The Foreign English Teacher Scam Explained. (Part 2)

[Don Wood]

Language Schools/Agents.

 

                       Abuse of work permits explained. To work in a government or private school as a teacher requires a degree.To work in a language school does not require a degree. The language school gets a work permit that only allows the language instructor to work in the language school. The language school then tells the language instructor that it is okay to work anywhere. This is a lie. The work permit only allows someone to work at the address written in the work permit. The address is of course written in Thai. The language school then sends the language instructor off to work in a government or private school. This is illegal, so the language instructor by default, is uninsured. Work permits do allow for a second place of employment but if it is in a government or private school the teacher is required to have a degree. This type of work permit scam is becoming more common and tourist "teachers" are targeted because they are usually unaware of the laws involving work permits and qualification requirements. Maybe if labor office officials bothered to check government and private school teacher's work permits at their place of work it might stop this abuse. Still, it would only be the fake foreign "teacher" getting caught and not the dodgy scamming language school owner. Last year a fake foreign teacher slipped on some wet tiles in a government school during the rainy season and badly broke his leg. He thought he was insured. He was mistaken. 

 

               

[NightSky]

Welcome to the jungle

 

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[ericthai]

Teachers in Thailand have been abused for decades.

I feel bad for the students that are getting poor education by untrained teachers. 

Until the govt gets serious and dumps money into the education system, nothing will change. 

[ThomasThBKK]

On 12/12/2019 at 6:59 PM, Don Wood said:

The language school then tells the language instructor that it is okay to work anywhere. This is a lie. The work permit only allows someone to work at the address written in the work permit. The address is of course written in Thai. The language school then sends the language instructor off to work in a government or private school. This is illegal, so the language instructor by default, is uninsured. Work permits do allow for a second place of employment but if it is in a government or private school the teacher is required to have a degree.

 

No, in general with a work permit you can work wherever you want. This has been changed last year in the emergency decree. 
You can totally work in every profession that allows foreign work if you have one, no matter what - the only issue here is that you need to have degree to teach at a school, that's unrelated to the wp.

 

Quote

However, and very significantly, Section 37 of Decree No. 2 repealed Sections 70, 71, 72 and 73 of Decree No. 1. Furthermore, Section 28 of Decree No. 2 provides that a work permit holder may engage in any work that is not specifically prohibited to all foreigners on the “Official List” of work prohibited to foreigners. The Official List outlines, the limited number of activities for which a foreigner cannot obtain work permission for in any case. (The current Official List is the same as was last issued under the Act. However, the Official List is being revised and we detail such in part three of this series once the revision is complete.)

 

As a consequence, any foreigner who has a work permit in Thailand may now, work anywhere, for anyone, and do any type work, that is not excluded by the Official List.

https://duensingkippen.com/thailandbusinesslawblog/?p=270

[Isaanbiker]

On 12/20/2019 at 12:29 AM, ericthai said:

Teachers in Thailand have been abused for decades.

I feel bad for the students that are getting poor education by untrained teachers. 

Until the govt gets serious and dumps money into the education system, nothing will change. 

Get rid of agencies that supply their foreign teachers " who don't need a degree" in the first place, with a dodgy one made by the agency.

 

Please have a look at ajarn.com, many agencies advertise that a degree isn't needed.

 

The truth is that they do need a degree to get them a work permit and the right type of visa.  

 

Schools usually take the cheapest agency, and these are usually the ones who do not offer any insurance, they don't pay for sick leave, no business days, and they often only pay a nine months salary.

 

Then they're sent on a visa run. If anything goes wrong, the agency knows nothing.

 

 Please get rid of them first, then start to change the Thai education system with people who know what they are doing. 

 

 "Untrained teachers"? How many trained foreign teachers have you met?

These days you can see "native speakers" from Hungary, Russia and other countries.

 

Being white alone might fill a position, but I feel very sorry for the poor students. 

 

  Unfortunately, do many people believe that speaking a language alone makes somebody a teacher.

 

Nah, there's more behind being a teacher, especially a successful one. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

   

 

 

 

 

[Isaanbiker]

On 12/20/2019 at 12:48 AM, ThomasThBKK said:

 

No, in general with a work permit you can work wherever you want. This has been changed last year in the emergency decree. 
You can totally work in every profession that allows foreign work if you have one, no matter what - the only issue here is that you need to have degree to teach at a school, that's unrelated to the wp.

 

https://duensingkippen.com/thailandbusinesslawblog/?p=270

No, in general with a work permit you can work wherever you want. This has been changed last year in the emergency decree. 
You can totally work in every profession that allows foreign work if you have one, no matter what - the only issue here is that you need to have degree to teach at a school, that's unrelated to the wp.

 

You can't work wherever you want. If a degree is unrelated to a work permit, what else does the Labor Department want to see?

 

 

[Isaanbiker]

Last year a fake foreign teacher slipped on some wet tiles in a government school during the rainy season and badly broke his leg. He thought he was insured. He was mistaken. 

 

    "A fake foreign teacher"? The labor laws stipulate that all government schools have to insure their foreign teachers through the Thai social security.

 

  It's usually 750 baht for the employer and the same amount for the employee. That should start from day one.

 

Please read the Thai labor law regarding teachers at government schools.

 

  What are fake teachers? Fake degrees, or fake smiles? 

 

[puchooay]

20 hours ago, Isaanbiker said:

Last year a fake foreign teacher slipped on some wet tiles in a government school during the rainy season and badly broke his leg. He thought he was insured. He was mistaken. 

 

    "A fake foreign teacher"? The labor laws stipulate that all government schools have to insure their foreign teachers through the Thai social security.

 

  It's usually 750 baht for the employer and the same amount for the employee. That should start from day one.

 

Please read the Thai labor law regarding teachers at government schools.

 

  What are fake teachers? Fake degrees, or fake smiles? 

 

Insurance via Thai social security is not the same as accident insurance. Teachers should have both.

[Isaanbiker]

On 1/22/2020 at 7:26 PM, puchooay said:

Insurance via Thai social security is not the same as accident insurance. Teachers should have both.

Nope. Thai Social Security covers all, including accidents, medicine, hospital fees, etc.

 

   Why would you need an extra  accident insurance? 

 

   Agencies who only offer a cheap accident insurance that cover only 10 to 20 K, are as useless as the Corona virus. 

 

I had a bike accident and my motorbike insurance only covered 12 K, the other 95 k were paid by my social security.

 

The labor law states that all foreign teachers should have the Thai social security.

 

But that costs money. The reality is that these teachers will lose their jobs and replaced, once they're absent for more than a week. 

 

   They only have a chance to come back if there's a shortage of teachers.

 

But these days, you can find "experienced teachers" from all over the world.

 

 Native English teachers from Aserbaidschan, etc...

 

 

[puchooay]

15 hours ago, Isaanbiker said:

Nope. Thai Social Security covers all, including accidents, medicine, hospital fees, etc.

 

   Why would you need an extra  accident insurance? 

 

   Agencies who only offer a cheap accident insurance that cover only 10 to 20 K, are as useless as the Corona virus. 

 

I had a bike accident and my motorbike insurance only covered 12 K, the other 95 k were paid by my social security.

 

The labor law states that all foreign teachers should have the Thai social security.

 

But that costs money. The reality is that these teachers will lose their jobs and replaced, once they're absent for more than a week. 

 

   They only have a chance to come back if there's a shortage of teachers.

 

But these days, you can find "experienced teachers" from all over the world.

 

 Native English teachers from Aserbaidschan, etc...

 

 

Thai social security does not cover all. In case of an accident you need to make sure you are covered for loss of earnings, damage to property and the likes and that you can go to another hospital for treatment if the hospital stated on your TSS card can not treat you.

 

I have read that you are a keen motorcycle rider. Then, why did you not know that regular motorcycle insurance is very low cover? It is only "Por Ror Bor" that covers you for personal injury. You really should have known that.

 

With regards to your posts, you seem to be living off past experiences, that you also had under a different online guises. Just because a school director initially refused to offer you Thai Social Security does not mean they all do. Just because you had a bad experience with an agency does not mean that they are all bad.

 

In 21 years of teaching I have had direct hires and agency hires. Good and bad experiences with both, mainly good. Every job had it's good points and bad. One needs to look at all aspects of a contract, not just TSS and length of contract.

 

My best ever job from a financial aspect was one of the worst work wise. I had 13 months salary, a new year bonus of 1 month was paid. I had most of March, all of April and 10 days of May off with full pay and also all of October. No social security but private health and accident cover. Free meals, no extra evening or weekend work. I left as the job became tiresome because of the lack of back up from management and department leaders. I left and went to and agency job. 10 months contract, no social security but a great fun job.

 

In short, one should not instantly turn their back on a job offer simply on one or two counts. Explore the offer correctly and thoroughly. Thai Social Security is good but restrictive, only one hospital can be used is one example. I find it hard to believe that anyone living in Thailand full time would not have thought of taking private health care out as a priority. Therefore negating the need for TSS. It's not the retirement package of 1000 baht a month you are relying on, is it?

Edited January 26, 2020 by puchooay

[WonnabeBiker]

On 12/20/2019 at 12:29 AM, ericthai said:

Teachers in Thailand have been abused for decades.

I feel bad for the students that are getting poor education by untrained teachers. 

Until the govt gets serious and dumps money into the education system, nothing will change. 

Quick! Which other country spends 4% of GDP on education?!? OTOH, there are lots of crazily wasteful bureaucratic oddities in Thailand. Complete schools without students included. Some 12,000 oversears, and silly local rules (allowing the worst students to obtain passing grades, thus rendering the whole system worthless from an international perspective. (Yers, there are fantastic Thai students and teachers. The latter must start at about 10 grand, although they would beat many foreign teachers if they had a chance to compete fairly. Alas, Thailand thinks that someone's passport is an idicator of English ability.

 

Years ago, there were countless African teachers. They have almost disappeared. And clever direct-hires give dodgy applicants a different job description. I had a colleague, 67 without a degree. No Krusapha or fingerprinting for  h i m.