Smoking Ban

[Jet Gorgon]

Don't drive a car, bike or burn toxic rubbish, but all my neighbours do. Many of them smoke as well, but I don't go schizoid on them.

[tuky]

I quit smoking for a year and a half some years ago. It was always nice when I smelt other people's 2nd hand smoke. It didn't make me want to smoke it is just an appealing aroma.

I hope things never get too stupid, I heard that smoking is banned within 20 metres or so from entrances to shopping centres in Australia, that is stupid.

[paulsmithson]

Get real MM smoking qas banned on aircraft for one reason only---it costs them money to clean the air!!!

I really think we should have a ban on non smokers in public places!!!!

I would be more tolerant iF non smokers gave us smokers the choice---like smokers only pubs and restaurants!!!!

[Pink Mist]

Get real MM smoking qas banned on aircraft for one reason only---it costs them money to clean the air!!!

I really think we should have a ban on non smokers in public places!!!!

I would be more tolerant iF non smokers gave us smokers the choice---like smokers only pubs and restaurants!!!!

if smokers gave non smokers clean air, not second hand smoke, why arn't they more considerant

[mpdkorat]

I was very recently in a hotel room in Korat which was a non smoking room. Several of the Thai style Karaoke bars in korat have a non smoking policy, there seems to be no hard and fast rules.

[Pink Mist]

smokers are anti social inconsiderate lepers

[gummy]

Every cloud has a silver lining and on average smokers die sooner than the sensible folk who do not smoke. Of course this also suits most governments which cream of a huge amount of tax on tobacco and saves having to pay their pensions for too long, assuming that is that they are not too much of a burdon on state health programs whilst dying from smoking induced diseases.

[tuky]

I find out more about what is going on at work from in the smoking room than I do in any meeting, I can get more things done by asking somebody in the smoking room.

Thank god for smokers.

[Pink Mist]

I find out more about what is going on at work from in the smoking room than I do in any meeting, I can get more things done by asking somebody in the smoking room.

Thank god for smokers.

you have no career without smokers lieyhthh

[chiang mai]

I see that some Councils in the UK will now employ Anti-Smoking wardens who are empowered to photograph and fine smokers who are breaking the law. For me frankly I don't care whether the subject is smoking or anything else because it all boils down to an erosion of individual freedoms and an ever increasing nanny role of government. If the government decides to outlaw body odor will the UK one day have Smell Police inspections to see if individuals have showered and changed their underwear every day.

[Ulysses G.]

I quit smoking for a year and a half some years ago. It was always nice when I smelt other people's 2nd hand smoke. It didn't make me want to smoke it is just an appealing aroma.

Maybe to a recently reformed smoker, but, believe me, a life-long non-smoker would say stink or stench!

[bmanly]

I have read all the posts and I must say I agree with Mighty Mouse on this issue. There is no doubt in my mind that second hand smoke can cause disease and kill you.

The best thing is what is going to happen in UK and Australia on July 1st, a total ban on smoking in bars and clubs.

There was a case in Australia where a bar worker sued her employer for environmental tobacco smoke (ETS) second hand smoke and was awarded damages of $466,048 AUD.

Here is the link for that and HERE IS THE CASE.

Background: Marlene Sharp, a bar worker at both the Port Kembla Hotel (1972 to 1984) and the Port Kembla RSL club (1984 and 1995) sued her employer for negligence in the NSW Supreme Court claiming environmental tobacco smoke (ETS) (secondhand smoke) caused her throat cancer. The trial extended over 8 weeks, was presided by Justice Peter McClellan and had a four person jury who had to determine whether Marlene Sharp's cancer was caused by exposure to ETS and whether the RSL had failed to provide a safe workplace environment. Marlene Sharp's barrister was Peter Semmler, QC. The verdict was delivered on 2 May 2001, with damages of $306,048 awarded to Marlene Sharp. Port Kembla Hotel settled in 2000, agreeing to pay $160,000. Total damages awarded: $466,048.

You can duck, you can weave but it is OTHER peoples smoke than can kill you and it has been proven in court.

[gummy]

I see that some Councils in the UK will now employ Anti-Smoking wardens who are empowered to photograph and fine smokers who are breaking the law. For me frankly I don't care whether the subject is smoking or anything else because it all boils down to an erosion of individual freedoms and an ever increasing nanny role of government. If the government decides to outlaw body odor will the UK one day have Smell Police inspections to see if individuals have showered and changed their underwear every day.

Sounds like one of the "great unwashed, smoking and I have got no respect for other people" fraternity to me

[loong]

I'm a smoker and I have no problem with bans in public areas. It helps me smoke less.

I do object to the way the Uk government treats us, legal users of a taxed drug. Don't forget that it IS a drug and users are addicts. The British government treats us legal users with contempt and yet will bend over backwards to help those addicted to illegal drugs. Even as far as giving them prescribed drugs paid for by the taxpayers.

The government rakes in a lot of revenue from tobacco and aren't brave enough to ban it altogether.

Why not ban the use of tobacco products for all people born before 2000. That way, theoretically the youngsters shouldn't get addicted - or would it make smoking more attractive?

[bmanly]

I'm a smoker and I have no problem with bans in public areas. It helps me smoke less.

I do object to the way the Uk government treats us, legal users of a taxed drug. Don't forget that it IS a drug and users are addicts. The British government treats us legal users with contempt and yet will bend over backwards to help those addicted to illegal drugs. Even as far as giving them prescribed drugs paid for by the taxpayers.

The government rakes in a lot of revenue from tobacco and aren't brave enough to ban it altogether.

Why not ban the use of tobacco products for all people born before 2000. That way, theoretically the youngsters shouldn't get addicted - or would it make smoking more attractive?

No Loong I don't think it should be totally banned and actually I don't care if some someone is a smoker.

It's like drugs, gambling or drinking yourself to death like Bon Scott lead singer of ACDC did, I don't care what individuals do. It is when "their" habit causes me unpleasantness or long term illness where I get concerned.

[Mighty Mouse]

You are not only "responsible for yourself", you are also responsible for those around you. This is what most smokers fail to accept.

Very interesting how you try to play off the philosophy that you believe to be correct as the one that is infact correct.

If you are responsible for those around you, where do you draw the line? If you truly believe this should you not dedicate your every waking minute to ensuring those around you are doing "the right thing" as you are responsible for them.

P.S i take you travel ever where by bike or walking?

"Where do you draw the line?" An interesting question.

Personally, I draw the line by being mindful of the comforts and safety of those around me. Whether I'm driving my car amongst other vehicles or pedestrians, whether I'm discarding dangerous items or chemicals etc.

In days gone by, there were limited laws regarding such things. These days, more stringent laws are in place. Discarding and handling asbestos is a pertinent point.

Common sense isn't controlled by any law. You either have it or you don't. If you have it, you should exercise it. If you don't, then governments may need to introduce legislation to protect the innocent victims of the fools whose actions cause suffering.

Many smokers (maybe the vast majority) fall into the 'fool' category.

It's because of the 'fools' that an increased number of "no smoking" bans are being introduced.

Before lighting up, do smokers inquire whether others in the near vicinity are asthmatic? Not likely.

How would you feel if your second hand smoke caused an asthmatic attack and the victim died as a result ?

In Australia smoking is permitted in your own motor vehicle. Maybe this will soon be outlawed also, because the 'fools' smoke with their children in the car or they throw the butts out the window whilst driving through our country areas.

Many major bushfires have been started that way. Hundreds of innocent victims of these 'fools' have lost their homes as a result. Wild life in various areas has been devastated as a result.

Precious drinking water has been wasted on extinguishing these fires. Millions of $$$'s lost because of one cigarette butt.

Smoking in bed can cause fires. Those fires have the potential to kill and to cause personal property loss.

With these things in mind, I repeat what I wrote in an earlier post, you are responsible for those around you. Maybe not legally in all cases, but certainly morally.

[rtaxron]

What a joke!!!!

Walking or shopping anywhere in a big City and you breathe in the car fumes which I think is more unhealthy than breathing in fag smoke. The World is going crazy with laws of does and donts.

[Mighty Mouse]

What a joke!!!!

Walking or shopping anywhere in a big City and you breathe in the car fumes which I think is more unhealthy than breathing in fag smoke. The World is going crazy with laws of does and donts.

....which is why the world is slowly changing over to hybrid cars. Give it time.

...and anyway, this thread is all about smoking, not car fumes. Obviously there are many more chemicals out there can than cause grief to ones health. If you want to argue about car fumes, start a new thread.

There are many dangers in life, smoking is but one. Let's eliminate smoking, then we can concentrate on something else.

[luckyluke]

What a joke!!!!

Walking or shopping anywhere in a big City and you breathe in the car fumes which I think is more unhealthy than breathing in fag smoke. The World is going crazy with laws of does and donts.

....which is why the world is slowly changing over to hybrid cars. Give it time.

...and anyway, this thread is all about smoking, not car fumes. Obviously there are many more chemicals out there can than cause grief to ones health. If you want to argue about car fumes, start a new thread.

There are many dangers in life, smoking is but one. Let's eliminate smoking, then we can concentrate on something else.

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BRAVO

[garro]

Smoking in public places, especially enclosed places, is the same as drink driving and so should be banned.

Both of these activities can harm others.

There should, however, be places where smokers can enjoy their habit without it affecting other people.

I have nothing against smokers only secondhand smoke.

While polution is very harmful I have never been in a position where a car was expelling fumes in a enclosed area such as a restaraunt where I was eating.

[Jet Gorgon]

Smoking in public places, especially enclosed places, is the same as drink driving and so should be banned.

Both of these activities can harm others.

There should, however, be places where smokers can enjoy their habit without it affecting other people.

I have nothing against smokers only secondhand smoke.

While polution is very harmful I have never been in a position where a car was expelling fumes in a enclosed area such as a restaraunt where I was eating.

OOOOOh. This thread is only about the horrors of second-hand or cigarette smoking, Garro. Might Mouse said. Puff, phew. Mighty Mouse noted that he drives a car. Oh, that car expels exhaust emissions into the atmosphere, no?, but, let me exhale a puff, phew. Oh, a smoker! More harmful than car exhaust? 5555 Why does MM drive a car? Too lazy or special or high class or incapacitated to walk or bicycle to work or market? Sorry, when car drivers and other polluters stand on the soap box as totally clean air users then they can slambast smokers; else, they are hypocrites espouting their own petty demands because they want their own way. Never heard about smokers affecting overall emissions that affect global warming, etc.

As Tuky noted, I got alot done, too, in the smoking room at work. Lots of laughs. My non-smoking (except for cigars, and aren't they the cool thing) big boss came down to the smoking stairwell often and I got more biz fixed there without the pansy whiners around. I guess that's the big issue here for me: lot's of stuff happens around you that you cannot control, but just get on with your lives! And be nice to other people! I just got lost in a big shopping mall, went for A&W and got into a laughing debate with three black kids over who sang"Great Balls of Fire." Bet non-smokers could never chill and laugh like that. Oh, and I was not smoking or blowing smoke at children.

[Bananaman]

Smoking in public places, especially enclosed places, is the same as drink driving and so should be banned.

Both of these activities can harm others.

There should, however, be places where smokers can enjoy their habit without it affecting other people.

I have nothing against smokers only secondhand smoke.

While polution is very harmful I have never been in a position where a car was expelling fumes in a enclosed area such as a restaraunt where I was eating.

OOOOOh. This thread is only about the horrors of second-hand or cigarette smoking, Garro. Might Mouse said. Puff, phew. Mighty Mouse noted that he drives a car. Oh, that car expels exhaust emissions into the atmosphere, no?, but, let me exhale a puff, phew. Oh, a smoker! More harmful than car exhaust? 5555 Why does MM drive a car? Too lazy or special or high class or incapacitated to walk or bicycle to work or market? Sorry, when car drivers and other polluters stand on the soap box as totally clean air users then they can slambast smokers; else, they are hypocrites espouting their own petty demands because they want their own way. Never heard about smokers affecting overall emissions that affect global warming, etc.

As Tuky noted, I got alot done, too, in the smoking room at work. Lots of laughs. My non-smoking (except for cigars, and aren't they the cool thing) big boss came down to the smoking stairwell often and I got more biz fixed there without the pansy whiners around. I guess that's the big issue here for me: lot's of stuff happens around you that you cannot control, but just get on with your lives! And be nice to other people! I just got lost in a big shopping mall, went for A&W and got into a laughing debate with three black kids over who sang"Great Balls of Fire." Bet non-smokers could never chill and laugh like that. Oh, and I was not smoking or blowing smoke at children.

We live in a world where certain conditions have been forced upon us. The greedy oil companies have made sure that we have no (little or no) alternative but to rely on the gas guzzling internal combustion engine as a means of facilitating our 21st century lifestyles. We have no way to opt out from this, to say "I won't drive a car or a motorbike" is entirely futile because every consumer good that you purchase has been brought to the place that you are buying it from by means of a fossil fuel assisted vehicle of some description, so like it or not your money is supporting the continued use of gas and the ongoing pollution of our atmosphere. Unless we live lives of total self subsistence then we are all hypocrites as indeed are all those Greenpeace demonstrators who use airplanes to fly half way around the world to protest against the destruction of rainforests. Whilst we have no viable alternative we are unfortunately forced to accept that we CANNOT live practically without vehicles that use gas and just because we DO have one, does not mean that we cannot take a just stance against the pollution of the environment.

So, back to the topic at hand, the issue we are discussing here is smoking and dragging another contentious issue into the debate in order to justify the morality of forcing others to breathe your second-hand smoke is entirely superfluous. When I sit in a restaurant enjoying my food, I have every right to insist that my enjoyment is not spoiled by the actions of some selfish individual who puts his/her cravings for nicotine before my health, well being and personal comfort. While I'm sitting on walking street having a foot massage, I have every right to object when the character next to me chooses to pollute my personal space with carcinogenic fumes. In those situations, I am not given the option to NOT breathe that smoke, when I'm riding my bicycle about town, I can choose to wear an anti pollution mask to minimise my exposure to vehicle fumes. The issue here is of one of the infringment of personal rights and unfortunately the vast majority of smokers are oblivious to the rights of non-smokers.

[Jet Gorgon]

All air-con spaces are non-smoking, even in Thailand. Why are you anti-smokers still complaining? Can you distinguish cigarette smoke from bus, lorry and bike exhaust fumes and say "Oh, I got sick or got cancer from the guy smoking cigarettes across from me at the vendor stall on Sukhomvit?" I can smell the stink of your vehicle's exhaust everywhere, too.

Funny that suicidal folks hook their faces up to a car's exhaust pipe to off themselves. Guess it takes too long with cigs.

So, militant non-smokers, you have a divine right to drive a polluting car, right? When you finish complaining about smokers, what's next on your agenda?

Peace pipe, brothers and sisters.

[fruittbatt]

All air-con spaces are non-smoking, even in Thailand. Why are you anti-smokers still complaining? Can you distinguish cigarette smoke from bus, lorry and bike exhaust fumes and say "Oh, I got sick or got cancer from the guy smoking cigarettes across from me at the vendor stall on Sukhomvit?" I can smell the stink of your vehicle's exhaust everywhere, too.

Funny that suicidal folks hook their faces up to a car's exhaust pipe to off themselves. Guess it takes too long with cigs.

So, militant non-smokers, you have a divine right to drive a polluting car, right? When you finish complaining about smokers, what's next on your agenda?

Peace pipe, brothers and sisters.

Jet,

you're arguing from the position of comparing pollutants, here. Yes, exhaust fumes, charcoal brazier fumes, open fires, factory emissions, coal power stations, cig smoke- first or second-hand, all add to our daily intake of toxic grit, which infiltrates sinuses, lungs and arteries, not to mention the critical effects on the atmosphere and climate change.

I do not own a car or motor-cy for environmental reasons, and do not buy greasies like french fries, fish cakes, kebabs, ping or yang stuff because i don't support polluting practices. I don't accept plastic bags at shops for the same reason. This doesn't make me some environmental fascist who prescribes what others should do or not. I try to live simply by my lights and to maintain a consciousness that all my words and actions affect other people and the world in which we live.

It does piss me off though when I go to open-fronted or enclosed restaurants with no smoking signs, only to find ashtrays on the tables, and people puffing with impunity at the next table. If I'm eating al fresco, I accept that smokers will be there, and try to position myself upwind if possible.

My take on the argument re "rights" of smokers and non-smokers is this: we live in a world threatened by pollution of our own making. In this knowledge, to deliberately inflict ANY further polluting practices on others is a marker of despair and contempt, that is callous and ultimately self-destructive IMO. I support any legislation which will lower pollution levels and preserve the life of our planet.

[November Rain]

I've just read this thread for the first time & I'm amazed at how vehement (& downright insulting in some cases) the anti-smoking lobby here are. How many of you saying that cigarette smoke is the greatest evil in the world are ex-smokers? Just wondering, as I've heard that ex-smokers are more forceful in their anti-smoking beliefs than those who have never smoked.

I'm a non-smoker. I have no problem with others smoking around me. All but one LTR I've had have been with smokers. I have far bigger problems with "nanny states" legislating against everything than I do with secondhand smoke.

Out of interest, for the non-Thais, how did you get here? On an aeroplane? Any idea how much damage those things are doing to the environment via air pollution? But we all use them. Where's the responsibility to others there?

Edit - typo

Edited February 19, 2007 by November Rain

[Jet Gorgon]

Good argument, Fruitt.

I am of the same mind, but just tend to adjust my position so I do not upset anybody else but want to make myself and my dogs comfy. And if I can share a laugh with someone, I'm even happier.

[davidjtayler]

Good argument, Fruitt.

I am of the same mind, but just tend to adjust my position so I do not upset anybody else but want to make myself and my dogs comfy. And if I can share a laugh with someone, I'm even happier.

Share a laugh and a spliff Jet ... and then we'll eat ... pizza of course

Save the cigars for after tho

[fruittbatt]

I've just read this thread for the first time & I'm amazed at how vehement (& downright insulting in some cases) the anti-smoking lobby here are. How many of you saying that cigarette smoke is the greatest evil in the world are ex-smokers? Just wondering, as I've heard that ex-smokers are more forceful in their anti-smoking beliefs than those who have never smoked.

I'm a non-smoker. I have no problem with others smoking around me. All but one LTR I've had have been with smokers. I have far bigger problems with "nanny states" legislating against everything than I do with secondhand smoke.

Out of interest, for the non-Thais, how did you get here? On an aeroplane? Any idea how much damage those things are doing to the environment via air pollution? But we all use them. Where's the responsibility to others there?

Edit - typo

good point about air-travel, NR. the knack is to use them as little as poss, but the upside is that - like any form of public transport - planes do the job of carrying many people rather than just one, two, or five. Imagine if planes were as cheap as motor-cys!

[peter991]

Blame Sir Walter Raleigh:

Sir Walter Raleigh, Explorer / Scalawag

Born: 1552

Birthplace: Devonshire, England

Died: 29 October 1618 (beheading)

Best Known As: The man who laid his cloak over a mudpuddle for the queen

Sir Walter Raleigh was one of the grand scalawags of the Elizabethan Age. He made a name for himself fighting the Irish at Munster; later he was introduced at court and became a favorite of Queen Elizabeth I. Known for his wit and womanizing, Raleigh was in and out of Elizabeth's favor. (According to a famous legend he once laid his plush and expensive cloak over a mud puddle so that the Queen's feet would not be dirtied; the legend has long been disputed, but it may actually be true.) He also organized expeditions to the new world, popularized tobacco, and found time to write poetry on the side. Raleigh was not a favorite of Elizabeth's successor, James I, who kept Sir Walter imprisoned in the Tower of London for years and finally had him beheaded in 1618.

After Raleigh's execution, his head was embalmed and returned to his wife... Some sources say on the day he was beheaded Raleigh was granted a last smoke of tobacco -- establishing the tradition of giving a prisoner a last cigarette before execution.

Peter

[fruittbatt]

Good argument, Fruitt.

I am of the same mind, but just tend to adjust my position so I do not upset anybody else but want to make myself and my dogs comfy. And if I can share a laugh with someone, I'm even happier.

Share a laugh and a spliff Jet ... and then we'll eat ... pizza of course

Save the cigars for after tho

mmmm....can i come to the virtual restaurant, too? I'll share a laugh, but my spliffing and pizza days are done, so I'll sit upwind and try hard not to inhale.