bristolboy Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 13 minutes ago, dblstndrds said: he listened, as the president said he would. how do you know if it bogus or legit if you do no hear it? His staff informed law enforcement authorities before they listened to the offer. Do you see how that might be a crucial difference? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dblstndrds Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 8 minutes ago, bristolboy said: His staff informed law enforcement authorities before they listened to the offer. Do you see how that might be a crucial difference? You mean after he listened to the phone call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolboy Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 2 minutes ago, dblstndrds said: You mean after he listened to the phone call. A spokesman for Schiff said, “Before agreeing to take the call, and immediately following it, the committee informed appropriate law-enforcement and security personnel of the conversation, and of our belief that it was probably bogus.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dblstndrds Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 16 minutes ago, bristolboy said: A spokesman for Schiff said, “Before agreeing to take the call, and immediately following it, the committee informed appropriate law-enforcement and security personnel of the conversation, and of our belief that it was probably bogus.” so would you agree this should happen regardless of the information and the source? that the fbi should be notified of any info that could relate to any politician? i just want to establish the rules that you want to apply to everyone equally first Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heybruce Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 14 hours ago, heybruce said: Tax breaks for the rich, an exploding deficit, praising tyrants, alienating allies, taking money from the military to build an ineffective law, defying constitutional oversight, etc; you consider these "doing the right thing"? 34 minutes ago, mogandave said: What “facts” might those be? The above facts were the ones you started replying to with nonsensical dodges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heybruce Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 59 minutes ago, dblstndrds said: you really do need to take a step back and not be so emotionally charged up. you seem consumed with righteous indignation. that can't be good for anyone People undermining democracy in the US annoys me. So does the complacency and rationalizations of the Trump cult followers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dblstndrds Posted June 15, 2019 Share Posted June 15, 2019 17 hours ago, heybruce said: 18 hours ago, dblstndrds said: you really do need to take a step back and not be so emotionally charged up. you seem consumed with righteous indignation. that can't be good for anyone People undermining democracy in the US annoys me. So does the complacency and rationalizations of the Trump cult followers. there is no "undermining" of democracy going on with the current potus. there is, however, a constant undermining of a legally elected president because irrational emotional people aren't able to accept legal election results. if you think your ideas are better, then get elected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heybruce Posted June 15, 2019 Share Posted June 15, 2019 1 hour ago, dblstndrds said: there is no "undermining" of democracy going on with the current potus. there is, however, a constant undermining of a legally elected president because irrational emotional people aren't able to accept legal election results. if you think your ideas are better, then get elected. By leaving open the door to accepting illegal election assistance from foreign powers, Trump is leaving open the door to undermining democracy. By resisting with every means possible Constitutional oversight Trump is undermining democracy. By attempting to end the investigation of Russian interference in the 2016 election Trump attempted to undermine democracy. Trump is not being undermined by anything but his own ignorance and apathy towards the job and responsibilities he has taken on. I don't have to get elected (and don't want the job), dozens of people better qualified than Trump are running for office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 On 6/14/2019 at 2:30 AM, heybruce said: I don't believe you. I think you, and Trump, want the House to stop investigating Trump and successfully going to the courts for legally demanded data that would expose his crimes. You see impeachment as a useful diversion and smoke screen. You can believe whatever you like, as is your, and my, right. I wasn't the one bringing impeachment up in the first place- that's down to the resistance, but perhaps Nancy is clever enough to see the downside. This could be a classic case of being careful of what one wishes for ???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 22 hours ago, heybruce said: By leaving open the door to accepting illegal election assistance from foreign powers, Trump is leaving open the door to undermining democracy. By resisting with every means possible Constitutional oversight Trump is undermining democracy. By attempting to end the investigation of Russian interference in the 2016 election Trump attempted to undermine democracy. Trump is not being undermined by anything but his own ignorance and apathy towards the job and responsibilities he has taken on. I don't have to get elected (and don't want the job), dozens of people better qualified than Trump are running for office. dozens of people better qualified than Trump are running for office. and dozens of better qualified than Trump will see Trump re elected, IMO. It's not about being qualified, it's about whom the voters prefer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heybruce Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said: dozens of people better qualified than Trump are running for office. and dozens of better qualified than Trump will see Trump re elected, IMO. It's not about being qualified, it's about whom the voters prefer. Yes, BS often beats competence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tug Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said: You can believe whatever you like, as is your, and my, right. I wasn't the one bringing impeachment up in the first place- that's down to the resistance, but perhaps Nancy is clever enough to see the downside. This could be a classic case of being careful of what one wishes for ???? So if someone disagrees with Donald it means you arethe resistance?you got the trump delusion syndrome bad brother Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
user68677878 Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 The remedy of impeachment was designed to create a last-resort mechanism for preserving Americas constitutional system. It operates by removing executive-branch officials who have so abused power through what the framers called “high crimes and misdemeanors” that they cannot be trusted to continue in office. Trump needs to be impeached as should have his predecessor. Both are guilty of abuse of presidential power. If Republicans, who portray themselves as the standard bearer want to be taken serious about maintaining the integrity of the American government, they themselves should be leading the calls for Trumps impeachment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 On 6/16/2019 at 3:01 PM, porphyry said: The remedy of impeachment was designed to create a last-resort mechanism for preserving Americas constitutional system. It operates by removing executive-branch officials who have so abused power through what the framers called “high crimes and misdemeanors” that they cannot be trusted to continue in office. Trump needs to be impeached as should have his predecessor. Both are guilty of abuse of presidential power. If Republicans, who portray themselves as the standard bearer want to be taken serious about maintaining the integrity of the American government, they themselves should be leading the calls for Trumps impeachment If Trump's predecessor wasn't impeached then I can't see why Trump should be. Your last paragraph, LOL. The GOP members know what would happen to them if they were complicit in removing Trump from office. They may not like him, they may not respect him, but they like their jobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 On 6/16/2019 at 2:01 PM, heybruce said: Yes, BS often beats competence. Yes, it does. Absolutely. That Nixon, Bush the younger and Obama were re elected says it all, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heybruce Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said: If Trump's predecessor wasn't impeached then I can't see why Trump should be. Your last paragraph, LOL. The GOP members know what would happen to them if they were complicit in removing Trump from office. They may not like him, they may not respect him, but they like their jobs. Trump has obstructed justice, abused executive privilege and defied Congressional oversight. Presumably he is defying Congressional oversight in an attempt to hide other crimes. These are grounds for impeachment. Obama never provided grounds for impeachment. I do agree with your second paragraph; spineless Republicans in the Senate who put their own re-election over the needs of the country are the reason why it is pointless for the House to send an impeachment recommendation to the Senate at this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riclag Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 29 minutes ago, heybruce said: Trump has obstructed justice, abused executive privilege and defied Congressional oversight. Presumably he is defying Congressional oversight in an attempt to hide other crimes. These are grounds for impeachment. Obama never provided grounds for impeachment. I do agree with your second paragraph; spineless Republicans in the Senate who put their own re-election over the needs of the country are the reason why it is pointless for the House to send an impeachment recommendation to the Senate at this time. Trump has obstructed justice in the eyes of his opponents. Legal minds far more trusted and experienced have found no obstruction Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 2 minutes ago, riclag said: Trump has obstructed justice in the eyes of his opponents. Legal minds far more trusted and experienced have found no obstruction Illiberal tries to gaslight those of us who have read the Mueller report. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riclag Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 34 minutes ago, heybruce said: Trump has obstructed justice, abused executive privilege and defied Congressional oversight. Presumably he is defying Congressional oversight in an attempt to hide other crimes. These are grounds for impeachment. Obama never provided grounds for impeachment. I do agree with your second paragraph; spineless Republicans in the Senate who put their own re-election over the needs of the country are the reason why it is pointless for the House to send an impeachment recommendation to the Senate at this time. To mention an attempt to hide other crimes is Conspiracy theories Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 34 minutes ago, heybruce said: Trump has obstructed justice, abused executive privilege and defied Congressional oversight. Presumably he is defying Congressional oversight in an attempt to hide other crimes. These are grounds for impeachment. Obama never provided grounds for impeachment. I do agree with your second paragraph; spineless Republicans in the Senate who put their own re-election over the needs of the country are the reason why it is pointless for the House to send an impeachment recommendation to the Senate at this time. In your opinion, but apparently Nancy does not agree with you. Presumably is not evidence. In my opinion Obama did sufficient to be impeached. BTW, there are no "grounds" for impeachment other than "high crimes and misdemeanours" which is code for whatever congress decides to impeach over. IMO the Dems are spineless for not making good on their threats to impeach- Nancy, just do it! Even if it's a lost cause they should have the intestinal fortitude to do what they think is right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heybruce Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 7 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said: In your opinion, but apparently Nancy does not agree with you. Presumably is not evidence. In my opinion Obama did sufficient to be impeached. BTW, there are no "grounds" for impeachment other than "high crimes and misdemeanours" which is code for whatever congress decides to impeach over. IMO the Dems are spineless for not making good on their threats to impeach- Nancy, just do it! Even if it's a lost cause they should have the intestinal fortitude to do what they think is right. I listed three definite grounds for impeachment before my presumably comment. I'm not surprised you are cherry picking the evidence, that's what your Fox News sources do. Pelosi agrees that there are grounds for impeachment, but that the timing isn't right. You have given no "high crimes and misdemeanors" committed by Obama. If not being liked by a fraction of the public were grounds for impeachment, Trump would have been out of office before he was sworn in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 On 6/18/2019 at 2:30 AM, heybruce said: I listed three definite grounds for impeachment before my presumably comment. I'm not surprised you are cherry picking the evidence, that's what your Fox News sources do. Pelosi agrees that there are grounds for impeachment, but that the timing isn't right. You have given no "high crimes and misdemeanors" committed by Obama. If not being liked by a fraction of the public were grounds for impeachment, Trump would have been out of office before he was sworn in. I refer to Obama's apology tour of the world; also sucking up to big bank managers and letting them off the hook, instead of prosecuting them and seeing them in jail, where they belong. That, IMO was grounds for impeachment. Misdemeanours can mean anything congress wants it to mean. Pelosi, LOL. She has realised that impeachment is a poisoned chalice, and is coming up with spurious grounds for not doing it. Perhaps she thinks just before the election would be a better time politically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 On 6/18/2019 at 2:30 AM, heybruce said: that's what your Fox News sources do. Cut the lies. I haven't seen Fox in over 6 months, and don't use them as a source. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolboy Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 39 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: Cut the lies. I haven't seen Fox in over 6 months, and don't use them as a source. Sounds to me like you're one of their sources. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heybruce Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 53 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: I refer to Obama's apology tour of the world; also sucking up to big bank managers and letting them off the hook, instead of prosecuting them and seeing them in jail, where they belong. That, IMO was grounds for impeachment. Misdemeanours can mean anything congress wants it to mean. Pelosi, LOL. She has realised that impeachment is a poisoned chalice, and is coming up with spurious grounds for not doing it. Perhaps she thinks just before the election would be a better time politically. " The following selections are quotes from President Barack Obama's speeches. Mitt Romney argued in his book No Apology: The Case for American Greatness, that the remarks constitute apologies. Our analysis, however, concluded they did not fit the formal definition of apologies; read our full report. " https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/obama-quotes/ Your "apology tour" nonsense is fake news. What specifically did Obama apologize for that he shouldn't have? Obama and many others wanted to prosecute the bankers, but you need crimes to do that. With few exceptions the bankers took advantage of legal opportunities and nearly crashed the world economy. The proper response to that is better regulation of banks, but Trump isn't into regulating. You haven't given any grounds for impeaching Obama other than the fact that you didn't like him. Funny how you think you can read Pelosi's mind. Another symptom of TDS I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heybruce Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 58 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: Cut the lies. I haven't seen Fox in over 6 months, and don't use them as a source. But you definitely ignore inconvenient facts and cherry-pick, or invent, "facts" that suit your beliefs. I suppose you could have picked that up from Trump instead of Fox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roobaa01 Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 no impeachment but reelected as president, thats how it will finish. wbr roobaa01 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 On 6/19/2019 at 6:29 PM, heybruce said: You haven't given any grounds for impeaching Obama other than the fact that you didn't like him. Funny how you think you can read Pelosi's mind. Another symptom of TDS I suppose. Visa versa on Trump. Far as I can see there are no high crimes or misdemeanours, whatever you present as "evidence". Maybe's are not proof. I can't read Nancy's mind. I'm just repeating what has been said by others. However, a few posters claim to know what I'm thinking, as in using Fox for a source, when I haven't even seen it for over 6 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 On 6/19/2019 at 6:32 PM, heybruce said: But you definitely ignore inconvenient facts and cherry-pick, or invent, "facts" that suit your beliefs. I suppose you could have picked that up from Trump instead of Fox. The thread isn't about me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heybruce Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 7 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said: Visa versa on Trump. Far as I can see there are no high crimes or misdemeanours, whatever you present as "evidence". Maybe's are not proof. I can't read Nancy's mind. I'm just repeating what has been said by others. However, a few posters claim to know what I'm thinking, as in using Fox for a source, when I haven't even seen it for over 6 months. Mueller outlined many instances of obstruction of justice. Add to that is Trump's reprogramming money allocated by Congress for specific purposes, a clear violation of the Constitution. And Trump's going to the courts with futile objections to Congressional oversight is another clear violation of the Constitution. I consider these high crimes and misdemeanors. What do you consider to be Obama's high crimes and misdemeanors? Six months isn't that long. Fox News, through its insane pundits posing as journalists, was eagerly spreading lies and misdirection about Trump back then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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