Thailand conscription / Military service

[Benrrd]

Dear reader

 

I am writing here because after many days of research I was unable to find a solution to my problem.

 

I fully understand the laws and obligation about Thais serving the country and how the drafting work.

 

My problem is that I have just turned 21 on December 2017. I was planning to visit Thailand for personal reasons in May 2018 but I heard from Thai immigration BKK that I would be detained when I arrive because I did not go to the drafting. That I would have to pray they only want a garentor to bail me out or worst I would be automatically enlisted into the military. 

 

Also to note that when I was 18 I did not sign up for the (sor dor 9) form and this may have made a bigger problem because I was thinking of deferring a year because I have another year and a haft of university left but seems to be impossible if I haven't registers in the first place. My name is in the thabien baann, from what I heard that means your already in the system for drafting so why do you have to register at 18 in the first place?

 

I do have a British passport aswell as Thai, I was thinking of getting a visa on my brits passport. But afraid that they will deny my application if they see my nationality on the British passport and maybe even revoke my Thai passport.

 

I guess my long waited answered question is will I be detained if I entered with my Thai passport if I didn't registered or went to the drafting April 2017 ?

 

or would it be better to get a visa exemption on arrival with my British passport ? - also fear here that I might be denied entry because on my British passport would say Thai nationality and they might ask to see my Thai passport.

 

I hope a solution will arise, I'm mainly concerned because I don't want to be stuck in Thailand and not being able to finish my last year of university.

 

Many thanks.

 

Ben

[ubonjoe]

How long do you plan on staying here?

Since you have been living outside the country you should of applied for an exemption from conscription at the embassy in London.

The fact you were not here when you turned 21 really means nothing since the draw is only done once a year. You should not have a problem on entry to the country unless you already missed the draw a local authority for where you are registered made a problem about it.

You could apply for tourist visa for your trip at the embassy in London or one of the honorary consulates. They would not deny the application.

[Benrrd]

I plan on staying for 2 months and returning to England or Switzerland but thank you very helpful information.

[blackcab]

Read the bio page of your British passport again. It will not say anything about being a Thai citizen (other than having a Thai sounding name).

 

Under Section 3, underneath where it says "Nationality" it will say "British Citizen".

[Tanoshi]

As far as I'm aware, there are two exemptions from drafting.

One is those who attended the 3 year Reserve Officer training corps whilst at school, the other is those who are attending University.

 

If you have a British passport, then you have obtained British citizenship.

Your British passport will only state you are a British citizen (no reference to Thai nationality).

 

If you are at University, then I suggest you contact the Thai Embassy in London for further advise.

http://www.thaiembassy.org/london/en/organize/81604-Contact-Details.html 

 

If you intend to stay for 2 months or more and use your British passport to enter, I suggest you obtain a Tourist Visa which will allow a stay of 60 days and can be extended a further 30 days.

 

 

[tifino]

In an inescapable-last-choice scenario, if you are entrapped:

 

 

the other Exemption from 'military' service, is the 3 months as a Monk option

 

(25 yrs old nephew, on OZ Passport did this when he couldn't escape the clutches)

Edited February 3, 2018 by tifino

[Benrrd]

6 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

As far as I'm aware, there are two exemptions from drafting.

One is those who attended the 3 year Reserve Officer training corps whilst at school, the other is those who are attending University.

 

If you have a British passport, then you have obtained British citizenship.

Your British passport will only state you are a British citizen (no reference to Thai nationality).

 

If you are at University, then I suggest you contact the Thai Embassy in London for further advise.

http://www.thaiembassy.org/london/en/organize/81604-Contact-Details.html 

 

If you intend to stay for 2 months or more and use your British passport to enter, I suggest you obtain a Tourist Visa which will allow a stay of 60 days and can be extended a further 30 days.

 

 

Funny story I contacted Thai embassy London for some question and was answered by a very impolite male.

I did not get to ask him any questions he simply said " oh wrong number sorry, bye" and hung up the phone

 

This made me not want to contact the embassy but in this case I will try again thank you for the advice.

[Benrrd]

8 minutes ago, tifino said:

In an inescapable-last-choice scenario, if you are entrapped:

 

 

the other Exemption from 'military' service, is the 3 months as a Monk option

 

(25 yrs old nephew, on OZ Passport did this when he couldn't escape the clutches)

3 months of being a monk sounds very tempting but I am not bothered about serving my main concern was just being detained in Thailand and not being able to return to England to finish my third year at university. I honestly don't mind drafting or volunteering. But I'll keep that scenario in mind! Thank you

[Tanoshi]

6 minutes ago, tifino said:

the other Exemption from 'military' service, is the 3 months as a Monk option

Monks and transgenders still have to go through the interview procedure and plead their case for exemption.

They can only be exempt if not physically fit, mentally unstable, or have changed their appearance to a varying degree.

 

 

[Benrrd]

So just to clarify, if I were to enter on my British passport with a tourist visa I don't have to oblige by Thai laws of serving. At this current stage and I won't be detained arriving or exiting the country.

Edited February 3, 2018 by Benrrd

[ubonjoe]

13 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

As far as I'm aware, there are two exemptions from drafting.

As I stated there is a "Request for Military Service Postponement".

Info and form is here on embassy website. http://www.thaiembassy.org/london/th/services/82032-การขอหนังสือรับรอง.html#b

[ubonjoe]

1 minute ago, Benrrd said:

So just to clarify, if I were to enter on my British passport with a tourist visa I don't have to oblige by Thai laws of serving. At this current stage

You would be entering the country as a British national. Unless you notified the local Amphoe they would not be aware your are in the country.

[Benrrd]

3 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

As I stated there is a "Request for Military Service Postponement".

Info and form is here on embassy website. http://www.thaiembassy.org/london/th/services/82032-การขอหนังสือรับรอง.html#b

Waow a link finally been trying to find this information/form to postpone my military service for weeks thank you shame I cannot read Thai or write Thai but I'll figure a way to do it

[Benrrd]

2 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

You would be entering the country as a British national. Unless you notified the local Amphoe they would not be aware your are in the country.

Fantastic

[tifino]

another thing:   when you turn up on the UK Passport, and get accosted at Immigration as to why you are using the UK Passport, and not the Thai:

 

Remember you have been living U.K. - away (from the language) and so feign you cannot understand whatever the heck they are going on about...
  Speak English - only. Don't hint you even understand anything at all, listening to them - but it takes skill to not let your body language betray you've understood what they want

 

But... if it all transpires you have to fill Forms - again request translations, and answer all in English

 

 

... make 'em work for it

 

 

when a Thai official faces an apparent Thai; they will be speaking Thai at them automatically.

This thinking came, after the fact, when missus was accosted, in Tahi, for using her OZ Passport

Edited February 3, 2018 by tifino

[Tanoshi]

http://www.thaiembassy.org/london/th/services/82032-การขอหนังสือรับรอง.html#b

 

Translated.

Request books, assembling military service Military Service Postponement

Thailand, where men in the UK and Ireland at anachakra age threshold must be drafted. Able to do military service. Can be requested from the Embassy that is located between studying abroad to help military service who filed the domicile of their country, Thailand?

Because the army has filed the message in the book to cross-examine strike waiver waiting to make military service option, then. Students are often not fully submit Thailand including the Embassy certificate issued to students is evidence to apply for the waiver, wait to make selection of such military service. Identify important information is missing, too.

So, to keep it accurate, according to army regulations. Students must bring the following documents.

Submit a waiver request pending operators make choose military service per Sheriff hometown soldier (filed manually or assigned to a parent or legal guardian is instead), complete all 4 messages below and send a copy of the document, in section 1-3, to the Embassy, otherwise the certificate that is issued by the Embassy may have been a military strike from and to cross-examine is not affected to apply for the waiver, wait to make military service option.

The evidence that must be used are as follows: Download .

1. a copy of the voucher, the army exceeded (. 9) , and a copy of the summons into military service (. 35). If there is a .

2. a copy of the House registration a copy of the identity card and passport.

3. a certificate from the Institute of education, which must specify the complete essence. As follows:

3.1 the Board-level disciplines, students What educational institution.

3.2 study courses are a few years old (proof of educational institution contains).

3.3 certificate from an academic institution must be translated into Thailand with signing of the translation and send it to the Embassy. Certified translations.

3.4 to translate the certificate, please make sure that the translation is correct, based on the principles of translation in all respects. . The handwriting of the translators Which must be handwritten and printed ' certified ' translation. ?

4. certificate of the Embassy

4.1 in order to obtain the certificate, students bring the copy of the document in section 1, 2, and 3 submit contains .

4.2. hibbeler (using the request form of legalization, the Embassy, or writing a book considered the Embassy) by requiring that the purpose to postpone for a few years. .

4.3 notification to mobile phone numbers, the Embassy will be contacted immediately If there are any problems (especially in the case of missing documents).
.

The form must be filled in.

The form 1 legalization and the form 2 certification Download .

Sample books to the provincial Governor quit the Embassy Download
.

Can submit it manually at the Embassy every day between 9.00-12.30 a.m. without an appointment in advance or submit evidence above come via postal mail.

Take 2-3 working days and £ 10 fee.

The certificate may be delayed. If the translated version. On the principles of translation, or the translation has not been written correctly or not fully assembled evidence.

Close the queue to get the card at 12.00 am will send back by mail. Please attach the envelope with postage imprinted envelopes to themselves with a claim by.

[Tanoshi]

6 minutes ago, tifino said:

another thing:   when you turn up on the UK Passport, and get accosted at Immigration as to why you are using the UK Passport, and not the Thai:

If using a British passport you are not questioned if you have another Nationality.

[tifino]

Just now, Tanoshi said:

If using a British passport you are not questioned if you have another Nationality.

it happens (happened) at Swampy

[Benrrd]

okay here is another problem to postpone the military draft I need to give some documents like the sor dor 9 and 35? What ever that is because I did not register my name at 18 I was not given a sor dor 9 (a summons letter into the military) don't have one 

[Benrrd]

Should I bother postponing the military draft considering I would be entering thailand with a British passport and visa only for 2 months. 

and if I were to repeat this process on the long run would I be caught out ?

[Tanoshi]

11 minutes ago, Benrrd said:

okay here is another problem to postpone the military draft I need to give some documents like the sor dor 9 and 35? What ever that is because I did not register my name at 18 I was not given a sor dor 9 (a summons letter into the military) don't have one 

Thailand does not automatically draft young men, it is a lottery system where he may or may not be chosen for military service.  At the age of 17, he must enroll in the Registrant List with the Military Registrar [known as Sassadee]  at his District Office. Once enrolled he would be given a Sor Dor 9 Form.  As he is not in the country, he could have a representative on his behalf (usually his parent or relative) to enroll on his behalf.  At the age of 20 he would have to revisit the District office to see the Military Registrar to collect an appointment slip for the lottery (Form is know as Sor Dor 35).  Living and studying overseas does provide temporary exemption to him from the conscription lottery by having his parents presenting letter of confirmation issued by the education institute, letter of confirmation issued by the Thai Embassy/Consulate in the country that education institute located at, Sor Dor 9 (previously obtained), Sor Dor 35 (if any), house registration.  Such exemption will only be available to him until he reaches the age of 29. If he were to not return to Thailand at the end of his schooling but chose to stay in the UK he could still move back to Thailand and, at the age of 30, apply for an exemption based on age. If he moves back to Thailand after University it is important to note that if he has a degree and volunteers on conscription day, he'll only have to serve 6 months, as opposed to the 2 years if you are chosen in the lottery. If he doesn't volunteer (but has a degree) he'll still do the 2 years.

 

https://th-th.facebook.com/notes/sunbelt-asia/military-conscription-for-a-half-thai/196554373700493/

[Benrrd]

I have read this article many time but still doesn't answer my question what do I do I'm not registered in the military registrar and I don't have a sor dor 9 ?

[blackcab]

44 minutes ago, Benrrd said:

So just to clarify, if I were to enter on my British passport with a tourist visa I don't have to oblige by Thai laws of serving. At this current stage and I won't be detained arriving or exiting the country.

 

Wrong.

 

When you are in Thailand you are subject to Thai law. Thai law states that male Thai citizens over 21 must go through the military draft process.

 

If the military discovers you are a Thai citizen and you have not completed the draft process, they can insist you go through the process.

 

Being British does not exempt you. Entering Thailand on a British passport does not exempt you. In fact, the UK embassy will not offer you any assistance at all because they will not interfere between the dealings of a dual national and their second country.

 

However, the likelihood of being discovered if you use a British passport to enter Thailand is very small. Immigration will not know who you are, your Thai ID number, or anything else (unless you tell them).

 

If you only speak English then they will have problems. Don't forget that there are people with Thai ancestry but without Thai citizenship. Foreigners come to Thailand every year trying to claim their citizenship because their parents didn't obtain citizenship for them when they were children.

[tifino]

Not about 'yourself' - but looking back at the OP Title:

 

- many a young Thai could really do with a bit of Enforced Discipline,

a fringe benefit of a bit of barracks time in uniform, 

as it breeds Self Discipline for later life

 

 

 

(I still right-dress and fold my sox)

Edited February 3, 2018 by tifino

[Tanoshi]

8 minutes ago, tifino said:

many a young Thai could really do with a bit of Enforced Discipline,

a fringe benefit of a bit of barracks time in uniform

That's a rather discriminating comment based on age and nationality.

 

[Tanoshi]

17 minutes ago, blackcab said:

However, the likelihood of being discovered if you use a British passport to enter Thailand is very small. Immigration will not know who you are, your Thai ID number, or anything else (unless you tell them).

I 'd totally agree with that.

 

Entering on a British passport with a Tourist Visa is your best option to avoid detection.

 

[tifino]

1 minute ago, Tanoshi said:

That's a rather discriminating comment based on age and nationality.

 

actually, SisterInLaw openly agreed that Nephew needed something done,

and at least the 3month monk option was the only compromise to what she 'really' wanted to be done with him

 

still, he:

came back a new man

now got a job

now married

 

still drinks'n'smoke though

[eddie61]

30,000 baht should fix it.....

[baansgr]

6 hours ago, blackcab said:

Read the bio page of your British passport again. It will not say anything about being a Thai citizen (other than having a Thai sounding name).

 

Under Section 3, underneath where it says "Nationality" it will say "British Citizen".

He may be referring to place of birth, which is probably a Thai town/city 

[samran]

Immigration and the military databases don't talk to each other.

 

Unless there is active paperwork out for you for not registering for conscription (highly unlikely) you'll be fine to come and go from Thailand on your Thai passport.

 

This thread has a lot of good background for someone in your situation