Petrol Pump Curfews Loom For Thailand

[mtsanford]

Very few countries are crazy enough to directly subsidize fuel, but lots, in fact most countries, indirectly subsidize it, by refusing to tax the environmental impacts of fuel use.

Not to mention almost all roads are publicly financed. And at least in my home town of San Francisco, 5% of all land space is FREE PUBLIC CURBSIDE PARKING for cars! And mind you, land is not cheap here!

[englishoak]

What are they doing now?

1) People will fill up before 10pm

2) Delivery at night will suffer affecting supply and demand and thereby increase costs and lower profit.

3) more traffic on the roads in the day ( if thats possible )

4) loss of jobs for 1000s working the nightshift.

5) How much does a gas conversion cost? not cheap I expect.

6) Dosn't Toxin have a current drive for LPG cos he has a company supplying or major shares in one?

The sooner the Thai's realise you don't need a v8 or power of a 3000+ the better, Big cars here are a fashion item and not needed. The rise in fuel prices is mabe a good thing although it will hit the poor harder. Subsidising Has however just swept the problem under the carpet and not dealt with it.

There is a reckoning coming for the Gov and it has no idea what to do about it. I doubt the ministers have any useful professional experience and the Thai system does not allow them to listen to the experts on the economy and actually do something that they suggest, as that would be losing face.

Adult people are getting more like kids. I want, I expect, I want, It's not fair, Me,Me,Me.

Well thats just tough grow up, shut up moaning, be constructive and deal with the real world and it's problems

At some time the world will have to accept that oil is not the future and has a finate supply.The sooner the better and if chaos ensues so be it, the world will survive and life goes on. The auto companies will HAVE to reinvest and come up with the electric or water driven auto. So what if it does 0-60 in 60 seconds.It's all about ego, luxury and selfishness at the moment and IMHO it will all end in tears if the world Governments do not wake up and do something soon.

But hey what am I talking about? ALL Governments are just a playground for individuals to get rich and powerful, stuff everyone else.

If you think thats not correct answer this?

Q) Have you ever known a poor politician or minister ?

Q) have you ever known a politician to be not rich?

[Dutchy]

There is a reckoning coming for the Gov and it has no idea what to do about it. I doubt the ministers have any useful professional experience and the Thai system does not allow them to listen to the experts on the economy and actually do something that they suggest, as that would be losing face.

Adult people are getting more like kids. I want, I expect, I want, It's not fair, Me,Me,Me.

Well thats just tough grow up, shut up moaning, be constructive and deal with the real world and it's problems

I strongly disagree, this is Thailand, what has the real world to do with this? he he

You seem to hit the nail right on the head...

[dezeure]

duuuuhhh STUPID IS WHAT STUPID DOES!!!!

I drive about a week with a tank of fuel, so its not because I can't fill up my car after 10 pm (which I probably have never done before) that this is gonna make me drive any less...

Seriously: only TRT could come up with such pathetic logic which no single civilized person can understand. I really would like to see what's in their heads (other than the present vacuum)

Switching to natural gas would not be easy neither... I hardly know any pumps which have LPG. And once you're out of BKK forget it, it doesn't exist (with a few exceptions)

Start by installing petrol stations with LPG and maybe people will change, but then again is it worth the investment?

A decent LPG system costs about 100,000 Baht or more, and you only save something like 4 to 6 Baht per liter. Your maintenance has to be done more often, and you have less power and higher engine usage (it won't last that long)

In Belgium for example this IS worth it, as you save about 35 Baht per liter (normal gas is around 48 Baht per liter, LPG around 13 Baht) and the government even pays a 20,000 Baht reward if you switch to a (nieuw) LPG system.

Also, all over Europe you can easily find pumps with LPG (except maybe in France)

[Foggy Bottom]

Switching to natural gas would not be easy neither... I hardly know any pumps which have LPG. And once you're out of BKK forget it, it doesn't exist (with a few exceptions)

Any town or city with tuk tuks already has a network of LPG filling stations

[rossabout]

When Thailand stops worring about the small things, like closing bars early, and closing pertol stations early and starts working on the fact they are falling behind with wages, technology and education. Have wages for most Thais really gone up in the past 20 years. Sure we as farangs love this country for is very low prices, but at what cost to this country. Same goes for the very lovely women who sell there bodies because they want the money for a better life for them and there families. When will "Toxin" get the point to improve ther country, you need to improve wages and not stop business's from making money.

Sounds like a backwards plan to me

[Martin]

Plachon has pointed out how cheap fuel ruins the environment (and even the Pentagon sees that this will result in the biggest threat yet to world peace). But cheap fuel also ruins countries' economies. We get to depend on it, because subconsciously we have made lifestyle decisions based on fuel costs today. Whenever the price rises, as it inevitably must, a recession is triggered off. But any government anywhere in the world who did what is necessary (probably at least a 50%, yes 50%, rise in fuel prices) would be slung out by the voters at the next election. So they duck the issue.

We are lucky that we have lived and are living in this day and age. Life was a lot tougher for our grandparents and all generations before them. And it will be lot worse for our grandchildren and all generations after them (but there may well not be many of those). How charming.

[PETERTHEEATER]

Er...., I thought vehicle engines consumed the petrol not the gas stations!

[Guest fj2003]

for all these guys of politician please change over to use gas at your car instead of petrol because you have the money and you will not need a laondry if you use it for this cos

he alter mach mal die augen auf und schau mal in die realitaet der welt

dir ist wohl die zeit in den staaten zu kopf gestiegen

back to the roots dosn't call back to middle even

[maerim]

So what if it does 0-60 in 60 seconds

I am more interested in what the stopping time from 60-0 is.

The way the Thai's drive it's usually 0, when they run into an immovable object.

[p_brownstone]

The Thai Government of the time instituted a similar Petrol Station Curfew during the first Oil "Shock" in the early 70's (if I remember correctly the Stations were ordered closed from 10.00 pm until 6.00 am) but they were also ordered closed totally on Saturday and Sunday, the idea then being to discourage Thais’ from their beloved weekend trips up-country.

Unfortunately no-one in power realised that most Consumer Goods in Thailand are transported from farm to market by 10 Wheel Truck, using Diesel fuel, so the first Monday after the Curfew there was a great shortage of every type of fresh food in city Markets.

The main rationale for the Curfew being considered this time is not so much the savings on Fuel consumption - obviously anyone with half a brain would fill up before the Curfew - the savings will come from not having Stations burning electricity all night.

Unfortunately Government control of both Refinery and Retail fuel prices (indirectly - by forcing the State owned PTT to keep prices unrealistically low, so the international Brands must follow suit) means that both Refinery and Retail profit margins, per litre, in Thailand are among the lowest in the world.

Because Refinery margins are so low, most of the Oil Companies insist that franchisees stay open 24 hours a day in order to get as much business as possible for their particular Brand.

24 hour operation puts huge additional costs onto the station owner - which, coupled with the low Retail margins on Fuel sales, is why in recent years there has been such a boom in non-related forecourt business - C Stores, Fast Food joints, Car Washes etc. etc., again exacerbating the consumption of electricity.

'Round and 'round we go!

[lor]

I will be coming to live in Thailand later this year but am getting a little worried about the government, in particular, the Prime Minister. Does he have something about 10 o clock, and wants all Thais to sleep by then? First we had bars, then all entertainment places, now Petrol stations, next TV stations. Maybe someone should suggest to him that all hospitals should close at 10pm too. That would stop people getting sick and save a lot of money running hospitals through the night! and help the nation's health at the same time.

Chris

[thaigene2]

Come on, the gas station early closure is a red herring. They are not stupid enough to think that shutting the stations at 10 will have any impact.

This is more about strategic change and control of civil society. Early bar closures, crack down on long-stay foreigners, silencing the domestic media, intimidating the foreign media, no sign or judicial reforms, tacit backing for foreign businesses cheated by their Thai corporate partners, and floating trial balloons every other day (like buying Liverpool FC with public or lottery money).

Is there long term-strategy that is good for the majority of Thais? In the long run will this be a goog thing or bad thing for Thais and Thailand?

We may think we know the answer..but do we really?

[plachon]

6.  Forecast - stores like 7-eleven will be the next to be curfewed (also a foreign owned multinational)

I think 7-11 is owned by the CP group which is one of Thailands most profitable and successfull companies, owned for the most part by one very wealthy Thai family. No doubt Mr T also has a substantial shareholding in this public company. The use of the 7-11 name is merely a licence and does not indicate ownership by a foreign company.

You're spot on Digger - CP owns the franchise on 7-11s and there's no way Mr Big would try and order those closed before............. before? even lose one minute's trading time per day. Personally, I think they should all be closed immediately for clear breach of advertising standards. I mean, fooling the consumer into thinking they're open from 7.00 am to 11.00pm, then staying open 24/7/365! Wouldn't get away with it anywhere else, bar China. Until such time as they open according to their stated namebrand, I'm giving this store a miss!

[plachon]

Plachon has pointed out how cheap fuel ruins the environment (and even the Pentagon sees that this will result in the biggest threat yet to world peace). But cheap fuel also ruins countries' economies. We get to depend on it, because subconsciously we have made lifestyle decisions based on fuel costs today. Whenever the price rises, as it inevitably must, a recession is triggered off. But any government anywhere in the world who did what is necessary (probably at least a 50%, yes 50%, rise in fuel prices) would be slung out by the voters at the next election. So they duck the issue.

We are lucky that we have lived and are living in this day and age. Life was a lot tougher for our grandparents and all generations before them. And it will be lot worse for our grandchildren and all generations after them (but there may well not be many of those). How charming.

Dunno about the Pentagon saying that, but Dr David King, the UK govt's chief scientist, said in a little publicised statement a few months ago that the US policy on global warming (or rather, lack of it) and addiction to oil was far more of a threat to the world than international terrorism. He was subsequently told to button it by Tony B.liar!

The only way to get people off their oil addiction, is to push up the price of fuel to an unaffordable level, and at the same time, subsidising clean and green alternatives. More bicycle lanes, like they've done in Holland, is a good start. That country is enlightened when it comes to getting people out of their cars, and there are lots of salient lessons to be had in Netherlands. Trust the sensible Dutch!

[maerim]

More bicycle lanes, like they've done in Holland, is a good start. That country is enlightened when it comes to getting people out of their cars, and there are lots of salient lessons to be had in Netherlands. Trust the sensible Dutch!

Very true because as we all know the mountains in the Netherlands are nowhere near as high as the ones round where I live.

[Dutchy]

The only way to get people off their oil addiction, is to push up the price of fuel to an unaffordable level, and at the same time, subsidising clean and green alternatives. More bicycle lanes, like they've done in Holland, is a good start. That country is enlightened when it comes to getting people out of their cars, and there are lots of salient lessons to be had in Netherlands. Trust the sensible Dutch!

Plachon for president!!!

But on a more serious note, there are indeed many things of interest in the Netherlands. But one can on the other not compare the Netherlands with Thailand, the Netherlands are a democracy for instance, Thailand uses a system where people vote for those in power after which those in power won't give a hoot about the electorate.

Thailand needs tax on petrol and a decent government...

Dutchy

[plachon]

The only way to get people off their oil addiction, is to push up the price of fuel to an unaffordable level, and at the same time, subsidising clean and green alternatives. More bicycle lanes, like they've done in Holland, is a good start. That country is enlightened when it comes to getting people out of their cars, and there are lots of salient lessons to be had in Netherlands. Trust the sensible Dutch! 

Plachon for president!!!

But on a more serious note, there are indeed many things of interest in the Netherlands. But one can on the other not compare the Netherlands with Thailand, the Netherlands are a democracy for instance, Thailand uses a system where people vote for those in power after which those in power won't give a hoot about the electorate.

Thailand needs tax on petrol and a decent government...

Dutchy

Dagnabit Dutchy - and I thought you were seroius there for a millisecond! But at least it proves my point about the Dutch being sensible (sometimes too bloody sensible for their own good, but that's another story for another thread).

Still, in an ideal multi-national country, I'd still put a Dutchie in charge of the Transport Ministry. (and a Swede in charge of Defence, a Swiss in Finance, a Dane in Energy, a French in Culture, a German in sport, a Canadian in Labour and a Thai in charge of the Minsitry of Sanuk ). All other Ministries would be banished, but still haven't decided who to install as President (by the way, Brits and Yanks would be banished until they get <deleted> out of Iraq . Any ideas?

(Think I've just started a new thread anyways..

[marquess]

I wonder how much the fuel would really cost, if the government removed the trading restrictions on the Baht?