USA,UK Income Affidavit Exchange Rate problem

[WeekendRaider]

someone may have this problem, so I wrote this thing.  but it cannot just be a few sentences.  if it sounds like it might be you, you may want to read the whole thing.
     

there is a 'trap for the unwary'.   my pension income as a monthly number is not at all fixed.  so I used a conservative figure when I swore to a affidavit at the US Consulate in Chiangmai in November but which was used until just today. 

because in the past we normally would swear to an affidavit a few days before we use it a problem crops up only now when we have affidavits that are months old.   in the west this would not be a problem and I will explain that, as an accountant, but let me get to the Thai way of dealing with this which is how Immigration works.  basically, you disappear into a rabbit's hole and magically everything is okay but only after a few weeks of extreme stress.  you "skate by". 

the US dollar has dropped a lot in a few months.  and I swore to a conservative figure at the US Consulate.  which cannot be changed with a new affidavit anymore.  "that should not be a problem because as a 'foreigner' you receive your pension in dollars".

WRONG.  I have lived in Thailand almost 20 years and I no longer "think" in dollars at all... ever.  even if I had a fixed monthly pension that only people with small pensions might still ever depend on.  my "pension income" swings quite a lot, day to day actually.  so I don not have a magic monthly number and even if I did it would be in my head in Thai Baht.  so when I swore to it I used the fx exchange rate at that time, I did not try to predict what it would be in US dollars 4 months later!!!!  of course not!

but TI uses the fx rate at the time you file for an extension.  that only makes sense if your pension income is relatively fixed and as well is a monthly distribution and you know what that magic number is in US dollars.  not Thai Baht.  do you see the problem?  you do know that that affidavit is paperwork and other evidence just ain't applicable unless TI says it is.

and if you don't know about this trap because of some other small issues.... which was me!.... and end up running too close to your exit stamp as this proceeds along..... it is very stressful to rely on "skating by" or appearing out the other end of a rabbit's hole depending on how conservative your figure was.  mine was conservative meaning tight to the 65,000 figure even though in "real life" it is maybe more than twice 65,000.. who knows?  in fact, one year I actually met the Consul General in person who came down to see the unknown American billionaire who had an income affidavit stating a pension income of 90,000 US Dollars a month..... except it was me and I had no idea why the Consul General had special handled my affidavit...... until a few days later at Chiangmai Immigration I almost fell over when I was asked "do you really have $ 90,000 a month in pension income"? 

if you don't get it, I can't even think in dollars anymore.  only Baht.  even when swearing to a form that says dollars on it.  and no, I am not an idiot.  I think pretty normal.  what's idiotic is asking for a single magic number, in US dollars, for a monthly pension income figure that is totally unknowable by even me, let alone my government.  except as a estimate and since using "90,000" I became conservative.

IN THE USA..... no one would apply the current exchange rate to a figure placed on a 4 month old affidavit.  that is called the "matching principle" in western accounting which is almost as important as being "conservative" in estimating income.  but in Thailand a simple procedure, and an assumption of "foreigners" always must know what their magical fixed monthly pension... and as well as that in their home currency..... means you could find yourself relying on a "just skating by" or "rabbits hole" solution.... which works..... as you get nearer to your extension due date apparently...... and is almost as stressful as anything I have ever experienced.  that is no joke at all 20 years in rural Northern Thailand.... if I was in Bangkok or the City of Chiangmai and traveled home alot and stuff... maybe not so terrified.  for me, it was horrific. 

Edited February 25, 2019 by WeekendRaider

[elviajero]

Fluctuations in exchange rates was one reason the combo method was introduced. You can (under current rules) top up the shortfall in income with cash in the bank so that 12 x monthly income plus bank balance equals 800K. If you use that current system the funds need to be in the bank for 3 months before you apply.

 

If applying under the new rules the funds need to be in the account for 2 months prior to the application, and there is still a question over whether or not the minimum cash in the bank is 400K. There are conflicting reports.

 

I suggest you go to your local office and ask what they require from you to apply under the combo method for your next application.

[onera1961]

Very confusing. I could not understand what the OP intended to say. You declare your monthly income in dollar in affidavit. On the date of your extension, the IO applies the conversion rate and determine if you qualify for extension or not. All mute now as no affidavit is issued any more.

I'm getting ready for 800K in the bank method. After months of arguing about why I would never keep 800K in a Thai bank, I have switched my position. I think this is the best way and in the long run you will be a winner. 

 

Baht will never depreciate to much in a foreseeable future unless China goes into a prolonged recession (very unlikely). The flood gate of Tourists from China and India will keep on increasing, keeping Baht strong. There is no sign of India's economy slowing down in the next decade and no sign of Indian Tourists bringing in foreign currency to Thailand. I don't see any reason for Baht to depreciate unless somebody can give me a good reason that I overlooked. 

By the way, I wonder why one wants to inhale smog filled air with 90,000/month USD income. Heck, I could live any where in the World with a mere 60K/year USD, including French Riviera

Edited February 26, 2019 by onera1961

[ubonjoe]

15 minutes ago, onera1961 said:

Baht will never depreciate to much in a foreseeable future unless China goes into a prolonged recession (very unlikely). The flood gate of Tourists from China and India will keep on increasing, keeping Baht strong. There is no sign of India's economy slowing down in the next decade and no sign of Indian Tourists bringing in foreign currency to Thailand. I don't see any reason for Baht to depreciate unless somebody can give me a good reason that I overlooked. 

Please stop putting your rant about exchanges rates in every post you do. If you want to do that do it in the Jobs, economy, banking, business, investments forum.

Further off topics post will be removed if you keep repeating them.

[WeekendRaider]

too many folks don't read posts and think carefully, and also like to believe 'everyone is the same' [as they are].   no!   allow me to dispel that notion if you read on...  sure!  I will drop a million baht into a retail bank and leave it there.  the blue motif one.  but my average ROI for 10 years or so has easily been closer to 3 digits than 1 and more important the affidavit only required one trip.. and that to the "weahaung" which I don't mind every once in a while... if I get there early in the day.  one trip to the Consulate.   the bank book thing, lamentably now that it is gone, requires 2 trips and, worse, my nearest local bank is almost as far away from my home as the "weahaung" is!!!!!  

it's also why I made mistakes..... I get up with the morning market folks, that's means about 2 am yes? and am barely awake when I do this in the place tourists call "Chiangmai" except that is the entire province in normal conversation where I live.  and.... my first thought whenever in "Chiangmai" is to leave and get back to where life is very special, which is rural village life.... the total opposite of a cheap hangout place.  plus... I believe in simple physics and the scene of lots of tourists is inescapably depressing as well.  EXAMPLE.  that smoke from the rice paddies and 2.5 PM nonsense is a negative forcing dudes.  that means it is a very very GOOD thing.   not to say we should burn stuff but that anyone who doesn't know that stuff is why the "polar vortex" in the USA "news" wasn't "news" 30 years ago, has a little reading up to do.   

Edited February 26, 2019 by WeekendRaider

[WeekendRaider]

just in case [my reply about the consulate affidavit trips being only one trip a year].. my side comment about paddy and trash burning kind of saving us.... most of that aerosol and PM forcing is the Yellow River basin obviously..... but it is a metaphor (the local smoke) and a good thing if you understand simple physics.  you know, example why "aviation" was not included in COP21.  that kind of thing.  we really need to now about this stuff.  be prepared.  2015 and 2016 might not have been an exception.  it could have been a harbinger.   

Edited February 26, 2019 by WeekendRaider