New Visa Extension rules

[Stuart]

For those of us who have a Thai wife and children the new Visa Extension rules are unfair. We have invested in our families and our children's education. There should be a 'grandfathering' option so as to ensure families are not forced to live on the streets because there husband is forced to leave the country and is no longer able to support them. To arbitrarily make up rules without thinking them through is against the laws of humanity and human rights.

 

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[Tanoshi]

An extension is a permit, not a Visa.

 

There is no change to either the amount or seasoning period of funds in a Thai bank.

Using the income method, if you can no longer obtain an Embassy income letter, then alternatively you can show overseas monthly transfers of 40K per month to your Thai bank account.

What's unfair.

Edited February 25, 2019 by Tanoshi

[DrJack54]

Bit melodramatic. How have rules changed. There are new requirements such as how long funds remain in bank if using 800k in bank etc... Your suggesting families torn apart etc, how. 

If income method then the income level hasn't changed. Don't understand the fuss.

[racyrick]

1 hour ago, Tanoshi said:

An extension is a permit, not a Visa.

 

There is no change to either the amount or seasoning period of funds in a Thai bank.

Using the income method, if you can no longer obtain an Embassy income letter, then alternatively you can show overseas monthly transfers of 40K per month to your Thai bank account.

What's unfair.

What is unfair is that the rules have changed( for those that no longer get income letter) since you now have to show 12 consecutive months of international transfers and that was NOT required before. You only needed the letter and have back up proof if asked, BUT the back up proof was never required to show the 12 months of international transfers. You could just show transfers to your account or proof from your home bank. That is what is unfair.

 

So now, if someone truthfully has 40,000 baht monthly income and does not have the new requirements, they can be denied an extension. That is what is unfair. Sure they say they will be lenient, but we all know what that means-up to each individual office, each individual IO, etc. If someone gets denied, now what?

[DrJack54]

11 minutes ago, racyrick said:

What is unfair is that the rules have changed( for those that no longer get income letter) since you now have to show 12 consecutive months of international transfers and that was NOT required before. You only needed the letter and have back up proof if asked, BUT the back up proof was never required to show the 12 months of international transfers. You could just show transfers to your account or proof from your home bank. That is what is unfair.

 

So now, if someone truthfully has 40,000 baht monthly income and does not have the new requirements, they can be denied an extension. That is what is unfair. Sure they say they will be lenient, but we all know what that means-up to each individual office, each individual IO, etc. If someone gets denied, now what?

For those on permit based on retirement and not married its 800k

Married why not put 400k in Thai bank and leave it there. What's that 13k USD. Hardly the crown jewels.

[Tanoshi]

15 minutes ago, racyrick said:

What is unfair is that the rules have changed( for those that no longer get income letter) since you now have to show 12 consecutive months of international transfers and that was NOT required before. You only needed the letter and have back up proof if asked, BUT the back up proof was never required to show the 12 months of international transfers. You could just show transfers to your account or proof from your home bank. That is what is unfair.

But you previously swore you were receiving over 40K per month on your affidavit.

Now you have to transfer it to a Thai bank, it's unfair.

 

17 minutes ago, racyrick said:

So now, if someone truthfully has 40,000 baht monthly income and does not have the new requirements, they can be denied an extension. That is what is unfair.

That's makes no sense.

If you truthfully have the 40K per month, then you can meet the requirements.

 

[ocddave]

Just did my yearly extension today at Nonthaburi, really not a big deal, I used the 400K in the bank method this time. All the normal paperwork needed for extension, add a letter (Bank Statement - 200 baht) from the bank (400K minimum balance), and a copy of the bankbook page showing todays balance (Deposit/Withdraw to update), no more need to deal with a trip to the US Embassy for an income letter, and then a separate trip to MFA at Chaengwattana for a stamp. I would say its easier to deal with going forward (and cheaper), just a quick trip to SCB bank in the morning (Letter/Bankbook Update), then over to Nonthaburi for the extension. The guy we dealt with at Immigration today was night & day different then what I experienced in the past, the guy was helpful and cheerful, maybe their new location has made things much better (or new employees). Even my 90 days are in/out in about 5 minutes, things are improving by my standards. One thing we asked him, was about showing proof via bankbook/letter when returning for my visa extension stamp, and he said it was "not needed/necessary", which i didn't expect, so another plus! So wait one month, get my stamp (extension), and hopefully all set for another year.

Edited February 25, 2019 by ocddave

[bkk6060]

Seems people that are liars have been complaining.

They lied on the income letters for years now are crying.

My favorite one recently was the crybaby who said he owned 3 houses, a farm and 2 newer cars. Then he complains how it is all unfair and he may have to leave the country???

 

Like others in this thread have mentioned nothing really has changed except the ultimate location of the funds.

Everyone knows the rules now.

Buck up, be an adult figure out a way to be here because no one else will do it for you or I doubt, feel sorry for you or care much.

Edited February 25, 2019 by bkk6060

[elviajero]

3 hours ago, Stuart said:

For those of us who have a Thai wife and children the new Visa Extension rules are unfair. We have invested in our families and our children's education. There should be a 'grandfathering' option so as to ensure families are not forced to live on the streets because there husband is forced to leave the country and is no longer able to support them. To arbitrarily make up rules without thinking them through is against the laws of humanity and human rights.

Nothing has changed!

 

Immigration have added a new option to prove income for those that can’t get embassy letters.

[BertM]

54 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

Seems people that are liars have been complaining.

They lied on the income letters for years now are crying.

My favorite one recently was the crybaby who said he owned 3 houses, a farm and 2 newer cars. Then he complains how it is all unfair and he may have to leave the country???

 

Like others in this thread have mentioned nothing really has changed except the ultimate location of the funds.

Everyone knows the rules now.

Buck up, be an adult figure out a way to be here because no one else will do it for you or I doubt, feel sorry for you or care much.

I read somewhere that there are two types of people, those that are victims and those that take responsibility for their situation. The second group does not blame others for their misfortunes or their situation.

Edited February 25, 2019 by BertM

[malagateddy]

I can remember most of the requirements re applying for a UK Visa for my wife way back in 2005.
From what I can gather now..it's a heck of a lot harder in every way now.
The years roll by..countries " tighten up " their respective immigration rules/regs.
Not a lot anyone can do about it.
Chin up troops..you're living..breathing..therefore winning.
Cheers


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[JackThompson]

 

3 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Married why not put 400k in Thai bank and leave it there. What's that 13k USD. Hardly the crown jewels. 

This may not be what you meant, but what it amounts to for those families is,  "If you don't have 400K liquid to put in a Thai bank, your family deserves to lose your support." 

 

Many of those folks spent the "crown jewels and more" building homes for their families, putting kids through school, etc.

 

3 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

But you previously swore you were receiving over 40K per month on your affidavit.

Now you have to transfer it to a Thai bank, it's unfair.

 

That's makes no sense.

If you truthfully have the 40K per month, then you can meet the requirements. 

2 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

Seems people that are liars have been complaining.

They lied on the income letters for years now are crying.

Seems some think that having 40K/mo in income is the same as having 40K/mo income all of which they can transfer to Thailand. 

 

I do - but many do not, and their families should not lose a husband's support due to Thai Immigration telling Embassies to do the impossible, then reversing-course after successfully getting some of the largest (in terms of expats) to cancel the service. 

 

Immigration started this letter-fuss by wanting "verification," - and no coincidence just before they modified the "money in the bank" method - both of which ensure more agent-payoffs, without a care as to the consequences borne by Thais and Expats.

 

1 hour ago, BertM said:

I read somewhere that there are two types of people, those that are victims and those that take responsibility for their situation. The second group does not blame others for their misfortunes or their situation.

Tell that to the family w/o a breadwinner any more.  It's a nightmare getting a marriage extension at many offices as it is, and this new twist makes accomplishing that goal even more arduous.  And don't forget the "back door extra seasoning" on "money in the bank" at some offices (including CW) - a month or two after applying (plus the published 2 mo before) - during the "under consideration" period.  

 

@Stuart and @racyrick :

One remaining option is to get a 1-year Non-O-ME Visa from a consulate nearby.  If they ask for financials (as currently in Penang - not yet in Laos or Vietnam), some (USA) can still get Stat-Docs from our embassies in the countries where those Thai Consulates are present (Vietnam, Malaysia, and maybe Vientiane).

Edited February 25, 2019 by JackThompson

[marcusarelus]

7 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

Many of those folks spent the "crown jewels and more" building homes for their families, putting kids through school, etc.

That being the case get a loan on the house and property from a family member/bank or other and deposit 400k in the bank and have the Farang make the monthly payments on the 400k loan.  Which is really a small amount on a 30 year loan.

[OJAS]

5 hours ago, Stuart said:

To arbitrarily make up rules without thinking them through is against the laws of humanity and human rights.

You would IMHO be more appropriately directing your wrath at the 4 rogue embassies who have arbitrarily withdrawn their income confirmation services - particularly since there are 80 other embassies in Bangkok who are presumably still providing these services:-

 

https://www.th4u.com/embassies.htm

 

[Tanoshi]

5 minutes ago, OJAS said:

You would IMHO be more appropriately directing your wrath at the 4 rogue embassies who have arbitrarily withdrawn their income confirmation services - particularly since there are 80 other embassies in Bangkok who are presumably still providing these services:-

 

https://www.th4u.com/embassies.htm

 

And why did those 4 stop the service?

And why do the other 80 continue the service?

[ocddave]

1 minute ago, Tanoshi said:

And why did those 4 stop the service?

And why do the other 80 continue the service?

I am going to guess a falling out between RTP Immigration and certain Embassy staff, obviously there were disagreements, and this is the end result.

[Tanoshi]

1 minute ago, ocddave said:

I am going to guess a falling out between RTP Immigration and certain Embassy staff, obviously there were disagreements, and this is the end result.

Nope!

[ocddave]

1 minute ago, Tanoshi said:

Nope!

Enlighten us then, or do you want us to keep guessing?

[Dumbastheycome]

11 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

That being the case get a loan on the house and property from a family member/bank or other and deposit 400k in the bank and have the Farang make the monthly payments on the 400k loan.  Which is really a small amount on a 30 year loan.

But that being it returns some to the  normality of  situation in  home origins. Oh No . Oh no. 

( I came  and exist as a non resident, non citizen, and  the fact I have avoided compliance to date  gives me a  right to  object ! )

Hello  reality.

[Tanoshi]

1 minute ago, ocddave said:

Enlighten us then, or do you want us to keep guessing?

I'm waiting for OJAS to tell us, as he believes the Embassies at are fault.

[Changoverandout]

For an extension based on marriage it’s an ‘average’ of 40000/month from abroad going into your Thai bank so you don’t have to have 40000 coming in EVERY month.

I have a biannual private pension.

Edited February 25, 2019 by Changoverandout

[elliss]

4 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Bit melodramatic. How have rules changed. There are new requirements such as how long funds remain in bank if using 800k in bank etc... Your suggesting families torn apart etc, how. 

If income method then the income level hasn't changed. Don't understand the fuss.

 

          Correct , you can either provide the 8000K  ,  or you cannot ,  aka good farang /alien. 

         Tissues , should be provided free @ immigration .  IMHO. 555

               , 

 

 

Edited February 25, 2019 by elliss

[ocddave]

Quote

I'm waiting for OJAS to tell us, as he believes the Embassies at are fault.

 

During our conversation with the young IO officer today, like I said he was cheerful and helpful, he seemed genuinely concerned about Retirement people who were being left out in the wind (stating he felt sorry for them - especially having to inform those unable to make the requirements). He even mentioned that the decision was not Thai Immigration's, but instead the fault of each of the Embassy's, so I really don't have the answer....but at least the IO we spoke to today was genuine and decent, actually refreshing from past experiences.

Edited February 25, 2019 by ocddave

[skatewash]

16 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

And why did those 4 stop the service?

And why do the other 80 continue the service?

My take on that is that they didn't like doing it and used the excuse of Thais not "being happy" about the level of verification to wash their hands of an unpleasant task that they felt was beneath them.  They choose to stop producing the letters, Thai Immigration has never said they would stop accepting them and to date, they haven't ever done that, that is, they continue to accept that from all embassies. 

That you believe otherwise is your prerogative but it's based on as much hard evidence as mine is, which is to say precious little.  We do however have the vice consul of the BE on the Pattaya radio program saying it was triggered by an FCO audit of things the embassy was doing that it didn't have to with a view toward obtaining cost savings and to stop doing things that were unnecessary, and her belief that there was a method (lump sum of money in the bank) which was a viable alternative.

[skatewash]

20 minutes ago, ocddave said:

I am going to guess a falling out between RTP Immigration and certain Embassy staff, obviously there were disagreements, and this is the end result.

Yes, the precipitous four got pissy, took their marbles and went home.  While that's a pretty immature attitude it would have been more understandable (and possibly forgivable) had it impacted them.  It didn't.  It impacted only their citizens who must now pay the price for their poor decision and impatience.

[tingtongtourist]

SO..,

now its UNFAIR because for years and years these guys been using visa agents to fraudulently get around financial requirements.

 

now Immigration actually asking for real proof.

 

yeah..SO unfair

5555

[jmd8800]

This all started back in late October and it is now late February. There really isn't much excuse for not having Plans A, B & C already mapped out.

 

Many things in my life did not work out as planned. I always got busy and mapped out a strategy to cope with the changes. Get busy. The more time people spend complaining, the less time they have to find a solution. Especially here on TVF as the signal to noise ratio is horrible and it can easily eat up a few hours of one's day.

[elliss]

41 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

That being the case get a loan on the house and property from a family member/bank or other and deposit 400k in the bank and have the Farang make the monthly payments on the 400k loan.  Which is really a small amount on a 30 year loan.

   

        Ha  Ha , the  house and land , belong to my thai darling  ,  which i paid for.

              Nobody , put a gun to my head , not yet .555

 

 

Edited February 25, 2019 by elliss

[ocddave]

1 minute ago, jmd8800 said:

This all started back in late October and it is now late February. There really isn't much excuse for not having Plans A, B & C already mapped out.

 

Many things in my life did not work out as planned. I always got busy and mapped out a strategy to cope with the changes. Get busy. The more time people spend complaining, the less time they have to find a solution. Especially here on TVF as the signal to noise ratio is horrible and it can easily eat up a few hours of one's day.

Yup, but I only reacted as soon as I saw the info posted here back in October. Like you said though, plan B went into motion right away, no spending any time complaining, just jump on the problem right away. Bank Account method started as soon as I could get the bank account opened and the Transferwise payments sent.

[Changoverandout]

And Transferwise shows as foreign transfer. In bkk bank anyway