Is Thailand a bad idea?

[Boy Wonder]

Quick backstory:

 

I'm in my early twenties and from the USA. I'm a tall, black guy with dreads and tattoos that is easily confused for a basketball player, hip hop artist or thug (depending on where you went to school).

 

I make $100k USD working online, and have zero obligations. I'm a very low-key guy, love to stay away from trouble and do not like to be the center of attention.

 

I'll be going to Thailand soon based on some recommendations from friends. My reason for going is that I am bored out of my mind in the USA. I feel like I've seen and done it all here, and everything just seems so mundane and repetitive to me. I've lived in many states, and have visited many more. Life has simply lost its flare here for me. Whether this is because of my lifestyle, or the fact that the USA just sucks in many ways, is beyond me. But the fact of the matter is, I want novelty.

 

I figured travelling the world/living in a new country and different culture for a while might spice things up nicely...as well as give me the opportunity to focus on growing my business without being hogged down by a soul-sucking 9-5 job that I have to commute to every day. There is a lot other problems, including but not limited to the cost of living, the political landscape, etc. I pay so much money here for such a mediocre way of life, whereas in Thailand the same money can get me a nice condo in a few different cities and give me a lavish lifestyle.

 

The questions:

 

I just stumbled across a thread titled "Leaving Thailand after 13 years" and it seems that Thailand may not be the paradise one would hope -- at least not if you're planning to live there long term, as opposed to being a tourist. Now I'm really curious and have a few questions:

 

1. From your own perspective, what have been the pros/cons of living long term in Thailand as opposed to the west?
2. What is your personal opinion of the outcome of my going to Thailand? In other words, am I delusional to think that going to Thailand will somehow solve the novelty, fulfillment and cost of living problems I'm having, or do you think this may be a good idea?
3. Given my personal description, do you think Thai people will be welcoming, or will I feel alienated?

 

Thanks so much in advance.

Edited July 21, 2018 by Boy Wonder

[KarminLine]

The highest number of fatalities and missing-persons of Australians in the world is in Thailand.

 

So if you were Australian, would sound like a bad idea, statistically.

[jackdd]

You should just give at a try for a few months, then you know how it is, all the reading won't help you

Two things you didn't mention, so maybe you just don't know it yet:

For Thai people white skin is beautiful, black skin is ugly. Most girls (normal girls, a hooker probably won't care too much) won't be interested in you just because of your skin color.

Most black people you meet here in Thailand come from Africa and are either working as drug dealers or pimps. Before i came to Thailand i didn't judge anybody by skin color. Here in Thailand i definitely do this, because for most black people i encounter here it's just true. Immigration Police, or police in general, are of course also aware of this, so you can expect to be treated accordingly.

[Boy Wonder]

21 minutes ago, jackdd said:

You should just give at a try for a few months, then you know how it is, all the reading won't help you

Two things you didn't mention, so maybe you just don't know it yet:

For Thai people white skin is beautiful, black skin is ugly. Most girls (normal girls, a hooker probably won't care too much) won't be interested in you just because of your skin color.

Most black people you meet here in Thailand come from Africa and are either working as drug dealers or pimps. Before i came to Thailand i didn't judge anybody by skin color. Here in Thailand i definitely do this, because for most black people i encounter here it's just true. Immigration Police, or police in general, are of course also aware of this, so you can expect to be treated accordingly.

I think you're right. Suppose I should just go and see for myself.

 

My question about race was more so about Thai people in general, including the men. As far as the girl situation, that's not really any different from the USA. Everyone has their preference. But I certainly don't look African.

 

And I'm not going there for hookers. Seem to be doing pretty well on Tinder there, won't have much need for that. ? 

 

 

[moontang]

you might be better off in Cuba.  You are going to have visa troubles here, unless you pay $$$.  Cambodia might be better, too.  What part of the US are you from?

[Boy Wonder]

3 minutes ago, moontang said:

you might be better off in Cuba.  You are going to have visa troubles here, unless you pay $$$.  Cambodia might be better, too.  What part of the US are you from?

Why Cuba in particular? 

 

Is a 3 month visa/renewing when expires no good?

 

I'm based on the west coast. Silicon Valley.

Edited July 21, 2018 by Boy Wonder

[moontang]

they can deny you entry, if they suspect you are living here on Tourist Visas.

 

I think you would face less discrimination in Cuba....good weather, not girls, good cigars.  20 US gets a Havana u. girl for the night.  I get easy visas since age 50, but wouldn't bother if I was much you nger, but would consider Cambodia...or with a nice income Hong Kong or Taiwan.

[sirineou]

about twenty years ago felt like I was in the same rut you are, didn't know what to do about it, just going through the paces. While in Italy at a jewelry trade show, ( Vicenzaoro )where I met a manufacturer from Thailand. I did some business with them mostly silver and semi precious stones , and at later trade show in Thailand I went there to see their operation and see if I could make some more contacts. While there I met a girl ( surprise?LOL) fall in love  and my life changed. Now my life has purpose. For me it opened a door that I never even considered existed. Getting married, (now married 13 years) building a house, the food, interesting people, going for a walk to the night market, gardening, visa runs to Laos etc etc.

Thailand as any other place does have it's challenges, IMO it is part of the charm. I enjoy challenges, it forces my out of my comfort level and helps me grow. If you are the same you will enjoy it.

You sound like a nice, educated young man, come here and try it out, what do you have to lose? rents are very cheap, .  I don't know about race, I am white, and as unfortunate as it is ,what others said about it ia true about color in Thailand. But even though some who don't know you might jump to unfair conclusions, those who do know you will appreciate you and you will get along just fine. Just don't have a thin skin about it and treat everyone with the respect you will like to be treated with . Like dogs who can smell fear, People can "smell" if you don't like them and they dont like you back.

If you do decide to come to Thailand, please follow up, I would love to know about your experience. 

  Post in this forum , or PM me with any questions, no such thing as a stupid question.

ChoK Dee (good luck in Thai)

Edited July 21, 2018 by sirineou
typos and puctuation

[Bang Bang]

To the OP:

Come stay here for a couple of months and decide for yourself. No one else can say how you will react.

 

That's what I did. I am from the US too. I was able to take leave from my job there to try a new one here. After 3 months I quit the old job. That was 11 years ago and I've not been back even once to the States. I love it here. But I do know Westerners who are miserable day in and day out complaining about everything Thai (you will find many right here on TV:-) 

 

Btw, re racism, there are stereotypes here as everywhere: Indians are cheap, Africans deal drugs, Chinese aren't clean and so on. But Thais are pretty fair and if they get to know you they'll judge you on the basis of who you are.

 

Incidentally, one French African guy I know rotates the most beautiful Thai hiso girlfriends. Good-looking young guy with the most amazing singing voice. Thai gals like guys who are sanook (fun).

 

Edited July 21, 2018 by Bang Bang

[Dexlowe]

If you really are earning that kind of money, you might want to consider the elite visa -- plenty of info on this board.

 

Briefly, some of the little things that will make a difference to how you enjoy your time here are: be clean and tidy at all times (no smells); be sanuk (fun), but not in a condescending way; develop a sixth sense for scams (in other words, learn to be ultra-cautious and know how to politely brush off scammers and pests); learn the things that Thais regard as important (you don't have to go "native", just be respectful at the right time); learn to be very patient and develop your sense of tolerance (very important); once you decide to stay, pick up a bit of conversational Thai. Finally, leave the women alone (I jest -- this advice was getting boring).

 

As a black man, you will encounter some racism, but it's not as bad as many make out -- but it is also up to you to set the tone. Especially, try not to dominate everything, as Americans, black Americans notably, tend to do. As an American, you'll be much more appreciated if you don't act the brash, know-it-all yank - be low-key, charming and respectful like many of my American colleagues who are very successful here.

 

Good luck.

[eddie61]

I would try it with the proviso that for a year or two, you rent, don’t buy. I mean that in every respect, including car, accommodation and ladies.

 

i think that your personal description may not be to your advantage, as there is undoubtedly a fair amount of racism in this country, combined with a fairly low standard of education.

 

Finally, there are advantages, including lower costs, an exciting vibe, exposure to a dynamic part of the world, and in your case, distance from the Don. 

 

 

[inThailand]

What do you got to loose to spend sometime herevand become another TV sex tourist? 

[Maradona 10]

'I make $100k USD working online,''

 

 

Course you do.

[Gecko123]

Thai people have a wide range of skin colors. While most tend to have a nut brown complexion, they also range from very light complected (often augmented by skin whiteners) to very dark brown (darker than many African-American complexions). While darker skin tones are associated with farming and being out in the sun (and consequently a less desirable occupational class), what you will not find here are Thais who automatically associate dark skin (whether Thai or foreigner) with criminality such as being a shoplifter, car jacker, purse snatcher or rapist, or of automatically being of low intelligence, as is frequently the case in the West.

 

Another interesting thing about Thailand is that in many families children from the same parents have different skin hues. That is, a brother can be lighter skinned than his sister. In Thailand you can also find countless examples of couples where there is a big difference in the darkness of one partner's complexion compared to their partner. So this "How can I discriminate against dark complected people when I have a dark complected brother or cousin or spouse?" really inhibits mindlessly racist attitudes from taking root here.

 

Also, please ignore the racist comment from an earlier poster about most Africans in Thailand being drug dealers or pimps. Many Africans here are gem dealers who come to Thailand to buy/sell/trade gems. (Thailand is a major market for sapphires, and many African countries export precious stones to Thailand as well.) There are also Africans teaching school, restaurant and small business owners, playing football for Thai teams, not to mention garden variety tourists and immigrants.

 

With that said, Thailand has sadly become more race conscious over the past thirty to forty years. There are even some Thais who have jumped on the racial band wagon, sometimes rather idiotically, clueless that the same people spreading anti-black doctrine are just as likely to promulgate anti-Thai views. (Thais can't be trusted, are lazy, are stupid, etcetera, etcetera. Sound familiar?) Thirty or forty years ago, most Thais saw the world through a 'Thai and then there's everybody else' prism. But over time with the spread of cable TV, internet, and social media, Thais have become more worldly and sophisticated about differences between people, and as I said earlier, a very small number have foolishly concluded that it is somehow a mark of sophistication to discriminate between people based on the color of their skin.

 

I should also like to add that in my opinion Thailand's sex industry and low cost of living attracts a considerable number of mostly white socio-economic refugees from the West who feel that their sense of white privilege back home is under attack by immigrants, Muslims, non-whites, and globalization and I am certain that just as they are not shy about voicing their views on internet forums such as this, they are also not shy about indoctrinating their Thai girlfriends and wives and other Thais they come in contact with their views. So this is another major conduit of how Western style racism has bled into the Thai psyche.

 

But even today I don't think you will find very much overt racism among Thais here, maybe occasional rudeness at a bar or a guesthouse, but that's about it. While I am sure you will be able to find tourists and other short time visitors to Thailand to be friendly enough, you should be aware that there are strong elements of anti-American sentiment running through the expat community here, and as mentioned above, some rather pronounced racial attitudes amongst the expat community here as well. In my opinion, the vast majority of people who seem determined to insist to their dying breath that Thais are racist are only attempting to legitimize their own racist behavior by projecting racism onto another group. For many white people, this is the first time they have been in a minority status and consequently they see discrimination everywhere they look.

 

In closing, you sound well-mannered, well-spoken, easy going, educated. I'm sure you'll do fine here.

Edited July 22, 2018 by Gecko123

[Maradona 10]

2 minutes ago, Gecko123 said:

Thai people have a wide range of skin colors. While most tend to have a nut brown complexion, they also range from very light complected (often augmented by skin whiteners) to very dark brown (darker than many African-American complexions). While darker skin tones are associated with farming and being out in the sun (and consequently a less desirable occupational class), what you will not find here are Thais who automatically associate dark skin (whether Thai or foreigner) with criminality such as being a shoplifter, car jacker, purse snatcher or rapist, or of automatically being of low intelligence, as is frequently the case in the West. Another interesting thing about Thailand is that in many families children from the same parents have different skin hues. That is, a brother can be lighter skinned than his sister. In Thailand you can also find countless examples of couples where there is a big difference in the darkness of one partner's complexion compared to their partner. So this "How can I discriminate against dark complected people when I have a dark complected brother or cousin or spouse really inhibits mindlessly racist attitudes from taking root here. Also, please ignore the racist comment from an earlier poster about most Africans in Thailand being drug dealers or pimps. Many Africans here are gem dealers who come to Thailand to buy/sell/trade gems. (Thailand is a major market for sapphires, and many African countries export precious stones to Thailand as well.) There are also Africans teaching school, restaurant and small business owners, playing soccer for Thai teams, not to mention garden variety tourists and immigrants.

 

With that said, Thailand has sadly become more race conscious over the past thirty years. There are even some Thais who have jumped on the racial band wagon, sometimes rather idiotically, clueless that the same people spreading anti-black doctrine are just as likely to promulgate anti-Thai views. (Thais can't be trusted, are lazy, are stupid, etcetera, etcetera. Sound familiar?) Thirty or forty years ago, most Thais saw the world through a 'Thai and then there's everybody else' prism. But over time with the spread of cable TV, internet, and social media, Thais have become more worldly and sophisticated about differences between people, and as I said earlier, a small number have foolishly concluded that it is somehow a mark of sophistication to discriminate between people based on the color of their skin.

 

I should also like to add that in my opinion Thailand's sex industry and low cost of living attracts a considerable number of mostly white socio-economic refugees from the West who feel that their sense of white privilege back home is under attack by immigrants, Muslims, non-whites, and globalization and I am certain that just as they are not shy about voicing their views on internet forums such as this, they are also not shy about indoctrinating their Thai girlfriends and wives and other Thais they come in contact with their views. So this is another major conduit of how Western style racism has bled into the Thai psyche.

 

But even today I don't think you will find very much overt racism among Thais here, maybe occasional rudeness at a bar or a guesthouse, but that's about it. While I am sure you will be able to find tourists and other short time visitors to Thailand to be friendly enough, you should be aware that there are strong elements of anti-American sentiment running through the expat community here, and as mentioned above, some rather pronounced racial attitudes amongst the expat community here as well. In my opinion, the vast majority of people who seem determined to insist to their dying breath that Thais are racist are only attempting to legitimize their own racist behavior by projecting racism onto another group. For many white people, this is the first time they have been in a minority status and consequently they see discrimination everywhere they look.

 

In closing, you sound well-mannered, well-spoken, easy going, educated. I'm sure you'll do fine here.

Perfect grammar...I'll give you a round of applause...

[EVENKEEL]

I'm in the Maritime Industry and know several Black sailors who have made Thailand their home with wives and kids. I haven't heard any bad stories of racism towards them. I believe it depends on the person. 

[ChouDoufu]

12 hours ago, Boy Wonder said:

I'm in my early twenties and from the USA. I'm a tall, black guy with dreads and tattoos that is easily confused for a basketball player, hip hop artist or thug (depending on where you went to school).

 

I make $100k USD working online, and have zero obligations. I'm a very low-key guy, love to stay away from trouble and do not like to be the center of attention.

i am...confused.

[flyingdoc]

Yes, excellent grammar indeed !  There have been some very sensible and helpful posts on here for a change.  Of course there will be some discrimination, but you sound sensible enough to be able to deal with it.  Try life here first for a while. You could come to like it !  It has lots of definite advantages over the U. S !! 

[smotherb]

51 minutes ago, Maradona 10 said:

'I make $100k USD working online,''

 

 

Course you do.

I worked online in the 90's I made over $100k. I am sure it is not impossible to do so now. So, why be so negative?

[Proboscis]

Three points:

 

- just because you find your place in the USA boring does not mean that you will find Thailand interesting or comfortable. Think outside the box. Read what other people say about Thais and black people in Thailand. This is not to say that black people cannot get along there but you would have to work extra hard with the language in order to make it worketc. You would also have to get around the visa situation - in short, if you don't work legally with all the documentation, you cannot stay longer than a few months per year unless you are over 50 in which case you can retire. You might not want to be an English teacher because what you are qualified for is not open to foreigners in Thailand.

- I don't know what your profession/business is but all the folks who I have met over the years who make their living online, invariably there comes a time when that falls off the edge due to reasons outside their own control. Wherever you go in the world, a job puts you in touch with others. Otherwise all you end up meeting are the types that the tourists meet in bars etc and appart from the rip offs, you don't get to meet real people. I am not suggesting that you give up your current comfortable $100K a year but I am suggesting that you take a look at your qualifications and skill set and ask yourself if you are going to be somewhere else, would you be in demand as an economic unit if your current business went down? If the answer is no, then consider getting a qualification that would put you in demand. Many choose English teaching qualification but there are many other things you could do.

- If you have a business that will travel with you, why not travel anyway. You don't have to be stuck in one country. All you need is a good Internet connection - and most places have a good one. Even in African countries, I was able to get a good mobile data connection even though it cost me $150 per month. Depending on how adventurous you are, I would take a look at South Africa, Botswana and even Zimbabwe (I was in Zimbabwe before Mugabwe was deposed and while it was economically depressed, it was potentially a great country - with $100k a year, you could go a long way - now the country is on the way up). If you speak French, there is Senegal and the other French-speaking parts of Africa. But even in Asia, you can look at other countries. Cambodia might be more forgiving about the colour of your skin than Thailand although perhaps you should consider waiting until the election is long over as that could be a bumpy ride. I am not trying to tell you where to go but just to open your mind a little.

 

And don't forget to buy worldwide health insurance (not just travel insurance). You will find that if you cover youself for everywhere except USA and Canada, it will be much cheaper.

 

Good luck.

[Maradona 10]

12 minutes ago, smotherb said:

I worked online in the 90's I made over $100k. I am sure it is not impossible to do so now. So, why be so negative?

Yea, course you did.

 

All millionaire's on here with lawyer wife's. LOL.

[connda]

Pro and cons.  Humm.

 

Many people come here for the low cost of living.  But that doesn't seem to apply to you based on your income.  Quite a few people work as digital nomads which for the moment tends to keep them under the radar of Thailand's strict and enforced laws regarding foreigners working in Thailand. But then again, if you're interested in starting a business, again, with your income you should be able to capitalize a business if you have a spare 2 million Thai baht to invest or roughly $60K.

You're articulate, so at least within Thailand you should have no real issues with socializing with other tourists or ex-pats per-se.  If you're staying in backpacker communities such as in Pai, Thailand or on the islands I'd expect that at your age and outward appearance you'd just be one-of-the-crowd.
As far as acceptance from Thais. Thais are xenophobic and unabashedly racist.  They have a number of words to describe foreigners.  The Thai word for foreigners literally means "different people" as in you ain't Thai and you'll never be accepted as anything but an outsider.  It's just a fact of life.  They also differentiate between white skinned foreigners who the call farang as opposed to dark-skinned foreigners from India, the Middle East, as well as Africa.  So, how will you fare as a member of the latter group?  It depends.  A certain group of older Thais will probably still remember black US servicemen coming to Thailand during the Vietnam era, and along the coast, like Pattaya, the US Navy still makes R&R stops so black Navy members aren't unheard of.  Then you're also American, my guess is that you're well-spoken, and you have money.  So that will also put you into you're own category as a bit of an enigma.  That's not necessarily a bad thing.  I have a very good friend who is black and hasn't encountered any real problems.  Once he starts talking with the local he was accepted as much as any other farang.  You won't fit into the nice neat racial categories they have, but once they get to know you you'll probably be tossed into the 'American' category although with dark skin. outside of the cities in rural areas, there is a good chance that many villagers have never seen anyone with black skin.  So you would be an object of curiosity. Now, that can be novel.

 

One word of warning.  If I were you I'd stay away from Central Bangkok and any other areas where there are Nigerian and other individuals coming sub-Saharan Africa as at the moment the local police are routinely sweeping up black Africans especially in Bangkok.  Do an Internet search on "Big Joke" and "African" or "dark-skin" or "Nigeria".  "Big Joke" is the head of a Thai police unit who tends to target foreigners who are committing some form of crime.  You'll find plenty of news articles.  And they do just come right out and say it: "We're targeting dark-skinned people."  Also, the dreads and the tats may cause you problems as in you'll stand out like a sore thumb.  If you indulge in recreation chemicals that are now legal in California, understand that they are not here in Thailand.  And the cops can and will force you to take a 'piss test' if they feel like it.  If you pop positive, you're looking at jail time and deportation.  Just a heads up.  Lose the dreads, dress business-casual and fly in business class and life could be a lot easier for you.  If that's not your style, then I'd simply avoid Bangkok.  Just saying.

As far a novel?  It's novel until it isn't.  It ain't Kansas, that for sure.  There is a lot of history here, there is still a huge disparity between those who have and those who don't and a large portion of those who don't eek out an existence farming or in by doing some form of trade work (e.g., construction) in rural areas.  Holidays such as Loi Kratong and Songkran are definitely novel the first time you experience them.  It all depends what you consider to be novel and not boring.  So, one thing I've learned from a life of swimming in various oceans: you never know how hot or cold the water will be until you get your feet wet.  So, jump on in, the water's just dandy!

Edited July 22, 2018 by connda

[jvs]

OP,when i was your age i got bored very easely also,moved countries and places and all kinds of jobs.When i was around forty i finally started to see a purpose.

No matter where you go,there you are.There is no way of getting away from yourself.

All bad ideas must have seem as a good idea at one time.

Just remember this,some day you will be reflecting on your life and compare good and bad things you did.

It is ok to feel sorry about something you did  do but you have no excuse for things you did not do.

Do not burn bridges behind you and for rest you will pick up along the way.

 

[smotherb]

11 minutes ago, Maradona 10 said:

Yea, course you did.

 

All millionaire's on here with lawyer wife's. LOL.

Yeah, I did. And, I pity people like you who just cannot imagine someone can actually earn good money

[spidermike007]

12 hours ago, moontang said:

you might be better off in Cuba.  You are going to have visa troubles here, unless you pay $$$.  Cambodia might be better, too.  What part of the US are you from?

Cuba absolutely sucks. Food is some of the worst in the world. Standard of living is higher than in the US, for nothing in return. People are cool. Government sucks royally. Avoid Cuba like the plague. Been there many times. I will not go anymore.

[spidermike007]

12 hours ago, jackdd said:

You should just give at a try for a few months, then you know how it is, all the reading won't help you

Two things you didn't mention, so maybe you just don't know it yet:

For Thai people white skin is beautiful, black skin is ugly. Most girls (normal girls, a hooker probably won't care too much) won't be interested in you just because of your skin color.

Most black people you meet here in Thailand come from Africa and are either working as drug dealers or pimps. Before i came to Thailand i didn't judge anybody by skin color. Here in Thailand i definitely do this, because for most black people i encounter here it's just true. Immigration Police, or police in general, are of course also aware of this, so you can expect to be treated accordingly.

I think these are generalizations. I think just as many women will find you exotic and attractive due to your looks, your youth, your height, and your exotic character. The dreads will be a novelty here. The tats you see everywhere you go. Give it a try. Thailand is a very cool place. I think most of the enmity that some Thai people show for black people is especially reserved for African people, who do not have a good reputation here. Alot are into all kinds of dodgy stuff. Americans still enjoy a good reputation here, despite Captain Chaos. Fortunately, most Thai people are not political. With the kind of income you have here, you will be able to live like royalty, and be able to save half your income, unlike in the US which is ridiculously expensive these days. And it will be easy for you to find a young and gorgeous Thai gal, considering your circumstances. Give it a try. Feel free to PM me if you need any specifics. Good fortune to you. Adventures are good for the soul. Get out. Get out of America. It is only going downhill. Thailand is still a great place, with alot of lovely people, amazing food, and lots to do and see. 

Edited July 22, 2018 by spidermike007

[nabbie]

Plus, learning Thai language (speaking or writing) might be a bonus if you consider to live in Thailand at long term. English labels/signs are not 100% everywhere....like food, highway and so forth...

[moontang]

When was thelast time you heard a Thai mention Tiger Woods?

[LawrenceN]

I have a close friend here in Chiang Mai. He's a well-educated black man in his 60s. He was one of the first black FBI agents after the racist pig J. Edgar Hoover died, and later had a successful career with IBM. He lived in Hong Kong before Thailand. When they were considering moving from the US to HK, his (white) wife said she had heard the Chinese didn't like blacks. She asked directly how he would feel about living in such a place. He answered, "I live in a country now that hates black people," namely the US. The point being, I think you'll find Thai people less bigoted than a sizable minority(?) of Americans. Smile, keep your cool, and learn a bit (or a lot) of the language, and you'll do fine here.

 

Regarding the language, I'll be brief. You're young, which gives you an advantage in language acquisition. You write well, so you pay attention to details in language. There is an education visa that may have fewer hassles than extending tourist visas. If you decide to study Thai, walk away from any teacher or program that doesn't teach you to read early on.

[KittenKong]

? Everywhere you go, you always take the weather with you. ?

 

Beats me how anyone can be bored anywhere. I never am.