Hypertension Clinic Local Hospital

[Speedo1968]

I have been asked to attend a Hypertension Clinic at my local government hospital in a small town 50km south of Khon Kaen.

 

I am from UK, aged 71 and, have had numerous TIA's and strokes, some with complications, since 2012.   

Generally I am admitted to the local hospital; if the event is bad, sometimes transferred to KK.     Most TIA's I have learnt to manage.

Fortunately my heart seems to be strong, my heart rate is low 40 / 45 avg, but BP 150 / 160 - 65 / 80 avg.

In my earlier years I did competition and sea swimming and my early working life was farming.

I walk 4km twice per day, 4.30am and 6pm with proper breathing all the time, plus a variety of simple exercises at home.

I am vegan for many years, my diet is excellent, non smoker / drinker and follow some alternative treatments both physical

e.g. corsaar ( excuse spelling ), chiropractic, accupuncture etc., and food e.g. chlorophyll, local herbs etc.  

I take only a minimum dose of one medication for BP and, as I am allergic to antibiotics I self treat using alternative therapies

as I do for any other symptoms that may require some form of intervention.

 

My questions are:

#1 - Has anyone else taken part in the HP clinic ?

#2 - Do the clinics take note of ethnicity, age, height, weight when offering advice ?

#3 - Is discussion of "alternative treatments" taboo here as I have found only one doctor willing to acknowledge its usefulness ?

 

[MalandLee]

Hi Speedo,

I am a mirror image, same age, vegan, non smoker, non drinker BP about same.

However I differ significantly in heart rate. I strongly suggest you get an opinion on your heart rate as "Bradycardia" can be an issue.

You are not an Olympic athlete given your stated exercise regime, fitter than most perhaps, but..

May I also respectfully suggest, you at least acknowledge, that what you are currently doing is not working. You need to look at some other treatment regime, lest one of those TIA's hits you much harder.

May I also suggest, you "school" your loved ones, *living with you*, the symptoms AND correct response, should the big one hit you unexpectedly - correct first aid and PROMPT intervention, will leave you with a much better quality of life.

Good Luck mate,
Mal

[Sheryl]

They will take note of your weight, height and age. Not likely your ethnicity since Thai hospitals are accustomed to dealing with a homogenous population.

 

They will not promote or discuss "alternative" treatments unless you mean things kike exercise, diet (which are not really alternative, they are quite mainstream).

 

Mainly they will monitor your BP and try different meds until it is better controlled. It is not adequately controlled at present. They'll also give you advise about diet , exercise and avoiding excess sodium all of which you likely already know.

 

If as it sounds like this is a district level (community) hospital the range of meds they will have available for HTN may be limited and it might be wise for you to forego treatment there for KKU Hospital.

 

From your heart rate it sounds like you may be on a beta blocker, these are no longer preferred for management of HTN in most cases. If I were you I'd see a cardiovascular specialist at Srinagarind (KKU Hosp) after hours clinic.

 

I trust you are also on an anticoagulant or aspirin?

 

 

 

 

[meatboy]

most of what has been suggested already take note.today I had my appointment at what is supposed to be an INR clinic.

every time I have to tell them because of the medication I take,and the arm in the cuff method of taking my blood pressure its always above 160-170.

I have an Omron hem 7130 bp.machine at home.i take most of my meds by 8.30am.and test at 11am.

the second test is always in the 130's,to prove this the wife takes a photo of the test and me as proof that my BP.is controlled.this happens all the time at a gov.hospital,they don't give you time to sit and relax.

[Speedo1968]

On 5/1/2018 at 6:42 PM, MalandLee said:

Hi Speedo,

I am a mirror image, same age, vegan, non smoker, non drinker BP about same.

However I differ significantly in heart rate. I strongly suggest you get an opinion on your heart rate as "Bradycardia" can be an issue.

You are not an Olympic athlete given your stated exercise regime, fitter than most perhaps, but..

May I also respectfully suggest, you at least acknowledge, that what you are currently doing is not working. You need to look at some other treatment regime, lest one of those TIA's hits you much harder.

May I also suggest, you "school" your loved ones, *living with you*, the symptoms AND correct response, should the big one hit you unexpectedly - correct first aid and PROMPT intervention, will leave you with a much better quality of life.

Good Luck mate,
Mal

Thanks Mal for your comments and thoughts.

 

I live alone but have a friend nearby who has helped in various ways in the past, however, "sods law" can always happen when a person is away, as it did in June last year.     Unfortunately I was totally paralysed except for my fingers so could not move anywhere.  When found, my friend stayed at the hospital and again saved my life with her knowledge, just as they did in 2012..

With their help It took me just 3 months to be able to walk my long walks again.

I have had two TIA's since that time, one with severe bacterial infection from a dog scratch, which again put me off my legs for two months.     My friend was there for the rescue on these occasions too.

Fortunately I am normally aware some days in advance of an impending TIA.   I go to the local hospital if it is bad.

 

 

As a rider to the above, I prepared a DNR request some years ago, which is with my family in the UK, and the hospitals I attend.    Further, it is part of a small file that is on display in my house, with a similar copy with me when ever I leave the house.   The folder also includes a list of any current medication and a full list of all my drug allergies, of which there are many.       It has helped prevent the hospital giving me something I am allergic to, including antibiotics and, the hospital generally ask me if the list they have is up to date and to sign a waiver regarding treatment.

 

I have now been on a new medication for a month and am settling down to its effects.

I have modified my diet slightly ( still vegan, now 30 years ) and the way I eat.

My exercise regime still includes walking but have added some further low power exercise through out the day.            I would love to include swimming but the local pool is often crowded and Korat ( The Mall ) pool is a little too far away.   

My BP is improving, often lower after exercise; my heart rate slowly edging upwards.

 

Thanks again for your thoughts.

 

 

[Speedo1968]

On 5/2/2018 at 2:19 PM, meatboy said:

most of what has been suggested already take note.today I had my appointment at what is supposed to be an INR clinic.

every time I have to tell them because of the medication I take,and the arm in the cuff method of taking my blood pressure its always above 160-170.

I have an Omron hem 7130 bp.machine at home.i take most of my meds by 8.30am.and test at 11am.

the second test is always in the 130's,to prove this the wife takes a photo of the test and me as proof that my BP.is controlled.this happens all the time at a gov.hospital,they don't give you time to sit and relax.

Thanks :meatboy" for your response.

Yes, have taken note of the various replies and information.

 

Some of the local hospital doctors do not even make eye contact with me let alone talk with me, if I have a Thai person with me.   Even when admitted to hospital.

As for BP testing most try to ask questions whilst taking your BP !

 

My BP is improving after I tweaked a few things 'in my diet, exercise etc., only heart rate remains low ( !? ), however that is also increasing slightly.   

 

Like you I use an Omron, an M2 Basic, have tested it against local clinic readings and it is fine.

I take numerous times a day but less so since I have adjusted to a new medication a month ago.    Has some unwanted side effects, but what doesn't ?

 

I may go on the first requested visit to the Hypertension Clinic as I am interested in my blood readings a year after my first stroke that had serious complications.

 

 

[meatboy]

we both seem to be in the same boat,although I have had heart surgery ect,2007.

I did have a mini stroke [T.I.A.] CT. brain scan reaveled nothing,i have also had a series of seizure's again scans have revealed nothing.i have been put on medication [nov] 2017 and they seem to have worked,although the first med.played havoc with my WARFARIN RANGE.as for the hypertension clinic,whenever I do a test at home,the wife takes a photo of the second test and saves it for reference.

last week at maharat my first bp.test was 202,after 3more tests it still showed 160.

the last few tests,5th.138/68

7th.147/71.

9th.132/63.these are my second test.same time every time 11am-11.30am.

are you on medication for the T.I.A.

[Speedo1968]

Sorry to read you had to have heart surgery.

 

Since my first TIA in 2012 I have listed around 40 TIA's and 6 strokes.

They have affected both left and right side, fortunately, I have managed most of them without hospital intervention.

Even when hospitalised, my friend and I continued with 'alternative' approaches to manage the effects ( much to the chagrin of the doctors ), in all cases leading to a much quicker discharge ( not needing dialysis ) and, as you know, one often improves quicker / better in a home environment.

 

I am allergic to Aspirin, all forms in UK, and could only tolerate one Aspent tab, which I stopped using a long time ago.

 

Have tried numerous meds. for TIA's since 2012, stopped all due to allergic responses.   The only one I take now ( Manidipine  - a calcium channel blocker ) I started on a settled dose four weeks ago.   I have side effects such as some swelling in my ankles and it is affecting nail growth.   

 

My main approach to the whole issue of TIA's and strokes is to listen to my body, if a TIA is coming be prepared and use your own healing ability to minimise damage ( e.g. I use accutouch ), if it is a stroke and I am able I do whatever is possible to minimise its effects.   I do the same kind of thing if I have cramp in a leg, as soon as it starts I just do very deep breathing, eventually this becomes an automatic response whenever cramp threatens.

 

Alternative treatments have saved my life a few times and I am sure have reduced damage, of course hospital treatment when needed has lessened some forms of possible damage too.     I don't discuss alternative treatments in general postings on 'thaivisa' but some, are of course recognised, such as accupuncture.

 

The main thing I guess is listen to your body.

 

My last CT scan a year ago was mostly white !

[meatboy]

having a new aota valve[done in the uk.]changed my life,but that was caused by self abuse,all the curries,pies,chips and of course CIDER. through the,60's,70's,80's.90's to 2015 did take its toll.

the latest,stroke and seizure's were also self inflicted,watching sport 11pm.-5am. 7am.on thai visa,i was getting servere headache's like I have never had before.i am lucky the medication prescribed in the uk.needed to control,BP,HEART,ANGINA BLOOD FLOW all seemed to have worked so far[10yrs] 

the wife worked in one of the big hospitals in wales,so she has quite a bit of knowledge of what to do in case of emergency.one of my main gripe's is,giving up the drink,which wasn't toooooo hard,but since my beloved sam [husky] passed away [feb] I have been wanting to go back on the bottle to drown my sorrows.

what worries me more is are we getting GENUINE medication.not fakes.

[ravip]

What is the circadian pattern in blood pressure?
Does blood pressure have a daily pattern?
Is it normally lower in the evening/night than in the morning (at wake up)?

How is this 'high reading' accounted for when deciding someone is having HBP and the necessity of medication?

[meatboy]

2 hours ago, ravip said:

What is the circadian pattern in blood pressure?
Does blood pressure have a daily pattern?
Is it normally lower in the evening/night than in the morning (at wake up)?

How is this 'high reading' accounted for when deciding someone is having HBP and the necessity of medication?

talking about when a high reading means ? what does it mean? when 3times at the hospital last week,202,190,then over 160 brought no response from a nurse.they never even questioned my pulse reading,which is always below 50 owing to the medication I have to take.

NO PAIN,NO WORRY.

[Sheryl]

4 hours ago, ravip said:

What is the circadian pattern in blood pressure?
Does blood pressure have a daily pattern?
Is it normally lower in the evening/night than in the morning (at wake up)?

How is this 'high reading' accounted for when deciding someone is having HBP and the necessity of medication?

The highest reading of the day should still be in normal rnage, the normal range is pretty wide.

 

BP will usually be lowest after rest (i.e. first thing in the morning but also after napping or lying down for a while) and highest when you have been very active or are in pain or stress.

 

People montoring their BP are advised to do so at about the same time each day, and at rest.

[MalandLee]

Hi Mate,

As (like you appear to be) a proponent of “Holism”. I do take holistic approaches to my situation too.

As you have found (Together with many doctors) BP is tricky, what works for one, is useless for another – for no “apparent” reason. Which does NOT mean there is no reason.

Vegan – I am a long term vegan. After a large TIA about 5-6 yrs ago, I was left with a speech impediment. I later recovered my ability to speak completely. I had blood pressures “resting” of about 220/120 – I was prescribed ACE inhibitors – after one month there was NO reduction in pressure.

I decided – as I was overweight (Not obese) to go on a one month Juice diet. Within 7 days of commencing, I like hundreds of others smashed my BP down to 110/70 – some days 100/60. I lost weight too which was a bonus. However, no matter how good I felt, (best I ever felt in my life), drinking juice was not THE answer, as it was unsustainable, long term.

THIS:- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XDSpuMIMPs - was a great motivator – FOR ME.

Fast forward, I am medication free, but, still have hypertension. I reside in the range 130-140/80-90. Not ideal by any means. But, I am free of the horrendous side effects of BP Drugs. I occasionally juice fast for a couple of weeks at least once per year – BP reduction (from this) lasts months, before it creeps back to the above range.

Recent blood tests (several over years) have revealed a pattern. Everything is well within normal range, except “triglyceride's” Cholesterol, HDL, LDL, VLDL combined are in the 3 mmol/L (About 55 Mg/dL) almost “homoeostasis”

So turning once again to “holism”, I researched and adjusted my (Vegan) diet to include ALA, DHA & EPA (search the acronyms – the search will help “Decoding the Omega 3 Alphabet”). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFFWstlfDRk has been very motivational – his voice on the other hand……….. did my head in :-)

Vegan sources of DHA and EPA are different to killing large numbers of animals. They are however, slightly more expensive. Having said that, they are exponentially better for your health.

I also take ONE weekly 1000 mcg B12 supplement.

I will ask blood be tested after 6 months on this regime, but, if my research is any good, I should be impacting my high triglyceride levels and hopefully, fine tune my BP. I can PM you the result(s)if you wish? I am already experiencing empirical results - penile tumescence, is now a regular (daily) occurrence, whereas before it was infrequent. 

I am now 5 years TIA free, at least that I am aware of. I do know they can happen without one knowing and without noticeable symptoms.

I hope this post helps you further decode your own metabolic puzzle.

Good Luck
Mal

PS I was deeply saddened to read of your lonely existence – it would seem to this dumbo, that a companion “could” be beneficial to you. You may be able to offer “someone” a future, platonic or otherwise. There are many beautiful Thai people out there, with the ability to see a “symbiotic” relationship, in the best sense of the word..

[Speedo1968]

On 5/12/2018 at 11:26 AM, ravip said:

What is the circadian pattern in blood pressure?
Does blood pressure have a daily pattern?
Is it normally lower in the evening/night than in the morning (at wake up)?

How is this 'high reading' accounted for when deciding someone is having HBP and the necessity of medication?

Yes, blood pressure does, in general, have a pattern however, what you do and how you do it during the hours you are awake can affect this.     Even eating 'wrong' foods at the wrong time, including hot / cold foods temperature wise.

 

Biological clocks are well known and made use of by Chinese, Indian and other teachers of good health.

The clocks show both brain / body activity etc. though some show a more "trendy !" pattern of body clocks.

I have attached a diagram and a BBC Radio program which relates to not just humans but also animals.

 

The bodys clock is in order to repair and refresh itself before the next day begins, it tries to do its best but if we continue to abuse it the clock will slow down or speed up and even stop.

 

I have an early morning high BP reading, especially if waking from a dream.

 

It may be useful if you have a concern over your own BP to keep a simple record of what you do / eat / when you take meds if any.     Record all three readings, that is including heart rate.

 

Have attached a picture showing a particular form of clock.    The In Our Time radio program from the BBC may help you to understand how the biological clock affects ALL living things.

 

InOurTime-20151217-CircadianRhythms