-a-half million of them, and I used to compare with my native West Yorkshire (which is Leeds, Bradford, Huddersfield, Halifax and Wakefield) and which has the same population and land size and shape.

But Thailand has 60 million and many, many times more land. (In fact, it has the land size of France). So it can manage OK, even punching well "below its weight".

Coming from the Land of 'Fur and Feather', I see the two like a game little cockerel and a great big turkey.

Singaporeans dash about wheeling and dealing to make money to buy next month's food and fuel.

Thais amble, but have enough rice in the moo baan's granaries to feed the village easily for the next year.

[peace]

stop using singapore as a punching bag.

For God sake, Thaskin visited China, Hong Kong and Bali...

One more thing, if singapore decide to pull out the investment in Thailand, it's not a small thing...not in term of dollar value but in term of investment confidence. Already, some of the main FDI country like Japan and US, EU have review their investment plan in Thailand and most have decide to invest in Vietnam instead..

A very wrong move.

[Tony Clifton]

How many billion baht have they lost at present on the Temasek deal?

That'll teach them to risk doing huge business deals with people with well known shaky backgrounds.

Friend of mine was once arrested for buying a "used" tv from a known criminal. Took the risk, lost his money and the tv set. Not the same kind of money as above but ethics are basically the same.

[rainman]

BANGKOK: -- Thailand Tuesday decided to suspend indefinitely all high level meetings including the planned summit later this year and a ministerial dialogue next month with Singapore as a result of the island's insensitivity to Thailand's political development.

Isn't Thailand also interfering with Singapore's politics? If Singapore wants to have a meeting with Thaksin, how can Thailand prohibit that? Seems like an unnecessary attempt to prevent him from having a meeting with Singaporean officials. If he wants to do it, he'll do it anyways, but before they attempted to stop him, nobody even knew about the meeting. Now its in all newspapers ...

[chuchok]

What was Singapore thinking? Smart as they are, they've been swindled billions by Thaksin first, and now they are paying political price as well!

They would have entered in good faith.They will be spewing now.A little country of 2 mil odd people have a surplus that most countries would be very happy to have.USD70 billion in investments.

They will look at it as being swindled by the Thai government.

[Martin]

Post # 37 above is the crucial one.

The Singapore Government isn't saying "sorry"--nor would it be expected--but they are making very soothing noises that show they've got the message and aren't wishing to quarrel with the growers of the rice.

[Rinrada]

Nowt to do with Tacky (Thailands Caretaker Prime Minister)..

Recon they are just jealous because everybody is slanging them off by saying that Singapores Changi Airport is better than the excuse for a Thai Chicken shed knocked up out at the back end of a field in Bagna Trad......

Its all to do with the shuush.........toilets.

...not so much Face ..more wot comes out of the other end....

[gjones]

good thinking on behalf of the ratabarn, now the baht will flop in the flip flop economt, or will it?

[Phil Conners]

As the interview was given to cnn ...will thailand stop talking to the US as well ????

I better go and watch CNN I got the pirated satellite from the Philippines and nothing is blocked out there.

Shh, careful now, next thing might be a ban on watching (non UBC) satellite. Don't laugh, it happened other places.

[younghusband]

No country in ASEAN would lend platform to any politician, let alone ousted by the coup, to critisize his own government. It's called meddling in domestic affairs.

I don't remember Ranaridh of Cambodia talking to press anywhere in ASEAN about Hun Sen, for example. It's a no no.

Jeez, Singaporeans won't allow opposition leaders to talk to their domestic media, let alone raise some stink in Malaysia, for example.

What was Singapore thinking? Smart as they are, they've been swindled billions by Thaksin first, and now they are paying political price as well!

Thailand 1 - Singapore 0.

As for the face - remember how they lectured Thailand on democracy afther they coup and then two weeks laters asked Sorayud to "help out" with Shin deal. He just recited back the same democracy lessons about "the rule of law" they've been teaching him.

Most countries in Asean are unpleasantly authoritarian or even quasi dictatorships.Malaysia,Thailand and Singapore are the exceptions although even these have systems of government that are intolerant of dissent.Nevertheless Thailand, by far the most admirable country in ASEAN, remains a country even now of which we can be proud and the instincts of the Thai people are always for freedom.But don't come all prim and proper about what ASEAN would or wouldn't put up with because its standards are so abysmally low.

I don't see Singapore has much to apologise for any way.Authoritarian though it is, there is not much that can be done in a free country to refuse CNN permission to interview whoever it likes.It's not North Korea.Jayakumar's meeting with Thaksin was a private and personal one.Singapore for all its faults and political ineptitude (what kind of advice was its Embassy in Bangkok giving on the Shin deal!!!), will look to defuse this crisis such as it is.But international opinion will certainly regard the Thai overeaction as yet another example of the childishness of this incompetent and illegal junta.

As somebody else pointed out Thaksin also gave interviews to the international press when in HK, but you won't see this ridiculous regime taking on China.

[Briggsy]

There's no doubt that the Singapore govt will be pushing to try and come out of the whole Shin deal ahead, not only for the dollars but the Hokkien kiasu (win all encounters). When they don't, they're not such a friendly sight.

They seem to have miscalculated by failing to predict that the CNS would react so angrily. I can't recall the last time Thai/Singapore relations hit such a low. They may regret, certainly in the short term, allowing Thaksin to meet high ranking politicians. Though publicly they will never say this.

[chuchok]

As somebody else pointed out Thaksin also gave interviews to the international press when in HK, but you won't see this ridiculous regime taking on China.

they just might be dumb enough....

[birago23]

Sure, stop talking to Singapore, be pissed off with the US, Japan, who needs them anyway...Thai economy rules...THIS IS THAILAND...just go ahead with this stupid policy and your only friends might be the Burmese military junta.

[Arkady]

The whole thing is quite funny really. The Lees knew their shareholder structure was not strictly legal but they did the Shin Corp deal because they believed that Thaksin was like them and would stay in power for many years to come. They themselves would throw the book at any foreigners and their nominees trying a similar stunt to get control of their own Singtel or Singapore Press Holdings without any hesitation. If it were the investment arm of a foreign government they would probably cut diplomatic relations immediately. Singapore closed down all vaguely independent local media decades ago and keeps a tight grip on foreign media through expulsions and the courts who have never found against the government in media cases. Recently The Economist was fined heftily in Singapore for printing an article critical of Temasek (before the Shin Corp deal) and its boss who is the prime minister's wife. Singapore would definitely go to great lengths to get retribution, if foreign media based in Thailand aired an interview of a Singaporean dissident criticising the Lees. Being shunned by Thailand will definitely hurt Singapore. Apart from loss of face there are vital things they can only get in Thailand e.g. jungle warfare training for their troops which they can't do in Malaysia or Indonesia because they are potentially their enemies. Thailand is also the only other Asean country which is now run politically and economically by their fellow Chinese.

On the other hand the Thai government and the CNS have allowed this situation by not dealing vigorously with Thaksin and his lackeys from the outset and even leaving in and/or appointing to high positions many former Thaksin aides. More recently they have played into his hands by incompetent meddling with capital inflows and new measures to curb foreign investment as well as promoting his popularist policies as their own. They have handed him a big stick to beat them with and given him a golden media opportunity to appeal to foreign sentiment as the ousted democratic leader who supports foreign investment and free trade - no need to mention his crack downs on visas or that he reduced foreign ownership in telecoms to 25% in 2001. Thaksin is a quick thinking opportunist, so what did they expect? Nevertheless, it is good to see they are now having to deal directly with the Singapore government's role in all of this. They should have done this in the first place instead of setting about dismantling foreign investment in Thailand as an indirect way to punish Singapore.

[Plus]

They will look at it as being swindled by the Thai government.

Yeah, that's what Thaksin has probably told them, and he is the one sitting with their money and drinking their tea!

It's a bit unclear what exactly Thai side protested about, but two immediate things - Thaksin was recieved by Singapore's Deputy PM, they can't hide behind "private lunch" excuse, and Thaksin has been interviewd by CNN and WJC while in Singapore.

The excuses they give (in post 37) downplay or ignore these facts. Let's the details in tomorrow's papers.

China and Hong Kong are not members on Asean, Singapore is, so the rules and responses are different, and while in Bali Thaksin didn't give any interviews and didn't meet anybody important, and he still had a diplomatic passport.

Thailand really had no other choice - if they let Singapore off, they can't demand anything from anyone else in ASEAN, as the precedent has been set. Now Singapore can give excuses that it didn't break any rules and they regret this and they regret that - everyone knows it was their mistake to let Thaksin meet their officials and talk to western media (if he really was interviewed in Singapore).

[chuchok]

They will look at it as being swindled by the Thai government.

Yeah, that's what Thaksin has probably told them, and he is the one sitting with their money and drinking their tea!

It's a bit unclear what exactly Thai side protested about, but two immediate things - Thaksin was recieved by Singapore's Deputy PM, they can't hide behind "private lunch" excuse, and Thaksin has been interviewd by CNN and WJC while in Singapore.

The excuses they give (in post 37) downplay or ignore these facts. Let's the details in tomorrow's papers.

China and Hong Kong are not members on Asean, Singapore is, so the rules and responses are different, and while in Bali Thaksin didn't give any interviews and didn't meet anybody important, and he still had a diplomatic passport.

Thailand really had no other choice - if they let Singapore off, they can't demand anything from anyone else in ASEAN, as the precedent has been set. Now Singapore can give excuses that it didn't break any rules and they regret this and they regret that - everyone knows it was their mistake to let Thaksin meet their officials and talk to western media (if he really was interviewed in Singapore).

Complete <deleted>.They can meet any body at any time.Same as any Government.Thaksin is now a private citizen.This is not a commie country...or is it?

[Trouble]

As much as many Thais and many of the posters here do not like Thaksin, let's not forget he was elected by a clear majority of the people in Thailand. How he got elected I suppose is subject for debate but no one has ever claimed, to my knowledge, that the elections were rigged in favor of Thaksin. There may have been money or gifts thrown out to villagers but they still voted for the guy. The military overthrew the elected government rather than let the people have a subsequent election. The military government is placing pressure on the press and opposition to refrain from commentary or criticism against the military government. Sorry but this whole change in government is just what it looks like, one group of military leaders who wanted the power because they think they know what is best for the people of Thailand. While I think that many of the policies of Taskin were not good for Thailand, there was a process going on by opposition political leaders which forced Thaskin from office once and was placing pressure for new elections. The military could not wait for the process to continue but instead stepped in. In my view the military government is no better in allowing criticism than Thaskin was. It is all about power is it not. One group has it, another group wants it. I surely think it was Thaskin's time to go but the military should have at least waited for the political process to work, if that is possible, before taking action. As to the criticism of Thaskin for selling his shares in the Shin Corp to the Singapore entity, that's business. Thaskin was a wealthy man before he entered public office. No doubt he increased his wealth while in office and probably used all sorts of influence to do that. Is that something new in Thailand? Seems to me that most of the generals, police, and politicians in Thailand have gained some wealth during their tenure in office/government. This whole issue with the selling of stock is a fabricated issue to discredit Thaskin. Whether he is liable for taxes or not will come out in the proceedings that are on going. The fact is I don't believe that a military takeover was the way to unseat Thaskin. The military government seems no better than Thaskin's government. It is using the same pressure that the Thaskin government used to surpress criticism. If I was the Singapore government I would tell Thailand to butt out of their business. Allowing Thaskin to enter the country, meet with a friend, and give an interview is Singapore's business. As the Singapore government stated, it was unaware that Thaskin has been accused of any crimes so what's the problem. Further, as many have said, Vietnam, China, et al are all trading partners. Thailand needs to export its rice and Singapore needs to buy it. Economics will always win out in the end. This criticism of Singapore is no more than another attempt by the military government to surpress opposition to their leadership.

[Plus]

I don't see Singapore has much to apologise for any way.Authoritarian though it is, there is not much that can be done in a free country to refuse CNN permission to interview whoever it likes.

Arkady above summed it up quite nicely. Thaksin was their guest, and they are responsible that he doesn't stir any political trouble while in Singapore. It is certainly within their means and they have plenty of experience in that area. They don't need to apologise, they'll just promise privately that it will never happen again and everything will be back to normal. They won't dig their heels because of Thaksin, and no one expects them to. Thaksin is like an ex-wife moving into best firends house - no one needs this aggravation.

>>>>>>>>

Thaksin has been caught again - first the passport, and now he must stay clear of the region, and will probably settle in China. They are true champions of free speech! If Thais make a deal with Chinese, he won't find a place to charge his phone battery in that country.

It's of course general's fault that they let the situation deteriorate, they gave too much leeway to Thaksin from the start, but they dealing with it decisively now.

[Plus]

Complete <deleted>.They can meet any body at any time.Same as any Government.Thaksin is now a private citizen.This is not a commie country...or is it?

No they can't, they are bound by Asean treaties and their asian way of doing things. It's not a commie country, it's the country of democracy and freedom....

Good call for Thailand - they wouldn't be able to pull this with Hong Kong or any western country, Singapore is a perfect target, they've been caught in this mess from the very beginning, too late to play innocent.

[peace]

On the rice trade...I think Thailand is on the losing end.

If I remember correctly, not too long ago, Malaysia raise the export price of egg and veg to Singapore.

In the end, the Malaysia farmer lose market share to other countries - Australia and Japan selling premium egg and veg while China sell economic price veg to Singapore.

This is a lesson that Thailand should take note of cos country like Japan, Korean are waiting for the chance to enter the market..and yes; China can trade rice too. Yunnan, China is not too far away from Thailand.