Mexico calls migrant children separation 'inhumane,' 'racist'

[bristolboy]

1 hour ago, mcambl61 said:

If you are being honest, you have to completely restructure the E verify system and make it properly funded and staffed, which it clearly isn't. in other words a typical govt run boondoggle.

http://thehill.com/blogs/congress-blog/judicial/300701-8-key-requirements-e-verify-congressional-mandate

So implementing it nationwide will take some serious effort, but it is needed badly.

 

Trump in October listed E-Verify among his immigration prioritiesand in February requested $23 million in his 2019 budget proposal to expand the program for mandatory nationwide use.

No, if you were being honest you would acknowledge that Trump is not reluctant to make outraged noises about thiings he cares about. As far as I can tell, nothing in his speeches or tweets at all about e-verify.  E-verity is a boondoggle?  It's been shown to be very effective. And that's the reason Republicans don't want to push it. It would hurt businesses and subject employers to criminal penalties if they were found to circumvent it. Sure it could be improved. But it would take a lot more cash than Trump has called for.

[Opl]

"Rachel Maddow obtains video of inside New York detention facility from woman who quit her job"

"Maddow said that the teacher said there was a huge influx of younger children arriving in the last few months. That’s how she realized it was as the result of the Trump administration’s policy. "

https://www.rawstory.com/2018/06/rachel-maddow-obtains-video-inside-new-york-detention-facility-woman-quit-job/

[mcambl61]

Just now, bristolboy said:

No, if you were being honest you would acknowledge that Trump is not reluctant to make outraged noises about thiings he cares about. As far as I can tell, nothing in his speeches or tweets at all about e-verify.  E-verity is a boondoggle?  It's been shown to be very effective. And that's the reason Republicans don't want to push it. It would hurt businesses and subject employers to criminal penalties if they were found to circumvent it. Sure it could be improved. But it would take a lot more cash than Trump has called for.

agreed it has to improved and funded, bit please do not pretend he is in some way against it. Give the man the funding he wants, but then he doesn't pass the budget, he can only approve or disapprove.

 

the level of confrontation and threats by the left is getting very dangerous. 

[mcambl61]

Just now, Opl said:

"Rachel Maddow obtains video of inside New York detention facility from woman who quit her job"

"Maddow said that the teacher said there was a huge influx of younger children arriving in the last few months. That’s how she realized it was as the result of the Trump administration’s policy. "

https://www.rawstory.com/2018/06/rachel-maddow-obtains-video-inside-new-york-detention-facility-woman-quit-job/

do you have a point or just want to point to now instead of 2014 when there was complete silence?

you might want to see the number of UNACCOMPANIED minors apprehended recently, maybe that has something to do with the reality?

[bristolboy]

*Deleted post edited out*

Yes, it's a huge problem and getting worse.

http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-trump-border-20180405-story.html

[mcambl61]

Just now, bristolboy said:

You accused me of virtue signaling when it clearly wasn't the case. Not only was it personal, it was incorrect.

 

All leftists? Most leftists? Some leftists?

And aren't you ignoring something? No threatening activity from Trump supporters?

sorry you were sensitive to an observation. 

 

list the events of "trump" supporters harassing govt officials in public place

[mcambl61]

Just now, bristolboy said:

Yes, it's a huge problem and getting worse.

http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-trump-border-20180405-story.html

so less apprehensions is good enough for you? where are the 2018 stats since those have risen greatly.

[mcambl61]

4 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

Yes, it's a huge problem and getting worse.

http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-trump-border-20180405-story.html

outhwest Border Migration FY2018

During the month of May, CBP saw a slight 1.9 percent increase overall when compared to April, but a 160 percent increase compared to May 2017.

The number of Family Units increased by 435 percent and the number of unaccompanied children (UAC) increased by 329 percent compared to May 2017.

[Opl]

" Michael Avenatti Returns As Trump’s Worst Nightmare By Fighting To Reunite Separated Families. "I was contacted about seven to ten days ago by a family in California who had a mother who had been detained and had been separated from her child. And I agreed to enter the fight on her behalf. And once that became known, a number of other families contacted my office as well as some not for profits. "

https://www.politicususa.com/2018/06/25/avenatti-trumps-worst-nightmare.html

 

 

[spidermike007]

There is no question that this is racist policy, and that Trump is a hater, and a racist. He despises people of color, and people who are not wealthy. They are like vermin to him. Many of these people are fleeing conditions that are largely created by US policy, and the war on drugs. I have a solution. Make all drugs legal. Everything. From heroin, on down. Not only watch consumption drop, but watch the cartels disappear, and with it, at least part of the huge wave of illegal immigration. Portugal did it successfully. Why not the US? Oh, I forgot it is a nation populated by alot of fake puritans. I am American, so do not get on your high horse and respond with hypocritical nonsense. Think for one moment, before you reply. Parroting a line is not a reply. 

 

In other words, take some responsibility instead of mimicking a few talking points of the hateful, huckster in chief. 

[mcambl61]

Just now, bristolboy said:

I'm not sure what you mean by "so less apprehensions is good enough for you?"

As for the 2018 states, do you think the Trump administration is doing a better and better job of apprehending illegal immigrants?

what I obviously meant was that we should never have a border that allows people to cross without going through a point of entry.

 

And yes at least he is trying to follow the law and calling out the ridiculous loopholes and laws passed by a incompetent congress funded by special interests.

[bristolboy]

1 minute ago, stevenl said:

" And yes at least he is trying to follow the law and calling out the ridiculous loopholes and laws passed by a incompetent congress funded by special interests. "

Exactly. And that is why he told Congress: don't do anything now, wait till after the next elections.

And that was just a few days after he urged Congress to act.

[stevenl]

1 minute ago, bristolboy said:

And that was just a few days after he urged Congress to act.

Yes, he knows what he is doing.

 

I do know though that when he urged Congress to act in the first place it was in the middle of the 'separated children upheaval'. Later on he realised he was losing that battle so gave in, and decided to move it all till after the elections. That way he can continue to blame Congress and especially Democrats (but Congress as a whole since he is no friends with many long standing Republican congressmen) and appeal to his base more: they do nothing, you need me.

[bristolboy]

5 minutes ago, mcambl61 said:

at least be honest about it. Congress can't get anything passed, that was obvious after the vote failed

The hardline immigration vote failed. The so-called moderate one didn't.

[mcambl61]

5 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

The hardline immigration vote failed. The so-called moderate one didn't.

the so called moderate one did not even get brought up for a vote, ot had less support for votes the the first one. how is that not failing?

[bristolboy]

13 minutes ago, mcambl61 said:

the so called moderate one did not even get brought up for a vote, ot had less support for votes the the first one. how is that not failing?

But Ryan had said that the wanted to give Republicans a chance to vote even though the measure would fail. 

[bristolboy]

1 minute ago, bushdoctor said:

Can you can show me proof of being turned away from the US border for having brown skin?    ....Didn’t think so. 

I can show you proof of being turned away for not entering with legal permission. 

You do realize there are millions of “brown skinned” Americans right? They are let through on a daily basis. 

My comment had nothing to do with "people being turned away from the border for having brown skin."

That wasn't what I was replying to, was it? Someone said there's no racial prejudice against Mexicans because they can come in all shades and colors. I pointed out something to the effect of Mexican illegal immigrants are overwhelming brown skinned and that when most Americans think of Mexicans they aren't picturing a people whose coloring resembles a typical Norwegian.

 

[bushdoctor]

15 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

My comment had nothing to do with "people being turned away from the border for having brown skin."

That wasn't what I was replying to, was it? Someone said there's no racial prejudice against Mexicans because they can come in all shades and colors. I pointed out something to the effect of Mexican illegal immigrants are overwhelming brown skinned and that when most Americans think of Mexicans they aren't picturing a people whose coloring resembles a typical Norwegian.

 

 

Am I misreading something?

 

 

Edited June 26, 2018 by bushdoctor

[bristolboy]

3 minutes ago, bushdoctor said:

 

Man I misreading something?

 

I can't tell if you're misreading something since I don't know how you construe the stuff you've quoted. I can confidently say you're misapplying something since that post was not what I was replying to. Here's what I was replying to:

 

"Really? Racist? Look, the policy is terrible, but it's not racist - at best it could be xenophobic. Have words lost all meaning? I find describing "Mexican" as a race, racist. Mexico has a multiracial society . "Mexican" is the demonym for people from the country Mexico. I wonder if Andres Obrador, would classify "American", "Canadian", "South African", and "French" etc. etc. as races?"

[bristolboy]

3 minutes ago, mcambl61 said:

I do look, and listen. He is blunt and to the point, not a career politician. we have seen what those have done to the country. the country has had enough of the ineffective ridiculous congress. 

 

If you think the racial divide ramped up under the Obamanation was not on purpose, and that wasn't racist I guess we see things differently. 

Are you referring to the Muslim who wasn't born in the United States?

[bushdoctor]

3 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

I can't tell if you're misreading something since I don't know how you construe the stuff you've quoted. I can confidently say you're misapplying something since that post was not what I was replying to. Here's what I was replying to:

 

"Really? Racist? Look, the policy is terrible, but it's not racist - at best it could be xenophobic. Have words lost all meaning? I find describing "Mexican" as a race, racist. Mexico has a multiracial society . "Mexican" is the demonym for people from the country Mexico. I wonder if Andres Obrador, would classify "American", "Canadian", "South African", and "French" etc. etc. as races?"

 

Do you think enforcing control of the border is racist? 

[bristolboy]

3 minutes ago, bushdoctor said:

 

Do you think enforcing control of the border is racist? 

Controling the border is not racist. Saying such things as Mexico is sending its worst people, falsely claiming elevated crime levels among these illegal immigrants. Creating a climate of fear over something that is not a threat, it. And proposing to spend so much money on a situation that is not a crisis, not even a real problem as things currently stand, has as one of its chief bases, racism.

[bushdoctor]

1 minute ago, bristolboy said:

Controling the border is not racist. Saying such things as Mexico is sending its worst people, falsely claiming elevated crime levels among these illegal immigrants. Creating a climate of fear over something that is not a threat, it. And proposing to spend so much money on a situation that is not a crisis, not even a real problem as things currently stand, has as one of its chief bases, racism.

 

As long as we can agree that’s your opinion and not necessarily fact, I have no problem. A large swath of people feel it is a crisis. 

[stevenl]

13 minutes ago, bushdoctor said:

 

As long as we can agree that’s your opinion and not necessarily fact, I have no problem. A large swath of people feel it is a crisis. 

Why is it a crisis? So far no answer to that question.

[bristolboy]

20 minutes ago, bushdoctor said:

 

As long as we can agree that’s your opinion and not necessarily fact, I have no problem. A large swath of people feel it is a crisis. 

I'm sure a "large swath", a vague formulation if ever there was one,  do feel it. The question is whether it actually is. What are the criteria for a crisis that makes this situation one?

[bushdoctor]

7 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Why is it a crisis? So far no answer to that question.

 

Other than the obvious fact that people were being allowed into the country illegally, and we had no idea who they were, you might remember the attacks we have seen in western countries around the world. 

 

This was mostly before President Trump ordered on Jan. 28  “We are going to convene my top generals and give them a simple instruction. They will have 30 days to submit to the Oval Office a plan for soundly and quickly defeating ISIS. We have no choice.”

 

Those are one example of the type of people we want to keep out. Then there are the drugs being sneaked across in remote areas, on “mules”,  human trafficking etc. etc.

 

 

 

[bushdoctor]

11 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

I'm sure a "large swath", a vague formulation if ever there was one,  do feel it. The question is whether it actually is. What are the criteria for a crisis that makes this situation one?

 

Trump’s campaign promise of securing the border was a major reason he is the President. 

 

[johnnybangkok]

41 minutes ago, bushdoctor said:

 

As long as we can agree that’s your opinion and not necessarily fact, I have no problem. A large swath of people feel it is a crisis. 

A much more apt way of saying this would be 'a large swath of people are being made to feel it is a crisis'. Deflect, obfuscate and demonise a situation that was a problem granted, but not to the extent it's being made out to be currently. America has always had illegal immigration but for some reason now it's so much worse than before? Really? 

This is taken straight from Wikipedia -

'Research shows that illegal immigrants increase the size of the U.S. economy, contribute to economic growth, enhance the welfare of natives, contribute more in tax revenue than they collect, reduce American firms' incentives to offshore jobs and import foreign-produced goods, and benefit consumers by reducing the prices of goods and services. Economists estimate that legalization of the illegal immigrant population would increase the immigrants' earnings and consumption considerably, and increase U.S. gross domestic product.

There is no evidence that illegal immigration increases the rate of crime in the United States. There is scholarly consensus that illegal immigrants commit less crime than natives. Sanctuary cities – which adopt policies designed to not prosecute people solely for being in the country illegally – have no statistically meaningful impact on crime or reduce the crime rate. Research suggests that immigration enforcement has no impact on crime rate.'

It's scaremongering pure and simple and you are all falling for it because  your beloved leader has made a non-issue into a really big crisis. Now why would he do that I wonder? Couldn't be to distract everyone from all the other really important stuff he's doing behind everyone's back like trying to defund Medicare and Medicaid or trying to kill off Planned Parenthood or  what's going on at the EPA or even (heavens forbid) to take your mind off that really annoying FBI investigation? 

The guy is a master of distraction and you are all falling for it.

 

Edited June 26, 2018 by johnnybangkok

[bristolboy]

2 minutes ago, bushdoctor said:

 

Other than the obvious fact that people were being allowed into the country illegally, and we had no idea who they were, you might remember the attacks we have seen in western countries around the world. 

 

This was mostly before President Trump ordered on Jan. 28  “We are going to convene my top generals and give them a simple instruction. They will have 30 days to submit to the Oval Office a plan for soundly and quickly defeating ISIS. We have no choice.”

 

Those are one example of the type of people we want to keep out. Then there are the drugs being sneaked across in remote areas, on “mules”,  human trafficking etc. etc.

 

 

 

A crisis? Were terrorists coming across the border? How many billions is it worth to stop a potential terrorist attack that comes via the southern border? What about the northern border? Have any of these terrorist attacks come form the south yet? As for drugs, Trump is actually asking for a cut in funds to the Coast Guard's drug interdiction efforts to fund his border program. Because the government doesn't have infinite funds to spend on any one program. And you seriously believe that the drug trade can be stopped or seriusly slowed by increased border protection? One of the huge problems the government has in recruiting officers for border patrol is the huge amount of money to be made by accepting bribes from drug gangs. An enormous amount of vetting has to be done for each potential officer.

[bushdoctor]

2 minutes ago, johnnybangkok said:

A much more apt way of saying this would be 'a large swath of people are being made to feel it is a crisis'. Deflect, obfuscate and demonise a situation that was a problem granted, but not to the extent it's being made out to be currently. America has always had illegal immigration but for some reason now it's so much worse than before? Really? 

This is taken straight from Wikipedia -

'Research shows that illegal immigrants increase the size of the U.S. economy, contribute to economic growth, enhance the welfare of natives, contribute more in tax revenue than they collect, reduce American firms' incentives to offshore jobs and import foreign-produced goods, and benefit consumers by reducing the prices of goods and services. Economists estimate that legalization of the illegal immigrant population would increase the immigrants' earnings and consumption considerably, and increase U.S. gross domestic product.

There is no evidence that illegal immigration increases the rate of crime in the United States. There is scholarly consensus that illegal immigrants commit less crime than natives. Sanctuary cities – which adopt policies designed to not prosecute people solely for being in the country illegally – have no statistically meaningful impact on crime or reduce the crime rate. Research suggests that immigration enforcement has no impact on crime rate.'

It's scaremongering pure and simple and you are all falling for it because  your beloved leader has made a non-issue into a really big crisis. Now why would he do that I wonder? Couldn't be to distract everyone from all the other really important stuff he's doing behind everyone's back like trying to defund Medicare and Medicaid or trying to kill of Planned Parenthood or  what's going on at the EPA or even (heavens forbid) to take your mind off that really annoying FBI investigation? 

The guy is a master of distraction and you are all falling for it.

 

He made the campaign promise to secure the border before he was president, so if he did it to cover things up as you accuse him of, he had brilliant foresight.