Dual WAN router that works - at a sensible price?

[Crossy]

I have an Asus RT-88U running the Merlin firmware (V384.13) as my main router.

 

Generally it works pretty well, apart from the dual-WAN function. Whilst it does (eventually) fail-over to the backup connection (an AiS 4G Home WiFi box) it takes a l-o-n-g time during which there is no internet, when failing-back to the main connection it takes a similarly long time (surely that should be instantaneous, both connections are up). It also has the quirk that it shows the working connection as disconnected (backup is correctly shown as hot-standby).

 

Lots of investigation on the various related fora suggests that this is a well known issue and that Asus / Merlin don't seem particularly interested in sorting it.

 

So I'm in the market for a "proper" dual-WAN router, of course I'm not in the market for actually shelling much of my hard-earned wonga. Obviously the beast has to be readily available in Thailand.

 

Thus far I've identified two potential candidates that won't break the bank:- 

 

TP-LINK SafeStream Gigabit Dual-WAN VPN Router (TL-ER6120) at 11,900 Baht 

https://www.invadeit.co.th/product/enterprise-networking/tp-link/safestream-gigabit-dual-wan-vpn-router-tl-er6120-p033756/

https://www.tp-link.com/th/business-networking/vpn-router/tl-er6120/

 

TP-LINK SafeStream Gigabit Dual-WAN VPN Router (TL-ER6020) at 5,900 Baht 

https://www.invadeit.co.th/product/enterprise-networking/tp-link/safestream-gigabit-dual-wan-vpn-router-tl-er6020-p033757/ 

https://www.tp-link.com/th/business-networking/vpn-router/tl-er6020/

 

ZyXEL also have a couple of potential candidates, but they are rather more expensive than I can really justify.

 

I don't need WiFi or buckets of LAN ports, that's already taken care of by the existing network kit.

 

Thoughts, recommendations, ideas?

 

[Tayaout]

If you are a geek you can check if your router support OpenWRT/LEDE firmware. It has a multi WAN script available that might work better than the manufacturer. 

 

https://openwrt.org/docs/guide-user/network/wan/multiwan/mwan3

Edited October 12, 2019 by Tayaout

[Crossy]

25 minutes ago, Tayaout said:

If you are a geek you can check if your router support OpenWRT/LEDE firmware.

 

Thanks. I'm hardly a geek but I'm not averse to a spot of flashing  

 

Sadly it seems neither of my Asus routers is supported by OpenWrt ????

 

My RT-AC66 is supported by Tomato which also has dual-WAN capability, but there seem to be issues there too (possibly Asus hardware related) and the Tomato MultiWAN is apparently still buggy anyway.

 

It's all good fun ????

 

[muratremix]

I have a linksys wrt3200acm model sitting ducks if you're interested (for sale). It works with Openwrt/LEDE and has a powerful cpu / ram and supports dual Wan. It's similar to your AC88U in terms of power and wifi capabilities.

[Crossy]

1 minute ago, muratremix said:

I have a linksys wrt3200acm model sitting ducks if you're interested (for sale). It works with Openwrt/LEDE and has a powerful cpu / ram and supports dual Wan. It's similar to your AC88U in terms of power and wifi capabilities.

 

What sort of numbers are we looking at $$$?

 

PM me if you wish.

[johng]

@Crossy  you might want to take a look at pfsense    https://www.pfsense.org/

 

https://docs.netgate.com/pfsense/en/latest/routing/multi-wan.html

 

or opensense 

https://docs.opnsense.org/manual/how-tos/multiwan.html

[Crossy]

Well, it looks like DD-WRT supports the RT-AC88U and it also now does dual-WAN so maybe, just maybe, I won't actually have to spend any dosh.

 

But it certainly looks like I will have to dust off my Linux skills (such as they were), there was I hoping for a nice simple GUI setup.

 

And of course I have to make all this happen without screwing the internet connection for our guests (and Madam).

 

[maxpower]

Cisco RV325

https://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/products/routers/rv325-dual-gigabit-wan-vpn-router/index.html

[Crossy]

5 minutes ago, maxpower said:

Cisco RV325

https://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/products/routers/rv325-dual-gigabit-wan-vpn-router/index.html

 

Interesting, 8400 Baht (inc VAT) from http://www.itk.co.th/network-switch/loadbalance/rv325-k9-g5 

 

[Tayaout]

1 hour ago, Crossy said:

Well, it looks like DD-WRT supports the RT-AC88U and it also now does dual-WAN so maybe, just maybe, I won't actually have to spend any dosh.

 

But it certainly looks like I will have to dust off my Linux skills (such as they were), there was I hoping for a nice simple GUI setup.

 

And of course I have to make all this happen without screwing the internet connection for our guests (and Madam).

 

I have a lot of experience with Linux and building my own custom router firmware from source. You will definitely screw the internet connection a couple time ????. Better setup a temporary hotspot from your phone.

[ballbreaker]

Cisco also makes the RV320 dual wan router which I think has few LAN ports and will be a few thousand baht cheaper than RV325 mentioned earlier post.

[tjo o tjim]

Ubiquiti EdgeRouter-X should be under 2,000B and can be set up for dual WAN.  
 

But, the expectation of instantaneous failover might be tough to satisfy. You can load balance the two uplinks, but any specific connection is going to take time to detect a failure and switch to the alternate. This is going to be device-independent. 

[Crossy]

9 hours ago, tjo o tjim said:

Ubiquiti EdgeRouter-X should be under 2,000B and can be set up for dual WAN.

 

Another that looks interesting, readily availalble here?

 

I'm not expecting failover to be "instant", it's always going to take time to switch. I would have thought failback would be faster with (almost) no interruption in service.

 

Meanwhile DD-WRT is giving me a headache.

 

EDIT Edgerouter X is 2,850 Baht from Invade. https://www.invadeit.co.th/product/wired-networking/ubiquiti/er-x-edgerouter-x-p034757/

 

[Tayaout]

2 hours ago, Crossy said:

 

Another that looks interesting, readily availalble here?

 

I'm not expecting failover to be "instant", it's always going to take time to switch. I would have thought failback would be faster with (almost) no interruption in service.

 

Meanwhile DD-WRT is giving me a headache.

 

EDIT Edgerouter X is 2,850 Baht from Invade. https://www.invadeit.co.th/product/wired-networking/ubiquiti/er-x-edgerouter-x-p034757/

 

It would be instant if there is a way to bound 2 Ethernet interface together.  Did in the past on a server. Could be done with OpenWRT and proper hardware. 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Link_aggregation

 

Edited October 14, 2019 by Tayaout

[carlyai]

I haven't investigated your problem but I would have thought that you should be able to get instant switchover with a high speed switch.
When I used to work in microwave com (in the old analogue days) you would have 3 communication bearers, one with telephony traffic, one with TV traffic and a protection bearer. If either of the main bearers failed they switched to the protection bearer without dropping out telephony traffic or picture sync.
I know I'm simplifying it, but 2 LAN port outputs thru a high speed switch.

Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk

[tjo o tjim]

Wow, 2,850 for an ER-X!  They are $45-50USD in the US, we have dozens around for testing their (slightly) more expensive equipment. 

The failover takes a few seconds to happen because it is typically ping-based at a 1-second interval, and it takes two failed pings to disable the interface, which puts you at a minimum of 3s. With load balancing instead of just failover you end up with some connections remaining active and some taking time to fail over, although many will push new connections to the proven route. 
 

Another option is a MicroTic RouterBoard. Don’t use them myself, but it is similar to the Ubiquity equipment. 

[thedemon]

On 10/12/2019 at 8:56 AM, johng said:

@Crossy  you might want to take a look at pfsense    https://www.pfsense.org/

 

https://docs.netgate.com/pfsense/en/latest/routing/multi-wan.html

 

or opensense 

https://docs.opnsense.org/manual/how-tos/multiwan.html

I would definitely second the pfSense suggestion.

 

If you have any kind of server or permanently on PC then you can run pfSense as a virtual machine. The only additional hardware you may require is another LAN card for the WAN ports.

 

I have been running pfSense on HyperV as my main router and another 5 instances with permanent VPN connections. They consume very little resources and have had 100% uptime for several years now. I haven't tried Dual Wan but I am sure pfSense could handle that easily.

[RedCardinal]

Draytek is solid, but might be OTT. Not sure on pricing here, but should come in under 10K THB.

 

Synology a dream to use, but again not sure of Thai pricing.

 

Peplink probably crazy money here in LoS.

[Tayaout]

33 minutes ago, RedCardinal said:

Draytek is solid, but might be OTT. Not sure on pricing here, but should come in under 10K THB.

 

Synology a dream to use, but again not sure of Thai pricing.

 

Peplink probably crazy money here in LoS.

The best router I had was Turris Omnia. Probably around 20K in Thailand. 

[wgdanson]

I am no expert, nor am I a PC thickie, but can someone explain to me what all this thread means. What will it let me do that I cannot do on the router I got free from 3BB?

[Peterw42]

7 minutes ago, wgdanson said:

I am no expert, nor am I a PC thickie, but can someone explain to me what all this thread means. What will it let me do that I cannot do on the router I got free from 3BB?

A dual WAN router is a router with 2 internet connections so you have redundancy if one goes off.

Often people will have the wired in internet and a cellular sim as a back-up, all in the same router.

 

You would probably only consider a dual WAN router if your internet has a history of outages and you need to stay connected, running a server, stock trading etc.

[Crossy]

1 hour ago, Peterw42 said:

A dual WAN router is a router with 2 internet connections so you have redundancy if one goes off.

Often people will have the wired in internet and a cellular sim as a back-up, all in the same router.

 

Beat me to it ????

 

That's exactly the situation we have, need to keep a functional internet connection at all times for business purposes.

 

[muratremix]

For business purposes, Speedify can also help. Their SaaS can provide you 0 down time connectivity assuming you have 2 or more connections (3g, 4g, wifi, lan etc)

[carlyai]

Just a couple of novice questions please.
Are most dual input systems failover from sensing a 'ping'?
Can you not reprogram the 'ping' to be less than 1s and failover after 1 failed 'ping'?

Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk

[tjo o tjim]

3 hours ago, carlyai said:

Just a couple of novice questions please.
Are most dual input systems failover from sensing a 'ping'?
Can you not reprogram the 'ping' to be less than 1s and failover after 1 failed 'ping'?

Yes, there are other ways of doing it, working down to lower levels of the network stack. Ping is considered a “layer 3” approach; OSPF and STP are “layer 2” approaches.  The layer 2 solutions are much faster and generally more reliable, but it requires controlling both ends of the connection.  Layer 3 solutions can be blind to the underlying external network.

 

Since ping responses are low priority and times can vary significantly it is generally a bad idea to set the threshold too tight, or to expect a single dropped ping to be a problem.  From a consumer perspective though, it is your best solution.  It just doesn’t work very well for things like phone calls.

[Crossy]

Meanwhile I "think" I have it working with DD-WRT on a spare router. It's currently inserted between the two gateways and the WAN port of my existing router. It does mean I have a double-double NAT but it's working OK (and is easy to remove when it doesn't).

 

I'll leave it like that for a while and if it seems reliable I can move the configuration to my main router.

[muratremix]

On 10/17/2019 at 2:37 PM, RedCardinal said:

Draytek is solid, but might be OTT. Not sure on pricing here, but should come in under 10K THB.

 

Synology a dream to use, but again not sure of Thai pricing.

 

Peplink probably crazy money here in LoS.

synology rt2600ac costs 6,990 baht on lazada. Same price of Amazon + shipping and tax but with 2 years of warranty.

[Tayaout]

9 hours ago, Crossy said:

Meanwhile I "think" I have it working with DD-WRT on a spare router. It's currently inserted between the two gateways and the WAN port of my existing router. It does mean I have a double-double NAT but it's working OK (and is easy to remove when it doesn't).

 

I'll leave it like that for a while and if it seems reliable I can move the configuration to my main router.

Maybe the router has bridge mode. This would disable the double NAT.

Edited October 19, 2019 by Tayaout

[4evermaat]

Amazon.com has some options.

 

 

The shipping estimates all seem to be 45 (including customs estimate).  Would take about 8 days to arrive.

 

Do you really want to spend that time configuring a router?

[tjo o tjim]

1 hour ago, 4evermaat said:

Amazon.com has some options.

Do you really want to spend that time configuring a router?

 

None of those options will prevent you from having to configure the router. ????

 

You should be able to get the EdgeRouter 4 locally as well.  They are good little routers; we have a few balancing 500Mb links and providing VPN services for site-site connections and remote access. But, you have a learning curve that takes trusting another online community.