Suvarnabhumi...have 2019 reentry permit...can i enter with no onward ticket?

[elviajero]

8 hours ago, glegolo said:

Yes, this is exactly my feelings in this as well...   elviajero .... Got it now!!

 

glegolo

What "it" do I need to "get"?

 

I'm not interested in your feelings, just facts.

[elviajero]

5 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

She'd had no idea what a re- entry permit was for until I explained, although she's seen plenty.

She's fully aware and trained on Thailand's Immigration requirements and as long as the passenger has a valid Visa or Extension, they look no further.

Maybe you should advise your DIL that an "extension of stay" without a valid re-entry permit is worthless, and that she only needs to ensure the passenger has a re-entry permit or visa.

 

5 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

That is not the first thing they look for though as has been suggested here.

How can you possibly know that. There are many airlines operating to Thailand from the UK, and if they follow the guidelines they only need to check that the person has a valid visa or re-entry permit.

 

5 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

I am not sure that is always the case.

I have seen reports on the forum of people being question about not having a visa when checking in for flights and the re-entry permit had to be shown to them.

As I wrote before not everybody has an extension. Some people would only have a entry/admitted until stamp and a re-entry permit.

+1

[Mattd]

Not sure why this went so far off track, however, every single time I have been traveling back to Thailand from overseas then the airline check in staff have referenced the reentry permit to verify my right to entry in to Thailand without a return ticket, in fact some airlines have this as an option to tick when booking the flight online.

For those on an extension of stay, the reentry permit is by far the easiest way for the airline to confirm, just by the definition of the name and as it has the number of entries allowed and the expiry date on it.

Oh and as a caveat, if you look at the actual extension of stay stamp, then it has "To keep your stay permit, reentry permit must be made before leaving Thailand" which reinforces that an airline should be checking for a reentry permit and not only the extension stamp!

[elviajero]

4 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

I haven't forgotten Joe, I'm specifically talking about departures from the UK.

98% of passengers departing for Thailand will have British or Thai nationalities.

Have you knowledge of the procedures followed by every airline flying to Thailand from the UK?

 

Anyone traveling with a valid re-entry permit, regardless of the permit to stay it's protecting, shouldn't have a problem boarding if the airline staff know Thailands requirements. The simple fact remains that not all of them do and that people with re-entry permits have been hassled when checking in.

 

What would your DIL do if someone turned up with a used non 'O-A' visa, valid re-entry permit but no "extension of stay"?

 

Whether or not someone has an extension of stay or not is irrelevant. According to the guidelines airlines should operate to based on Thailands requirements, a valid visa or re-entry permit is required otherwise the airline should insist (their choice) on being proof of an onward flight.

[Tanoshi]

16 hours ago, elviajero said:

What would your DIL do if someone turned up with a used non 'O-A' visa, valid re-entry permit but no "extension of stay"?

What does the airline do if someone turned up with a used non O-A Visa, no re-entry permit, OR

an extension of stay, with permission to stay until......…….but no re-entry permit.

 

Why don't they refuse boarding if a re-entry permit is of such importance.

 

[Mattd]

56 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

What does the airline do if someone turned up with a used non O-A Visa, no re-entry permit, OR

an extension of stay, with permission to stay until......…….but no re-entry permit.

 

Why don't they refuse boarding if a re-entry permit is of such importance.

 

Theoretically they should refuse boarding if as you state.

[Tanoshi]

5 hours ago, Mattd said:

Theoretically they should refuse boarding if as you state.

Why?

As a UK national am I not entitled to a 30 day Visa exempt entry.

 

There are those who forget, or not aware they need a re-entry permit. Topics on here about that happening.

They still board, they still get a 30 day Visa exempt entry.

 

If as suggested a re-entry permit is the first thing they look for,  then in the absence of any, the airline should refuse boarding and Immigration should refuse entry on a Visa exempt because they have no return ticket...……….but that isn't what happens.

 

[Mattd]

12 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Why?

As a UK national am I not entitled to a 30 day Visa exempt entry.

 

There are those who forget, or not aware they need a re-entry permit. Topics on here about that happening.

They still board, they still get a 30 day Visa exempt entry.

 

If as suggested a re-entry permit is the first thing they look for,  then in the absence of any, the airline should refuse boarding and Immigration should refuse entry on a Visa exempt because they have no return ticket...……….but that isn't what happens.

 

The airlines regularly refuse boarding to those who plan on entering with a 30 day VEE and have no return ticket.

[Tanoshi]

4 minutes ago, Mattd said:

The airlines regularly refuse boarding to those who plan on entering with a 30 day VEE and have no return ticket.

Agreed, but that isn't what we're debating.

[Tanoshi]

On ‎7‎/‎22‎/‎2018 at 7:10 PM, elviajero said:

Should the check-in staff ask about a visa just point out the re-entry permit.

 

On ‎7‎/‎22‎/‎2018 at 8:40 PM, elviajero said:

Airline staff do not always know the rules or even what a re-entry permit is or does, and almost certainly wouldn't have a clue about the 'extension of stay'.

 

On ‎7‎/‎22‎/‎2018 at 10:00 PM, elviajero said:

Because they are airline staff and not immigration officials!!!!

 

On ‎7‎/‎22‎/‎2018 at 10:00 PM, elviajero said:

The airline staff should know that an onward flight is not needed when the passenger holds a valid re-entry permit, but the reality is that they don't always know.

Clear as mud then.

 

[Mattd]

Just now, Tanoshi said:

Clear as mud then.

It is very clear, or at least should be.

All of the airlines flying in to the airports of Thailand are required to ensure that each passenger, whose flight terminates in Thailand, have the right of entry in to Thailand and that those who do not have any type of visa or reentry permit have a way to depart Thailand within the time frame that they would be permitted to stay in Thailand.

Thai immigration should also be asking to see a departing ticket for those entering on a VEE, they rarely do, except for some certain nationalities, but they should by their own rules.

Admittedly not all airlines rigidly enforce this, but they should and they are liable to large fines and the repatriation if they do not carry out this due diligence and a passenger is refused entry and in turn the staff member that checked them in originally could well lose their job for not checking as per their rules.

In my experience, airline check in desks in the UK are more stringent than most, Singapore is another airport that is also strict when checking documents.

This is why they insist on a document check for those online bookings that have printed their boarding pass, like I said yesterday, some of the airlines have reentry permit as one of the options for foreign passport holders entering Thailand within that online system.

I'll standby my statement yesterday, in all my years of traveling in and out of Thailand using reentry permits, the check in staff ALWAYS refer to this as their verification, never seen it any different.

[melvinmelvin]

8 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

What does the airline do if someone turned up with a used non O-A Visa, no re-entry permit, OR

an extension of stay, with permission to stay until......…….but no re-entry permit.

 

Why don't they refuse boarding if a re-entry permit is of such importance.

 

 

I think they should refuse boarding (if you don't have a return flight/out of Thailand ticket)

WIth no re-entry stamp, that is

your extension of stay is in principle void if you leave LoS with a return-permission

 

and what you try to do is Visa on arrival or Visa exempt without a return ticket

 

[melvinmelvin]

 

re-entry permits;

 

can be purchased one by one, valid for 1 go/come

or for a year?

 

if you have an extension of stay (or the equivalent issued as a VISA from  an embassy) running from say 1.feb to 1.feb

 

and you buy your re-entry permit (for  a year?) on say 1. july

what would be the period of validity for re-entry 1. july to 1 july or 1. july to 1. feb  (when extension os stay or visa expires) ?

 

 

 

[elviajero]

26 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

 

re-entry permits;

 

can be purchased one by one, valid for 1 go/come

or for a year?

 

if you have an extension of stay (or the equivalent issued as a VISA from  an embassy) running from say 1.feb to 1.feb

 

and you buy your re-entry permit (for  a year?) on say 1. july

what would be the period of validity for re-entry 1. july to 1 july or 1. july to 1. feb  (when extension os stay or visa expires) ?

You can buy single entry or multiple entry re-entry permits. Either would be valid until the end date of the permit (permission) to stay it’s protecting.

 

Until 1 Feb, when the extension expires.

[melvinmelvin]

12 minutes ago, elviajero said:

You can buy single entry or multiple entry re-entry permits. Either would be valid until the end date of the permit (permission) to stay it’s protecting.

 

Until 1 Feb, when the extension expires.

 

thanks, if that is correct I think this is getting clearer to me

 

the thing that airport staff should look at/for is the entry/re-entry permit, extension of stay or its VISA brother is of way lesser importance

and will in principle be void if you don't have the come-back-OK

 

(a few times I have been asked by check in staff (where I come from in Europe) they are very happy when I point to the extension of stay,

 false happiness! then)

 

I think the only place I have experienced real problems related to such issues is in Canada,

I have flown (on Canadian carriers) many times from Canada to Brazil, I don't need a visa to Brazil - Canadians do

lots and lots of piss talk related to this. Sometimes very very difficult.

 

(and some annoying experiences in the US because immigration have not been familiar with my a bit special papers)

Africa, "behind the iron curtain", arab countries, asia and the pacific - never a problem

 

 

 

 

[Tanoshi]

2 hours ago, Mattd said:

All of the airlines flying in to the airports of Thailand are required to ensure that each passenger, whose flight terminates in Thailand, have the right of entry in to Thailand and that those who do not have any type of visa or reentry permit have a way to depart Thailand within the time frame that they would be permitted to stay in Thailand.

Whilst I agree in principal with your sentiments the fact is airlines do not check for a re-entry permit, or understand it's significance.

Even if they did, it's not their responsibility to advise the passenger on their entry rights in the absence of such.

 

Many an expat has departed in the second year of an O-A Visa, or on an extension, without a re-entry permit and not only allowed to board, but also admitted back into Thailand at Immigration, albeit on a VEE.

The fact this happens shows airlines do not check for a re-entry permit as a means of right of entry.

Many nationalities don't even require a Visa.

 

Here's just one example;

 

 

[BritTim]

10 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

Whilst I agree in principal with your sentiments the fact is airlines do not check for a re-entry permit, or understand it's significance.

 Even if they did, it's not their responsibility to advise the passenger on their entry rights in the absence of such.

It is understandable that regular airline check in staff do not understand all the nuances of the immigration rules of all countries their airline flies to. However, as far as Thailand is concerned, they should be aware that passengers should generally have:

• a valid visa to enter Thailand; or
• failing that, they should be from a country entitled to visa exempt entry, and have an onward flight out of Thailand within 30 days.

Failing that, it is up to the supervisor to sort things out. The supervisor should understand that a re-entry permit is a valid replacement for the function of a visa when traveling to Thailand. They also need to evaluate whether to permit travel by those from countries entitled to visa exempt entry, but lacking a visa, re-entry permit, or onward flight reservation.

[Mattd]

12 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

Whilst I agree in principal with your sentiments the fact is airlines do not check for a re-entry permit, or understand it's significance.

Even if they did, it's not their responsibility to advise the passenger on their entry rights in the absence of such.

Sorry, I totally disagree with this.

1. They DO check reentry permits, at least with me as I have said. You seem to be assuming that check in staff are not intelligent enough to work things out, the below image supports why they would look for a reentry permit if the check in staff can read.

2. It is ultimately their responsibility, if they allow the passenger to fly and that passenger cannot enter Thailand, then the airline is responsible to repatriate, plus they will be fined, they take this responsibility seriously, as it costs a lot of money.

 

 

[Tanoshi]

Let's be clear, I specifically mentioned a UK national, although it could be any national who is allowed entry by VEE.

 

What should happen in theory and what actually happens in practice are two entirely different matters. In the case of someone with  an extension of stay (I use that as an example) but no re-entry permit, is that the airline doesn't refuse boarding, and Immigration allow entry on a VEE.

 

If the airline recognised the importance or significance of a re-entry permit with an extension, they would also be aware the passenger would only be allowed entry on a VEE, which requires an onward flight, which the passenger doesn't have and is never requested neither by the airline or Immigration.

 

Please advise of one case you know of where a national who is allowed a VEE, but holds an extension from a Visa, but forgets to obtain a re-entry permit, where the airline has refused boarding because they have no onward ticket, or Immigration refuse entry on the same grounds and the airline is forced to repatriate the passenger to his departure origin at their expense.

[Tanoshi]

55 minutes ago, Mattd said:

 

 

How convenient for the airline staff, your extension and re-entry permit are on the same page.

 

My latest re-entry permit is two pages further into my passport than my current extension.

[Mattd]

1 minute ago, Tanoshi said:

How convenient for the airline staff, your extension and re-entry permit are on the same page.

My latest re-entry permit is two pages further into my passport than my current extension.

This is the first time it has ever been on the same page and unfortunately it is the last page of the passport ?

10 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Let's be clear, I specifically mentioned a UK national, although it could be any national who is allowed entry by VEE.

 

What should happen in theory and what actually happens in practice are two entirely different matters. In the case of someone with  an extension of stay (I use that as an example) but no re-entry permit, is that the airline doesn't refuse boarding, and Immigration allow entry on a VEE.

 

If the airline recognised the importance or significance of a re-entry permit with an extension, they would also be aware the passenger would only be allowed entry on a VEE, which requires an onward flight, which the passenger doesn't have and is never requested neither by the airline or Immigration.

 

Please advise of one case you know of where a national who is allowed a VEE, but holds an extension from a Visa, but forgets to obtain a re-entry permit, where the airline has refused boarding because they have no onward ticket, or Immigration refuse entry on the same grounds and the airline is forced to repatriate the passenger to his departure origin at their expense.

The original poster asked if he needed a return flight when he had a valid reentry permit and the answer to that is no, 100% both for immigration and checking in and in my experience (I fly in and out at least 10 times a year) the check in staff do know and understand what a reentry permit is, bearing in mind that they do this day in day out and see hundreds of passengers flying to Thailand.

 

If a person is flying from a country that can obtain a VEE then the airline should ask to see a return OR another ticket out of Thailand and if they cannot produce this, they will either deny boarding, or get the passenger to sign something to indemnify the airline should immigration refuse entry.

The same thing applies to somebody who has an extension of stay and neglected to get a reentry permit, there is no difference.

Yes, the reality is different, in that perhaps the passenger could wing it regarding the extension stamp with check in staff, that would depend on their luck that day.

Immigration here are lapse at wanting to see a return ticket for VEE, the fact remains that they can ask to see a return or another ticket and refuse entry if there isn't one.

 

Anyway, the OP did have his question answered, otherwise this could go on forever.

[melvinmelvin]

this is kind of a digression, but;

 

This month I arrived BKK with TG biz.

When I checked in the lady probably noticed that I did not have any onward travel on the ticket.

She flipped pages in the passport and enquired about visa, I just pointed to the extension of stay

on the page that was open and she was happy (the reentry was on a separate page).

 

That was it re checking of passport/ticket/boarding card - next was BKK immigration.

At the gate; no checking of anything, I was just waved onto the jetty,

at the doors entering the plane, the same, no control of anything.

 

Weird, don't think I have experienced that before.

[BritTim]

45 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

What should happen in theory and what actually happens in practice are two entirely different matters. In the case of someone with  an extension of stay (I use that as an example) but no re-entry permit, is that the airline doesn't refuse boarding, and Immigration allow entry on a VEE.

If the traveler has neither a re-entry permit, nor an onward flight ticket, it will usually be up to the airline supervisor to decide whether to allow the passenger to check in. The previous irrelevant permission to stay (extended or not) has no bearing on that decision, assuming the supervisor knows the rules. Each airline will tend to use its own guidelines on this. Many will allow check in, but insist on the signing of an indemnity form first.

[OJAS]

12 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

this is kind of a digression, but;

 

This month I arrived BKK with TG biz.

When I checked in the lady probably noticed that I did not have any onward travel on the ticket.

She flipped pages in the passport and enquired about visa, I just pointed to the extension of stay

on the page that was open and she was happy (the reentry was on a separate page).

 

That was it re checking of passport/ticket/boarding card - next was BKK immigration.

At the gate; no checking of anything, I was just waved onto the jetty,

at the doors entering the plane, the same, no control of anything.

 

Weird, don't think I have experienced that before.

Which airport did you fly from?

[Tanoshi]

1 hour ago, melvinmelvin said:

She flipped pages in the passport and enquired about visa, I just pointed to the extension of stay

on the page that was open and she was happy (the reentry was on a separate page).

That has been my own personal experience at check in and I've flown twice this year already from 2 different UK airports with 2 different airlines.

 

A good expat friend who only recently arrived back from a trip to the UK, who is on a retirement extension, different airport, different airline to me, only realised his 'lapse' of obtaining a re-entry permit when he came to complete his landing card on the flight.

He received a 30 day VEE and has now obtained his Non O stamp as part of the conversion process to regain his extension.

 

I totally agree with the sentiments of what should happen at check in, but invariably the sight of a Visa with a valid enter before date, or an extension with permission to stay until...…………. convinces the check in that entry will be accepted.

[melvinmelvin]

Oslo, Norway.

 

[melvinmelvin]

yes, not much room for mistakes,

better not forget to get a re-entry permit and better not forget to renew the extension of stay

 

it is a cumbersome process to sort that out and get a new extension of stay