Settlement Visa Refusal

[nick020773]

advice required ???

today my wife picked up her package from the vfs to be confronted by a refusal notice but i believe the refusal was due to the package not been looked at and would like some advice

now it initially starts of by saying and i quote as my wife emailed me the refusal notice

Your application has been considered on papers and documents submitted and with an interview .

there was no interview the application was only submitted last monday and on tracking the application told to collect from vfs last friday ??

they then say they think we could not live together without any recourse to public funds ?

because

apparently the only evidence submitted which was bank statements sometimes show a very small balance which they noted and also that my wife claimed that that i earned £32,000 per annum and have offered no corrubitive evidence to prove this.

now my package was all very neat with an index as to where to find everything and i had letters from my employer stating my average salary and also 10 month worth of origional pay slips showing my weekly pay and to top it off they could have seen on my bank statements that my salary was going in every week also.

these are the only points made to refuse this settlement visa and am wondering on any of your suggestions please

nick

[buriramboy]

earning 32k a year would not entitle you to any public funds that i can think of, so i don't understand their arguement there, in all honesty it sounds like maybe they mixed your wifes application up with someone elses. Anyway get your appeal in straight away, also mentioning that no interview took place.

BB

[markr]

You must contact them asap, give the ECM a call at the embassy pronto!

They may well have mixed your's up with someone else's also check the passport for a visa! sounds stupid i know, but you may well have just got someones refusal letter

Goodluck

Mark

[atlastaname]

You have been selective in posting the refusal notice so are you sure there is nothing else in it ?If not type an e-mail to the ECM now and call tomorrow morning uk time (early pm Bangkok time is always good for getting the ECM in my experience ) to explain why you think the papers may have been mixed up. Talk it through with the ECM and you should soon get to the bottom of it. Let us know what happened

[Mossfinn]

Nick,

There has been a few dodgy calls recently including the wrong name on the refusal of the applicant!

get on the phone and start making some in-roads asap.

Apart from contacting Scouse, there isn't much else to say, appeal or re-submit, not sure on the timing of each and which would be quicker.

It is obviously wrong, as in the refusal statement, not actual decision as we don't know all the facts.

You appear to have submitted a carefully planned doc, did it fulfill the criteria stated on the Embassy advice notices.

Good Luck

Moss

[the scouser]

Nick,

Before you do anything else, make sure that your wife's appeal is submitted before the 28-day deadline. You don't have to go into detail on the form as you will be given the opportunity later to substantiate your case, if required.

Having made the appeal, write to UK Visas complaints section setting out the reasons why you believe the decision to refuse your wife's visa is flawed, and asking that the decision be overturned now as it would be punitive to make your wife wait until such a time as the appeal is heard (probably 5-6 months). I have successfully managed to get several adverse decisions overturned by making representations through UK Visas, so it is possible. Should you be sucessful, it is then a simple matter to withdraw the outstanding appeal.

Scouse.

[the scouser]

Nick,

I've just had a look at your previous posts, and now recall you as the chap who was accused of attempting to facilitate your wife's entry to the U.K. when she applied as a visitor. This may still be a factor in the embassy's reasoning, but I would need to know the full background details before being able to give authoritative advice.

Scouse.

[Mossfinn]

I have successfully managed to get several adverse decisions overturned by making representations through UK Visas, so it is possible.

Scouse.

These are the operative words of the responses so far Nick.

Good Luck

Moss

[atlastaname]

I have successfully managed to get several adverse decisions overturned by making representations through UK Visas, so it is possible.

Scouse.

These are the operative words of the responses so far Nick.

Good Luck

Moss

NO actually Moss they are not .... and this is why....

Bearing in mind that the OP is suggesting that his application MAY have got mixed up with another (however unlikely i think this is, it is possible) and bearing in mind that UK Visas aim to reply within about 3 weeks (from their website) and given that the appeal can be submitted up to 28 days after, the correct sequence of events is as follows

1) Contact by e-mail today and phone in person tomorrow the ECM in Bangkok explaining the discrepancies and why he thinks the application may have been mixed up (this will be very quickly established one way or another) .... then

2) and 3) simultaneously contact UK Visas and lodge the appeal if the ECM proves unhelpful

Cheers

Atlas

[nick020773]

hi

i fully intend to ring the ecm in the morning but through past experiece they always tell me that everyone is interviewing and cannot take your call . when i ask when is a good time they promptly tell me that i must email and await a response ??

we cant talk to our own embassy officials now

i can also state i have not missed anything out of the refusal letter and still believe as the scouser rightly states about my last posts that it has something to do with my wifes past refusal for a visitor visa.

but in the settlement visa i sent the old paperwork from th vv refusal with a very documented letter stating all the refusal points they made were fullfilled ie going back to thailand and getting married in the time frame i mentioned and these points stated were not mentioned as i think i covered them well enough.

i have emailed the ecm but i have noticed on the refusal notice it has a stamp saying reviewed and clearly states ecm does this mean the ecm has verified and justified the refusal ?

all been said they clearly state my wife had an interview and didnt and that i never gave anymore evidence stating my icome like i previously said of which as origionally said i must have sent at least 10 months of weekly wage slips showing weekly take home of anywhere between £400 - £800 weekly ???

nick

[Mossfinn]

NO actually Moss they are not .... and this is why....

Actually Alas, they are Old Boy!

The thread consistently refers to telephone calls and e-mails, good advice both, also there are several responses regarding getting the appeal process together, also good advice, but as there would appear to a possible complication, then I would still suggest that they are the operative words.

After the telephone calls, e-mails and possible appeal process, I bet it will not be cleared up, I hope I am wrong.

Good Luck, Nick

Moss

[atlastaname]

Now Nick has added several bits of crucial info the situation has changed somewhat. You can only advise on what is posted ... seems like there is more to this than was originally posted by far. Would still be worth phoning ( you will get through if you keep onto it ... early afternoon BKK time is best i find) if only to clear up why they say she had an interview. However it looks like you are in for the long slog so its steps 2 and 3 then.

[Mossfinn]

Now Nick has added several bits of crucial info the situation has changed somewhat. You can only advise on what is posted ... seems like there is more to this than was originally posted by far. Would still be worth phoning ( you will get through if you keep onto it ... early afternoon BKK time is best i find) if only to clear up why they say she had an interview. However it looks like you are in for the long slog so its steps 2 and 3 then.

The clues were actually there earlier, but as this is nearest we will get to agreeing, I think it is up to Nick now to decide his next set of moves.

But you are right, it could be a long slog ahead.

Good Luck

Moss

[Chris.B]

i fully intend to ring the ecm in the morning but through past experiece they always tell me that everyone is interviewing and cannot take your call . when i ask when is a good time they promptly tell me that i must email and await a response ??

Send them a fax then, much better than an email. Mark it URGENT in large letters. Here is their fax number:- Fax: +66 (0) 2 254 9579

Edited March 26, 2007 by Chris.B

[nick020773]

i wold like to know what crucial information i seem to have added on my last post as i seem to be lost now ???

yes we had a previous application that the scouser is aware of but i am sure somewhere that a previous application is not allowed to be predudice to the new one ???

maybe i am wrong

anyway like i said no points from the old application have been brought up they seem to have found a new point mite i add with a interview that didnt happen how can they do this

nick

[the scouser]

They write the refusal notices from a standard template, so I would hazard a guess that the refusing visa officer simply forgot to amend it to read that your wife didn't have an interview.

Each application should be treated on its own merits. However, if they had reason to doubt the genuiness of your relationship at the visit visa stage, it is likely that any misgivings will be carried forward to any subsequent application unless you have done something to assuage them.

Certainly, getting married in order to circumvent a visit visa refusal is no panacea. Only you know the true circumstances of your relationship, and on the assumption that they are genuine, there is no reason why you should not make your representations to UK Visas complaints section.

Scouse.

[nick020773]

well after getting nowhere by telephone this morning apart from conformation that they had received my email sent yesterday as i suspected ?

which is best to send the appeal to loughborough or back to the embassy in bkk ?

nick

[the scouser]

Send the appeal papers to Loughborough, either by fax or by recorded delivery post.

Scouse.

[atlastaname]

well after getting nowhere by telephone this morning apart from conformation that they had received my email sent yesterday as i suspected ?

which is best to send the appeal to loughborough or back to the embassy in bkk ?

nick

Nick,

Its true that it sounds like you are going to have to contact UK Visas about this as well as lodge your appeal. But before you can really lay into UK Visas you need to know a few things . You need to know why they say you submitted NO corroborating evidence of your income when you say you did . I mean this is a huge discrepancy , either you did or you didn't. Have they lost them ? We had a case recently where this was alleged so its possible. Only you know for sure what you submitted. But in order to lambast UK Visas and make a strong case you have to know the answer. The bit about them saying you had an interview is likely to be the ECO's error (THEY are allowed to make errors ..you aren't) in not amending the form as said above. Its still a point to clear up though as its extra ammunition to fire at UK Visas...albeit more minor. When my ex-partner had a refusal in 1997 the ECO made several VERY small errors in the refusal notice but i listed them all and the ECM agreed that the ECO couldn't have looked carefully enough and overturned the refusal. So it can help . That was with a reasonable ECM , unfortunately i believe MS Aleyne Howerd now deals with them and she is famous for never overturning refusals . Had no dealings with Gerry Grant who also is ECM .

You say you did speak with the Embassy this morning , but you don't say who with or if you asked about the discrepancies.? I don't know you so don't know your character but when dealing with the Embassy and UK Visas for that matter , timidity will get you no-where. If the ECM is not available you ring and ring again until they are . The cost of calling Thailand nowadays is so cheap its laughable (several 1p and 2p a minute access numbers). There is no excuse for not getting the answers you need in order to fully understand the refusal thus be able to put your best case to UK Visas.

You could be in for a long haul anyway , but if you don't get the answers and tackle UK Visas quickly then you CERTAINLY are in for the long haul.

Good luck

Atlas

[nick020773]

i can confirm that my wage slips for a least 10 months were all submitted with the last one from only maybe 3 weeks ago showing my gross to date been around £29,000 also in the same place was a letter from my employer stating my salary details pay frequency and time with employer usual stuuf.

this was all neatly indexed in the front of the folder as to where the eco could find this information

as far as the appeal does my wife need to sign the papers then fax to me then i can fill in the particulars as i have seen the copies that she has emailed me and i am a little confused by it all ??

thanks

nick

[atlastaname]

In light of your above comment Nick , its all the more baffling.

HOWEVER it appears that you don't want , for some reason , to tackle them about it at all(!!) and seem resigned to the appeal . I think thats wrong , but its your choice. You got a long wait ahead of you , you might just get her the visa by the very end of this year if you win.

If it was me i would appeal yes , but be going at them day and night to expose their error in saying no evidence was submitted when it sounds like you did exactly what you should do ,(you can offer to re-submit the wage slips) and liasing with UK Visas as well by e-mail AND by phone. Also go to see your MP because IF this is all as you say , then its wrongly refused on the evidence point and you say there was really no other point in the refusal notice. MP's do have contacts if they feel strongly enough about an injustice. If this refusal relates in any way to your previous difficulties then it should have been in the refusal notice and you say it wasn't.

Doing all of the above will not damage your appeal at all , and may avoid you having to wait until the very end of this year . But its your call ....

[nick020773]

hi again,

i am very confused now i require some advice on the appeal paperwork

does my wife have to sign the paperwork as it seems to state she only signs if she if doing the appeal herself ?

on the other side i have sent a fax to the embassy today and will follow up in the morning with another call and email and i will pesture them until they are sick of me as this has been a very unjust descision ??

nick

[Andrew Hicks]

i wold like to know what crucial information i seem to have added on my last post as i seem to be lost now ???

yes we had a previous application that the scouser is aware of but i am sure somewhere that a previous application is not allowed to be predudice to the new one ???

maybe i am wrong

anyway like i said no points from the old application have been brought up they seem to have found a new point mite i add with a interview that didnt happen how can they do this

nick

Nick,

It must surely be a mistake that will be cleared up.

The previous refusal should not be the reason. Your right to a fair hearing requires that you are told the actual reasons for refusal. At an appeal, you would rebut the allegations in the refusal statement and they could not breathe a word about the previous refusal. Accordingly you would win.

Have a look at 'The Hicks Report' that I have just posted in case there's anything in it that could be helpful.

Choke dee, mate.

Andrew Hicks

[nick020773]

update ,

after numerouse phone calls to the embassy the ecm has always been to busy to answer my calls ??

i have also sent emails and a fax marked urgen but to no avail ?

i have now contacted my mp and am awaiting a response for him who also will be chased everyday as i dont see why i should let this drop.

i have had all the appeal forms faxed to me by my wife which with everything else i must still start the process but i am unsure as to wether it needs my wifes signature as under the appealant declaration it states only fill this part if you complete the form yourself ?

so if i am right in my thinking i sign as the representative ( sponsor ) and that is ok ??

i hope someone can answer my question as i dont want to get this wrong ??

thanks

nick

[the scouser]

You can sign it on behalf of your wife. Unless you have instructed an adviser/solicitor tick the "no" box for whether you have a representative; you can always change this later if you do instruct a brief. Also, you can enter your wife's address as c/o your own, and that way, you'll get the papers quicker than if they are sent to her home in Thailand.

Scouse.

[nick020773]

just an update

after numeous attempts to phone the embassy and emails and a fax i received a response which was stated they conceded the fact there was no interview but he decision would be upheld it was very brief.

anyway in the meantime i have been to the IAS who have taken on my appeal for me and have lodged the appeal so now it seems i have to play the waiting game which i believe can take upto 6 months.

so am now preparing my next hols to LOS

nick

[mikeybee]

Well nick i,am in the same position as you and will let you no how i get on and pass any info on to you, but for now it's a waiting game so don't get to down and just think about the trip to los as it keeps me smiling.

goodluck

mikeybee