Pheu Thai will ban military conscription if voted in

[GarryP]

43 minutes ago, robblok said:

That is the mistake many of you guys make.. he was voted in so he had a right to steal.. he had no more right to steal than any Thai politician and anyone who does is crook in my book not just Thaksin. It was just clear how much he stole. I can't think of any PM with more corruption cases against him than Thaksin. That might be because they had it out for him or it might be that he was more corrupt. But either way he was corrupt and a crook in my book. 

 

Voting is NOT a way to punish corruption its a way to select a government. Courts punish corruption. I don't want any corrupt crooks in government junta or otherwise.

He's just been found not guilty by the Supreme Court in one case. I was sure it wasn't going to go his way, but from reading about the case, the decision is sound. 

[GarryP]

28 minutes ago, boonrawdcnx said:

If I would be Thaksin / PT I would go further - commission a study that will show that the entire armed forces of this country are more or less useless and not needed at all - and how much they have cost the tax payer since they last fought a war on elephants or running barefoot with cheap swords!

(Sorry I forgot that the declared war on the allied forces at the end of WWII - but they did not get to fight in it !) And I do not want to mention Baan-Rom-Klao here - that would be too embarrassing.

The amount would be in the trillions of baht!

The study would show that they could easily be replaced by some kind of modern, well equipped border police comprising of probably 1/10 of the current ridiculous number of soldiers compared to other countries with a similar population.

Now we are talking real money that could be spent for useful things like education, infrastructure, hospitals e.g in addition it would free up hundreds of thousands of citizens who currently contribute nothing to the countries GDP - who could do actual work instead of playing maids for superior officers.

Thailand’s aging population will need them very soon. Unless of course they will start to hire cheap Chinese and more Cambodian and Burmese Labour to fill the need - and this itself will be the real threat because they will then take over the country from within especially the Chinese who have just been invited in by this shortsighted pseudo government!

Present that amount to the Thai people and show them that there is no need that we have little children who go hungry every day and old people who are left to themselves trying to survive on 600 baht a month - while some people wear jackets that cost a years salary for others and ugly fat people wear watches for millions around their wrist!


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

Rom Klao was a joke. It just showed how pathetic and useless the army is. Very few of the higher ranks were present at the front or any where near the front, issuing orders from afar. The rank and file did not know what they were doing and a very large number went awol. Professional army? They must be joking.  

[robblok]

9 minutes ago, GarryP said:

He's just been found not guilty by the Supreme Court in one case. I was sure it wasn't going to go his way, but from reading about the case, the decision is sound. 

Of course the decisions against him are sound, if you look at many of the other cases they are sound too. The guy is corrupt, just like many others. I can't say he is more or less corrupt I can only say that those who are corrupt should not be in government. 

[GarryP]

1 minute ago, robblok said:

Of course the decisions against him are sound, if you look at many of the other cases they are sound too. The guy is corrupt, just like many others. I can't say he is more or less corrupt I can only say that those who are corrupt should not be in government. 

Rob, you misread my post. He was found "not guilty" and the decision appeared sound. I thought he would have been found guilty regardless.  

[robblok]

11 minutes ago, GarryP said:

Rob, you misread my post. He was found "not guilty" and the decision appeared sound. I thought he would have been found guilty regardless.  

I expected him to be found guilty my mistake, there are so many solid cases against the guy. I don't expect them to judge him unfairly, he has great lawyers and by acquitting him it shows they are not bias otherwise he would be guilty regardless like you said. 

[pornprong]

1 hour ago, robblok said:

Of course the decisions against him are sound, if you look at many of the other cases they are sound too. The guy is corrupt, just like many others. I can't say he is more or less corrupt I can only say that those who are corrupt should not be in government. 

Yeah, only a fool would question the impartiality and credibility of the Thai courts.

 

A number of court decisions in the past have been greeted with incredulity by the public who found them ridiculous. For instance, a woman who stole a mango to feed her hungry children was given 10 years imprisonment while a rich young person who kills several people and is charged with reckless driving causing death is given a suspended jail term because it is his first criminal offence and because he confessed. 
 

Sound?..............only an idiot would think so.

[unblocktheplanet]

On 8/27/2018 at 7:38 PM, robblok said:

Just wait for the court cases to finish and then he will be convicted for coruption.

Wait a minute... You trust Thai courts?!? Woo-hoo! KMROTGL (killing myself rolling on the ground laughing)!

[unblocktheplanet]

On 8/27/2018 at 9:51 PM, billd766 said:

 

I was in the RAF for 25 years and I never fired a shot in anger

Other conscripts are not so level-headed: Israel's IDF, for instance.

[unblocktheplanet]

On 8/27/2018 at 10:31 PM, holy cow cm said:

Good thing my son has dual citizenship as US citizen. 

 

Quote from article: There the conscripts were assigned to units for training and then to appropriate service elements for duty. After a two-year commitment, conscripts who did not choose to reenlist (or were not permitted to do so) were released and placed on unassigned reserve status for an additional twenty-three years. During this period of reserve service they were subject to recall whenever a need arose

As the most warlike country, the US still maintains draft registration for all young men with criminal penalties--five years and $250,000--for failure to comply, plus civil sanctions such as being ineligible for govt jobs or loans, and, in some states, even drivers' licences. There is an ongoing US Commission on Service examining conscription, the first public conversation on the issue since its inception in 1940. There's a good chance they'll make a gender-equal draft & require women to register! 

[candide]

On 8/30/2018 at 6:08 AM, robblok said:

I expected him to be found guilty my mistake, there are so many solid cases against the guy. I don't expect them to judge him unfairly, he has great lawyers and by acquitting him it shows they are not bias otherwise he would be guilty regardless like you said. 

As discussed earlier, Thai courts want to show they are fair and unbiased. So they acquitted him on a minor offense because they have already planned in advance to convict him of a major offense. Actually he may be culprit in this particular case and not  in the next one. We'll never know for sure.

[unblocktheplanet]

Let’s get this straight: All politicians are corrupt, everywhere. If one pleads ‘democracy’, one has to consider the system which provides the choices. What will be the next excuse to postpone elections, elections with no viable choices. Voting is a fairytale.

 

It’s nonsense to say a military govt is any better than TRT or PT. Same diff — The system is designed so that the money sticks to those at the top, no matter who it is. A crucial difference is that we have the distinction of prosecuting and convicting an elected leader for the performance of her duties—rice pledging. How is this different from submarines? The military have created not only an economic but a moral deficit.

 

A military NLA gives near-unanimous approval to every legislation the military floats. And what about judicial corruption?  A 98% conviction rates proves the point.

 

The military is the willing hand in the glove of real power. I’m no ‘publican but reining in the military is a complex web extending itself throughout every facet of Thai society. Thailand’s reich has madmen, shrewd madmen, at its helm. We’ve had conscription continuously since 1905 under Rama V, King Chulalongkorn.

 

The only way to make the generals sit up & listen is a concerted campaign to inform our 35M tourists they’re spending their money on dic. We are, friends, the new Burma and deserve the same level of int’l boycott, divestment, sanctions.

 

However, the military’s true weakness is that it requires cannon-fodder and conscription to provide it. Whether this proposal for abolition is a death-knell for PT or FF remains to be seen.

 

There are no real wars anymore. The next one will be humanity’s last.

 

This is a powerful populist argument. no matter where it comes from. Thailand’s next generation deserve no draft.

 

No. 1 - Prosecute military coupmakers. No more coups.

No. 2 - Legal protection for conscientious objectors

No. 3 - Abolish the draft.

No. 4 - Drastically cut military spending.

No. 5 - Reform the military structure: Smaller army, fewer generals.

No. 6 - Abolish the armed forces entirely.

 

There are refusers, both political and religious. It’s illegal under the Act to fail to show up; it’s not illegal to refuse to draw.

 

Facebook: Abolish Conscription in Thailand!

ยกเลิกการเกณฑ์ทหารในประเทศไทย

https://th-th.facebook.com/Conscription/

[robblok]

2 hours ago, candide said:

As discussed earlier, Thai courts want to show they are fair and unbiased. So they acquitted him on a minor offense because they have already planned in advance to convict him of a major offense. Actually he may be culprit in this particular case and not  in the next one. We'll never know for sure.

Good excuse, how about accepting that most cases are just sound and he is a big crook. I mean if you look at the cases of the telecom sale and loan.. only a blind man would think he is innocent. I am not saying he is more or less (though the number of corruption cases against him is big) corrupt as others. I am saying that he is guilty and it shows because they are actually investigating cases against him and did not do so with all others. 

 

I dont really care if its Thaksin or an other corrupt criminal I don't like to see any of them in power when they have stolen money.

[Bluespunk]

Will they also end their use of their street thug UDD? 

[wow64]

Haha this made me laugh. 

 

Selling the subs and buy hospitals good slogan.

[Cadbury]

W

On 8/28/2018 at 3:58 AM, webfact said:

Pheu Thai will ban military conscription

What about also banning Thai military training and boot camps for kindergarten children.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-12-23/thai-junta-introduces-idealogical-boot-camp-for-kindergarten/8145362

[Eric Loh]

1 hour ago, wow64 said:

Haha this made me laugh. 

 

Selling the subs and buy hospitals good slogan.

Lock them up. ? better slogan. 

[billd766]

8 hours ago, unblocktheplanet said:

Other conscripts are not so level-headed: Israel's IDF, for instance.

 

But I wasn't a conscript. I was a volunteer.

 

It was something that I wanted to do from the age of 10 or 11, so I did it.

 

If I were ordered to kill a protester and I refused I would be charged and court martialled. I could claim at my court martial that the officer who ordered me to do so had given an illegal order.

 

Back in the just post war era at Nuremberg the excuse of just following the orders from my superior was NOT accepted as an excuse. 

[Small Joke]

I've never understood the appeal of populism. Whereby people vote with great enthusiasm, for their own oppression under a one party, nationalistic regieme. 

Ultimately, someone else usually ends up bombing the shit out of them, or they self destruct. 

Crazy. 

[Small Joke]

Empty promise they have no hope of fulfilling, they may as well promise a republic. 

The military here is enmeshed, look at what really goes on at  'Children's Day' it's like something Goebbels would have dreamed up. 

[Eligius]

10 minutes ago, Small Joke said:

Empty promise they have no hope of fulfilling, they may as well promise a republic. 

The military here is enmeshed, look at what really goes on at  'Children's Day' it's like something Goebbels would have dreamed up. 

Yes. I personally find it nothing less than repugnant and disgusting the way little children are militarised and brainwashed in their most impressionable years. 

Scumbags that do this!

[pornprong]

1 hour ago, Small Joke said:

Empty promise they have no hope of fulfilling, they may as well promise a republic. 

The military here is enmeshed, look at what really goes on at  'Children's Day' it's like something Goebbels would have dreamed up. 

There would have been a time when to mention such a policy would have one thrown in jail under 112.

From little things big things grow.

[jerojero]

One of the most common sense proposals in a very long time. Why does the military need to force young men into service? Because no one would volunteer to be abused by the hierarchy of command and servants to the hundreds of generals.

[tomta]

11 hours ago, wow64 said:

Haha this made me laugh. 

 

Selling the subs and buy hospitals good slogan.

It is a slogan. Short hand way of suggesting the thrust of what you think and want for the country. I think it is a good slogan. It doesn't make me laugh

[melvinmelvin]

7 hours ago, Eligius said:

Yes. I personally find it nothing less than repugnant and disgusting the way little children are militarised and brainwashed in their most impressionable years. 

Scumbags that do this!

 

that is one of the reasons that it is important that Thailand has conscription,

conscription will ensure that there is at least a wee bit of normal thinking within the armed forces

 

scrap conscrption and you get a HUGE armed forces of non thinkers and d-heads

 

[billd766]

12 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

 

that is one of the reasons that it is important that Thailand has conscription,

conscription will ensure that there is at least a wee bit of normal thinking within the armed forces

 

scrap conscrption and you get a HUGE armed forces of non thinkers and d-heads

 

 

Thailand already has these and they certainly don't need any more.

 

Culing 75% of them can only be an improvement.

[DogsBarkingAllDay]

No need army conscription and weapons because now no war?

Then open your house door wide, because now don't have thief. 

When you about to shit, you start finding a toilet.

When they want to shit, shit is already spilling out then start find a toilet.

 

On 8/28/2018 at 3:58 AM, webfact said:

Compulsory conscription should be replaced by voluntary military service

Does people remember when the public having problems, who came to help?

Floods, moneylending, emergency crisis, etc. 

Did the army contribute to the society? 

The army is always ready to protect the nation.

Changing to voluntary military service and you can imagine when there is a crisis. You cant find help like before.

Who you want to ask for help?

They can argue over the debatable weaponries but I don't think they should undermine the army's presence.  

 

Look at other country which owing enormous debt but their creditors still fear the debtor because of their powerful weapons and army personnel capabilities. 

 

 

[heybruce]

2 minutes ago, IAMjustAforeignerWHOloveTH said:

No need army conscription and weapons because now no war?

Then open your house door wide, because now don't have thief. 

When you about to shit, you start finding a toilet.

When they want to shit, shit is already spilling out then start find a toilet.

 

Does people remember when the public having problems, who came to help?

Floods, moneylending, emergency crisis, etc. 

Did the army contribute to the society? 

The army is always ready to protect the nation.

Changing to voluntary military service and you can imagine when there is a crisis. You cant find help like before.

Who you want to ask for help?

They can argue over the debatable weaponries but I don't think they should undermine the army's presence.  

 

Look at other country which owing enormous debt but their creditors still fear the debtor because of their powerful weapons and army personnel capabilities. 

 

 

Thailand's military does not exist to protect Thailand from foreign invaders, it exists to protect the elite from the citizens who want democracy and a better life, and to reward favored generals with cushy, unnecessary jobs.

 

Costa Rica exists without a military, when were they last invaded?

 

The number of military members that assist during disasters are a small fraction of the total, meaning a much smaller military could still provide the required assistance.  However a smaller military would have a smaller budget and not provide the same opportunities for graft.

 

Greece and Italy have enormous debts and less than renowned militaries, but no one is threatening to invade them over debt issues.

[Mexlark]

Lets face it. Even if Peua Thai are elected (highly likely), conscription will probably continue to exist because political parties all have to curry favour with the military. Unfortunate fact of life, but PT's leadership are not true radicals by any stretch. So it's just an empty cynical ploy to gather votes.They won't be banning their own goon squads either

[heybruce]

4 minutes ago, Mexlark said:

Lets face it. Even if Peua Thai are elected (highly likely), conscription will probably continue to exist because political parties all have to curry favour with the military. Unfortunate fact of lufe, but PT's leadership are not true radicals by any stretch. So it's just an empty cynical ploy to gather votes.They won't be banning their own goon squads either

Getting elected with a promise to end conscription, especially if the promise is adopted by other parties, would put the military on notice as to its widespread unpopularity.  That is worthwhile. 

[Mexlark]

Have the military ever taken any account of unpopularity before? Frankly, they don't have to because everyone knows it is just an empty threat from politicians who will gladly live with it if is useful to protect their investments. I watch conscripts being used for free labor, and know that the local base is rather anti-junta