British family stranded in Thailand over son’s passport issues

[genf]

14 minutes ago, watcharacters said:

 

There was apparently more than one  party guilty of oversight.

 

A fine has been paid and I say let them go.

 

I didn't read anywhere there's a murder or robbery connected with this couple or boy.

 

The end of the world won't happen due to this  infraction.

 

On with them I say..

 

All down to the common sense really. People with British-Thai dual nationality use the British passport to enter and exit the UK. So, the airline has nothing to do with that. When arriving in Thailand they would use Thai passport (to get entry and exit stamps) to enter (valid or not passport) and exit Thailand (valid passport only).  

[stevenl]

6 minutes ago, genf said:

The problem must be the following:
- the boy was born in the UK, his Thai mother and Scottish father could apply for a FIRST Thai passport for him at the Thai embassy in London anytime BUT he would not be able to get the SECOND passport in the UK until he gets a Thai national ID.
- to get the Thai national ID, the boy must be registered in a Thai house registration (Tabian Baan)
- when the boy's name is on the Tabian Baan (the House registration), automatically when he reaches 18 years of age he would be on the military conscription list. And he would have to return to Thailand when he's 21 years old for the conscription selection.
- the parents may not have registered the son in any house registration in Thailand.
- because of that explained above, it would naturally take a long time to process all the paperwork in Thailand.
- the boy should have returned to Thailand on the British passport in the first place (if he was not on Tabian Bann), as to avoid all this palaver.

Hence, the problem.

PS. Had the mother ever visited Pantip.com to ask about this, people there would have advised her how to do things properly.

"the boy was born in the UK, his Thai mother and Scottish father could apply for a FIRST Thai passport for him at the Thai embassy in London anytime BUT he would not be able to get the SECOND passport in the UK until he gets a Thai national ID."

I think this is incorrect and he would have been able to get consecutive Thai passports at the Thai embassy in London.

[user343434]

19 minutes ago, Patriot said:

Unless I’m missing something the lad has a Brit passport so doesn’t need to go through the visa shenanigans. 

They entered Thailand on the Thai passport and will enter UK on the British??

When checking in they were stopped by airport staff who recognised Max’s Thai passport had expired during their stay.

Full story: https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/family-stranded-in-thailand-over-son-s-passport-issues-1-4777948

 

-- Edinburgh News 2018-2018-08-03

 

@ watcharacters

I fully agree that let them pay and then let them go home with a lessons learned stamp in the new passport.

It just bounces off me to blame the authorities for their own mistake.

He is not looking as a one "time budget tourist" and should know the score and what has to be prepared before travelling.

To blame is only the person who invented passports and borders in this world LOL

[Snow Leopard]

Their own fault. Nothing to do with Thai immigration. I cant stand Western media who make such a drama about this kind of thing. Just renew it. Leave the country. Simple. 

[Get Real]

Yeah, it´s good to see. Thumbs up. Why? Oh, I am brittish. I do not have to care about anything. Opps! did my soms passport go out. Oooh. No problem just let us fly home.

It ain´t that simple. Just look at the passport before travel! It´s that simple!!!!! Seems like Brexit starting to become a sickness that affects the mind even more than before.

[AdamTheFarang]

Unbelievable, the son could have entered on his British Passport and would be given 30 days which is more than the 4 weeks they stayed.  "Kenny added: “It’s total bureaucracy. When we entered Thailand we should have been warned about the passport expiring. Max is ready to come home and see his friends - this is typical of someone expecting a nanny state.....like some say GB has become.

 

I know my Passport has at least 6 months left before I travel which last time I checked seems the normal allowance. 

 

This matter could so easily have been avoided in a number of ways as above or re-newed the Thai Passport before travelling and now they blame others.

 

Pathetic take responsibility for yourselves!

[orchis]

irresponsible father

 

[genf]

32 minutes ago, stevenl said:

"the boy was born in the UK, his Thai mother and Scottish father could apply for a FIRST Thai passport for him at the Thai embassy in London anytime BUT he would not be able to get the SECOND passport in the UK until he gets a Thai national ID."

I think this is incorrect and he would have been able to get consecutive Thai passports at the Thai embassy in London.

I am afraid you must have misunderstood about obtaining the second and consecutive passports in the UK. 

Not nowadays.

I hope you can read Thai     http://www.thaiconsulatela.org/content_detail.aspx?content_id=75

ส่วนเด็กไทยในอเมริกาที่จะกระทบหรือมีผลโดยตรงที่สุดก็คือ การขอทำหนังสือเดินทางไทย เพราะการเพิ่มชื่อเด็กในทะเบียนบ้านไทยเพื่อให้เด็กมีหมายเลขประจำตัวประชาชน 13 หลักเป็นหลักเกณฑ์สำคัญในการยื่นคำร้องขอทำหนังสือเดินทางให้กับเด็กไทยที่เกิดในอเมริกา (รวมถึงประเทศอื่นๆ ด้วย) คือ 
                - กรณีเด็กทำหนังสือเดินทางเล่มแรก สถานกงสุลใหญ่ฯ จะอนุโลมให้ทำหนังสือเดินทางได้ โดยใช้สูติบัตรไทยเป็นหลักฐานแสดงตนของเด็กในการทำหนังสือเดินทาง ถ้าพ่อและแม่ยังไม่ได้เพิ่มชื่อเด็กในทะเบียนบ้านไทย
                - กรณีเด็กทำหนังสือเดินทางครั้งที่สอง สถานกงสุลใหญ่ฯ จะไม่อนุญาตให้ทำหนังสือเดินทาง ถ้าพ่อและแม่ยังไม่ได้เพิ่มชื่อเด็กในทะเบียนบ้านไทย โดยจะต้องใช้สูติบัตรไทยและสำเนาทะเบียนบ้านไทยที่ได้เพิ่มชื่อเด็กแล้วยื่นเป็นหลักฐานแสดงตนของเด็กในการทำหนังสือเดินทาง

           สรุปว่าปัญหาจะเกิดขึ้นเมื่อพ่อแม่พาเด็กมาทำหนังสือเดินทางไทยครั้งที่สอง ถ้ายังไม่ได้เพิ่มชื่อในทะเบียนบ้านไทยและยังไม่มีเลข 13 หลัก ก็จะทำหนังสือเดินทางครั้งที่สองไม่ได้ ฉะนั้นถ้าได้สูติบัตรไทยแล้วควรรีบไปขอเพิ่มชื่อเด็กในทะเบียนบ้านไทยให้เรียบร้อย ซึ่งถ้าไม่สะดวกไปติดต่อเองที่ประเทศไทย ก็อาจมอบอำนาจให้ญาติพี่น้องไปดำเนินการแทนได้ ดูรายละเอียดเกี่ยวกับเอกสารหลักฐานที่จะต้องเตรียมได้ที่เว็บไซต์สถานกงสุลใหญ่ฯ  www.thaiconsulatela.org (แถบเมนูด้านซ้ายมือให้เลือกหัวข้อ “นิติกรณ์และงานทะเบียนราษฎร์” / เลือก “การเพิ่มชื่อเด็กไทยที่เกิดในสหรัฐฯ ในทะเบียนบ้านไทย”) หรือสอบถามเพิ่มเติมได้ที่ 323 – 9629574

http://www.thaiembassy.org/london/en/services/82038-Thai-Passport.html

E-Passport Application

Thai Electronic Passport (E-Passport)

1. Make an appointment via 24 hours online booking (click here)

       For your convenience of services, please kindly check the Embassy's working hours and official holidays here.

       2. For applicants under 20 years old, both of parents are required to accompany the applicant to the Embassy.

       3. You are advised not to book your travels before receiving the passport as we cannot be responsible for any cancellations.The current processing time for a Thai passport is between 4-6 weeks.

       4. The fee is £25 in cash only.

       5. Thai nationals must bring his/her Thai Identity card to submit the passport application.

       6. The applicant should always bring original identical paper works, passport and official photo ID to contact the Embassy. 

 

Edited August 3, 2018 by genf

[tolsti]

2 hours ago, markaoffy said:

So they let him in with this passport ? What a joke Thai


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

Thailand does allow Thai citizens with an expired passport to enter the country.

[stevenl]

40 minutes ago, genf said:

I am afraid you must have misunderstood about obtaining the second and consecutive passports in the UK. 

Not nowadays.

I hope you can read Thai     http://www.thaiconsulatela.org/content_detail.aspx?content_id=75

ส่วนเด็กไทยในอเมริกาที่จะกระทบหรือมีผลโดยตรงที่สุดก็คือ การขอทำหนังสือเดินทางไทย เพราะการเพิ่มชื่อเด็กในทะเบียนบ้านไทยเพื่อให้เด็กมีหมายเลขประจำตัวประชาชน 13 หลักเป็นหลักเกณฑ์สำคัญในการยื่นคำร้องขอทำหนังสือเดินทางให้กับเด็กไทยที่เกิดในอเมริกา (รวมถึงประเทศอื่นๆ ด้วย) คือ 
                - กรณีเด็กทำหนังสือเดินทางเล่มแรก สถานกงสุลใหญ่ฯ จะอนุโลมให้ทำหนังสือเดินทางได้ โดยใช้สูติบัตรไทยเป็นหลักฐานแสดงตนของเด็กในการทำหนังสือเดินทาง ถ้าพ่อและแม่ยังไม่ได้เพิ่มชื่อเด็กในทะเบียนบ้านไทย
                - กรณีเด็กทำหนังสือเดินทางครั้งที่สอง สถานกงสุลใหญ่ฯ จะไม่อนุญาตให้ทำหนังสือเดินทาง ถ้าพ่อและแม่ยังไม่ได้เพิ่มชื่อเด็กในทะเบียนบ้านไทย โดยจะต้องใช้สูติบัตรไทยและสำเนาทะเบียนบ้านไทยที่ได้เพิ่มชื่อเด็กแล้วยื่นเป็นหลักฐานแสดงตนของเด็กในการทำหนังสือเดินทาง

           สรุปว่าปัญหาจะเกิดขึ้นเมื่อพ่อแม่พาเด็กมาทำหนังสือเดินทางไทยครั้งที่สอง ถ้ายังไม่ได้เพิ่มชื่อในทะเบียนบ้านไทยและยังไม่มีเลข 13 หลัก ก็จะทำหนังสือเดินทางครั้งที่สองไม่ได้ ฉะนั้นถ้าได้สูติบัตรไทยแล้วควรรีบไปขอเพิ่มชื่อเด็กในทะเบียนบ้านไทยให้เรียบร้อย ซึ่งถ้าไม่สะดวกไปติดต่อเองที่ประเทศไทย ก็อาจมอบอำนาจให้ญาติพี่น้องไปดำเนินการแทนได้ ดูรายละเอียดเกี่ยวกับเอกสารหลักฐานที่จะต้องเตรียมได้ที่เว็บไซต์สถานกงสุลใหญ่ฯ  www.thaiconsulatela.org (แถบเมนูด้านซ้ายมือให้เลือกหัวข้อ “นิติกรณ์และงานทะเบียนราษฎร์” / เลือก “การเพิ่มชื่อเด็กไทยที่เกิดในสหรัฐฯ ในทะเบียนบ้านไทย”) หรือสอบถามเพิ่มเติมได้ที่ 323 – 9629574

http://www.thaiembassy.org/london/en/services/82038-Thai-Passport.html

E-Passport Application

Thai Electronic Passport (E-Passport)

1. Make an appointment via 24 hours online booking (click here)

       For your convenience of services, please kindly check the Embassy's working hours and official holidays here.

       2. For applicants under 20 years old, both of parents are required to accompany the applicant to the Embassy.

       3. You are advised not to book your travels before receiving the passport as we cannot be responsible for any cancellations.The current processing time for a Thai passport is between 4-6 weeks.

       4. The fee is £25 in cash only.

       5. Thai nationals must bring his/her Thai Identity card to submit the passport application.

       6. The applicant should always bring original identical paper works, passport and official photo ID to contact the Embassy. 

 

But he could get his ID card in the UK as well, before applying for the passport. So he would also have been able to obtain the second passport at the London embassy.

Or does he have to apply for ID card in person at 'his' amphur?

 

Edited August 3, 2018 by stevenl

[overherebc]

2 hours ago, markaoffy said:

So they let him in with this passport ? What a joke Thai


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

Why not? At the time it was a valid passport. It takes very little time and effort to re-new a Thai passport which is what should have been done.

And compared to the cost and time needed to re-new a UK passport it's cheap as chips.

Edited August 3, 2018 by overherebc

[stevenl]

2 minutes ago, overherebc said:

Why not? At the time it was a valid passport. It takes very little time and effort to re-new a Thai passport which is what should have been done.

And compared to the cost and time needed to re-new a UK passport it's cheap as chips.

Even if not valid they would have let him in.

[genf]

@ stevenl,  if you had read the news clearly that they had to get the Thai birth certificate from the UK to Thailand in order to get a new Thai passport in Thailand, that clearly shows the parents had not registered the boy in the Thai house registration as to avoid the conscription (it is normal practice for most half-Thai boys born abroad).

Please bear in mind that once you (as a man) have a Thai national ID you must go through the conscription process, unless you are exempt.

Years ago, it wasn't possible to get the Thai national ID outside of Thailand. I have been outside of Thailand for 40 years more or less, in the UK and many countries in Europe, and I have never once applied to have it done in the UK or anywhere else in Europe. Whenever I get a chance to visit home I would get it done when I am there. For the past 40 years, I have my national ID renewed only twice in my entire life, as when living here in Europe I have no need to use the ID at all. Only need to carry one around when I am there for longer than 5 or so weeks.

Hope you clear now.

 

[stevenl]

2 minutes ago, genf said:

@ stevenl,  if you had read the news clearly that they had to get the Thai birth certificate from the UK to Thailand in order to get a new Thai passport in Thailand, that clearly shows the parents had not registered the boy in the Thai house registration as to avoid the conscription (it is normal practice for most half-Thai boys born abroad).

Please bear in mind that once you (as a man) have a Thai national ID you must go through the conscription process, unless you are exempt.

Years ago, it wasn't possible to get the Thai national ID outside of Thailand. I have been outside of Thailand for 40 years more or less, in the UK and many countries in Europe, and I have never once applied to have it done in the UK or anywhere else in Europe. Whenever I get a chance to visit home I would get it done when I am there. For the past 40 years, I have my national ID renewed only twice in my entire life, as when living here in Europe I have no need to use the ID at all. Only need to carry one around when I am there for longer than 5 or so weeks.

Hope you clear now.

 

I had read and they had not registered at an amphur. But maybe you did not read my post properly?

 

"But he could get his ID card in the UK as well, before applying for the passport. So he would also have been able to obtain the second passport at the London embassy.

Or does he have to apply for ID card in person at 'his' amphur?"

[overherebc]

24 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Even if not valid they would have let him in.

True.

And as I posted before, if I decided to go on overstay here on an expired passport and was sent back to UK they couldn't refuse me entry.

The parents didn't think or didn't seek advice on this before hand and are now hoping 'social media' will come to their rescue.

 

Edited August 3, 2018 by overherebc

[genf]

@ steven:  You must have missed my point altogether, had they registered the boy in the Thai Tabian Bann and submitted the Thai national ID (which has to be done in Thailand only, even by any relatives with written consent from the parents and authorisation issued by the Thai consulate in London) when applying for the first passport then everything would have been simple. They could have easily applied for a new Thai passport while they were there. Had it been properly done, it would have only taken a minimum of one day to get one. But they DID NOT.

Instead, they started throwing blame at the Thai immigration system and others. 

I know our system (all systems) is not perfect but if the rules are followed accordingly there would be no problems.

Regards,
 

[stevenl]

8 minutes ago, genf said:

@ steven:  You must have missed my point altogether, had they registered the boy in the Thai Tabian Bann and submitted the Thai national ID (which has to be done in Thailand only, even by any relatives with written consent from the parents and authorisation issued by the Thai consulate in London) when applying for the first passport then everything would have been simple. They could have easily applied for a new Thai passport while they were there. Had it been properly done, it would have only taken a minimum of one day to get one. But they DID NOT.

Instead, they started throwing blame at the Thai immigration system and others. 

I know our system (all systems) is not perfect but if the rules are followed accordingly there would be no problems.

Regards,
 

So they could apply for the Thai ID from UK.

 

Now I know what you mean with this post " the boy was born in the UK, his Thai mother and Scottish father could apply for a FIRST Thai passport for him at the Thai embassy in London anytime BUT he would not be able to get the SECOND passport in the UK until he gets a Thai national ID. ". You meant to say 'he could have applied for renewal of his passport at embassy in London, but would first have had to register at amphur in Thailand', which can be done by consent. I interpreted it as 'he would have had to go to Thailand to complete the renewal application'. Hence my remark "he would have been able to get consecutive Thai passports at the Thai embassy in London. ", which appears to be correct.

[overherebc]

8 minutes ago, stevenl said:

So they could apply for the Thai ID from UK.

 

Now I know what you mean with this post " the boy was born in the UK, his Thai mother and Scottish father could apply for a FIRST Thai passport for him at the Thai embassy in London anytime BUT he would not be able to get the SECOND passport in the UK until he gets a Thai national ID. ". You meant to say 'he could have applied for renewal of his passport at embassy in London, but would first have had to register at amphur in Thailand', which can be done by consent. I interpreted it as 'he would have had to go to Thailand to complete the renewal application'. Hence my remark "he would have been able to get consecutive Thai passports at the Thai embassy in London. ", which appears to be correct.

Ok not sure but wouldn't the fact he already had a passport for Thailand make it simpler/easier?

[ratcatcher]

A sad case of  a Jock strapped.

[ravip]

5 hours ago, JAZZDOG said:

The young man has another VALID passport. Immigration could go up the ladder until someone with common sense could solve the problem. Unfortunately in LOS the only thing that can solve a problem outside the box is a box of money. Common sense and corruption don't mix well. Anyone questioning if there is not corruption here has no business questioning someone's state of consciousness.

1. Can you exit a country on a foreign passport if you don't have an entry stamp in it?
2. Common sense and corruption don't mix well - No denial about this fact.
3. When one forgets your passports validity, do you expect the immigration officers to remind you?
4. If this same thing happened in your home country what would've been the result, according to you?

Here you will see what can happen in airports, corrupted or not >>> click

[melvinmelvin]

6 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

Would the UK or any other country let you depart on an expered passport? 

 

 

 

 

I think you would have run into fairly deep shit in pretty much any country in the world with expired passports.

 

This is just another silly UK family not having their papers in order.

 

The family has nothing to complain about.

 

[Patriot]

Exactly the same thing happened to a friend recently.

The family are resident here in Buri Ram.

He, an Aussie, with kids being Thai-Aussie Passport holders.

Planned for a trip to Indonesia. Reached Check-In at Suvarnabhum and then realised  the son's Thai Passport had expired. Tried using the Australian PP to leave the country but there was no Entry Stamp ie the foreigner was not staying for the allowed visa period.

Quite rightly, the Immigration department didn't budge, holiday cancelled, my mate eating double portions of Humble Pie.

The British family in question on this thread surely should have gone through the simple process of renewing the Thai Passport during their holiday here.

It is NOT the Thai Immigration's fault and the sensationalist western media can get stuffed.

[genf]

57 minutes ago, overherebc said:

Ok not sure but wouldn't the fact he already had a passport for Thailand make it simpler/easier?

It doesn't work that way for the Thai immigration system. 

For a half - Thai child born abroad, the child will get a first Thai passport without having the Thai national ID (no need to be registered in Tabian Baan) during the birth registration process, it is a concession. 

In this case, if the parents had not breached the Thai immigration rules in the first place and made so much fuss about this, things might have been a lot easier.  

Read a warning posted on the Gov. UK website

https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/thailand/entry-requirements
If you’re a dual national you must make sure that when you depart Thailand you have a valid passport of the nationality used to enter, otherwise you may have difficulty in leaving.

Simple rules to follow:  for a dual national having two passports-
Use the UK passport to enter and exit the UK.

Use Thai passport to enter and EXIT Thailand.

Never use one passport to enter the kingdom and try to use the other to EXIT.

You will definitely peeve any immigration officer off.

 

It's a common knowledge for most Thais who have two passports, especially those who care to follow the news.

The child MUST be registered in the Tabian Baan, and after having obtained a Thai ID that child can then apply for the second and subsequent passports abroad (in a country of residence) or in Thailand.

My daughter is in the same predicament, as we haven't yet registered her in the Tabian Baan in Thailand. She is now 22, living in Edinburgh, had her first Thai passport when she was 8 years old. So, before she can get her next Thai passport I have to register her in the Tabian Baan to get a Thai ID. That is if she wishes to have a valid Thai passport.


 

[bdenner]

12 hours ago, Snow Leopard said:

Their own fault. Nothing to do with Thai immigration. I cant stand Western media who make such a drama about this kind of thing. Just renew it. Leave the country. Simple. 

Exactly!

The same thing happened to my sister in law and her British husband 4 years ago, their sons Thai passport had expired (they knew it was going to but did nothing about it?). Bottom line = it cost em an extra 3 days in Bangkok to sort it AND all sorts of hassles with the airline.

[Snow Leopard]

8 hours ago, genf said:

It doesn't work that way for the Thai immigration system. 

For a half - Thai child born abroad, the child will get a first Thai passport without having the Thai national ID (no need to be registered in Tabian Baan) during the birth registration process, it is a concession. 

In this case, if the parents had not breached the Thai immigration rules in the first place and made so much fuss about this, things might have been a lot easier.  

Read a warning posted on the Gov. UK website

https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/thailand/entry-requirements
If you’re a dual national you must make sure that when you depart Thailand you have a valid passport of the nationality used to enter, otherwise you may have difficulty in leaving.

Simple rules to follow:  for a dual national having two passports-
Use the UK passport to enter and exit the UK.

Use Thai passport to enter and EXIT Thailand.

Never use one passport to enter the kingdom and try to use the other to EXIT.

You will definitely peeve any immigration officer off.

 

It's a common knowledge for most Thais who have two passports, especially those who care to follow the news.

The child MUST be registered in the Tabian Baan, and after having obtained a Thai ID that child can then apply for the second and subsequent passports abroad (in a country of residence) or in Thailand.

My daughter is in the same predicament, as we haven't yet registered her in the Tabian Baan in Thailand. She is now 22, living in Edinburgh, had her first Thai passport when she was 8 years old. So, before she can get her next Thai passport I have to register her in the Tabian Baan to get a Thai ID. That is if she wishes to have a valid Thai passport.


 

I like the UK FCO advice. You may have difficulty leaving. Its impossible to arrive and leave any country that requires an entry stamp or VOA on arrival with a passport switch as these guys found out. Also if you are leaving BKK to the UK your passport info needs to be entered into the airline system beforehand.

 

Good luck with your daughter. Tell her to keep her valid Thai passport. You never know the future. Hard to explain to the younger generation these days though.  

[dotpoom]

How was he allowed into Thailand in the first place with so little time left in his passport?....did nobody either from the airlines or airport notice it

[anon537687643]

A Thai national can't be refused even with an expired passport.
Same in UK for a UK citizen.
If I was caught with an expired passport here and on overstay, got caught and deported back to UK do you think the UK will refuse entry and send me back here?

Exactly ! But the “ Thai officialdom lovers are out in force “


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[thaized]

He enter on his thai passport ats for sure to jump the q,s in thai lane.its a came back to bit them in the ass maybe next time they wont try be so stupid.its simple use one or the othet mate.sorry i feel for the guy truth is haveing duel is ok but know when to use it is another.if he had got his british passport stamped with card he would not have had a problm.i have a son with same both passports we use one or other never try use both.its a night mare as this shows.sorry mate .

[overherebc]

8 minutes ago, dotpoom said:

How was he allowed into Thailand in the first place with so little time left in his passport?....did nobody either from the airlines or airport notice it

Even if the passport had expired he can't be refused entry.

[overherebc]

13 hours ago, Snow Leopard said:

Their own fault. Nothing to do with Thai immigration. I cant stand Western media who make such a drama about this kind of thing. Just renew it. Leave the country. Simple. 

A better headline would be

UK family screw up on son's passport and get an extended holiday in Thailand.

That's not dramatic though, is it?