How Many Have Left Los

[tijnebijn]

TAWP and Roger are more than absolutely right.

What Tawp ment is that there have become many changes,and lt is the same for me,how you could be prepared for something to change all of a sudden and cope with that a few months after you need a new visa???

Tell me!!!!!!

it is not stange we are complaining and no I have never been a visarunner(VOA).

There are just a lot us who try to cope,and like Roger said ,let's say after a marriage and maybe a child as well, years done means they really love and prosper each other right??

Give them the non-o,regardless what income or whatsoever,the 200k a while ago seems now very reasonable.

It is outrageous when you have a thai family to make it so complicated,they should also make it more easy when you do not have a high education to work,thailand has the lowestunemployment in the world I read resently,so what;s the problem???

I think there should be more postings on this,and then we can see hw many people are in this situation.

[rogerinthai]

what is the point of staying here if this is your focus ?

would it not be easier to make an effort to accomodate the new regulations and get on with enjoying all the thing that los has to offer.

after all is said and done, isn't this our primary reason for being here ?

Well, it depends. If you simply retire here, living on money made elsewhere, you are right - why bother?

But if you want to build your life here as a relatively young person that has decades of living here in front of you, you want to develop a buisness and be able to own it properly, you want to be able buy a house and be able to own the land under it withour relying on the wife and relatives or on whatever temporary legal loopholes, you do not want to be continuously "on a temporary visa" or "on a work permit" which can be changed or cancelled whenever, you want to know that you have a solid basis for building your life here, raising children and all and that you will not be kicked out suddenly (and have maybe 7 days to leave the place! after living here for years!), then, it might be worthwhile to make some efforts.

[Geppis72]

what is the point of staying here if this is your focus ?

would it not be easier to make an effort to accomodate the new regulations and get on with enjoying all the thing that los has to offer.

after all is said and done, isn't this our primary reason for being here ?

Well, it depends. If you simply retire here, living on money made elsewhere, you are right - why bother?

But if you want to build your life here as a relatively young person that has decades of living here in front of you, you want to develop a buisness and be able to own it properly, you want to be able buy a house and be able to own the land under it withour relying on the wife and relatives or on whatever temporary legal loopholes, you do not want to be continuously "on a temporary visa" or "on a work permit" which can be changed or cancelled whenever, you want to know that you have a solid basis for building your life here, raising children and all and that you will not be kicked out suddenly (and have maybe 7 days to leave the place! after living here for years!), then, it might be worthwhile to make some efforts.

Agree 100% !!

Also... if you open a new company and want to do something legally,

and you are not married with a Thai,

and you are not over 50

you can not,

because you will not full fill the requirement for the Visa extension

due no proof of tax paid earlier.

[tijnebijn]

Roger we totally understand each other.

For canot own something I do not bother personnally actually,cause that is something i new when I came here in the first place,got children and when something happens to my wife it will automatically go to my children,so let say it short I can't take any possessions with me when i die with me anyway,at least that is what I believe.

For me this topic now is about to stay and they just be fare.

my wife is saying that there is a big chance when a new government arises(HOPE LEFT THINKING),that alot will be corrected,I sincerely hope so.

[terry57]

what is the point of staying here if this is your focus ?

would it not be easier to make an effort to accomodate the new regulations and get on with enjoying all the thing that los has to offer.

after all is said and done, isn't this our primary reason for being here ?

Well, it depends. If you simply retire here, living on money made elsewhere, you are right - why bother?

But if you want to build your life here as a relatively young person that has decades of living here in front of you, you want to develop a buisness and be able to own it properly, you want to be able buy a house and be able to own the land under it withour relying on the wife and relatives or on whatever temporary legal loopholes, you do not want to be continuously "on a temporary visa" or "on a work permit" which can be changed or cancelled whenever, you want to know that you have a solid basis for building your life here, raising children and all and that you will not be kicked out suddenly (and have maybe 7 days to leave the place! after living here for years!), then, it might be worthwhile to make some efforts.

what is your situation rodger ?

are you in trouble because you are to young for a retirement visa, not married, so you cant get a marrage visa or just dont have enough money to accomadate the new changes. ?

your post sort of tells me you are trying to change the unchangeable.

you cant own land as a farang and thats always been the same. so whats your point on that one.?

you can own a condo if you want.

you can own a house and lease the land if you want.

my friend does this and has a 30 year lease. chances are he will be dead by then.

if you get married the land deeds remain in the thai wifes name and always have done.

i mean do you want to fight the government to change all these things.?

ill tell you what to do, and this is sure fire no risk stuff.

invest all your money in your own country and live of your interest.

if you dont want to play by the thai rules, just rent as rents are very cheap especially in the north.

this way you have nothing to worry about.

you seem to be throwing up the worst case senario's for all situations.

if you have no money nobody can help you and we are all in the same boat when it comes to that.

one cannot blame the thai system if they have no money to meet the regulations governing farang being able to reside in the country.

i am only approaching this subject in a practical manner.

[rogerinthai]

because of former very lax and easy immigration rules the government has been forced to close loop holes.

Lax and easy immigration rules??? You must be kidding. Do you know that in Cambodia you can get a visa for a year for around 200 USD, no questions asked? In the US, tourist visa for 6 months easily (as a European), in Sri Lanka you can get a resident visa pretty easily (one year, extendable) and own land outright, etc etc.

Thailand's visa rules were, and are, especially strict, they are an exception, both when considering the region and other places.

I do not belong to those who cry "what will Thailand do without the visa runners". No, I believe Thailand will do just fine (changes in foreign investments as a result of last changes are another story). But, let's ask - what damage did those visa runners do to Thailand?

[tijnebijn]

Yeah terry with this one I agree with you.

The different things Roger talks about I agree too,nothing more to say.

maybe one of us can start a new post on this,on the other hand getting tired of it....

[terry57]

Yeah terry with this one I agree with you.

The different things Roger talks about I agree too,nothing more to say.

maybe one of us can start a new post on this,on the other hand getting tired of it....

yes im over it to mate and just one more thing to roger.

[terry57]

because of former very lax and easy immigration rules the government has been forced to close loop holes.

Lax and easy immigration rules??? You must be kidding. Do you know that in Cambodia you can get a visa for a year for around 200 USD, no questions asked? In the US, tourist visa for 6 months easily (as a European), in Sri Lanka you can get a resident visa pretty easily (one year, extendable) and own land outright, etc etc.

Thailand's visa rules were, and are, especially strict, they are an exception, both when considering the region and other places.

I do not belong to those who cry "what will Thailand do without the visa runners". No, I believe Thailand will do just fine (changes in foreign investments as a result of last changes are another story). But, let's ask - what damage did those visa runners do to Thailand?

well for my last comment roger.

visa runners done absolutely no damage at all to thailand and my point about lax immigration rules was directed at visa runners.

not too many countries around that would allow this system, so the party is over.

you must admit that the runners had a very good thing going there for a long time, as being able to come and go like that was surely a privilage and could not last.

anyway mate,

take it easy on your self as it can all be sorted if you work with them and not against them.

good luck to you.

[appleman_thai]

I am leaving next month - after 5 and half years.

I worked as an Expat for 5 years. Bought 2 condos.

Applied for Investment Visa - was sent around the world for all kinds of papers and documents until finally it came to October 2nd and they said that the Investment Visa was cancelled..although I had applied back in August.

In Suan PLu they treated me like a second class citizen - which is what I am here!

In Hua Hin they were extremely nice and friendly but the decision lies with Bangkok so all the smiles couldnt help me.

I think Thailand is going through some tough times and it is quite clear that there is an anti foreigner feeling. Some people call it zenophobia but thats just a fancy word for being racist.

I wonder what type of people Thailand want to stay? I am financially sound, can speak reasonable Thai, can read and write a bit too, I am resepctful to Thai customs and ways and genuinely tried to fit in.

But I get the destinct feeling that I am not wanted.

So I am going home and will have fantastic memories of an Amazing country. No regrets, no bad feelings but just a feeling that it could and should have been even better.

Bye Bye Thailand -

[rogerinthai]

what is your situation rodger ?

are you in trouble because you are to young for a retirement visa, not married, so you cant get a marrage visa or just dont have enough money to accomadate the new changes. ?

I am 31, unmarried, been here on a Non-Imm-B for several years, started my company and have a WP, currently considering closing it for various reasons.

i mean do you want to fight the government to change all these things.?

Listen, as you can imagine, I have other things I am interested in, and will not dedicate my life to fighting the laws, BUT it doesn't mean I will not be very willing to help and support such intiatives. Read Heng's last replies again - other immigrants have done it in other places. Why should Thailand be an exception?

[Heng]

It's all relative. Some immigrants have had to face lower, some have had to deal with much higher hurdles.

Correct, and I don't want to sound as if I am making excuses, but in the era of communication, computers and flights, was it ever easier to make sure someone gets out and stays out? Especially when this someone does not look a tiny bit like the local population?

Western Countires have laws regarding foreigners who stay there for years with families, they have a good chance to become legitimate, allowed to stay indefinitely and work with no limitations - but in Thailand, even those who stayed here legitimately, for many many years, do not receive such rights.

Yeah, the laws are indeed different. It's a different country, hence there are different laws. But that's besides the point anyway, as going down that path will inevitably lead to the "our rules are better than your rules" type of debate.

For folks who have an issue with the current law, the options are either comply, work to change them (long term), or do your best to bend and break the law. My point is that it seems that most western foreigners opt for the latter. Eastern and southern Asians do the latter as well, but they also have been steadily working their way into influencing the laws themselves for a long time as well.

[tropo]

for every 1 farang that leave there will be a 1000 that will stay exactly where they are, so i cant see the problem actually.

You're getting a distorted view of the real figures. The guys who are leaving are not the type who generally post on this forum, and even if they were they're now too busy packing and relocating.

[tropo]

Ok,then read this....

a friend of mine who has 4 condos let out to falangs , has had 2 contracts broken in the past month by falangs saying they cant get a visa to stay. they had both previously been here for many years.

i have no idea whether these falangs are the right kind of falang or the wrong kind of falang , but they told my friend that they had had enough of jumping through hoops here to satisfy immigration and the labour department and were moving out. they closed down their small businesses and three thais lost their jobs.

one moved to japan and one to malaysia.

hardly an exodus , but maybe indicative of a trend.

Or a few of the others.

Right on Chuchok.

My English landlord who has about 35 million baht invested in real estate in Pattaya/Jomtien can hardly find tenants now for his mid to upmarket apartments. No one is signing 6 month or 1 year contracts. He's dropping the rents, but still hardly a bite.

When I took up one of his apartments in June he was full at higher prices.

The exodus has begun.