The released call details already indicate guilt.

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2 minutes ago, Forethat said:

He COULD be.

Another Illiberal dream.

2 minutes ago, TopDeadSenter said:

Not strictly true. The democrats could always do it the mature way. You know, win an election. But I think with the appalling behavior over the last 3 years of witch-hunt on top of witch-hunt and hysterical tantrums, that running a sensible campaign would be extremely difficult to do at this late stage.

Agreed. 

IMO if the Dems do not nominate a real progressive, forward thinking candidate like Tulsi Gabbard or Mayor Pete, they are relying on hope and more of the same political posturing from candidates giving promises that they have no way of keeping, only to get elected. 

 

5 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Erm..... Biden isn’t being impeached.

 

Trump is.

Irrelevant .

 

What is relevant is that US high ranking official used his position and power to interfere for personal gain.

 

Should he not be investigated ? Should it not be an outrage that he did it or attempted to do it ?

 

 

2 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Another Illiberal dream.

I wouldn't call it Liberal, I'd simply call it correct. Trump is not impeached yet. He COULD be impeached.

4 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

They will if significant public opinion is in favor of impeachment.

Yes in a true democracy public opinion counts. 

My cynical view after voting in america for 42 years is that members of congress are bought and paid for, and thus elected by Big corporations and the Military Industrial complex, not public opinion.  

13 minutes ago, BestB said:

Can Trump haters explain to me why there is so much outrage about Trump and yet nothing regarding Biden and his interference ?

Because one set of allegations are about a man with consistently toxic behaviour so are probably true (but yet to be confirmed until all the facts are in, LOL),  the other set of allegations are the rants of a schoolyard bully whose MO is 'no, I didn't do anything bad, you did!!!! Why aren't they investigating Hilary? Why aren't they investigating Biden?'

2 minutes ago, dundas said:

Because one set of allegations are about a man with consistently toxic behaviour so are probably true (but yet to be confirmed until all the facts are in, LOL),  the other set of allegations are the rants of a schoolyard bully whose MO is 'no, I didn't do anything bad, you did!!!! Why aren't they investigating Hilary? Why aren't they investigating Biden?'

So in other words hypocrites ?

From an outsider’s perspective, sometimes a whistleblower is declared enemy of the state but in this case he is a hero?


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13 minutes ago, BestB said:

Can Trump haters explain to me why there is so much outrage about Trump and yet nothing regarding Biden and his interference ?

I'm not a "trump hater' but I do find some of the actions he has brought with him to the White House deplorable. He is systematically attempting to dismantle the very fabric of democracy. He uses 'strong arm' tactics and misdirection, blatant lies and attempts to pass these falsehoods on to his nation and the world. He deliberately uses his platform to contributes to mis-information and chaos which keeps law makers busy and allows for more potential conflicts to continue unchecked.

 

He has more potential conflicts of interest than any sitting president has had in living memory and refuses to do simple things to bring clarity and clear his name of the accusations.

 

A President of a leading democracy should be a beacon of democracy himself. Instead he belittles, accuses, mocks and attempts to discredit others from a point of power very few people ever have and ever will wield.

 

Others views may vary from mine.

 

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Well, coverup attempt or not, an awful lot has been uncovered already. Emphasis on awful. 

 

The impeachment process is on, for better or worse. It's happening. It can't be stopped. Here we go.

 

 

All it means is that Biden is finished. Warren is promising an extra $2,400 a yer to people on SS.

 

I knew they would throw Biden under the bus a long time ago and you can track my posts on that. Kamala Harris did it literally and now they are sabotaging their front runner again.

 

I hope with the SS fund running out of money by 2030 that any extended benefits will not apply to anybody living abroad. 

 

16 minutes ago, Forethat said:

I wouldn't call it Liberal, I'd simply call it correct. Trump is not impeached yet. He COULD be impeached.

 

He will be impeached - unless he resigns first - as this only requires a simple majority in the House.

 

He may or may not be convicted during his trial in the Senate. But Republican Senators will be forced to vote yea/nay on individual article(s) of impeachment.

 

Any further stone-walling by the adminstration will simply add another count of Obstruction of Justice.

 

Really no way out for the president.

 

Probably the same for the vp, ag, sec. of state, and whatever Rudy is.

 

"At long last sir, have you no sense of decency?"

 

Not sure who plays John Dean here? Steven Engel?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

4 hours ago, webfact said:

"I want to congratulate the Democrats on their latest information warfare effort against the president," Nunes said sarcastically.

"I want to congratulate the President on his latest shooting of his foot, he is a true centipede."

13 minutes ago, Farangwithaplan said:

I'm not a "trump hater' but I do find some of the actions he has brought with him to the White House deplorable. He is systematically attempting to dismantle the very fabric of democracy. He uses 'strong arm' tactics and misdirection, blatant lies and attempts to pass these falsehoods on to his nation and the world. He deliberately uses his platform to contributes to mis-information and chaos which keeps law makers busy and allows for more potential conflicts to continue unchecked.

 

He has more potential conflicts of interest than any sitting president has had in living memory and refuses to do simple things to bring clarity and clear his name of the accusations.

 

A President of a leading democracy should be a beacon of democracy himself. Instead he belittles, accuses, mocks and attempts to discredit others from a point of power very few people ever have and ever will wield.

 

Others views may vary from mine.

 

Again, fine he has done this or that and happy to accept , but what about Biden and what he has done or attempted to do? Biden is a front runner for presidential position , is he not?

 

Is he not one of the most senior government officials ? Ex Vice President , was he not ?

 

So whatever he did or attempted to do is all ok?

1 hour ago, Skallywag said:

Doesn't matter, elected officials stick together. 

The 53 member Republican majority in the Senate will never impeach their leader

Just heard on the news that a respected republican senator stated that already 30 (!) of his republican colleagues would vote for Trump being removed from office when they would have the chance.  It is a well-known fact that many republican leaders (e.g. Mitt Romney) despise Trump, but have been quiet in order not to to be outcasted by the Party and bullied by Trump.  But now that their very seats are becoming endangered by Trump's toxic behavior they will of course stop supporting him.  So the old Pelosi-argument that it would not be worth impeaching him, as it would be voted down in the Senate, doesn't stand anymore.

 

47 minutes ago, dundas said:

Judging by their (non) actions I think that members of the Republican Party are convinced that he is innocent, innocent and more innocent, regardless of whether he is proven guilty or not. I would also be concerned about the concept of 'innocent until proven guilty' when Trump is trying his hardest to influence the justice system, ie, appointing judges on the Supreme Court that are likely to deliver favourable outcomes for him. 

Republicans are biased as are Democrats.  No argument there.

 

As to Trump appointing judges to the Supreme Court, both Democrats and Republicans choose justices who they believe will be favorable for them.  It would be disingenuous to imply that Trump is the only President ever who has appointed justices with that in mind.  I'd consider your argument on that point as failed in the least.

24 minutes ago, Cryingdick said:

All it means is that Biden is finished. Warren is promising an extra $2,400 a yer to people on SS.

 

I knew they would throw Biden under the bus a long time ago and you can track my posts on that. Kamala Harris did it literally and now they are sabotaging their front runner again.

 

I hope with the SS fund running out of money by 2030 that any extended benefits will not apply to anybody living abroad. 

 

You seem to have staggered into the wrong thread.

11 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

Just heard on the news that a respected republican senator stated that already 30 (!) of his republican colleagues would vote for Trump being removed from office when they would have the chance.

 

That was a Republican strategist, Mike Murphy (ran McCain's pesidential bid I think), and he said that would happen if the vote were taken in secret (which it would not be).

 

 

 

 

17 minutes ago, mtls2005 said:

 

He will be impeached - unless he resigns first - as this only requires a simple majority in the House.

Yes, he COULD be impeached in case there is evidence. I don't think we're there yet.

So, he WILL be impeached if there's enough evidence, yes. But it's not there yet.  

16 minutes ago, mtls2005 said:

Not sure who plays John Dean here

Would be fun if the whistleblower turn up to be Mike Pence. He know his days as VP is numbered.  ????

14 minutes ago, BestB said:

Again, fine he has done this or that and happy to accept , but what about Biden and what he has done or attempted to do? Biden is a front runner for presidential position , is he not?

 

Is he not one of the most senior government officials ? Ex Vice President , was he not ?

 

So whatever he did or attempted to do is all ok?

But. But.. But... But...But ... But... Biden.

 

Give it a rest already.

 

The topic is not Biden.

1 hour ago, TopDeadSenter said:

Not strictly true. The democrats could always do it the mature way. You know, win an election. But I think with the appalling behavior over the last 3 years of witch-hunt on top of witch-hunt and hysterical tantrums, that running a sensible campaign would be extremely difficult to do at this late stage.

That’s funney coming from a non American lol the dems won the popular vote Donald won the old holdover from the slave days electoral college with help from a hostile foreign power the witch hunt you refer to has put some swamp critters in prison and more to join soon the one and only reason Donald isent on trial is because he is potus they won’t indite a sitting potus but if it makes you feel better call it a witch hunt lol Donald May finally get what’s coming to him!

Edited September 27, 20196 yr by Tug

Just now, Chomper Higgot said:

But. But.. But... But...But ... But... Biden.

 

Give it a rest already.

 

The topic is not Biden.

Funny how you don't care about the VPs son making MILLIONS from a Ukraine company when Daddy is VP.

Does he speak Russian?  have any Ukraine expertise? or you don't care because his daddy is a Dem?

23 minutes ago, mtls2005 said:

 

He will be impeached - unless he resigns first - as this only requires a simple majority in the House.

 

Not if this caper falls apart first.

11 minutes ago, Forethat said:

Yes, he COULD be impeached in case there is evidence. I don't think we're there yet.

 

Yes, of course, I was stating my opinion.

 

Unless he resigns first, which seems a push today (or otherwise leaves office), I am 100% confident he will be impeached, based solely on the evidence (his statements, his tweets, the WB complaint, and the transcript) which he has provided to date.

 

Witnesses like WH staff, Jared, Ivanka, Pompeo, Barr, Pence, Rudy (reliable witness?) and even the president via a video deposition will by jimmies on top.

 

Ironic that he who whines about email servers is undone by nefarious server activity within the WH.

 

Norway, if you're listening...

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 27, 20196 yr by mtls2005

2 minutes ago, Tippaporn said:

Not if this caper falls apart first.

‘Caper’

 

is that you exhibiting the balanced and open minded view you insist all the rest of us adhere to?

 

55 minutes ago, BestB said:

Irrelevant .

 

What is relevant is that US high ranking official used his position and power to interfere for personal gain.

 

Should he not be investigated ? Should it not be an outrage that he did it or attempted to do it ?

 

 

And do you really think that if the GOP thought there was any meat to the allegations they would not have moved heaven and earth to investigate this matter already?

Seriously??

Edited September 27, 20196 yr by Becker

Yes, he COULD be impeached in case there is evidence. I don't think we're there yet.
So, he WILL be impeached if there's enough evidence, yes. But it's not there yet.  

He will be impeached.

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2 minutes ago, mtls2005 said:

 

Yes, of course, I was stating my opinion.

 

Unless he resigns first, which seems a push today (or otherwise leaves office), I am 100% confident he will be impeached, based solely on the evidence (his statements, his tweets, the WB complaint, and the transcript) which he has provided to date.

 

Witnesses like WH staff, Jared, Ivanka, Pompeo, Barr, Pence, Rudy (reliable witness?) and even the president via a video deposition will by jimmies on top.

I'm not so sure, to be fair.

There's a political issue that comes into play as well. The Democrats will have to take into account the high possibility that the President is never convicted of anything, and that is unlikely given what I have seen so far and that a two thirds majority vote in the Senate is required.

35 minutes ago, BestB said:

Again, fine he has done this or that and happy to accept , but what about Biden and what he has done or attempted to do?

Well I did explain and answered your initial question. Trump is president. That is the most senior power in the land. Biden was never the most powerful person in the land.

 

Now you are asking me new questions which differ to your original question so I will give you my thoughts on these new questions.

35 minutes ago, BestB said:

 Biden is a front runner for presidential position , is he not?

 

Is he not one of the most senior government officials ? Ex Vice President , was he not ?

 

So whatever he did or attempted to do is all ok?

You would need to clearly and consicely explain to me what you believe Biden has"done or attempted to do." But I would prefer if you did it in a separate thread that you start.

 

The reason I say this is because this is a thread that has no relevance to Biden at all other than his name was referred to in documentation from a Whistleblower and also in telcon transcripts from the whitehouse. If you want to discuss Biden, why don't you make a separate thread so there can be clear lines of discussion on your concerns. This thread can then be kept clean and focused on the Whistleblower discussion.

 

You see, bringing in Biden into a direct discussion about the Whistleblower information muddies the waters. I am sure you want quality discussion so making a separate Biden thread will be the best way to do that. If I happen to see your Biden thread I will happily contribute so long as the discussion is amicable, fact based and intelligent and free of conspiracy.

 

Already in the last 2 days I must have blocked 5 or 6 people because their posts regarding this Whistleblower matter showed no insight, logic or ability to assimilate to any real level.

 

But I won't respond to you any more on this matter in this thread. I don't want to lose the focus on the thread's intent.

 

 

 

Edited September 27, 20196 yr by Farangwithaplan