Credo Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 The US economy is a like a big steam engine. It takes some time to get it going, but once it's going it's not easy to stop. Obama got it going and Trump has certainly done what he can to make business easier for most, with the exception of his tariffs. As far as working class people are concerned, life is not so easy. @EVENKEEL I know a lot of young to middle age people who have moved, but that's not so easy. The cost of finding housing and getting settled in a new location is far from cheap. Unless it is a very well paying job, it's not all that simple. For people who are single it's a little easier, but if you have a family, it becomes daunting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 On 11/3/2018 at 1:28 PM, sirineou said: Is it because of Trump or is it despite of Trump? I wonder if things would be better or worst is someone other than Trump was president. Because of Trump. The other party that would have won likes to spend other people's money too much, which is never good for an economy. Let's not get into whether it would have been better under one of the other GOP candidates, As establishment puppets, they wouldn't have done any better than the opposition. Remember that Bush the younger caused the crisis in 2007. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 On 11/6/2018 at 4:12 AM, Credo said: The US economy is a like a big steam engine. It takes some time to get it going, but once it's going it's not easy to stop. Obama got it going and Trump has certainly done what he can to make business easier for most, with the exception of his tariffs. As far as working class people are concerned, life is not so easy. @EVENKEEL I know a lot of young to middle age people who have moved, but that's not so easy. The cost of finding housing and getting settled in a new location is far from cheap. Unless it is a very well paying job, it's not all that simple. For people who are single it's a little easier, but if you have a family, it becomes daunting. I don't know that Obama actually got it going, but he sure liked to spend other people's money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brunolem Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said: I don't know that Obama actually got it going, but he sure liked to spend other people's money. Not really...what the US governments spend, both Democrat and Republican, is not so much other people's money, but rather "fake" money created at will by its banking system. Even in times of supposed economic "boom", the government is running trillion dollar budget deficits, something it wouldn't have to do if it was financing its budget with money from taxation, and was living within its means. As a matter of fact, the economy is "booming" only because of the huge budget deficits, themselves made possible by the banking system. Of course, this can't last forever, otherwise that would mean that America has discovered the perpetual wealth creation machine, the financial equivalent of the perpetual motion machine in physics, something we have known for a long time only exists in the minds of those who promote and benefit from the scam... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 12 minutes ago, Brunolem said: Not really...what the US governments spend, both Democrat and Republican, is not so much other people's money, but rather "fake" money created at will by its banking system. Even in times of supposed economic "boom", the government is running trillion dollar budget deficits, something it wouldn't have to do if it was financing its budget with money from taxation, and was living within its means. As a matter of fact, the economy is "booming" only because of the huge budget deficits, themselves made possible by the banking system. Of course, this can't last forever, otherwise that would mean that America has discovered the perpetual wealth creation machine, the financial equivalent of the perpetual motion machine in physics, something we have known for a long time only exists in the minds of those who promote and benefit from the scam... You are correct of course. The US printed ( or the electronic equivalent ) billions of $ to keep the 1% in the lifestyle to which they aspire. However, eventually, someone has to pay for it, and it sure ain't going to be the 1%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
direction BANGKOK Posted November 13, 2018 Share Posted November 13, 2018 13 hours ago, Brunolem said: Not really...what the US governments spend, both Democrat and Republican, is not so much other people's money, but rather "fake" money created at will by its banking system. Even in times of supposed economic "boom", the government is running trillion dollar budget deficits, something it wouldn't have to do if it was financing its budget with money from taxation, and was living within its means. As a matter of fact, the economy is "booming" only because of the huge budget deficits, themselves made possible by the banking system. Of course, this can't last forever, otherwise that would mean that America has discovered the perpetual wealth creation machine, the financial equivalent of the perpetual motion machine in physics, something we have known for a long time only exists in the minds of those who promote and benefit from the scam... Not often I agree with every single word a poster writes in here. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirineou Posted November 14, 2018 Share Posted November 14, 2018 23 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said: Because of Trump. The other party that would have won likes to spend other people's money too much, which is never good for an economy. Let's not get into whether it would have been better under one of the other GOP candidates, As establishment puppets, they wouldn't have done any better than the opposition. Remember that Bush the younger caused the crisis in 2007. Talk about spending other people's money. "The deficit rose nearly 17 percent year over year, from $666 billion in 2017. It is now on pace to top $1 trillion a year before the next presidential election, according to forecasts from the Trump administration and outside analysts. The deficit for the 2018 fiscal year, which ended Sept. 30, was the largest since 2012, when the economy and federal revenues were still recovering from the depths of the recession." https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/15/us/politics/federal-deficit-2018-trump-tax-cuts.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brunolem Posted November 14, 2018 Share Posted November 14, 2018 3 hours ago, sirineou said: Talk about spending other people's money. "The deficit rose nearly 17 percent year over year, from $666 billion in 2017. It is now on pace to top $1 trillion a year before the next presidential election, according to forecasts from the Trump administration and outside analysts. The deficit for the 2018 fiscal year, which ended Sept. 30, was the largest since 2012, when the economy and federal revenues were still recovering from the depths of the recession." https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/15/us/politics/federal-deficit-2018-trump-tax-cuts.html There is the deficit, and then there's the deficit! The "official" budget deficit for 2018 is just below 800 billion dollars, but that is only because many expenses are not included in the budget (how convenient). Among these expenses are the financing of Social Security which is bleeding to death thanks to the millions joining the ranks of retirees every year! When it's all said and done, the real deficit for 2018 is 1.3 trillion dollars, a doozy in a "booming" economy... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted November 14, 2018 Share Posted November 14, 2018 18 hours ago, Brunolem said: There is the deficit, and then there's the deficit! The "official" budget deficit for 2018 is just below 800 billion dollars, but that is only because many expenses are not included in the budget (how convenient). Among these expenses are the financing of Social Security which is bleeding to death thanks to the millions joining the ranks of retirees every year! When it's all said and done, the real deficit for 2018 is 1.3 trillion dollars, a doozy in a "booming" economy... In our present day society, it's hard to see how any politician can rein in the beast they have created. By bribing the voters with unaffordable promises, they have built in huge debt which will never be paid off. The number of retirees is only going to increase. Perhaps a catastrophic depression in which most of the unemployed, retirees on welfare etc etc die off is the only way western societies will get out of debt. I just hope I'm not around when it happens. I just think Trump is less likely to increase the debt than the other candidate would have, or at least not as much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirineou Posted November 14, 2018 Share Posted November 14, 2018 21 hours ago, Brunolem said: There is the deficit, and then there's the deficit! The "official" budget deficit for 2018 is just below 800 billion dollars, but that is only because many expenses are not included in the budget (how convenient). Among these expenses are the financing of Social Security which is bleeding to death thanks to the millions joining the ranks of retirees every year! When it's all said and done, the real deficit for 2018 is 1.3 trillion dollars, a doozy in a "booming" economy... The only time we had a balanced budget in recent history was during the Clinton administration then the republicans took over and drove the economy into a ditch. it took Obama two terms to drive is out of the ditch and now a Trump administion will drive us back in I read somwhere that by 2020 we will be paying more for just the interest of the debt than all programs combined except defense. And that by 2025 we will be spending more interest for the debt than all programs combined including defense. Someone who knows more about this please feel free to corect me on the dates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brunolem Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 4 hours ago, sirineou said: The only time we had a balanced budget in recent history was during the Clinton administration then the republicans took over and drove the economy into a ditch. it took Obama two terms to drive is out of the ditch and now a Trump administion will drive us back in I read somwhere that by 2020 we will be paying more for just the interest of the debt than all programs combined except defense. And that by 2025 we will be spending more interest for the debt than all programs combined including defense. Someone who knows more about this please feel free to corect me on the dates The dates are by definition unpredictable. The US Office of Budget always makes its calculations based on a linear trend, assuming among other things that there will never be a recession! What is currently known is that, based on the actual situation, the yearly budget deficits will be well over 1 trillion dollars, as far as the eye can see...which is by definition unsustainable! Who will buy all this crappy paper and how will the interests be paid? The only "solution" would be to go the Japanese way, with a central bank buying all the public debt (printing money) and keeping the interest rate at zero. The big difference is that Japan doesn't have the world reserve currency, and that it has managed to stay more or less afloat because it is a major exporter, whereas the US is a major importer. In other words, Japan keeps its financial mess contained within its borders and pays for its imports with the dollars it collects from its exports. The US can't do that, so at some point, probably not too far in the future, something is gonna give... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brunolem Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 5 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said: In our present day society, it's hard to see how any politician can rein in the beast they have created. By bribing the voters with unaffordable promises, they have built in huge debt which will never be paid off. The number of retirees is only going to increase. Perhaps a catastrophic depression in which most of the unemployed, retirees on welfare etc etc die off is the only way western societies will get out of debt. I just hope I'm not around when it happens. I just think Trump is less likely to increase the debt than the other candidate would have, or at least not as much. Something like that, and no one who is a least a little bit aware of our predicament (that is probably less than 1% of the insouciant population) wants to be there when the s..t is going to hit the fan! All pension funds, public and private, are one economic recession away from bankruptcy...with most of them currently massively underfunded! There is no other reason for the actual geopolitical tensions all over the world. Western leaders know that our unsustainable system, with its insane promises (work 40 years and retire 25 years, for example), is facing the abyss...without any realistic solution. So, the only way out is the same as always: a major conflict that will wipe the slate clean! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thasoss Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 3.7% unemployment rate sounds good but i believe most of these new jobs are low paying service jobs soon to be taken over by A1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EVENKEEL Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 Keep the poor masses happy with the $1.00 menu of unhealthy crap and prices of TV's at unbelievably low prices and the slobs are happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EVENKEEL Posted November 15, 2018 Share Posted November 15, 2018 (edited) whoops Edited November 15, 2018 by EVENKEEL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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