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Cassava farmers protest Paraquat ban


webfact

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8 minutes ago, Chazar said:

Christ Im seeing the  full wrath of a  fruitcake..................

I would appriciate if you do not feel the need to call me different degrading things, and keep to the discussion instead.
 

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so no staff = dont grow  food ok,  good  plan.

Yes, kind of like a factory producing that can not use environmental och health endangering product in their production.

The same factory can produce and serve 450 custormers with only family members and ownership. If they want to make more money and higher production they have to emplot staff.

A factory is a business, same like farming is a business, Just in Thailand that small and medium farming is not registered as one.

Never said don´t grow, but you have to start see it out of a business perspective.

 

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11 minutes ago, Chazar said:

in paraquats  case because it was being used for suicide, the main cause of deaths.

In the west they added a vomiting agent and several other safeguard so hardly a good reason to ban it if it was that good. 

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14 minutes ago, Chazar said:

in paraquats  case because it was being used for suicide, the main cause of deaths.

Pretty sure that was not the reason. That due to there are other same effective substances still available. Like we should soon see a ban on sleeping pills and valium.

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Joel Salatin explain well the issue with farmer that believe petrochemical marketing push. Their obstination to resist change and thinking outside the box keep them poor. 

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18 hours ago, webfact said:

Vashira asked the deputy minister to stop claiming that the chemical is dangerous to people and citing incorrect information from Non-Government Organisations (NGOs).

And all the information gained from all the other countries around the globe who have investigated, tested, submitted detailed health reports and banned it on the evidence that it is dangerous are all wrong?

Thainess at it's finest!

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11 hours ago, farmerjo said:

No it was because of ill informed people like yourself thinking your doing the world a favour.

 

Stupid argument, the experts don't know it you know better. While you have a big benefit from it. I would say your as trustworth as the chemical companies who sell the stuff. 

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23 minutes ago, robblok said:

Stupid argument, the experts don't know it you know better. While you have a big benefit from it. I would say your as trustworth as the chemical companies who sell the stuff. 

The facts are it is used in nearly the double amount of countries than it's not.

The facts are there must be a lot of mental health issues in the countries that it has been banned.(mostly EU countries)

The facts are it is being phased out in countries as suitable replacements are found.

 

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2 hours ago, Tayaout said:

Joel Salatin explain well the issue with farmer that believe petrochemical marketing push. Their obstination to resist change and thinking outside the box keep them poor. 

Exactly. The low income society in Thailand is built on: "I´ve been doing like this all the time, and I have no clue how to change that"

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2 minutes ago, Matzzon said:

Exactly. The low income society in Thailand is built on: "I´ve been doing like this all the time, and I have no clue how to change that"

He is referring mainly about the US farmers but the principle remains the same everywhere. 

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7 minutes ago, Matzzon said:

The low income society in Thailand

The EU banned these chemicals and cannot grow enough food for their demand.

Now they want 3rd world countries to supply clean,green food cheap so it's not to expensive for their consumers,at somchai's expense.

Somchai has turned around and said i can do that at long as you find me a way that doesn't hurt my very short pockets. 

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It's hard to take away things that we think benefit us once we realize there is something dangerous about them. That's why the environmentalists face so much anger from those who have grown accustom to environmentally unfriendly things that make their lives easier and better. It's a human reaction. Try taking smartphones away from kids. Even cigarettes and alcohol linger on despite killing millions. Most farmers in Thailand really have no future because they just have too little land for what they grow. Half of the present number farming will be gone in 30 years with their land sold to others who can easily handle more land with the tech that is available. You can't live on 10-20 rai of rice land these days. Although some have much more rai, there are plenty who hold onto that little bit of land getting by doing odd jobs. Their kids have all left for the cities, and those kids also help their farmer parents. For many, just being able to say they have a patch of rice land they get their own rice from has become more about pride than any profit. To make a living off so little land, a person really has to be creative and have a green thumb for growing things other than cassava and rice.

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I came on to enlighten the non farmers why chemicals used in there right way are a very good tool for farmers.

In the article they pass all the required criteria,regulations of using the non selective herbicide.

I know i haven't won any friends on this subject but i bet a lot more non farming people who have read through the subject actually know now why it was banned in countries and will be banned in more.

 

 

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14 hours ago, farmerjo said:

You did not bring one bit of substance here to the article in facts.

My plants are growing and need oxygen to thrive and your taking that away from them.

Your plants need CO2 and the govt and this person is contributing plenty lol 😂

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3 hours ago, farmerjo said:

The EU banned these chemicals and cannot grow enough food for their demand.

Now they want 3rd world countries to supply clean,green food cheap so it's not to expensive for their consumers,at somchai's expense.

Somchai has turned around and said i can do that at long as you find me a way that doesn't hurt my very short pockets. 

Just to wierd! Then I guess that Somchai need to grow a backbone and tell the rest of the world to farm it themselfs or pay the price he asks.

A business can not hurt the person who is running it, if he takes control of the outs and ins of it. After that we always have the crazy concept in Thailand that if neighbour Somchai is farming cassava, I need to do that to. That leads at the end to an uncontrollable over production. In that case there can be no control of outs and ins. There they need to learn to stabalize the market that sets the two parameters of supply and demand. In other words a lot of Somchai´s is going to have to re-evaluate their stance in the market a find a business that gives them the possibility to control the outs and ins.

Today they are running their operations without registered companies, no control over the spendings and allowing themselfs to get run over by the big truck called distributor and over production.

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8 hours ago, Matzzon said:


A business can not hurt the person who is running it, if he takes control of the outs and ins of it.

A farmer can control the inputs and most farmers do ,they have no control of the outputs , especially the price they receive for they crop ,they is no future markets in Thailand for crops ,it is now  mid October our local sugar mill is due to open in about one months time ,asking farmers how much he will get for they crop no one knows ,about the only thing is certain the government is helping to the tune of 50 baht/ton, sugar cane is a 3/4 year crop ,5 years ago cane price was very good 1000 baht/ton very happy growers then the price dropped  to 750-800 baht/ton for 3 years  farmers had no chose but to except that price .

Last year cassava price was good  2.50  baht/kg this year with the drought and lower yields  who knows most say a lower price  ,again know one knows until harvest time then the farmers have know chose but to get what they can , and it is the crop buyers/middle men who make the money ,farmers  to them are just a sauce money for a new Merk,SUV.  

The government will help sugar cane farmers, as molasses a by-product of sugar cane, is used to make ethyl alcohol , which is then used to make gasohol ,if world crude oil prices rise the government will help cassava farmers as well , cassava is used to make ethanol alcohol. 

That is why they has been a big increase in both crops over the past few years ,so all of us can put cheap fuel in our cars,motorbikes etc. 

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20 minutes ago, kickstart said:

A farmer can control the inputs and most farmers do ,they have no control of the outputs , especially the price they receive for they crop ,they is no future markets in Thailand for crops ,it is now  mid October our local sugar mill is due to open in about one months time ,asking farmers how much he will get for they crop no one knows ,about the only thing is certain the government is helping to the tune of 50 baht/ton, sugar cane is a 3/4 year crop ,5 years ago cane price was very good 1000 baht/ton very happy growers then the price dropped  to 750-800 baht/ton for 3 years  farmers had no chose but to except that price .

Last year cassava price was good  2.50  baht/kg this year with the drought and lower yields  who knows most say a lower price  ,again know one knows until harvest time then the farmers have know chose but to get what they can , and it is the crop buyers/middle men who make the money ,farmers  to them are just a sauce money for a new Merk,SUV.  

The government will help sugar cane farmers, as molasses a by-product of sugar cane, is used to make ethyl alcohol , which is then used to make gasohol ,if world crude oil prices rise the government will help cassava farmers as well , cassava is used to make ethanol alcohol. 

That is why they has been a big increase in both crops over the past few years ,so all of us can put cheap fuel in our cars,motorbikes etc. 

If yields are down that would mean lower supply if demand is up then prices should be higher or you would think

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15 hours ago, Matzzon said:

I would appriciate if you do not feel the need to call me different degrading things, and keep to the discussion instead.

You offer  no solution thats workable, you have no idea how  hard it is to get staff (which you have admitted) to  pull weeds yet tell me I mustnt use paraquat, that leaves one alternative, dont grow any food..............so I dont think  calling you a  fruitcake is degrading as you offer no other option.

For over 5  years we used no weedkillers, then the Burmese who replaced the Thais as Thais were to lazy didnt want to do weed  pulling either, so now we have no weed pullers and are left with only weed  killers or stop growing anything. Paraquat is not proven carcinogenic there are hints a lot of use leads to Parkinsons, Paraquats  main reason for being banned WORLDWIDE was SUICIDE.

Even if  you pay them 500 a  day they aint interested in pulling weeds

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15 hours ago, Matzzon said:

Pretty sure that was not the reason. That due to there are other same effective substances still available. Like we should soon see a ban on sleeping pills and valium.

it was the reason

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15 hours ago, Tayaout said:

In the west they added a vomiting agent and several other safeguard so hardly a good reason to ban it if it was that good. 

Once youve  swallowed it  neat its most likely already to late as it  will be destroying everything it touches even vomiting it out will have little effect

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15 minutes ago, farmerjo said:

We did some calculations in another section.

Close estimates of how a Thai farms.

paraquat = 160 baht/rai

organic alternative = 2200 baht/rai 

its  ok  like Gunther whatshername they wont mind paying that new price to save the planet, heck Ill do it if youll pay, the way things are going wont be able to find anyone to spray it anyway finding any staff now is getting to be a nightmare...............plenty happy to sit around doing  <deleted>  all all day though, no end of candidates for that.

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47 minutes ago, kickstart said:

A farmer can control the inputs and most farmers do ,they have no control of the outputs , especially the price they receive for they crop ,they is no future markets in Thailand for crops ,it is now  mid October our local sugar mill is due to open in about one months time ,asking farmers how much he will get for they crop no one knows ,about the only thing is certain the government is helping to the tune of 50 baht/ton, sugar cane is a 3/4 year crop ,5 years ago cane price was very good 1000 baht/ton very happy growers then the price dropped  to 750-800 baht/ton for 3 years  farmers had no chose but to except that price .

Last year cassava price was good  2.50  baht/kg this year with the drought and lower yields  who knows most say a lower price  ,again know one knows until harvest time then the farmers have know chose but to get what they can , and it is the crop buyers/middle men who make the money ,farmers  to them are just a sauce money for a new Merk,SUV.  

The government will help sugar cane farmers, as molasses a by-product of sugar cane, is used to make ethyl alcohol , which is then used to make gasohol ,if world crude oil prices rise the government will help cassava farmers as well , cassava is used to make ethanol alcohol. 

That is why they has been a big increase in both crops over the past few years ,so all of us can put cheap fuel in our cars,motorbikes etc. 

Yes, everything is right. Does that have anything to do with the ban of paraquat? No, not at all. That only have to do with poor organisation and farmers that do not stand up regarding the things they really need. Instead they stand up and fight the wrong war to be able to use a poison that is unhealthy both to nature, the food chain and humans.

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3 minutes ago, Chazar said:

Its ONE extremely mild degrading thing.

Thank you for understanding. It doesn´t matter if it´s one or 20 and you do not get the right to chose the degree of the one thing. That is owned by the reciever.

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27 minutes ago, Chazar said:

You offer  no solution thats workable, you have no idea how  hard it is to get staff (which you have admitted) to  pull weeds yet tell me I mustnt use paraquat, that leaves one alternative, dont grow any food..............so I dont think  calling you a  fruitcake is degrading as you offer no other option.

For over 5  years we used no weedkillers, then the Burmese who replaced the Thais as Thais were to lazy didnt want to do weed  pulling either, so now we have no weed pullers and are left with only weed  killers or stop growing anything. Paraquat is not proven carcinogenic there are hints a lot of use leads to Parkinsons, Paraquats  main reason for being banned WORLDWIDE was SUICIDE.

Even if  you pay them 500 a  day they aint interested in pulling weeds

So, that means if a person in a shop can not offer you what you want, you have the right to call them what you want? Get a grip.

I do not have to offer a solution, I leave that to the farmers. There is still not an option to continue to use a chemical that endangers health and nature.

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15 minutes ago, farmerjo said:

Serious,do you get paid by TV to be a clown. 

Ok, tell me then. Why would I need to offer a solution? Is that just because I have an opinion that to poison people and nature is wrong? An opinon that is shared by many people.

Please also answer why you feel the need to call me a clown because we have different opinions in a discussion?

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10 minutes ago, farmerjo said:

Serious,do you get paid by TV to be a clown. 

steady Ive already used fruitcake and I dont have that right, Im going to "ban" myself before the mods do it for me. 

Im deeply  offended by the "get a grip" though

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