3 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

He also tried to bribe the judges with the "pastry box" for which one of his lawyers was convicted and and served time. 

 

Then there's the small matter of the Krungthai Bank fraud, where other key players have been convicted and given a lengthy jail sentence. 

 

And the issue of lending tax payer's money to the Burmese Junta at preferential interest rates so that they could buy telecoms from his family business.

 

And the list goes on.

 

But of course, some TVF posters want to sweep it all under the carpet by claiming it as "political". After all that's just what Thaksin says, and he also says he and his sweet little sister have never ever done anything wrong. And he wouldn't lie now would he 

 

 

So be it, but those crooks were the peoples choice. Not a bunch of tank driving thugs stealing power while being sponsered by the Amart.

9 minutes ago, scorecard said:

 

Well maybe a list for 'truly serves the interests of its citizens' - bottom of the ranking already filled by the shins.

 

'The way I see it is the shins are flying around Asia try to drum up support for democracy for Thailand...', now what was it the paymaster said 'I'm not interested in democracy', and 'democracy is not important for Thailand'.

 

 

 

 

 

 

If, and that's a very big if, he ever managed to get back and free of his sentence, his bail jumping, all those outstanding serious charges etc; and if he managed to get some puppet regime back in power then watch him dismantle democracy just like his eternal buddy Hun Sen is doing.

 

Lawsuits, new suppression laws, arrests of opposition, cronies placed in all key positions, and a ruthless rape of the treasury to make up for the recent years of no place at the trough. Bet that 2.2 trillion baht loan would be high on the agenda!

 

The flunkey's are there to be instructed - how much money is available, what to do, when to do it etc. And some posters still like to pretend PTP aren't a wholly owned subsidiary of the Shin Corp!

1 minute ago, Oziex1 said:

So be it, but those crooks were the peoples choice. Not a bunch of tank driving thugs stealing power while being sponsered by the Amart.

 

Yes they were the people's choice. And they betrayed the people once they started putting themselves and their own interests above the law - lying, cheating, threatening judges, and thieving.

 

Nothing will change until substantial reforms occur, which includes a robust justice system that is impartial and delivers them same justice based on the same applications of law to all. 

 

And neither the last elected governments or Juntas have shown any real inclination to change things. Therefore, the cycle is unbroken and continues to repeat.

 

 

12 hours ago, bristolgeoff said:

What a surprise so close but yet so far from justice.they just keep showing up anywhere and saying look at us free as a bird

 

Which as they are both billionaires, they can do. 

 

And Thaksin knows far far to much about somethings that might get spilled should he ever be really arrested.

Just now, Baerboxer said:

 

Yes they were the people's choice. And they betrayed the people once they started putting themselves and their own interests above the law - lying, cheating, threatening judges, and thieving.

 

Nothing will change until substantial reforms occur, which includes a robust justice system that is impartial and delivers them same justice based on the same applications of law to all. 

 

And neither the last elected governments or Juntas have shown any real inclination to change things. Therefore, the cycle is unbroken and continues to repeat.

 

 

Agreed Baer

It's a great tragedy for Thailand, I have no answer for it.

 

As corrupt as the Shins were and are, I kinda liked them giving the elites a serve of their own medicine and there were two coups to rid Thailand of them, an indication of the desparation and the beliefe of their entlment to take command of the trough.

5 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

 

Respectfully, if you do not understand the political element of the legal system of Thailand, especially in cases involving higher-ups (General Rolex, the Red Bull Heir, Chalerm, Suthep, PAD members, Yingluck, etc etc etc)...

 

... then you should probably wear a helmet 24/7 for your own safety and protection.

 

Cheers and have a nice day.

 

 

Yes, we all understand the "political' element when it comes to elite hisos, political clans, the well connected, those from the "right" families etc; and the vagaries of way different elements of society are treated whenever it suits.

 

However, that doesn't mean all crimes committed by anyone involved in politics can be dismissed as "political". 

 

Politicians fuel the vagaries of the justice system because it suits themselves. And when not in power are the first to squeal how unfair it all is when they can't just ignore the laws they broke anymore.

 

Thaksin is a crook. Not the only one by a long stretch. But his appearance on TV stating he's never done anything wrong, never ever, shows how absurdly removed from reality, morality and any sense of right they are.

5 minutes ago, Oziex1 said:

Agreed Baer

It's a great tragedy for Thailand, I have no answer for it.

 

As corrupt as the Shins were and are, I kinda liked them giving the elites a serve of their own medicine and there were two coups to rid Thailand of them, an indication of the desparation and the beliefe of their entlment to take command of the trough.

 

 

Agree mate. In some ways, certainly early on when Thaksin first came to power, it was good to see that. But it quickly became obvious what the real intentions were. Replacing them at the trough rather than remove the trough.

 

The big hope has to be in the new parties, younger new politicians (not ones from existing political clans) and the Student movements. But they will have a hell of a fight changing things and making real reform. The Junta, who've got all the tanks and a lot of firepower having exactly changed much - still can't even get taxis to use their meters or stop refusing passengers!

32 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

He also tried to bribe the judges with the "pastry box" for which one of his lawyers was convicted and and served time. 

 

Then there's the small matter of the Krungthai Bank fraud, where other key players have been convicted and given a lengthy jail sentence. 

 

And the issue of lending tax payer's money to the Burmese Junta at preferential interest rates so that they could buy telecoms from his family business.

 

And the list goes on.

 

But of course, some TVF posters want to sweep it all under the carpet by claiming it as "political". After all that's just what Thaksin says, and he also says he and his sweet little sister have never ever done anything wrong. And he wouldn't lie now would he 

 

 

I see so the pastry box lawyer got time and Thaksin got convicted on number of corrupt charges. Serve them right. The travesty seem glaring when those TV junta supporters still don’t see that big corrupt gorilla in the room who blatantly snub justice to bring them to court for all the corruptions. To rub salt, even the corruption agencies are in bed with them. The watch gate saga no where near conclusion even with the evidence obvious.

11 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

The big hope has to be in the new parties, younger new politicians (not ones from existing political clans) and the Student movements

Sorry can’t agree. The big hope is not new parties and younger politicians but the nullification of the military power and put them in their proper place and away from politics and governance. The big hope is with the people deciding the future; not future decide by the military and their elite backers.

 

11 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

Sorry can’t agree. The big hope is not new parties and younger politicians but the nullification of the military power and put them in their proper place and away from politics and governance. The big hope is with the people deciding the future; not future decide by the military and their elite backers.

 

 

Sorry but if you think simply nullifying the military is the answer then you're incredibly wrong. Doing that would leave the door wide open for the likes of the Shins or some other immoral corrupt clan to grab power and hold it, rather like Hun Sen is doing ( and maybe the Lees did?).

 

Both sides of the current equation need to be reformed; as does the pivot in the middle which is the justice system. Without that there will be no balance.

unfortunately I doubt Thailand has any party that is ready to do the right thing for the people and not themselves, getting into govt means big paydays for them and I cant see that changing anytime soon, While they may have good intentions to start with, they soon change so that they can do as they please and screw the people, they all do it, money is simply too important to them all

 

Edited May 5, 20188 yr by seajae

19 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

I see so the pastry box lawyer got time and Thaksin got convicted on number of corrupt charges. Serve them right. The travesty seem glaring when those TV junta supporters still don’t see that big corrupt gorilla in the room who blatantly snub justice to bring them to court for all the corruptions. To rub salt, even the corruption agencies are in bed with them. The watch gate saga no where near conclusion even with the evidence obvious.

 

Thaksin has only been convicted for one offense, for which he has been sentenced and absconded. He does have a large amount of other charges should he return without and amnesty and before their statute of limitations.

 

Yes, there are a great many others who should be facing investigation and possible charges. A great many unexplained wealth, etc. But without a robust independent impartial and skilled justice system it won't happen. 

16 hours ago, happy chappie said:

The way I see it is the shins are flying around Asia try to drum up support for democracy for Thailand which is the only hope for little sister to get back in power and crucify all her enemies and wanting to meet with prime ministers of those countries who have more important things than getting their hands dirty with these two.

Democracies in Asia are a bit thin on the ground: Cambodia, Laos, China, Vietnam, N Korea. Some of those purporting to be democratic are stretching the definition somewhat.

6 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Thaksin has only been convicted for one offense, for which he has been sentenced and absconded. He does have a large amount of other charges should he return without and amnesty and before their statute of limitations.

 

Yes, there are a great many others who should be facing investigation and possible charges. A great many unexplained wealth, etc. But without a robust independent impartial and skilled justice system it won't happen. 

We are getting somewhere near agreement. A robust and independent judiciary system and separation of power are what needed to wipe the mess that Thailand suffered. Does have a nice ring to that but sadly impossible for the next few years when the elites with the military have succeeded in writing a highly skewed charter that will place them in the dominant position. That big boulder has to be removed if Thailand has any chance of a meaningful future for the people. 

4 minutes ago, champers said:

Democracies in Asia are a bit thin on the ground: Cambodia, Laos, China, Vietnam, N Korea. Some of those purporting to be democratic are stretching the definition somewhat.

I don’t purport that Laos, China, Vietnam and N Korea are democratic. Last I checked, they are socialists. Has something happen to them in the last few hours? 

50 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

I don’t purport that Laos, China, Vietnam and N Korea are democratic. Last I checked, they are socialists. Has something happen to them in the last few hours? 

No, that is understood, Eric, me neither.

Others purporting to be democratic might be Myanmar, for example, who have the sort of "democracy" we may end up with in Thailand.

2 hours ago, Oziex1 said:

So be it, but those crooks were the peoples choice. Not a bunch of tank driving thugs stealing power while being sponsered by the Amart.

 

...the peoples choice...

 

No, you mean they fooled the unaware people...

 

Big difference.

 

 

 

 

2 hours ago, Oziex1 said:

Agreed Baer

It's a great tragedy for Thailand, I have no answer for it.

 

As corrupt as the Shins were and are, I kinda liked them giving the elites a serve of their own medicine and there were two coups to rid Thailand of them, an indication of the desparation and the beliefe of their entlment to take command of the trough.

 

'...giving the elites a serve of their own medicine ... '

 

How's that?

 

 

1 hour ago, Eric Loh said:

I don’t purport that Laos, China, Vietnam and N Korea are democratic. Last I checked, they are socialists. Has something happen to them in the last few hours? 

 

Yes, good examples of socialist democratic people's republics where everyone is equal. Except those that are more equal of course.

 

And they all share this class or "more equals" who always seem to acquire unusual wealth!

1 hour ago, Eric Loh said:

We are getting somewhere near agreement. A robust and independent judiciary system and separation of power are what needed to wipe the mess that Thailand suffered. Does have a nice ring to that but sadly impossible for the next few years when the elites with the military have succeeded in writing a highly skewed charter that will place them in the dominant position. That big boulder has to be removed if Thailand has any chance of a meaningful future for the people. 

 

Indeed. It's all about elites squabbling over who controls the trough and enjoys the spoils and privileges of massive wealth, doing whatever they please and being above laws. They have used the military as a control tool and under their patronage it has grown to a prominence that may make them wonder what they've created. Although money still trumps everything here.

 

Expecting any faction therein to actually want to change that is really hoping for too much. Their concern and only concern is to get control and to keep the status quo with a justice system that they're above and immune.

 

 

 

 

18 hours ago, scorecard said:

 

Except that the paymaster wasn't convicted of a political crime, he broke the serious law about abuse of authority (nothing whatever to do with politics) and was convicted and you know this well, plus the case was decided and he was given a 2 yr jail sentence during the reign of his own party.

 

So easy to tell serious unturths when you think nobody is watching.

 

Not nice but par for the course for some unethical folks.

 

 

I do not involve myself in local Thai politics however there are few countries outside the muslim middle east or africa that  will extradite!  It would be up to the junta to justify any request for extradition.  The problem is that the junta is an illegal unelected regime that deposed the legal government. Hence nothing legal can be attributed to them.  

39 minutes ago, scorecard said:

 

'...giving the elites a serve of their own medicine ... '

 

How's that?

 

 

Taking from the trough the elites like to claim as their own

44 minutes ago, scorecard said:

 

...the peoples choice...

 

No, you mean they fooled the unaware people...

 

Big difference.

Someone is certainly fooled and unaware.

If, and that's a very big if, he ever managed to get back and free of his sentence, his bail jumping, all those outstanding serious charges etc; and if he managed to get some puppet regime back in power then watch him dismantle democracy just like his eternal buddy Hun Sen is doing.
 
Lawsuits, new suppression laws, arrests of opposition, cronies placed in all key positions, and a ruthless rape of the treasury to make up for the recent years of no place at the trough. Bet that 2.2 trillion baht loan would be high on the agenda!
 
The flunkey's are there to be instructed - how much money is available, what to do, when to do it etc. And some posters still like to pretend PTP aren't a wholly owned subsidiary of the Shin Corp!

So far that is just your word. Facts are at no point in time did he take steps to dismantle democracy.

The current lot did. I am getting sick and tired about this absolute nonsense. You decline to condemn the current lot, even though there is indisputable evidence they did dismantle democracy and gave themselves unlimited powers and a sweeping amnesty to boot.


Thaksin is a Saint compared to these people, give it a rest, you have no leg to stand on.

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...the peoples choice...
 
No, you mean they fooled the unaware people...
 
Big difference.
 
 
 
 

What an utter disgraceful comment. I have many good friends in this country, many of them made a very conscious choice at the ballot box. They are so much more aware of how this country works than you, it isn't even funny.

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Only country n the world who can get away with jailing the opposition by accusing the of defamation. Or you  might get off lightly with a  few years of attitude adjustments.