Boy, 5, Killed But Mother Survives Knife Attack

[LaoPo]

i'm very shocked and saddened about this incident. my heart goes out to the injured mother and the family behind.

as i live in near vicinity to where it happened, i would really be interested in a follow-up on police investigations. latest gossip in the neighbourhood is still the same version from the beginning that the thai-ex did the crime as he was no more receiving money from the woman. i said gossip, so don't know how much is true.

horror to think there are such mad perverts out there who kill even infants for robbery. even in this more quiet part of samui robbery and crime increase as building increases... i know it happens anywhere in the world but is still so bitter

Indeed gossip and speculation, so far, as we don't know the truth yet.

SBK wrote in her previous post that is was "...most likely everything to do with greed, considering the amount of valuables the woman has reported missing.".

I fear that this is just part of the crime and not just greed.

Let me explain, please:

A few days ago a man (who was in a bitter divorce dispute with his wife about the children) in my country went to the house of his mother in law, who was babysitting his 2 young boys; she refused to 'hand them' over to him...he killed her with a knife, took his two boys in his car and he drove to the nearest railroad-crossing.

He dragged them out of the car (whilst they were screaming and crying... ) but he was too strong. He dragged them onto the rails when the train came....all three died. An elderly man with his bycicle watched everything from across the railroad....

The whole country was in utter shock.

Specialists in these kind of tragic cases think it must have been a kind of revenge (towards his wife)....Meaning: if I can't see/have the kids, YOU can't have them either....

I'm not saying that the murder of the child on Samui was out of revenge also, but a simple robbery (stolen items) just doesn't make sense to commit such a horrible, execution-style murder on a 5-year old, and attempt to the mother as well. He could have beaten them, knocking them unconscious, but killing?

We can only hope they catch him/them.

edit: Just re-checked the tragedy; the father was 32; the boys 4 and 6 years old; the mother in law, 58...

LaoPo

Edited March 24, 2007 by LaoPo

[John 1]

Why are we going on about this case, as I said before sad but life goes on if you check other kids would have been murdered in Thailand since this case. As for follow up in the newspaper don't expect that this is old news. I wrote in a previous thread about number of murders on the increase on Samui, this is a small island and a small population but murders and people killed in motor accidents is a very high percentage per population, don't ask me to give figures.

[mafaso]

i'm very shocked and saddened about this incident. my heart goes out to the injured mother and the family behind.

as i live in near vicinity to where it happened, i would really be interested in a follow-up on police investigations. latest gossip in the neighbourhood is still the same version from the beginning that the thai-ex did the crime as he was no more receiving money from the woman. i said gossip, so don't know how much is true.

horror to think there are such mad perverts out there who kill even infants for robbery. even in this more quiet part of samui robbery and crime increase as building increases... i know it happens anywhere in the world but is still so bitter

Indeed gossip and speculation, so far, as we don't know the truth yet.

SBK wrote in her previous post that is was "...most likely everything to do with greed, considering the amount of valuables the woman has reported missing.".

I fear that this is just part of the crime and not just greed.

Let me explain, please:

A few days ago a man (who was in a bitter divorce dispute with his wife about the children) in my country went to the house of his mother in law, who was babysitting his 2 young boys; she refused to 'hand them' over to him...he killed her with a knife, took his two boys in his car and he drove to the nearest railroad-crossing.

He dragged them out of the car (whilst they were screaming and crying... ) but he was too strong. He dragged them onto the rails when the train came....all three died. An elderly man with his bycicle watched everything from across the railroad....

The whole country was in utter shock.

Specialists in these kind of tragic cases think it must have been a kind of revenge (towards his wife)....Meaning: if I can't see/have the kids, YOU can't have them either....

I'm not saying that the murder of the child on Samui was out of revenge also, but a simple robbery (stolen items) just doesn't make sense to commit such a horrible, execution-style murder on a 5-year old, and attempt to the mother as well. He could have beaten them, knocking them unconscious, but killing?

We can only hope they catch him/them.

edit: Just re-checked the tragedy; the father was 32; the boys 4 and 6 years old; the mother in law, 58...

LaoPo

In the States last week a man rented an airplane with his 8 y.o daughter flew to his mother-in-laws house and crashed the plane into it killing him and girl but not hurting anyone on the ground.

He and the wife were in a bitter divorce as well. More revenge. Interesting way to do it though.

[BigC]

after all the bad stories and press from samui. this one has to have hit an all time low.how low can you get killing a kid.

I was in esaan when some thai pointed out the stroy in the thai national paper. discusted and i can say. i would like to know the full real story though becuase i haven't read any concrete evidence on a motive or who done it yet.

[BigC]

i hope they don't find a scape goat to take the rap

[hecky]

after all the bad stories and press from samui. this one has to have hit an all time low.how low can you get killing a kid.

I was in esaan when some thai pointed out the stroy in the thai national paper. discusted and i can say. i would like to know the full real story though becuase i haven't read any concrete evidence on a motive or who done it yet.

guy i rent my house off has brother in police at Nathon, i asked him today what the out come was he said ex boyfriend was in the clear and that it was a migrant worker from one of the local camps, plain case of robbery and murder. this only what a local policeman has told me today many other members of this furum seem to know better though and had already found the ex boyfriend guilty from day one

been here 8 years and the crime gets worse and worse.

[taxexile]

there was a piece on thai television news a couple of days ago about this.

what they reported was as follows ,

the company that built the house where the girl lived went bankrupt and or refused to pay suppliers and or workers , they may have been building some other houses nearby , or the house was on a moobaan development.

the bankrupt company owed money to various building suppliers and workers on samui , most of them had agreed to wait until the building company could pay off its debts

one disgruntled supplier or worker went round to the house or moobaan and broke into the unfortunate victims house for the purposes of robbery , attacked the mother and killed the child.

[limbos]

after all the bad stories and press from samui. this one has to have hit an all time low.how low can you get killing a kid.

I was in esaan when some thai pointed out the stroy in the thai national paper. discusted and i can say. i would like to know the full real story though becuase i haven't read any concrete evidence on a motive or who done it yet.

guy i rent my house off has brother in police at Nathon, i asked him today what the out come was he said ex boyfriend was in the clear and that it was a migrant worker from one of the local camps, plain case of robbery and murder. this only what a local policeman has told me today many other members of this furum seem to know better though and had already found the ex boyfriend guilty from day onebeen here 8 years and the crime gets worse and worse.

Hecky,

Do you happen to have any statistics to back this up by any chance? I'd be really interested in those rather than just a blank statement.

I'm here for the same amount of time and tend to believe that the increase of violence/accidents goes hand in hand with the increasing amount of people that live here now compared to 8 years ago.

[sbk]

From the Nation:

Samui police nab alleged child killer

Samui police yesterday arrested a man they say murdered a young boy and seriously injured his mother in a knife attack last month at a newly-built home on the resort island near Surat Thani.

Waiphoj Jai-ngarm, 33, denied the charge after his arrest and three hours of questioning.

But Samui police said that Waiphoj had been identified as the attacker by Oraphan Yanacroft, who survived the brutal attack and witnessed her son's murder.

Station chief Pol Col Chaiyuth Nilwong Waiphoj's sought to kill Oraphan and her son after he lost a court case to her recently for unpaid debts.

So, now that the ex-boyfriend is in the clear would all those who already tried and convicted the man in the court of Thai Visa like to stand up and admit their error?

[KhunMarco]

From the Nation:

Samui police nab alleged child killer

Samui police yesterday arrested a man they say murdered a young boy and seriously injured his mother in a knife attack last month at a newly-built home on the resort island near Surat Thani.

Waiphoj Jai-ngarm, 33, denied the charge after his arrest and three hours of questioning.

But Samui police said that Waiphoj had been identified as the attacker by Oraphan Yanacroft, who survived the brutal attack and witnessed her son's murder.

Station chief Pol Col Chaiyuth Nilwong Waiphoj's sought to kill Oraphan and her son after he lost a court case to her recently for unpaid debts.

So, now that the ex-boyfriend is in the clear would all those who already tried and convicted the man in the court of Thai Visa like to stand up and admit their error?

Don't hold your breath !

[LaoPo]

after all the bad stories and press from samui. this one has to have hit an all time low.how low can you get killing a kid.

I was in esaan when some thai pointed out the stroy in the thai national paper. discusted and i can say. i would like to know the full real story though becuase i haven't read any concrete evidence on a motive or who done it yet.

guy i rent my house off has brother in police at Nathon, i asked him today what the out come was he said ex boyfriend was in the clear and that it was a migrant worker from one of the local camps, plain case of robbery and murder. this only what a local policeman has told me today many other members of this furum seem to know better though and had already found the ex boyfriend guilty from day onebeen here 8 years and the crime gets worse and worse.

Hecky,

Do you happen to have any statistics to back this up by any chance? I'd be really interested in those rather than just a blank statement.

I'm here for the same amount of time and tend to believe that the increase of violence/accidents goes hand in hand with the increasing amount of people that live here now compared to 8 years ago.

Maybe there are Thai statistics, but I wouldn't know where to find or get them.

These are international statistics, about -general- Thailand crime:

http://www.nationmaster.com/country/th-thailand/cri-crime

and this about murders in Thailand -per country- (click on the 'sources' and 'definitions'); if you 'forget' about countries #4 - #5 and #6, South Africa, Mexico and the USA respectively, Thailand -as a major tourist-destination- is ranked #8 with 5,140 murders...

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur-crime-murders

and, this is Thailand-murders (per capita), ranked as #14:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_...ders-per-capita

LaoPo

[limbos]

Laopo,

Thanks for the stats, but unfortunately they state nothing about today's crime rate on Samui compared to 8 years ago.

Will it be a valid educated guess that Thailand did not move too much in these stats over the last 8 years?

[LaoPo]

Laopo,

Thanks for the stats, but unfortunately they state nothing about today's crime rate on Samui compared to 8 years ago.

Will it be a valid educated guess that Thailand did not move too much in these stats over the last 8 years?

I really wouldn't know but my guess is that crime-rate in general is going up, not down. The problem with crimes is that not every crime is reported to the police and statistics don't always say very much, apart from the more serious crimes like murder which are of course in most cases reported to the police.

Rapes -in Thailand- per country statistics however show Thailand to be #14 with 4,020 rapes (and that's less than murders which stand at 5,140 )

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_rap-crime-rapes

and #27 per capita:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_rap_...apes-per-capita

My only guess is that rapes are not always reported to the police, since it's extremely odd that a country like Canada (less people than Thailand) has 24.000 reported rapes and Thailand a 'mere' 4,000.....

LaoPo

[limbos]

Fully agree on the rape aspect.

Probably 'losing face' counts also by not reporting and if I'm correct, most women get raped by somebody they know? Another reason posibly in Thailand not to report what happened.

Very sad indeed.

[sbk]

We had a discussion about this in the Ladies forum and it was generally accepted idea that many women don't report rapes because they get an unsympathetic response from the police with the general idea being that somehow they brought it on themselves.

So, no, I'd say the rape numbers are way underreported. This occurs in the US and Europe as wel.

Some interesting statistics from the US Rape Trauma Center:

The Demographics of Rape

According to the U.S. Department of Justice, an estimated 91% of the victims of rape and sexual assault are female and 9% are male.

Nearly 99% of the offenders they described in single-victim incidents are male.

Lawrence A. Greenfield. 1997. Sex Offenses and Offenders: An Analysis of Data on Rape and Sexual Assault. Washington, DC: Bureau of Justice Statistics, Office of Justice Programs, US Department of Justice.

80%-90% of violent crimes against women are committed by someone of the same racial background as the victim.

US Department of Justice. 1994. Violence Against Women. Rockville, Maryland: Bureau of Justice Statistics, US Department of Justice.

Sexual Assault Prevalence

1.3 women (ages 18 and over) in the United States are forcibly raped each minute. That translates to 78 per hour, 1,871 per day, or 683,000 per year.

D.G. Kilpatrick, C.N. Edmunds, & A. Seymour. 1992. Rape in America: A Report to the Nation. Arlington VA: National Victim Center.

Overall Crime figures for the state of California from January to June 2000 show a 9.7% increase in the number of reported forcible rapes when compared to the same period in 1999.

Criminal Justice Statistics Center, December 2000.

Rape and sexual assault prevalence is difficult to determine because the crime is significantly underreported. The primary annual government indicators available are the FBI's Uniform Crime Report (UCR), which only includes rapes reported to law enforcement, and the U.S. Department of Justice's National Crime Victimization Survey (NCVS) which involves a survey of U.S. households and tallies offenses reported by victims age 12 and older. Both estimates are thought by many experts to be low. (1) Results of the NCVS released in December 1998 estimated 311,000 rapes and sexual assaults against victims over the age of 12 in the United States in 1997. (2) Results of the UCR indicated approximately 96,000 reported forcible rapes in 1997. (3)

1. American Medical Association. 1997. Facts About Sexual Assault. Chicago, Illinois: American Medical Association.

2. Michael Rand. 1998. Criminal Victimization 1997: Changes 1996-97 With Trends 1993-97. Washington, D.C.: Bureau of Justice Statistics National Crime Victimization Survey, Office of Justice Programs, US Department of Justice.

3. Federal Bureau of Investigation. 1997. Uniform Crime Reports for the United States, 1997. Washington, D.C.: Federal Bureau of Investigation, US Department of Justice.

Reporting

Rape is called the most underreported violent crime in America.

Only 16% of rapes are ever reported to the police. In a survey of victims who did not report rape or attempted rape to the police, the following was found as to why no report was made: 43% thought nothing could be done, 27% felt it was a private matter, 12% were afraid of police response, and 12% felt it was not important enough.

Kilpatrick et al., 1992.

In the United States, a rape is reported every five minutes.

FBI Uniform Crime Report, 1997.

60% of the women who reported being raped were under 18 years old

29% were less than 11 years old

32% were between 11 and 17

22% were between 18 and 24

7% were between 25 and 29

6% were older than 29

3% age was not available

Rape in America: A Report to the Nation, National Victim Center, 1992.

Perpetrators

Only 2% of rapists are convicted and imprisoned.

U.S. Senate Judiciary Committee: Conviction and Imprisonment Statistics, 1993.

These are old statistics but it isn't the numbers that matter so much as the idea it gives.

[limbos]

Thanks for that SBK, that's an unfortunate eye opener.

Fully agree with the possible response one can receive here from the local MiB.

[BigC]

after all the bad stories and press from samui. this one has to have hit an all time low.how low can you get killing a kid.

I was in esaan when some thai pointed out the stroy in the thai national paper. discusted and i can say. i would like to know the full real story though becuase i haven't read any concrete evidence on a motive or who done it yet.

guy i rent my house off has brother in police at Nathon, i asked him today what the out come was he said ex boyfriend was in the clear and that it was a migrant worker from one of the local camps, plain case of robbery and murder. this only what a local policeman has told me today many other members of this furum seem to know better though and had already found the ex boyfriend guilty from day one

been here 8 years and the crime gets worse and worse.

i hear what you are saying. it is parr for the coarse where ever this is a boom in a part of a country then crime tkes off big time.

money attracts crime.

the more money goes into samui the more crime will go up. look at he pattaya paper. bigger samui bigger crime.

[Master of the court]

after all the bad stories and press from samui. this one has to have hit an all time low.how low can you get killing a kid.

I was in esaan when some thai pointed out the stroy in the thai national paper. discusted and i can say. i would like to know the full real story though becuase i haven't read any concrete evidence on a motive or who done it yet.

guy i rent my house off has brother in police at Nathon, i asked him today what the out come was he said ex boyfriend was in the clear and that it was a migrant worker from one of the local camps, plain case of robbery and murder. this only what a local policeman has told me today many other members of this furum seem to know better though and had already found the ex boyfriend guilty from day one

been here 8 years and the crime gets worse and worse.

i hear what you are saying. it is parr for the coarse where ever this is a boom in a part of a country then crime tkes off big time.

money attracts crime.

the more money goes into samui the more crime will go up. look at he pattaya paper. bigger samui bigger crime.

Could it be...............and Im just asking.......

Since the mother claimed all kind of stuff stolen...........it could look like she's in financial trouble.....goes crayzy kill her own kid ( it does happend around the world) slit herself after she understand the trouble she is in.......and claim burglary.....

She lived with a falang, where is he ??? did he stop sending money ??

A migrant worker......come on.....thats to easy....did they find all her stuff with him ???

Im not suggestion but asking

[mikethevigoman]

As usual the Thai police put out statements diverting away from the truth. as with the two russian women killed in Pattaya at first they said it was a westerner due to height at shoe print size found at the scene. then they arrest a Thai. here they are saying ex boyfriend probably. they know if they can gloss over things for a few days other news takes over and the heat goes away from the story. this is another brutal murder on Samui that the locals will try and keep as quite as possible as always. i use the term gloss over as people will not be so worried if the story is the killer was known to the family instead of it being a break in and terrible murder.

the amount of violent crime on the island is increasing daily, rape murder robbery allcommon place around the world i know but in the last 3 months i knew somebody who was murdered also somebody who ws raped and numeous people who have been robbed.

only when the foriegn media start on about how bad Samui is do the police do anything.

earlier post asked about follow ups, well the follow up to the rape story posted a few eeks ago is that the police arrested two illegal foreign workers in a camp near the attack. to many of these workers from Laos Cambodia et etc here commiting crime now and nothing happens.

as earlier reply said everybody is going along with ex boyfriend story yet the papar report does not say this what happened, this is what the police are saying. seems strange if the victim was out of the country for 5 years and back for just a few days that ex boyfriend not even from Samui just turns up. hopefully the truth will out and if it was another vicious crime here it gets reported correctly.

i doubt very much the fact that the child was not 100% Thai made a differnce, been here 8 years and do not feel any hate from Thais, i do however feel the place is far more dangerous from common crimminals from other countries

Edited April 13, 2007 by mikethevigoman

[SamuiJens]

after all the bad stories and press from samui. this one has to have hit an all time low.how low can you get killing a kid.

I was in esaan when some thai pointed out the stroy in the thai national paper. discusted and i can say. i would like to know the full real story though becuase i haven't read any concrete evidence on a motive or who done it yet.

guy i rent my house off has brother in police at Nathon, i asked him today what the out come was he said ex boyfriend was in the clear and that it was a migrant worker from one of the local camps, plain case of robbery and murder. this only what a local policeman has told me today many other members of this furum seem to know better though and had already found the ex boyfriend guilty from day one

been here 8 years and the crime gets worse and worse.

i hear what you are saying. it is parr for the coarse where ever this is a boom in a part of a country then crime tkes off big time.

money attracts crime.

the more money goes into samui the more crime will go up. look at he pattaya paper. bigger samui bigger crime.

Could it be...............and Im just asking.......

Since the mother claimed all kind of stuff stolen...........it could look like she's in financial trouble.....goes crayzy kill her own kid ( it does happend around the world) slit herself after she understand the trouble she is in.......and claim burglary.....

She lived with a falang, where is he ??? did he stop sending money ??

A migrant worker......come on.....thats to easy....did they find all her stuff with him ???

Im not suggestion but asking

And I'm telling you that you'r post was over the top,motc, we know the police version now and I don't see that she could kill her first born esp. son, and then cut her own neck.

Sure, worse has happened in the States for example. But not this one, Sorry, don't even want to go there! imho.

[mikethevigoman]

Whatever the sinister background of this horrible murder of a 5 year old child and attempt to do the same on his mother................., what strikes me most is the 'neglect' on this news...here on TV and in the local and nationwide Thai & English newspapers.

The murder of a small Thai/Farang 5-year old child is less 'news' than the murder on a 100% farang, whether child or adult.

Can anyone imagine the impact of an execution style murder -slit throat- like this on a farang child in Thailand....?

Sad and tragic story and sad 'us', but, life goes on, doesn't it?

Note: anyone remember the tragic rape&murder on Katherine Horton? WHY was that more important news and sensational than the life of this child ?

Oh, I forgot, KH was white and British.....

sorry for being so cinycal but this murder makes me sick!

LaoPo

Good point, fully agree.

Me too,. seems songkran and the weather forecast is more important, jeez what are they like !

[Shokdee]

Samui Express - Suspect in 3-year old boy's murder arrested. (They arrested Vipotch Chaingam -who was positively identified by Orapan, the boy's mother who survived.

"A source said Vipotch had sued Orapan before the court after she allegedly failed to pay for her order of conctuction materials. Orapan reportedly won the case."

Nothing to do with estranged husbands, nothing to do with illegal immigrants. Folks, if you get screwed by somebody on Samui and you go to court and win the case, you are in DANGER OF YOUR LIFE.

[LaoPo]

Samui Express - Suspect in 3-year old boy's murder arrested. (They arrested Vipotch Chaingam -who was positively identified by Orapan, the boy's mother who survived.

"A source said Vipotch had sued Orapan before the court after she allegedly failed to pay for her order of conctuction materials. Orapan reportedly won the case."

Nothing to do with estranged husbands, nothing to do with illegal immigrants. Folks, if you get screwed by somebody on Samui and you go to court and win the case, you are in DANGER OF YOUR LIFE.

Anybody on Samui who can confirm this and post a link ?

LaoPo

[Shokdee]

In case you're thinking - Oh, this is a NEW angle (the problem around construction/contractor) - I'll remind you that when this story was first reported this was already mentioned as one possible cause but I think slipped past people too focused on the love triangle/spurned lover theory.

I'll dig up an earlier edition of the newspaper .....

Here we are:

SamuiExpress March23-April5 2007, VOL2 No 9. Front page and continued inside...

LOVE ANGLE EYED IN MURDER TRY (sic)

"The police are also looking at the money angle as it was reported that Orawan still owed a certain contractor some Bt200,000. The services of the contractor was allegedly terminated after the construction of their new house was no (sic) completed on time"

So what seems to have happened is that this then went to court and Orawan won the case. Not happy about this, the guy returns to smash their head on a table, slit her and her boy's throat, etc.