Uk Visitor Visa Questions

[sonicdragon]

Greetings

I am British and will visit the UK with my 2 twin babies in May for 4 months and I want to apply for a visitor visa for my Thai wife (the babies mother).Here are some pertinent facts

1. the babies were born in Bangkok in Oct 2006 and have UK+thai passports and UK+thai birth certificates

2. we were married in Jan 2007 in thailand

3. we have been together for 4 years but I don't have any evidence of that - the only evidence is her being the mother of my children as per their bith certificates.

4. I am a Hong Kong permanent resident and my wife was previously a HK resident (she still has a HK ID card)

5. I run a small business in HK and travel there every month or two for a few days, but mainly I live in thailand (I currently have a family visitors visa for thailand)

6. I don't have accomodation in HK - we live at my wife's house in thailand.

We will all be in HK in April for 1 month before leaving for the UK in May.

It has been suggested that applying in Hong Kong for her visa may be better than in Thailand because applications are vetted less stringently and I am a HK resident with business there. Can anyone advise on this ? I am concerned that 1 month may not be enough time to apply.

What kind of evidence would we need to submit for her application ? I assume the babies birth certificates are evidence enough of our relationship ? Do I need our marriage certificate translated into english ? Would the ECO be satisfied that she would not overstay simply by being the mother of our 2 small babies (she is a full time mother) ? Do I need any evidence concerning my business in HK (ie, to show that I intend to leave the UK after 4 months) ? In which case what kind of evidence would be suitable ?

Thanks in advance

[vinny]

For an idea of what's expected, see also Visa Application Centre's Spouse of British citizen (based in Thailand) going to UK for visit checklist.

[Mahout Angrit]

It has been suggested that applying in Hong Kong for her visa may be better than in Thailand because applications are vetted less stringently and I am a HK resident with business there. Can anyone advise on this ? I am concerned that 1 month may not be enough time to apply.

Your comment about vetting maybe true but the only family member who needs a visa is your wife but has your wife residence status in HK? as she should apply for UK visas in the country in which she is resident. If your wife is in HK you could explain your situation to the UK embassy in HK and ask them if they will process it but they are not bound to.

However it seems from what you say you she stands a good chance to get approval in Thailand.

Where most applications fail is on "reason to return" to Thailand and you should be able to give adequate evidence on that score. You will need to show sufficient funds for the trip and show accomodation (at friends, family or hotels) for the duration.

[sonicdragon]

will need to show sufficient funds for the trip and show accomodation (at friends, family or hotels) for the duration.

Showing funds is not a problem - my HK bank statement should be OK - but how do I "show accomodation" ? Do they need a photo ? We will stay at my mother's house - this must be a common scenario for visits - do we need to show proof that my mother owns the house ? or just that she lives there (eg utility bill) ?

Where most applications fail is on "reason to return" to Thailand and you should be able to give adequate evidence on that score.

What do you think is adequate ? My wife has no job in thailand - she looks after the 2 babies - but she does own property - does that help ? I was previously advise that maybe they are more interested in whether *I* will leave the UK after 4 months ? In which case I have the problem of not owning any property of having a rental agreement outside the UK - I just have my business in HK (of which I am the sole director).

Thanks again !

[Mahout Angrit]

but how do I "show accomodation" ? Do they need a photo ? We will stay at my mother's house - this must be a common scenario for visits - do we need to show proof that my mother owns the house ? or just that she lives there (eg utility bill) ?

Then your mother should be the sponsor (as well as yourself)see Notes for Sponsor yes she should provide proof she owns or rents the house and there is sufficient space to house you and your family, photos will help.

What do you think is adequate ? My wife has no job in thailand - she looks after the 2 babies - but she does own property - does that help ? I was previously advise that maybe they are more interested in whether *I* will leave the UK after 4 months ? In which case I have the problem of not owning any property of having a rental agreement outside the UK - I just have my business in HK (of which I am the sole director).!

The fact that she owns property then does seem like the only reason you can give apart from maybe evidence of your business and family life in Thailand It should be obvious to the ECO that your wife wouldn't be working with 2 small babies but you must still convince them that she will return (which obviously means you too) so evidence of the successful business being directed from Thailand should help.

The fact that you will be requesting 4 months to stay in UK is not encouraging. Normally for a first visit a tourist would be expected to stay for 4 or 5 weeks but as your wife is not working then it is feasable that she can stay longer (and you can afford to)

Hopefully some other contributors will come up with tips and suggestions.

Edited February 6, 2007 by Mahout Angrit

[the scouser]

A letter of invitation from your mother should be sufficient, along with, perhaps, a utility bill which confirms that she lives at the address. Then provide evidence of your wife's ownership of the house in Thailand and your business in Hong Kong, along with a copy of your passport, which shows your status in both Hong Kong and Thailand, and your wife should have little difficulty getting the visa.

Scouse.

[GU22]

Quite, the fact that you are not resident in the UK means she has little or no incentive to remain in the UK.

Whether she returns to Thailand or goes with you to HK is of no concern to the British embassy, as long as she leaves the UK at the end of the visit.

[sonicdragon]

Thanks for your advice ! I will let you know how it goes

[sonicdragon]

I have a follow-on question on this...

Regarding my wife's property ownership, car ownership and bank statements/passbooks, all these documents are obviously in Thai - is it necessary to have them all translated into english. I assume that it is, but there are dozens of pages !! And some of them are very complex and in the case of the title deeds (showing drawings of the plots and past transfers of ownership) having these translated into english will be very costly and time consuming. I had initially thought that just the land registry title transfer documents would be sufficient to have translated, showing the price paid etc, but it was pointed out to me that these do not show evidence of current ownership - only that she was once the owner, and the actual title deed is the document that really matters.

How far do we have to go on this ?

thanks !

SD

[GU22]

Unless it specifically says so on the checklist, it is not strictly necessary to translate Thai documents. Although I always think it is a good idea to do so.

I wouldn't translate her bank book. With the car ownership and land ownership papers I would only translate the pages that name her as the owner.

Remember, as she is the spouse of a British citizen living abroad, you will be her main reason to return. Showing that you are a HK/Thailand resident and that she is your wife should be enough.

See the checklist Vinny linked to earlier.

[Mahout Angrit]

It isn't necessary to translate documents unless specified. there are lots of Thai readers in the embassy.Land registry documents are not necessary (if there is a house on the land) (i've never submitted them) as the 'tabien baan ' will show her as the owner. Definitely no need to translate bank book and not sure car ownership papers are needed but send as much as you can just to indicate you are based in Thailand.

[sonicdragon]

Thanks again for the replies. I suppose that her assets are a secondary consideration anyway. What is the "'tabien baan" ? For each property she has 2 documents, one seems to be the title deed (a large document with a drawing of the plot on one side and list of all the previous owners on the other), and the other document is a 1 sided white form showing the price paid and with her address etc and the format of that is different for those plots with buildings on.

I'm just filling in the VAF1 now, getting the paperwork together and another question has arisen - sorry if I'm being obtuse, but, does my mother need to be the sponsor, since we are staying at her house ? She is not supporting us financially- I am doing that, but I am not resident in the UK - and the checkilist seems to indicate that the sponsor should be the person that my wife is visiting. The checklist also indicates that we should provide my mothers passport copy - however she does not have a passport (and her birth certificate is lost). I have also written a long letter explainig about everything with a list of enclosures - so should my letter and my mothers letter both say that we are sponsoring my wife ? Or is a simple invitation letter from my mother, and a detailed "sponsorship" letter from me, sufficient ?

Sorry if this is becoming anal ! But I just want to get it right

[the scouser]

Just an invitation letter from your mother will suffice, explaining to the visa officer that you and your wife are to stay at her house for the duration of the visit.

The "tabien baan" is the house book which details who lives at the property.

Scouse.

[Mahout Angrit]

I would get your mother to write a letter stating she is the owner of the house, that they are looking forward to seeing you and you family, state the size of the house, that there is sufficient room to house you. She could add that all food and tourist transport will be provided by her while you are there also. If you think a photo will help you can send that but not necessary.

Ask your wife about the 'tabien baan' she'll know what it is.

Neither of you need to use the word 'Sponsor' in your preparation, the pure act suggests you are doing that so with your mothers letter and your evidence you are in fact both sponsoring your wife

//Edited to add extra information

Edited February 8, 2007 by Mahout Angrit

[sonicdragon]

Happy to report that, having followed the advice given in this thread, my wife's family visit visa was approved and issued, 2 days after submission. Good for a 180 day visit.

Many thanks to all who advised

I'm beginning to find that living in thailand is getting harder and harder and we will experiment by splitting our time between the UK, Hong Kong and Thailand while the children are still below kindergarten age, before deciding where we will be "based". But I increasingly get the feeling that we (foreign men married to thai women) are not welcome here.

Thanks again !

SD

Edited February 22, 2007 by sonicdragon

[Mahout Angrit]

Congratulations......

Lucky you have the opportunity to check out your base, enjoy it while you can

Just noticed you said in your OP that you will go to UK in May. You should be aware that you are allowed 180 days to enter and leave the UK but from the date of issue of the Visa (not the date of entry to UK)

Edited February 22, 2007 by Mahout Angrit

[sonicdragon]

Really ? Well that is a big problem, coz it was issued today, we go to UK on 15 May and leave on 15 Sep (copy of paid tickerts showing dates of travel were enclosed with application and both my and my mothers sponsorship letters state clearly the dates of travel and length of stay required.

The visa has the following information:

Valid from 21/02/2007

to 21/08/2007

type of visa: C

Number of Entries: MULT

Duration of Stay: 180 Days

What can we do now ?

Thanks

SD

[the scouser]

You'll have to contact the embassy and see if they'll change the validity of the visa: it can be post-dated for up to 3 months. What date did you enter on the visa application form as being your intended date of arrival in the UK?

Scouse.

[sonicdragon]

15 May 2007 was the intended date of arrival as written on the application form.

[Mahout Angrit]

15 May 2007 was the intended date of arrival as written on the application form.

Clearly the embassy did not pick up on your arrival date, It's their error so they should change your date of issue for you, I hope they do. As Scouse says they can defer the date of issue up to 3 months if you request it.

If not the UK immigration will not know what date you leave (as they don't check on exit) but your wife wouldn't want to be challenged while in the UK and to be found with an expired Visa.

[sonicdragon]

Thanks for that.

I was worried that we should have applied for a 1 year visa instead. Obviously the problem would not have occured in that case. But it seems very counter-intuitive if one has to apply for a visa that is valid for a "duration of stay" that depends on the time the application is submited relative to the return date, and not on the length of the visit, particularly when the intended arrival date and proposed length of stay are requested on the form.

I'll let you know what happens tomorrow. I hope this doesn't requre another trip to Bangkok !! But I'm guessing they won't send the amended one in the post. Grrrrr

[sonicdragon]

Further update. Called the embassy/visa section this morning and explained what had happened. They were happy to discuss it with me and didn't insist on speaking to my wife about it. They agreed it was their mistake and said they would fix it. So I went up to the embassy again today. 45 mins later got the passport back, with first visa cancelled "without prejudice" and with a new visa valid from 13 May, expiring on 13 Nov.

Many thanks again, especially to Mahout Angrit.