Thousands of activists block London roads to demand action on climate change

[elmrfudd]

9 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I guess Solar Power really does have its limited uses.... 'mainly residential'. 

 

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/china-launches-largest-floating-solar-farm-180963587/

wow, a whole 40mega watts!!! 

 

 

used for up to 15,000 homes...isn't that mainly residential?

they might even be powering some shops and warehouses.

 

 

and at what cost? and at what available run time? 

and does it use battery storage? is it used at night?

what is it's uptime record since installation and being online?

all those important operability things left out to make a real credible comparison.

 

but that doesn't matter now does it.

 

you really do have to get a a better grip on things. but hey, keep

trying!

 

I am sure your grasp of engineering and science will help you.

[RickBradford]

Just now, Chomper Higgot said:

I've asked you for the basis of your claim that the protestors are 'Serial Narcissists' you can't provide a basis and now you mention documented facts?

I'm sorry, you've sunk below even the very low bar set for constructive debate round here.

 

The backgrounds of the 'leaders' of this protest are in the public domain and you would only have to do a small amount of Google searching to discover them for yourself.

[Chomper Higgot]

Just now, elmrfudd said:

wow, a whole 40mega watts!!! 

 

and at what cost? and at what available run time? 

and does it use battery storage? is it used at night?

what is it's uptime record since installation and being online?

all those important operability things left out to make a real credible comparison.

 

but that doesn't matter now does it.

 

you really do have to get a a better grip on things. but hey, keep

trying!

 

I am sure your grasp of engineering and science will help you.

I guess I updated with the global list while you were typing, here it is again.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_photovoltaic_power_stations

 

Why do I need to get a better grip of things when there are so many large scale operational solar power plants installed around the world. 

 

Perhaps its you who need to put your prejudice view to one side and accept that solar power is being implemented in national and regional power grids around the world. 

 

As I said above, solar power has gone way past providing power for 'local lighting'.

[elmrfudd]

10 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I guess I updated with the global list while you were typing, here it is again.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_photovoltaic_power_stations

 

Why do I need to get a better grip of things when there are so many large scale operational solar power plants installed around the world. 

 

Perhaps its you who need to put your prejudice view to one side and accept that solar power is being implemented in national and regional power grids around the world. 

 

As I said above, solar power has gone way past providing power for 'local lighting'.

again, it is used where it is viable or practical. it will never supplant fossil fuels in efficiency or capacity or ability to supply

industrial peak demand. and will always require expensive battery and inverter systems to provide 24 hr supply

 

but keep up the climate change mantra, that will overcome reality if you try hard enough.

[blazes]

1 hour ago, bristolboy said:

I wasn't aware that the price of gas was governed by the laws of physics. Thanks for the info.

 

The climate always changes. Unfortunately some people never do....

[Chomper Higgot]

3 minutes ago, elmrfudd said:

again, it is used where it is viable or practical. it will never supplant fossil fuels in efficiency or capacity or ability to supply

industrial peak demand. and will always require expensive battery and inverter systems to provide 24 hr supply

 

but keep up the climate change mantra, that will overcome reality if you try hard enough.

Who claimed any of that? not me.

 

Solar Power is already feeding MW to power grids, MW that do not then have to be produced by fossil fuels. (See link to list of large scale Solar Power Plants).

 

As are a number of other renewable power sources. 

 

 

[elmrfudd]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Who claimed any of that? not me.

 

Solar Power is already feeding MW to power grids, MW that do not then have to be produced by fossil fuels. (See link to list of large scale Solar Power Plants).

 

As are a number of other renewable power sources. 

 

 

who, mainly bristol boy where the claims originated from if you weren't too lazy to follow.

 

I never said they weren't feeding the grid, but they do not have reactive load capabilities in almost all most cases.

neither does wind.  (they can't increase power on demand without large battery banks and inverter systems)

 

they do not possess the 24/7 reactive load responses required for large industrial loads or when load sheds.

 

but then you knew this being an engineer and man of science

[bert bloggs]

7 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

And yet public support to end the US involvement in the Vietnam war hastened the end of US involvement in the Vietnam war.

 

Go figure.

Chomper ,you can go on and on as much as you like Britain does not have a large carbon footprint ,and for a second do you think the countrys that are polluting the most give a flying fart about a few protesters in Britain? do they hell .

Britain is doing all it can (god help them) diesels to be outlawed ,congestion charges etc etc . glad i was born when i was . because the next 50 years are going to be not to good ,especially that by the year 2150 there will be another 5 billion on the planet. Now that is something to worry about.

[Chomper Higgot]

7 minutes ago, elmrfudd said:

who, mainly bristol boy where the claims originated from if you weren't too lazy to follow.

 

I never said they weren't feeding the grid, but they do not have reactive load capabilities in almost all most cases.

neither does wind.  (they can't increase power on demand without large battery banks and inverter systems)

 

they do not possess the 24/7 reactive load responses required for large industrial loads or when load sheds.

 

but then you knew this being an engineer and man of science

Well guess what.... 

 

Design grids with the right mix of power sources to meet the demand and demand profile.  

 

It seems, someone is doing this already, hence the large scale solar power plants being built and put on line. 

 

Maybe the people financing and managing those projects know something you don't. 

 

[elmrfudd]

2 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Well guess what.... 

 

Design grids with the right mix of power sources to meet the demand and demand profile.  

 

It seems, someone is doing this already, hence the large scale solar power plants being built and put on line. 

 

Maybe the people financing and managing those projects know something you don't. 

 

well being a man of science, you already know the existing grids need to be updated or retrofitted

to allow the systems to exist on the same grid, with switching and shedding capabilities.

 

but you already know this being a man of sound engineering and science background 

[Chomper Higgot]

10 minutes ago, elmrfudd said:

well being a man of science, you already know the existing grids need to be updated or retrofitted

to allow the systems to exist on the same grid, with switching and shedding capabilities.

 

but you already know this being a man of sound engineering and science background 

Oh that would be a big problem. 

 

Perhaps get the tiffy to sort it out, if he's not a huff and puff man. 

[elmrfudd]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Oh that would be a big problem. 

 

Perhaps get the tiffy to sort it out, if he's not a huff and puff man. 

most of the huff and puff belong to the sparkies and "managers"

[bristolboy]

1 hour ago, RickBradford said:

I'm sorry, you've sunk below even the very low bar set for constructive debate round here.

 

The backgrounds of the 'leaders' of this protest are in the public domain and you would only have to do a small amount of Google searching to discover them for yourself.

And I guess you're up to your old trick of having either find the evidence ( or not) to back up your claims. 

[bristolboy]

4 hours ago, elmrfudd said:

sorry, a few countries and an opinion article by a renewable energy company don't cut it, and they certainly do not change the laws of physics.

 

 

Battery storage and its cost/lifespan and most importantly its ability to react to large Peak loads are not

anywhere near cost effective, not to mention the massive footprints required to have the facilities.

factor in the lower reliability, their inability to react to large power demands, there simply is no comparison.

 

add to that an average 10 year battery lifespan, it gets even more inefficient.

 

add to that the CCGT design that reclaims the exhaust heat to run a boiler to drive a steam turbine for even more efficiency

and there is no solar system that can compete with that level of efficiency and power generation capacity.

Maybe you've been away from the business a little bit too long. Do try and keep up:

Gas turbine competition heats up

Natural gas is still often described as “the fuel of the future”. If you are selling turbines for gas-fired power generation, it cannot feel that way. Sales of gas turbines have fallen sharply, under pressure from low-cost renewable energy, and are expected to remain weak for at least another couple of years.

 

 

https://www.ft.com/content/bc315606-a0da-11e8-85da-eeb7a9ce36e4

[bristolboy]

9 minutes ago, Cadbury said:

To qualify what you say in more easily understood terms then CO2 has risen from 0.028% to 0.040% of the earth's atmosphere.

So is the other 99.960%, or (999,600 ppm) of earth's atmosphere blameless in global warming? Why is 400 copping all the flack? Just a question.

I know what you mean. I mean, carbon dioxide is only 0.04% of the atmosphere, and yet there are so called "scientists" out there who claim it's essential to plant life. Obvious nonsense.

[Rimmer]

An inflammatory post has been removed

[Cat ji]

19 hours ago, bristolboy said:

I think the problem that denialists are currently suffering from [...]

So is it "denier" or "denialist"? 
Familiar. Those who question what they were indoctrinated in.
Refer also to murtaad, apostate, heretic.
 

[Cat ji]

1 hour ago, elmrfudd said:

I never said they weren't feeding the grid, but they do not have reactive load capabilities in almost all most cases.

neither does wind.  (they can't increase power on demand without large battery banks and inverter systems)

 

they do not possess the 24/7 reactive load responses required for large industrial loads or when load sheds.

 

but then you knew this being an engineer and man of science

What about extremely high load demand, like aluminium smelters, for instance?

[bristolboy]

14 minutes ago, Cat ji said:

So is it "denier" or "denialist"? 
Familiar. Those who question what they were indoctrinated in.
Refer also to murtaad, apostate, heretic.
 

Yes, That's what science is about: indoctrination.

[RickBradford]

30 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

And I guess you're up to your old trick of having either find the evidence ( or not) to back up your claims. 

As I said previously, the background of these activists is readily available in the public domain.

 

Self-promoting narcissists that they are, it takes about 5 minutes for any Internet-savvy person to compile an almost complete dossier on them.

 

Don't expect me to hand you the basic research on a plate. Sometimes you have to do things for yourself; that way, you can find out if you really want to know the facts or merely want to continue hand-waving.

 

[bristolboy]

Just now, RickBradford said:

As I said previously, the background of these activists is readily available in the public domain.

 

Self-promoting narcissists that they are, it takes about 5 minutes for any Internet-savvy person to compile an almost complete dossier on them.

 

Don't expect me to hand you the basic research on a plate. Sometimes you have to do things for yourself; that way, you can find out if you really want to know the facts or merely want to continue hand-waving.

 

That's why scientists, historians, legal scholars never provide footnotes or references. Because we should trust them. And since that's the case, we should place our trust even more in an anonymous poster on this forum. Makes sense. There are those who say honorable people provide the proofs of what they assert.  But hey, that's just loose talk.

[RickBradford]

8 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

There are those who say honorable people provide the proofs of what they assert.  But hey, that's just loose talk.

No need to be so precious.

 

As I say, you can check the identity of these people for yourself in 5 minutes if you want to. From what I'm seeing, you don't really want to, and that's fine, too.

 

Just lay off the moral superiority bit; it's not making the grade.

[bristolboy]

27 minutes ago, RickBradford said:

No need to be so precious.

 

As I say, you can check the identity of these people for yourself in 5 minutes if you want to. From what I'm seeing, you don't really want to, and that's fine, too.

 

Just lay off the moral superiority bit; it's not making the grade.

I don't think my standards are so high are that most don't live up to them. It's just a very few.

[RickBradford]

^^^

I agree that your standards are not very high, but it's something you can always work on. Recognizing the problem is the first step towards fixing it.

 

Doing your own research instead of demanding others do it for you would be a good first step to take.

[Chomper Higgot]

13 minutes ago, RickBradford said:

^^^

I agree that your standards are not very high, but it's something you can always work on. Recognizing the problem is the first step towards fixing it.

 

Doing your own research instead of demanding others do it for you would be a good first step to take.

Posting hogwash then telling those who challenge you to find the evidence to support the hogwash you posted.

 

Doh!

 

[RickBradford]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Posting hogwash then telling those who challenge you to find the evidence to support the hogwash you posted.

 

Doh!

How do you (or the other poster) know that it's 'hogwash' if you can't be bothered to check it out for yourself? It's called independent research.

 

Much easier to claim that it's 'hogwash' and refuse to research it yourself; that way, you put off having to face uncomfortable facts.

[Chomper Higgot]

5 minutes ago, RickBradford said:

How do you (or the other poster) know that it's 'hogwash' if you can't be bothered to check it out for yourself? It's called independent research.

 

Much easier to claim that it's 'hogwash' and refuse to research it yourself; that way, you put off having to face uncomfortable facts.

You’ve made the accusation of people you don’t know being ‘serial narcissists’.

 

There is no such thing as a ‘serial narcissist’

 

An example of your hogwash.

[bristolboy]

21 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

You’ve made the accusation of people you don’t know being ‘serial narcissists’.

 

There is no such thing as a ‘serial narcissist’

 

An example of your hogwash.

However there is such a thing as a garden-variety narcissist. And someone who makes claims, especially someone who is anonymous, and expects other to do the work of substantiating them is someone who thinks its all about him. And that's the crucial defining point of a narcissist.

[Scott]

I suggest people get back on topic and stay there.   Continued bickering and baiting will earn suspensions.   Don't present information as facts and then expect others to look it up.   

[Donutz]

Sounds like the bickering bunch need a bit of on topic humour: