Trump: Harley-Davidsons being made in Thailand is "the beginning of the end"

[pegman]

14 hours ago, Monomial said:

 

Not saying stock will get hit. Most stock will probably go up, in fact. But it won't go up as much as prices go up in goods in order to compensate for the tariffs. At the same time, wages will increase more than investor profits. The result is that absolute economic efficiency will decrease, but the investor class will suffer comparatively more than the labor class. You need to think beyond, the price will go up so nobody will buy. High tariffs will encourage production in America, injecting more money in American wallets, allowing them to continue purchasing even at the higher prices. Meanwhile, high tariffs will help to offset the trend of decreasing salaries of the American labor class over the last few decades, pushing wages up. A new equilibrium will take at least a decade to be reached, so any flip flopping on tariffs during short periods in the past has little to do with real economics, and everything to do with politics.

 

The people who lose the most in this scenario are those on a fixed income. The second biggest losers are the investors, who will see a larger percentage of corporate revenues going to salary, and less to investor profits. In aggregate, the efficiency of wealth generation will decrease, and absolute production will also decline. But the labor class stands to be relatively better off in this scenario vs. investors. It isn't really all that difficult to understand, but it is obviously going to be an unpopular option for those who currently benefit from the status quo.

 

This is not the first time free trade has been tried, reached a peak and then declined throughout history. The effect is well studied.

 

Tell that to the Harley Davidson workers Warren. Their jobs are moving off shore because of tariffs both in ASEAN & the EU. If Trump had signed onto TPP and not imposed tariffs on EU steel their plant would have stayed open in KC.  You really should do some research on Hoover's tariffs and the subsequent 1930's Great Depression. 

 

Consumers will not pay more for major purchases if they think they can wait out the tariffs. Most of the world outside the Trumptards think Draft Dodger Donald will be locked up before long. 

 

There will be more jobs lost than created. New jobs will be filled by some of those losing jobs. Corporations don't give raises to shop floor grunts out of the goodness of their  hearts. In the end investors will lose too because this will very likely end up causing at least a recession.

 

[lvr181]

21 minutes ago, doggie1955 said:

I could care less if he hurt peoples feelings with his tweets, especially non US citizens.

Including his allies? You want/need a strategic military alliance (understandable) with the Kingdom but you don't care about "hurt feelings" when insulting other non-US citizens? Remove your blinkers. 

 

When did bullying replace diplomacy? For better or worse we now have a world community and that brings about a change of thinking, that we need to learn to live with our neighours.

 

"The world" does not begin and stop at the borders of the USA.

[pegman]

16 hours ago, ChrisY1 said:

Won't make them any cheaper.....they'll be called "luxury" and have the huge taxes that are present now.

That cannot be right. Why would they open a plant here then? 

[tryasimight]

From what I understand HD will be building 500 and 750cc models here not the larger bikes so I doubt we will see much of a price reduction on the higher end models.  I hope I am wrong though and the big  bikes come down in price. 

[Kerryd]

On 7/1/2018 at 8:00 PM, tryasimight said:

From what I understand HD will be building 500 and 750cc models here not the larger bikes so I doubt we will see much of a price reduction on the higher end models.  I hope I am wrong though and the big  bikes come down in price. 

I've been trying to find more information out about which models they plan on assembling in Thailand, for the same reason. To see if the prices will come down. I'm sure Harley knows that there is a market for their product here (just have to visit Burapa Bike Week every year to see that) and have done their due diligence with regards to the cost of setting up a factory, importing the parts, assembling, distributing the finished products and the pricing of those products.

They won't be for sale at "USA" prices but one would hope they are considerably cheaper than what they currently retail for (in Thailand). Keep in mind as well that these bikes (assembled in Thailand) will be supplied to most of the SE Asian market, not just Thailand.

I'm sure they also know that the average Thai (or Malaysian, Indonesian, Cambodian) guy isn't going to be splashing out 1.5-2 million baht for a new Electra Glide or Road King, but may be able to buy a "Street" or a Sportster or even a Dyna for 3-700k (depending on model and size of course).
I'm guessing the 750cc Harley "Street" and the "883" Sportsters will be very popular with a certain element as they fit 2 of the categories that a lot of clubs have (it must be over 600ccs and/or it must be Harley).
A lot of guys were using 400cc Steeds to try and meet the "big bike" requirement that a lot of clubs have but they just don't cut it, especially on long trips, which is why I think many clubs adopted a "600cc" minimum size for membership.

Harley's website doesn't have any information on it, and no job listings. They note in one spot that there will be a plant in Rayong and that's all I could find (aside from the press clippings previously released).

Who knows, maybe they'll look at my resume and hire me ! 

[DavidHouston]

A bit of a reality check. Harleys are made all over the world:

"Technically speaking, Harley-Davidson motorcycles sold in the United States are not actually made here [in the US], but assembled here.  Harley contracts manufacturing of parts to plants located all over the world, including Germany, Italy, Taiwan, Japan, and Mexico.  Those parts are then shipped to Harley factories here.  And these are not just accessories, but components for engines, chassis, and wheels.  Exactly what percentage of a Harley-Davidson motorcycle is American made, is not exactly known, as each model and model year is different. "

https://www.throttlexbatteries.com/details.aspx?p=A4D3D61DCEB3C859&ppid=59924&beid=7BD67A6B7D0B565F

Such complexities as supply chain management are usually beyond the scope of the politicals debate. It would be interesting to note to what extent the Thai factory merely assembled complete motorcycles from parts imported from the U.S. and how much of the total value of the produce was attributable to such imported parts.

 

Edited July 5, 2018 by DavidHouston

[Kiwiken]

On 6/28/2018 at 4:10 AM, doggie1955 said:

Tariffs need to be increased first of all. (I am from the US). If the tariffs were higher then the money it costs to outsource products might make companies start to use Americans to produce goods. I believe it is always better to have any country use their own people to do the jobs to get things made, instead of getting poor little Chinese people to make our shoes and toys, and yes I do realize that China is not the only country that companies use to make cheaper products, but its a big one. If tariffs were higher then the companies would not make as much money from foreign people and more local citizens would have jobs, and more businesses would buy materials from inside their own countries...MAGA

And sadly many other Countries would not buy US made or designed products. Because Companies outsource production overseas We can get cheaper Harleys, Levis, Generic drugs, Trucks, Aircraft , Ships. For many Countries made in the USA is over priced.

I would venture to say if the US undertook such high levies then most Countries will retaliate and the USA will on make for the USA.

Rather than paying taxes or duty to the USA Companies will simply as they once did set up smaller production Companies in Our respective Countries.

NZ under license once made all the American icons for local consumption but globalisation made these products cheaper and more accessible to many more of Our populations.

Going back to protectionism will most likely see an eventual collapse of the Global Trade and monetary system. Last few times this happened led to recession, Depression and war