Moving to Chaing Mai

[LivinLOS]

6 hours ago, Dazinoz said:

I have lived here 4 1/2 years. I also came from Oz. Personally I would not buy straight up. I would rent and look around. I am in my 5th rental now. Moved for a variety of reasons.

This... Also things change fast.. New roads going in... Traffic in areas becoming really restrictive.. 

 

Even knowing the place well its hard to predict what another few years brings, I would 100% rent for a few years to really be sure of what areas I liked, what I needed to access, etc.. 

[thaibeachlovers]

15 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

There are two possible routes, straight down the 107 past the womens prison to the moat, or via MaeJo, either one is viable if not easy, outside of rush hour traffic. San Sai/Doi Saket catches the Chiang Rai traffic, the 107 is mostly farmers heading to/from market, tourists in the winter months and of course tourist vans headed to Pai.

 

We like it very much and we wouldn't change our choice, it suits us very well. And there are shortcuts to be had which I won't write about here.

I just spent an extremely irritating time trying to find Mae Taeng on google maps which claims it doesn't exist, but regardless, If I were driving there I'd never use 107 from C M. Always on 1001 and cut across to 107 at the intersection with the Mae Hong Son turnoff. 

The traffic in Mae Rim would make me suicidal if I had to go that way everytime.

[simoh1490]

54 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I just spent an extremely irritating time trying to find Mae Taeng on google maps which claims it doesn't exist, but regardless, If I were driving there I'd never use 107 from C M. Always on 1001 and cut across to 107 at the intersection with the Mae Hong Son turnoff. 

The traffic in Mae Rim would make me suicidal if I had to go that way everytime.

Easy to spot Mae Tang on the maps, just look for the dam/reservoir, it's a monster.

[StevieAus]

All the above advice is good before you buy anything particularly company get legal advice as different to Australia

There is a very good female lawyer in Chiang Mai I have used her for about 10 years plus my expat friends

Email me direct if you want details

Good luck

[BTB1977]

8 hours ago, WHYWHY said:

Thank you all 

Yes thought of renting first but have 2 large dogs 2 cats 

So thought best option is to buy 

I've been to few places in Thailand and love Chaing Mai so thought good to buy 

Then everyones happy including the dogs 

So your dogs and cats might be happy for a few months to a year. What happens if they change their mind?? The dogs will just say not my money not my problem. And cats dont give a shit. They did not write the check to buy the house. 

[Justfine]

Would Mae On be a good place to live?

[F4UCorsair]

19 hours ago, Dazinoz said:

I have lived here 4 1/2 years. I also came from Oz. Personally I would not buy straight up. I would rent and look around. I am in my 5th rental now. Moved for a variety of reasons.

 

As far as the smoke goes, yes it can get bad and I know people with health problems can suffer. I bought a cheapish air purifier from Homepro and run it 24 Hours a day in the bedroom with the doors and windows closed, obviously with AC on when sleeping. You certainly notice the difference when we exit the bedroom in the morning, but is pleasant for us at night.

 

To me a lot of where you live depends on what you want to do and how often and what mode transport you will own. I own a car and refuse to ride and motorbike as I never did in Australia and see the traffic here and how they drive. Our first house was great but just too far for my wife to get anywhere as she won't drive here. Songthaews and tuk tuks were not really available where we were. So we moved.

 

Not sure what hills you plan to live in but the hills to the west of CM has the airport at their base. 95% or more of flights take off to the north but soon turn east and then south. A recent thread had someone complaining about the noise and he lived in the San Sai district which the aircraft are at around 5 to 8000 feet so noise not so great. Our 2nd, 3rd and 4th house were directly under the flight path probably only about 2 kms from the end of the runway. They passed over us at 2500 feet at take off thrust so was considerably loud but we found we got used to it. Worst was when we were watching TV and the noise would drown the TV out.

 

Hope this helps a bit.

It would be 'climb thrust' at 2500 feet, ge erally a significant reduction on 'takeoff thrust'.

 

If that's Inconvenient, anywhere closer would be unbearable.

Edited January 8, 2018 by F4UCorsair

[sanemax]

On 1/7/2018 at 6:54 AM, WHYWHY said:

Hi yeah buying company so have income and house to live 

I dont know how much you know about Thailand , but businesses operate quite different here to back home , for example , when you buy a business, like a bar , you dont actually buy the business outright , you do not buy the actual land the bar is sitting on , you have to pay a monthly rent for the bar and land , so, you are not actually buying the bar, you are just buying the lease .

   Successful money making businesses here tend not to get sold and even if you were able to buy a successful money making business , the business income may not be enough to get your initial investment back .

   Many Thai businesses work long hours for a meager income .

The dream of moving to Thailand, buying a house and a business and living happily ever after  , is usually just a dream that quickly turns into a nightmare

[simoh1490]

7 minutes ago, sanemax said:

I dont know how much you know about Thailand , but businesses operate quite different here to back home , for example , when you buy a business, like a bar , you dont actually buy the business outright , you do not buy the actual land the bar is sitting on , you have to pay a monthly rent for the bar and land , so, you are not actually buying the bar, you are just buying the lease .

   Successful money making businesses here tend not to get sold and even if you were able to buy a successful money making business , the business income may not be enough to get your initial investment back .

   Many Thai businesses work long hours for a meager income .

The dream of moving to Thailand, buying a house and a business and living happily ever after  , is usually just a dream that quickly turns into a nightmare

I'd agree with the above completely, the dream of owning a business in Thailand for a farang usually remains a dream but more often becomes a nightmare and it doesn't matter how much business experience you have back home. Best advice is do nothing for a year at least, except invest your money safely (fixed deposits in banks), rent your home, travel a lot and look at everything you want to get involved in very very closely and talk to as many people as possible - float ideas here and see what sort of response you get, although figuring out who to listen to and who to ignore is equally as problematic!

 

BTW owning a bar in Thailand is not owning a business, it's a lifestyle choice at best for 99%.

Edited January 8, 2018 by simoh1490

[Dazinoz]

1 hour ago, F4UCorsair said:

It would be 'climb thrust' at 2500 feet, ge erally a significant reduction on 'takeoff thrust'.

Same same but different. Still very noisy.

[sanemax]

10 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

 

BTW owning a bar in Thailand is not owning a business, it's a lifestyle choice at best for 99%.

The best strategy for owning a bar in Thailand , is to buy a bar , then to sit with a laptop on a stool next to the bar, with a drink and pretending to be a customer and staring out from the bar at all the potential  customers who walk by and dont stop in your bar for a drink .

   Spend all day drinking and when a customer doesnt eventually stop by for a drink , sit and tell them about all the corruption and scams , about how you cannot even serve a drink in your own bar and about having to employ a cashier that drinks all the spirits and that you have to mark all the bottles with a date on it and about how your girlfriend keeps all the money and tell them about how much money youve lost................and then ask them if they want to buy a bar .

   Not sure how successful that strategy is, but there seems an awful lot of bar owners trying it

[simoh1490]

1 minute ago, sanemax said:

The best strategy for owning a bar in Thailand , is to buy a bar , then to sit with a laptop on a stool next to the bar, with a drink and pretending to be a customer and staring out from the bar at all the potential  customers who walk by and dont stop in your bar for a drink .

   Spend all day drinking and when a customer doesnt eventually stop by for a drink , sit and tell them about all the corruption and scams , about how you cannot even serve a drink in your own bar and about having to employ a cashier that drinks all the spirits and that you have to mark all the bottles with a date on it and about how your girlfriend keeps all the money and tell them about how much money youve lost................and then ask them if they want to buy a bar .

   Not sure how successful that strategy is, but there seems an awful lot of bar owners trying it

3

At that point in the proceedings, it's time to diversify into a bike rental/internet/massage/laundry conglomerate with perhaps a small shop on the side selling coffee and cakes (I can't understand why nobody has tried that last one, it seems like a real money spinner to me, I mean, look at Starbucks)

[KKr]

43 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

At that point in the proceedings, it's time to diversify into a bike rental/internet/massage/laundry conglomerate with perhaps a small shop on the side selling coffee and cakes (I can't understand why nobody has tried that last one, it seems like a real money spinner to me, I mean, look at Starbucks)

absolutely, if it were not very profitable, there would not be so many of them.

[F4UCorsair]

47 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

At that point in the proceedings, it's time to diversify into a bike rental/internet/massage/laundry conglomerate with perhaps a small shop on the side selling coffee and cakes (I can't understand why nobody has tried that last one, it seems like a real money spinner to me, I mean, look at Starbucks)

There was such a coffee and cake place, can't recall the address, but it was in vicinity of Chiang Mai Gate Hotel, run/owned by a Japanese woman, but it didn't last long.   It was a shame because the coffee was great and cakes/pastries also very good.

 

I think that was about 7 years ago, and gone less than a year later.  Of course it may have moved?

Edited January 8, 2018 by F4UCorsair

[sanemax]

2 minutes ago, KKr said:

absolutely, if it were not very profitable, there would not be so many of them.

I do think that he was being sarcastic, as you may be being as well :)

[simoh1490]

About the only shop that got the coffee and cakes bit right is Love at First Bite in Watkate and he spent 30 years in the US before returning home to start the place.

[KKr]

1 hour ago, sanemax said:

I do think that he was being sarcastic, as you may be being as well :)

it is true though, what other reason could there be to open another coffee shop ;-)

getting off topic though ... 
would be interesting to investigate the business plans of people opening businesses around here and the failure rate in comparison to other countries. ....
maybe an MBA student on the forum picks this up ?

Edited January 8, 2018 by KKr

[Bill97]

getting off topic though ... 
would be interesting to investigate the business plans of people opening businesses around here and the failure rate in comparison to other countries. ....

Business plans, here, in your dreams.



Sent from my iPod touch using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[simoh1490]

The failure rate of new business start up in the West is roughly 90% within 5 years, since hardly anyone here makes business plans I would hazard a guess that the failure rate here is over 95% within two years.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

3 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

The failure rate of new business start up in the West is roughly 90% within 5 years, since hardly anyone here makes business plans I would hazard a guess that the failure rate here is over 95% within two years.

 

I think business plans (for new businesses) are overrated.  People make business plans mostly when they need something:  investment, a loan, pass some regulatory hurdle, apply for a subsidy, etc.  Then they get on Excel and do 5 year projections with graphs that go 'up', based on source data extracted from their hopes & dreams.

 

Everyone else in small business just gets started and sees if there actually is a viable business or not.  If yes then great and do the paperwork. If not then no worries and try something else.  This by the way is exactly how most Thai people do it.  It's very Darwinian and I kind of like it.

 

6 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

About the only shop that got the coffee and cakes bit right is Love at First Bite in Watkate and he spent 30 years in the US before returning home to start the place.

 

15 or so years ago when they opened you'd be right.  Now there are lots of good places, and far better than Love at First Bite.  (E.g. l'Opera, the Dhara Dhevi bakery and many others.)  Even many of the hole in the wall coffee shops do surprisingly good. 

 

7 hours ago, sanemax said:

I dont know how much you know about Thailand , but businesses operate quite different here to back home , for example , when you buy a business, like a bar , you dont actually buy the business outright , you do not buy the actual land the bar is sitting on , you have to pay a monthly rent for the bar and land , so, you are not actually buying the bar, you are just buying the lease .

 

Yes, unless of course you don't, and start a new bar on a property you rent or secure otherwise.  It rarely makes sense to buy an existing bar, mostly because the owner persists in thinking that it's worth more than the furniture and appliances.  (Spoiler Alert: it isn't.)

 

(That said, it also rarely makes sense to start a bar, period. :)  But taking over an existing bar with the whole key money spiel is downright insane. )

 

6 hours ago, F4UCorsair said:

There was such a coffee and cake place, can't recall the address, but it was in vicinity of Chiang Mai Gate Hotel, run/owned by a Japanese woman, but it didn't last long.   It was a shame because the coffee was great and cakes/pastries also very good.

 

It's still very good.  It's named Baan Bakery. And now it's just down the soi from where they were, down Suriyawong Road Soi 1, past the new "BED" hostel at the end of that soi.

 

The old place is now a Halal restaurant that puts too much salt in their food.

 

On 1/7/2018 at 8:21 AM, Ulysses G. said:

The smokey season has almost never bothered me much and a lot of other expats feel the same. However, there are a lot of others who are really made uncomfortable during those months. 

 

And then there are those who make others uncomfortable even before those months with non-stop whining about it, after they find out that Asia's air doesn't resemble that of a Norse fjord, most of the time.

 

Edited January 8, 2018 by WinnieTheKhwai

[F4UCorsair]

Thanks for the info on Baan Bakery Winnie.  I had hoped they'd moved and not closed down.  I'll find it next time in CM.

 

Coffee and cake is my only concession to life back home when I'm traveling.

[thaibeachlovers]

8 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

I'd agree with the above completely, the dream of owning a business in Thailand for a farang usually remains a dream but more often becomes a nightmare and it doesn't matter how much business experience you have back home. Best advice is do nothing for a year at least, except invest your money safely (fixed deposits in banks), rent your home, travel a lot and look at everything you want to get involved in very very closely and talk to as many people as possible - float ideas here and see what sort of response you get, although figuring out who to listen to and who to ignore is equally as problematic!

 

BTW owning a bar in Thailand is not owning a business, it's a lifestyle choice at best for 99%.

True. Too many successful western businessmen arrive in Thailand thinking they know it all, buy the business, get married, buy the house, car etc etc etc, and end up leaving LOS broke and broken.

 

Re buying a bar, in '96 I was staying in an hotel on Soi Yamato, Pattaya that had house ladies downstairs. I got to know a Brit that bought a part share, and he was really buzzing that he'd bought a "brothel" ( his word ), presumably because he was thinking "freebies". Not long after, I saw the major partner dragging him out by a leg, and giving him a few fives in the street.

Perhaps a bit extreme, but such is the fate of some wannabe bar owners. It's not a business for the naive.

Edited January 8, 2018 by thaibeachlovers

[thaibeachlovers]

22 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

Easy to spot Mae Tang on the maps, just look for the dam/reservoir, it's a monster.

Oh, I think I know where Mae Tang is, but google maps don't show it. If I'm correct the reservoir has raft rooms to rent. My wife and I had lunch there on the way to Chang Dao.

[simoh1490]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Oh, I think I know where Mae Tang is, but google maps don't show it. If I'm correct the reservoir has raft rooms to rent. My wife and I had lunch there on the way to Chang Dao.

Next time you're there, try Mountain Flood, good food and you can rent a room/raft for a day or half a day, all kinds of toys to play with in the water, it's a nice way to laze away some free time.

[thaibeachlovers]

8 hours ago, sanemax said:

The best strategy for owning a bar in Thailand , is to buy a bar , then to sit with a laptop on a stool next to the bar, with a drink and pretending to be a customer and staring out from the bar at all the potential  customers who walk by and dont stop in your bar for a drink .

   Spend all day drinking and when a customer doesnt eventually stop by for a drink , sit and tell them about all the corruption and scams , about how you cannot even serve a drink in your own bar and about having to employ a cashier that drinks all the spirits and that you have to mark all the bottles with a date on it and about how your girlfriend keeps all the money and tell them about how much money youve lost................and then ask them if they want to buy a bar .

   Not sure how successful that strategy is, but there seems an awful lot of bar owners trying it

If I win the lottery I'm buying a barbeer in Pattaya so at least one bar has pretty girls that don't pay more attention to their phones than the customers.

Given how chubby and very average looking most bargirls seem to be these days, and given their complete lack of interest in anything but their phone, I'm not at all surprised most bar beers seem to be customer free zones.