Humans first - soi dogs second! Thais now advocating "the final solution"

[pedro01]

55 minutes ago, Airbagwill said:

Malaysia is now not rabies free and the most recent case in Feb was on the peninsular - the cull was a total failure and the dog population is retuning and rabies has spread from Borneo to the mainland.

relatively speaking Malaysia has a much smaller free roaming dog population and of course areas like Borneo are thickly forested, so any cull will fail as animals can flee or enter from the wilderness.

To "eliminate" rabies in any mainland country, you would also have to kill all the wild mammals as well.

 

 

A cull is not a one time thing - it has to be ongoing. It has to have the buy in from people not to treat stray animals like domestic pets.

[ChiangMaiLightning2143]

On 15/03/2018 at 4:09 PM, brucegoniners said:

Why doesn't this country invest in some real shelters for these animals? 

 

It's not their fault that their owners didn't fix them or that many Thais just let dogs go in the streets when they don't want to take care of them anymore.

 

The mark of a good society is not only how it takes care of it's people, but also how it takes care of it's animals.

 

Dogs are the most loyal creatures on god's earth, much more so than humans.

 

This country should stick to it's buddhist rules and not kill what god created.

Buddhism does not say there is a god and there is no God anyway.

 

Soi dogs are pests, created of human neglect like every other problem on the Earth.

There is a cull everyday in so-called civilized countries. Animals are rounded up and shunted to dog pounds and shelter. The unwanted surplus are destroyed in a Humane process,

Until Thailand develops such centers repeated culls are PART of a solution not the total answer. Any dog on the streets without a license or chip should be dealt with.

People who let their mutt run free or feed  and water soi dogs should be face heavy fines or be arrested.  If they love animals so much let them serve out community service volunteering at animal shelters.

 

No it is not the dogs fault, what of their existence? Lie in the street get scabrous. Bark. Poop. Chase a Farang. Bark. Eat Garbage. Bark,  repeat. Not a moment of happiness I'd say it is suffering and they should be put out of their misery humanely.

 

Edited March 28, 2018 by ChiangMaiLightning2143

[Airbagwill]

26 minutes ago, pedro01 said:

 

A cull is not a one time thing - it has to be ongoing. It has to have the buy in from people not to treat stray animals like domestic pets.

...and as such is impractical.

The I'll-fated cu'll in Malaysia was a knee jerk reaction that killed 4000 dogs...not The 4 million advocated by those misinformed in Thailand 

[Airbagwill]

7 minutes ago, ChiangMaiLightning2143 said:

Buddhism does not say there is a god and there is no God anyway.

 

Soi dogs are pests, created of human neglect like every other problem on the Earth.

There is a cull everyday in so-called civilized countries. Animals are rounded up and shunted to dog pounds and shelter. The unwanted surplus are destroyed in a Humane process,

Until Thailand develops such centers repeated culls are PART of a solution not the total answer. Any dog on the streets without a license or chip should be dealt with.

People who let their mutt run free or feed  and water soi dogs should be face heavy fines or be arrested.  If they love animals so much let them serve out community service volunteering at animal shelters.

 

No it is not the dogs fault, what of their existence? Lie in the street get scabrous. Bark. Poop. Chase a Farang. Bark. Eat Garbage. Bark,  repeat. Not a moment of happiness I'd say it is suffering and they should be put out of their misery humanely.

 

As explained culls only shift the population around and as a long term solution simply don't work.

Imagine if you removed every dog from Bkk, what would happen then? You'd have to start on the cats....after the cats the rats......if you have a propensity pointless Sysiphus type tasks, well a cull us for you..

Anyone come up with a preferred method of culling and carcass disposal yet?

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎3‎/‎27‎/‎2018 at 12:32 PM, Airbagwill said:

Absolutely no-one has suggested HOW the dogs could be culled either which kind of underlines the depth of thought that has gone into it.

Either you haven't read all the thread or you are making it up. I suggested a way to carry out the cull, unless you are claiming I'm "no one".

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, Airbagwill said:

Malaysia is now not rabies free and the most recent case in Feb was on the peninsular - the cull was a total failure and the dog population is retuning and rabies has spread from Borneo to the mainland.

relatively speaking Malaysia has a much smaller free roaming dog population and of course areas like Borneo are thickly forested, so any cull will fail as animals can flee or enter from the wilderness.

To "eliminate" rabies in any mainland country, you would also have to kill all the wild mammals as well.

 

Culling has to be an on going project, not a oncer.

Of course strays will return as vile people throw their unwanted pets onto the streets to fend for themselves.

I have yet to be pursued by any wild mammals in LOS, as they probably have too much sense to try and live among humans, or they would get eaten.

Edited March 28, 2018 by thaibeachlovers

[AboutThaim]

27 minutes ago, Airbagwill said:

As explained culls only shift the population around and as a long term solution simply don't work.

Imagine if you removed every dog from Bkk, what would happen then? You'd have to start on the cats....after the cats the rats......if you have a propensity pointless Sysiphus type tasks, well a cull us for you..

Anyone come up with a preferred method of culling and carcass disposal yet?

Yes, several.  Where do you buy the selective blinkers that you obviously wear?

[AboutThaim]

On 27/03/2018 at 12:41 PM, Airbagwill said:

Which as has been explained doesn't work. please explain how you would operate this cull.

Please explain in detail how you will limit the food supply of these scavengers to effectively reduce the population.  You want every other poster to explain how they would effectively cull the population.  Would you have police patrol the sois at night to catch the locals that put out their left over rice?  Are you going to somehow protect the almost endless food supply of other mammals, birds, reptiles?

 

There have been several suggestions on how to cull and dispose of the carcasses but you just keep on with the same ol' bla, bla, bla, ad nauseum.

[smew]

Hello, all you people posting comments please save your breath with all your suggestions and ideas this is Thailand nothing will be done unless there is cash involved for the people with decision and  powers to implement. 

[Artisi]

To Airbagwill: using your figure of 5 million dogs in Thailand, can you please answer the following simple questions:

1. how long will it take to reduce the 5m population to an acceptable level by starvation, considering that while some dogs are starving others will be reproducing? 

2. how do you intend to  completely remove all food sources?   

3. how do you intend to collect randomly starved dogs dotted throughout the country and dispose of the carcasses..? 

How about for once, answering a few direct questions instead of the usual mantra of, it doesn't work, you don't know what your talking about, I've told you before, how about getting up to speed etc. 

Your move, you consider yourself the expert on this subject, always with the same answer - so here is your chance for once to make a meaningful contribution to the discussion. 

Of course all other misinformed poster are welcome to join it the discussion, although your ideas etc. are useless, misdirected and a waste of time. 

Eagerly awaiting your reply. 

[humbug]

animals abusers should be castrated and animal killers should be euthanized

 

an eye for an eye

 

you have more chance of dying of swallowing chewing gum than rabies

 

if anyone cant stand sharing a planet with animals then those humans dont deserve to be in this planet

 

its as simple as that

Edited March 28, 2018 by humbug

[Artisi]

34 minutes ago, humbug said:

animals abusers should be castrated and animal killers should be euthanized

 

an eye for an eye

 

you have more chance of dying of swallowing chewing gum than rabies

 

if anyone cant stand sharing a planet with animals then those humans dont deserve to be in this planet

 

its as simple as that

Bah! humbug. 

[johng]

animals abusers should be castrated and animal killers should be euthanized
 

Off course you your self are a vegan who doesn't use cosmetics or toiletries and doesn't take medicine or vaccinations ?

[AboutThaim]

1 hour ago, humbug said:

animals abusers should be castrated and animal killers should be euthanized

 

an eye for an eye

 

you have more chance of dying of swallowing chewing gum than rabies

 

if anyone cant stand sharing a planet with animals then those humans dont deserve to be in this planet

 

its as simple as that

That comment really hums (stinks) so bug ...er off.

[Artisi]

14 minutes ago, johng said:

 

Off course you your self are a vegan who doesn't use cosmetics or toiletries and doesn't take medicine or vaccinations ?

 

and he loves cockroaches, spiders, ants, mosquito's, leaches, diseased cats - dogs -cow- birds -  you -  know the type, all mouth and trousers  (with out must in there)

[oldlakey]

5 hours ago, Airbagwill said:

Malaysia is now not rabies free and the most recent case in Feb was on the peninsular - the cull was a total failure and the dog population is retuning and rabies has spread from Borneo to the mainland.

relatively speaking Malaysia has a much smaller free roaming dog population and of course areas like Borneo are thickly forested, so any cull will fail as animals can flee or enter from the wilderness.

To "eliminate" rabies in any mainland country, you would also have to kill all the wild mammals as well.

 

Oh my goodness Airbagwill, where on earth are you getting your info from

The last case on the Peninsular was in Feb 55555555555555555

The last case of human infection on the peninsular was late 20th century, are you incapable of simple research or do the results not fit your agenda

The last animal infections on peninsular Malaysia were quickly removed by that word we must not use CULL and that was in the last quarter of 2015

A widespread vaccination programme was also undertaken in the effected area

The last death from rabies in MALAYSIA was in SARAWAK this was a man who was bitten on NOV 27 2017 who was treated on the day at a clinic but the MUPPETS did not vaccinate him or refer him to a government hospital thus he died 2+ months later

That outbreak has now been declared under control

Rabies has spread from Borneo to the mainland 55555555555555

You are in need of serious help my man, I really feel sorry for you because you seem to believe the absolute BS you post 5555555555555555555

Why you no UNDERSTAND simple truths 5555555555555

Peninsular Malaysia is now free of rabies because of the cull plus a vaccination programme, its not rabies free as a whole because of the Sarawak outbreak which came from Indonesia / Kalimantan it will take some time for Malaysia to be able to claim its rabies free again if ever having borders with Thailand and Indonesia

This will be my last post on this thread as I know when I am beaten

Have a nice day

 

[AboutThaim]

The final solution.  If you are threatened by a soi dog.  Carry a paper bag with you at all times.  When threatened quickly blow up the bag and pop it with your hands.  An airbagwill fix the problem! 555

[johng]

 

14 minutes ago, AboutThaim said:

blow up the bag and pop it with your hands.

A kids "cap gun" works well too...but maybe best to cut the barrel off  in case someone thought it is real.

[Airbagwill]

17 hours ago, oldlakey said:

Oh my goodness Airbagwill, where on earth are you getting your info from

The last case on the Peninsular was in Feb 55555555555555555

The last case of human infection on the peninsular was late 20th century, are you incapable of simple research or do the results not fit your agenda

The last animal infections on peninsular Malaysia were quickly removed by that word we must not use CULL and that was in the last quarter of 2015

A widespread vaccination programme was also undertaken in the effected area

The last death from rabies in MALAYSIA was in SARAWAK this was a man who was bitten on NOV 27 2017 who was treated on the day at a clinic but the MUPPETS did not vaccinate him or refer him to a government hospital thus he died 2+ months later

That outbreak has now been declared under control

Rabies has spread from Borneo to the mainland 55555555555555

You are in need of serious help my man, I really feel sorry for you because you seem to believe the absolute BS you post 5555555555555555555

Why you no UNDERSTAND simple truths 5555555555555

Peninsular Malaysia is now free of rabies because of the cull plus a vaccination programme, its not rabies free as a whole because of the Sarawak outbreak which came from Indonesia / Kalimantan it will take some time for Malaysia to be able to claim its rabies free again if ever having borders with Thailand and Indonesia

This will be my last post on this thread as I know when I am beaten

Have a nice day

 

7 people have died of rabies in Malaysia. However there are cases of animals with rabies every year - they are often blamed on animals coming over the border from Thailand replacing gaps in the population left by unsuccessful culls.

Malaysia has an 80 km "barrier" they try to maintain between themselves and Thailand.

 

PS - rabies in many cultures is called "the Rage" due to the wild an irrational behaviour of those who suffer from it.

 

Edited March 29, 2018 by Airbagwill

[Keesters]

On 3/28/2018 at 10:58 AM, Airbagwill said:

Lets get one thing straight culling doesn't work, never will and "set Zero" as some of the Thai media are referring to it as is NEVER gonna happen.

 

it you cull in your street (BTW - how did you do this?) you will eventually see dogs returning .....of course they could be carrying disease as well and will fight with any other dogs - owned or not - on the streets.

 

of course you could keep killing dogs ad infinitum, but it would be a lot easier just to stop feeding them and you'll find they soon melt away.

Culls don't work...so you say...everybody else disagrees with you. It works if you keep doing it which is what I said.  Please keep up and read.

 

The Thais are the ones advocating a cull...see OP. How they do it is up to them

 

I don't feed stray dogs and don't advocate it either. Plenty of people do perhaps they should be included in the cull.

[Keesters]

On 3/28/2018 at 11:03 AM, Airbagwill said:

I think it has been explained quite adequately why that doesn't work - you just create a flow of dogs from out side - remember there are about 5 million to replace the ones you killed.

What is your method for killing all these dogs that arrive on a conveyor belt  system?

It's a continual flow of culling ... please read and keep up. If you keep on removing the source of a problem the problem will eventually go away.

 

How it is done is up to the Thais...it is them that are advocating "the final solution"

 

 

[Keesters]

On 3/28/2018 at 11:00 AM, Airbagwill said:

You should note that 40% of all Rabies infections come from owned "pet" dogs. ... not free roaming animals. Of course you have had yours vaccinated?

And many of those free roaming dogs are pets let out for a poop after which they return home. All my dogs past present and future have had/will have rabies vaccinations.In Pattaya it is law for dogs out in public area and my dogs get proper exercise, leashed of course.

[milouone]

We are in the twenty-first century, our thoughts are regressing. we are unable to think of the well-being of all. I thank this person who 543 years ago tried to show us a way. Thanks to Thailand for trying to show us the other possibilities that we demonstrate day after day in our western countries. Are our facade democracies the panacea? Let me doubt it strongly. Have our minds clear or are we a product of our policies imbued with power.

Avoiding a massacre is possible, unfortunately in our world only governed by money ...

 

[Airbagwill]

52 minutes ago, Keesters said:

It's a continual flow of culling ... please read and keep up. If you keep on removing the source of a problem the problem will eventually go away.

 

How it is done is up to the Thais...it is them that are advocating "the final solution"

 

 

The Thai authorities are NOT advocating the "final solution" - "Set Zero" as some call it

Continual culling HOW? Darrts - have you costed that? plus euthanising the animals and disposing of the bodies at a rate that is fast enough?

You can capture and destroy small numbers in a small population but in the large mainland population this is not possible as the rate of culling and cost is not effective.

what are you going to do with the cats?

 

 

"If you keep on removing the source of a problem the problem will eventually go away." - this is incorrect especially with a large mainland dog population - the only ways to reduce are neutering and reducing the food supply.

As the authorities know there is no point.

 

The action being taken in Bangkok is capture, vaccinate neuter and release. The expected time is 6 years. to ring the population under control.

In Phuket the SDF "have reduced the street dog population from 80,000 in 2003 to an estimated 4,000 to 6,000 now. And, as a result of the vaccination part of the programme, Phuket is the only province in Thailand that is, according to the government, rabies-free." - SDF

 

to achieve a virtually rabies free you need to keep a level of 70% vaccination and keep other dogs from coming into the area, culling does the opposite, it allows dogs in from outside areas. So to keep the 70% the dogs are returned and spayed. 

 

 

Edited March 29, 2018 by Airbagwill

[Airbagwill]

52 minutes ago, Keesters said:

It's a continual flow of culling ... please read and keep up. If you keep on removing the source of a problem the problem will eventually go away.

 

How it is done is up to the Thais...it is them that are advocating "the final solution"

 

 

 

Dogs in Thailand - 2.ppsx

[Airbagwill]

1 hour ago, Keesters said:

Culls don't work...so you say...everybody else disagrees with you. It works if you keep doing it which is what I said.  Please keep up and read.

 

The Thais are the ones advocating a cull...see OP. How they do it is up to them

 

I don't feed stray dogs and don't advocate it either. Plenty of people do perhaps they should be included in the cull.

"Culls don't work...so you say" - No! I don't say, every organisation/authority involved in dog control says so - you are confusing the messenger with the message.

[oldlakey]

1 hour ago, Airbagwill said:

7 people have died of rabies in Malaysia. However there are cases of animals with rabies every year - they are often blamed on animals coming over the border from Thailand replacing gaps in the population left by unsuccessful culls.

Malaysia has an 80 km "barrier" they try to maintain between themselves and Thailand.

 

PS - rabies in many cultures is called "the Rage" due to the wild an irrational behaviour of those who suffer from it.

 

I know I said I had made my last post but as you are really good entertainment and if truth were told I sort of like you as long as I can switch you off when you just become too much

In your POST 481 you claimed the last case of rabies in Peninsular Malaysia was in FEB now you know that is incorrect dont you my man in fact its total BS

Now you claim there is rabies cases every year in Malaysia concerning animals MORE BS my man

Stop making silly claims which are easily disproved via the internet to try and support your claim that the CULL of 2015 did not work it DID hence no more rabies cases in Peninsular Malaysia since

The deaths from rabies in Sarawak should not be confused with the Peninsular outbreak, but anyway that outbreak has been declared over as no new cases have been detected for several months

Research  will show when Malaysia was a Rabies free country

Why do you insist on continually making a fool of yourself cant you see how silly you look

[AboutThaim]

2 hours ago, Airbagwill said:

to achieve a virtually rabies free you need to keep a level of 70% vaccination and keep other dogs from coming into the area, culling does the opposite, it allows dogs in from outside areas. So to keep the 70% the dogs are returned and spayed. 

 

Huh? You say to achieve rabies free you need to vaccinate and keep other dogs coming in to the area.  Then the opposite is culling which allows other dogs to come into the area. So in one scenario it is possible to stop dogs from other areas coming in but not in the other.

 

BTW how are you progressing with the details of how to put scavenging dogs on restricted rations?  That seems to be your main arguement for reducing the population. Even though you also say they will go somewhere else if there is no food.  Can you clear up those points to give your arguement a smidgen of respectively?

[Artisi]

2 hours ago, AboutThaim said:

Huh? You say to achieve rabies free you need to vaccinate and keep other dogs coming in to the area.  Then the opposite is culling which allows other dogs to come into the area. So in one scenario it is possible to stop dogs from other areas coming in but not in the other.

 

BTW how are you progressing with the details of how to put scavenging dogs on restricted rations?  That seems to be your main arguement for reducing the population. Even though you also say they will go somewhere else if there is no food.  Can you clear up those points to give your arguement a smidgen of respectively?

Fat chance of anything forthcoming, that would need a considered comment, not a rehash of existing data. 

[Airbagwill]

Silly claims disproved by the internet?

 

I make claims based on documentation from the government and media.

The last person to die was in Feb, 7 people have died in Malaysia, the mainland has regular findings of rabies, this is because animals for Thailand are thought to bring it in.

They hve a very strict 80 km barrier zone that is very thoroughly policed and frequently turn stuff up.

 

The difference of course is that the stray dog population is far smaller relative to Thailand's massive numbers 

 

Malaysia is also predominantly a Muslim country where many consider dogs as "unclean" which means that unlike Thailand there are far lwess people feeding the animals.

As you well know by now it ultimately is the size of the food source that determines the size of the dog population.

 

There have been no successful culls in Asia EVER.