Australian pensioners $750 ???

[samran]

21 hours ago, emptypockets said:

And SFA for the working man who has to pay taxes to support the mob of bludgers.

They are forecasting that the unemployment rate is going to go from 5% to 15% this month. Most of the 'bludgers' you are talking about were working this time last month.

 

At this point in time, if you are a working man still, count yourself lucky and stop being such a tight@rse.

[marquis22]

10 hours ago, Will27 said:

The real question is, do you live in Australia?

 

Yes, for at least 6 months of the year. Maybe less in the future if Jetstar do not resume flights from Bkk to Melb????

I was not wanting to hurry back to Aus for the payment, just going back as there was a directive from the PM for all Aus citizens to return.

But if I cannot go back, I cannot go back and happy to stay here and miss out on $750.

Just hope no one with covid19 infects the whole of Lampang!!!!!!

 

[deej]

3 hours ago, pdtokyo said:

Spin the wheel ... it will land either on ...

 

 

 

Black

You did tell Clink that you have left and at that time they insisted you nominate an o/s bank account (or in the case of going somewhere really wild like N. Korea, postal address for receipt of money order), your rate will be reduced and you are near certain to miss out on residence-based handouts, which will be all of them. Handout to non-resident is considered a 'leak'.

 

Short answer - follow the Clink rules and you must give them a non-Oz destination for funds and when you do that, you clearly label yourself a non-resident.

 

 

Please take my post with a smile . I.am not badgering Etc

But Rudds Govt hand out reached my Thai Bank A/C whilst i was on a disabilty pension and residing here for approx 8  yrs  full time

Can Sco Mo do a Rudd LOL

Edited March 24, 2020 by deej

[Olmate]

3 hours ago, pdtokyo said:

You're sure about that are you? Outside Oz for > 6 weeks and still paid as a resident into an Oz account??

 

Please DM me details of how you did it, i'll pay you 10% of my pension for life (minus fees and charges) if it's 'legal' or even real.

 Not sure why you mention 6 weeks I,m on retirement extension .Guess your new at this, all my expat mates from Oz and I have for many years received the pension into Oz accounts, not the extra entitlements tho that living in Oz pensioners get,eg rent assist . you need to  register yourself ,log in then,read up a bit on MyGov site!  It handles your Centrelink and taxation info also .That will be a chore at the moment tho as site has crashed again today. Stay in Oz pal .You can,t leave there now anyway after tonite,s announce,ment!

[AussieBob18]

4 hours ago, pdtokyo said:

Spin the wheel ... it will land either on ...

 

Red

You didn't tell Clink that you left Oz and against the odds, their data-matching missed you, you continue to receive payments into your original Oz bank account and those payments are not reduced to "overseas"" rates ... if you are sprung there will be a penalty ... but as a bonus for living dangerously you're guaranteed to automatically get any handouts like the 2 x $750

 

Black

You did tell Clink that you have left and at that time they insisted you nominate an o/s bank account (or in the case of going somewhere really wild like N. Korea, postal address for receipt of money order), your rate will be reduced and you are near certain to miss out on residence-based handouts, which will be all of them. Handout to non-resident is considered a 'leak'.

 

Short answer - follow the Clink rules and you must give them a non-Oz destination for funds and when you do that, you clearly label yourself a non-resident.

 

imo the red strategy can only pay off if you never ever ever intend to return to Oz, you don't have any Oz assets and you can afford to treat Oz pension as a disposable bonus and survive without it.

Makes sense. But eventually CLink finds out because every person leaving Australia on an Australian passport is provided by immigration to Clink and they match that against cuurent and past Pension/Payment receivers.  I receive a payment now, and it stopped as of the date when I left the country to visit Thailand, and then automatically started again from the date I returned.

The ATO are also informed by Immi, such that once a person has been overseas for 2 years, they declare them a non-resident for tax purposes.   Looks to me like the best option is to keep residency in Aust (cheap place) and then return for a visit at least before the 2 years period expires. 

 

[deej]

4 minutes ago, pdtokyo said:

You're a lucky man. Today the CentreLink systems are 11 years sharper and the government is 11 years meaner than it was in 2009. You'd be a very lucky man to get it today!

 

No offence taken deej, my post was simply meant to lay out the reality of CentreLink systems as i see them from the outside. There's a lot of snakes and very few ladders in their game.

 

But you never know, ScoMo/SloMo/Smoko/ScottyFromMarketing may yet give you a happy ending. \

 

Now there's an image to keep you awake tonight.

Thks cobber for a thoughtful discussion .Sadly rarely seen on TV in general LOL

In my case to fully give my details i would wipe out TV

If my marbles are intact us Pre 2003 Gang were grand fathered in  with Howards Govt  new legistration laws which are enforced by Centrelink now  and do not apply to the  Pre 2003 .Gang

Perhaps i am on cloud nine

but will sleep well tonite what  ever the outcome

thks again Cobber

[Olmate]

3 minutes ago, pdtokyo said:

6 weeks is the magic period that CentreLink decides that you are not on holiday and you are supposed to tell them you are overseas.

 

You are right, they won't cut the pension after 6 weeks ... only the extras.

 

They claim, but nobody knows for sure, that the Clink systems are closely coupled to the Oz IMMI system ... so the process is automated.

 

I've just checked again and you are correct about the Oz/Thai bank account ... it seems the choice is yours ...

 

 

I stand corrected!

 

 

There just saved you 10%!????

[baansgr]

On 3/23/2020 at 2:09 PM, owl sees all said:

Boris Johnson is considering something similar for the UK. Funny how 'great minds' think alike.

Can you post a link with that....haven't heard anything whatsoever in the latest pension reforms.Pensions are paid regardless where you reside however not all receive an increase. 

[AussieBob18]

13 minutes ago, pdtokyo said:

good to know the IMMi thing actually works ... it's tough to know when Clink is bluffing or not. Others have commented they like it that way ...

 

When you say your payment stopped ... do you mean the whole payment stopped?  ... or just the extra entitlements like rent assist as discussed in last couple of posts.

 

haha when i leave there is no way i can return to even a cheap place in Oz ... unless we come out of this CV19 thing with an Oz population of about 25, there will still be no cheap places. I'm hoping that return to Oz and staying with friends or Airbnb will be good enough to re-establish residence. But maybe Airbnb won't be here by then either ....

Not on pension yet - the whole payments stopped - and they stop every time I visit Thailand which I do every year and they start when I arrive back.

But the 6 weeks is a 'magic number' - if I was away for more than 6 weeks, CLink would cancel the payments and I would have to reapply when I return.

It is like the magic number of 2 years for ATO.

[Grumpy John]

5 hours ago, pdtokyo said:

You're sure about that are you? Outside Oz for > 6 weeks and still paid as a resident into an Oz account??

 

Please DM me details of how you did it, i'll pay you 10% of my pension for life (minus fees and charges) if it's 'legal' or even real.

Been doing it foR over a year.  I am with an azzhole bank called ING.  Why are they azzholes?  They have my Oz address on record which is all they need but they insist they need my Thai address as well...and because I didn't give them certified copies of my address they locked me out of my account 2 weeks ago. I can See my balance and I can transfer my money to another bank...which I probably will as I have a Robodirect account...which I will have my pension paid into.  But the fact of the matter is I  don't trust banks...especially now since those POS politician's in Crapberra have allowed bail in for all and sundry. Once the exchange rate improves I will bring all my money here.  Go back to gold trading! 

Edited March 24, 2020 by Grumpy John
Smelling

[deej]

3 minutes ago, AussieBob18 said:

Not on pension yet - the whole payments stopped - and they stop every time I visit Thailand which I do every year and they start when I arrive back.

But the 6 weeks is a 'magic number' - if I was away for more than 6 weeks, CLink would cancel the payments and I would have to reapply when I return.

It is like the magic number of 2 years for ATO.

The magic number in 2001 was 6 months and i was on a full disability pension(no deductions)report to Centre Link on leaving OZ and arriving back

How good was that LoL

[AussieBob18]

One thing I think is important to note at this time for those unaware.  If you are on the pension and living overseas (being paid the overseas rate), if you ever return to Australia with the 'intention' of staying in Australia, you will automatically lose the overseas portability and will have to wait 2 years to qualify again - and you may not be approved if they believe you will return to living overseas.  

I have no idea how long before CLink automativcally decides someone who has returned to Australia has decided to stay in Australia, but I would not be surprised if that magic 6 weeks is used.  I know if the rule, but I have no idea when it would be automatically applied by CLink - they often make arbitrary decisions as they know many people will not tell them things.  It is my recommendation that if/when you ever return to Australia while on the 'overseas pension' that you make it clear to CLink that you are not returning to stay if it is going to be for more than 5-6 weeks. 

 

[AussieBob18]

27 minutes ago, pdtokyo said:

haha when i leave there is no way i can return to even a cheap place in Oz ... unless we come out of this CV19 thing with an Oz population of about 25, there will still be no cheap places. I'm hoping that return to Oz and staying with friends or Airbnb will be good enough to re-establish residence. But maybe Airbnb won't be here by then either ....

You wont be able to establish residency with an AirBNB place.  If you are staying with a friend you can draw up a 'rental agreement' for 12 months with automatic renewal (even for a room), and with their support/signature you can tell the Govt agencies and depts that you are now living at that address. You probably cant do that at a hotel or an airbnb - but maybe if you get a 12 months agreement? 

[Olmate]

13 minutes ago, AussieBob18 said:

One thing I think is important to note at this time for those unaware.  If you are on the pension and living overseas (being paid the overseas rate), if you ever return to Australia with the 'intention' of staying in Australia, you will automatically lose the overseas portability and will have to wait 2 years to qualify again - and you may not be approved if they believe you will return to living overseas.  

I have no idea how long before CLink automativcally decides someone who has returned to Australia has decided to stay in Australia, but I would not be surprised if that magic 6 weeks is used.  I know if the rule, but I have no idea when it would be automatically applied by CLink - they often make arbitrary decisions as they know many people will not tell them things.  It is my recommendation that if/when you ever return to Australia while on the 'overseas pension' that you make it clear to CLink that you are not returning to stay if it is going to be for more than 5-6 weeks. 

 

I understand if you are a full blown Aussie u get the portability,ie worked all your life there, then retired. Haven,t heard of losing that. Mate got banned for 12 months here ,went home, told centrelink he was back to stay 12 months, went onto the full pension.Now with new retirement visa came back to the reduced pension.No talk of portability problem.? Others have suggested be truthful but vague about your future travel plans!

[AussieBob18]

30 minutes ago, Olmate said:

I understand if you are a full blown Aussie u get the portability,ie worked all your life there, then retired. Haven,t heard of losing that. Mate got banned for 12 months here ,went home, told centrelink he was back to stay 12 months, went onto the full pension.Now with new retirement visa came back to the reduced pension.No talk of portability problem.? Others have suggested be truthful but vague about your future travel plans!

Always be truthful and vague with CLink - but only tell them what they need to know for your benefit - because they will never tell you what you need to know for your benefit.  I'll find the link and post tomorrow.

[owl sees all]

1 hour ago, baansgr said:

Can you post a link with that....haven't heard anything whatsoever in the latest pension reforms.Pensions are paid regardless where you reside however not all receive an increase. 

Boris said he was going to financially help the vulnerable and aged over the virus. I'll post as soon as I get more info'.

[marquis22]

7 hours ago, pdtokyo said:

so, presuming you are still an Australian resident and your pension is paid into an Oz account, the $750 question is ... did you hold a concession card as at March 12?

I am not in Australia at the moment as stranded in Thailand due to all flights being cancelled. So I do not qualify for the $750. Concession cards are cancelled when out of the country for a certain period of time so I will get a new concession card issued when I get back on Aus soil. The $750 question is .. that there are more things to worry about than $750, like plunging stock markets and the on paper the loss of more than $750!!

Or actually to answer your question as I reread it: I do not know as I forget how long being out of Australia the concession card is cancelled. I left Australia on Feb 20.

[madmen]

On 3/23/2020 at 2:10 PM, marquis22 said:

I cannot get back there to receive the payment ????

I think the date to be there in Australia to qualify is March 31. ( haven't read the link listed above to know for sure ????

More to come ,just book a flight

[Will27]

11 hours ago, AussieBob18 said:

Makes sense. But eventually CLink finds out because every person leaving Australia on an Australian passport is provided by immigration to Clink and they match that against cuurent and past Pension/Payment receivers.  I receive a payment now, and it stopped as of the date when I left the country to visit Thailand, and then automatically started again from the date I returned.

The ATO are also informed by Immi, such that once a person has been overseas for 2 years, they declare them a non-resident for tax purposes.   Looks to me like the best option is to keep residency in Aust (cheap place) and then return for a visit at least before the 2 years period expires. 

 

I'm pretty sure this is incorrect AB.

 

And keeping a residence doesn't mean you're necessarily a resident either.

if someone has an apartment in Oz and spends 1 or 2 weeks a year in it, and

the rest in Thailand, good luck trying to prove that you're a resident for tax purposes.

[Will27]

15 minutes ago, pdtokyo said:

hmm, probably turn out to case by case. As is well-documented, bureaucracies always leave themselves wiggle room.

 

I bow to Will27 superior knowledge regarding current situation vis a vis retired Thai expats but for what it's worth, ages ago i worked in Japan for 4 year+ stretch, only returning to Oz a couple of weeks per year, owned Oz property but had it rented out whole time. i never stayed there.

 

I was absolutely certainly no doubt considered Oz resident for tax purposes the whole time.

 

Absolutely etc because my charming Canadian employer tried to get all of us expats in Japan to declare ourselves non-resident so they could get their mitts on our potential home-country tax refunds ... it got legal and afaik nobody went along with employer plan. It helped of course, that we were all paying tax on our Japanese income in home countries!

We're getting way off topic here, but residency for the ATO can be a complicated beast.

 

I'm of the firm opinion that the vast majority of expats living in Thailand are non-residents

for tax purposes.

 

Some people seem to think that having an Australian address or a bank account or makes them a resident.

 

Pretty much the bottom line is IMO, is that if you're spend the vast majority of your time in Thailand, you're

a non-resident. 

 

I don't think the ATO is too keen to start pursing pensioners and those on smallish incomes.

And nobody really wants to discuss with the ATO and poke the bear.

 

Just try and fly under the radar methinks.

[gk10002000]

On 3/23/2020 at 2:46 AM, Trentham said:

I hope expats do not get it. it is meant to boost the Australian economy - not Thailand's

well they may be expats but that does not mean they do not spend money back home in Australia.  They may have tax liabilities, businesses, employees, alimony, child support, properties, etc.  I guess it depends exactly on how one defines an expat.

[ThaiBunny]

1 minute ago, gk10002000 said:

well they may be expats but that does not mean they do not spend money back home in Australia.  They may have tax liabilities, businesses, employees, alimony, child support, properties, etc.  I guess it depends exactly on how one defines an expat.

I'm not sure that someone on the Australian pension is likely to have a business or employees. The government has clearly defined eligibility as someone actually in Australia on a certain date; anyone else is an expat, permanent or temporary

[Olmate]

4 minutes ago, gk10002000 said:

well they may be expats but that does not mean they do not spend money back home in Australia.  They may have tax liabilities, businesses, employees, alimony, child support, properties, etc.  I guess it depends exactly on how one defines an expat.

Or if they had a National Airline still operating they could pay for a ticket home. ????????????

[giddyup]

18 hours ago, Will27 said:

There's two Aussie expats where I am in Thailand  and they get their pension paid into an Oz bank account.

Been in Thailand 10 years, pension been paid into ANZ Australia all that time.

[ThaiBunny]

3 minutes ago, giddyup said:

Been in Thailand 10 years, pension been paid into ANZ Australia all that time.

Let us know when they get the $750. Payments start next Wednesday and will drop into bank accounts over the next 14 days

[ThaiBunny]

1 minute ago, pdtokyo said:

we'll see if anyone with a valid concession card as at March 12th who happens to be temporarily in Thailand (or any other non-Oz place) on that date gets the $750 after March 31st.

The assumption is that Immigration's computers report to Centrelink. I've had a number of friends who report that they have personally experienced such a linkage. As you say, we shall see

[giddyup]

1 minute ago, ThaiBunny said:

Let us know when they get the $750. Payments start next Wednesday and will drop into bank accounts over the next 14 days

Pretty sure you won't be eligible if you're living outside of Australia like me.

[Olmate]

2 minutes ago, giddyup said:

Pretty sure you won't be eligible if you're living outside of Australia like me.

After paying tax for 60 yrs I,d much rather have my 750 go to the new arrival to Oz with 3 wives and 10 kids who is eligible !

[deej]

Holding a valid Medicare Card will this enable one to receive the Loot of 750 bucks coming and a further 750 bucks later???

as i understand being a holder of Medicare Card u have to be a resident 

Please correct me if the above is wrong

Again many thks in advance 

Greatly appreciated

 

[samran]

4 minutes ago, deej said:

Holding a valid Medicare Card will this enable one to receive the Loot of 750 bucks coming and a further 750 bucks later???

as i understand being a holder of Medicare Card u have to be a resident 

Please correct me if the above is wrong

Again many thks in advance 

Greatly appreciated

 

Medicare cards are valid up till 5 years after you leave Australia.

 

Having said that, I'm non resident, fill in an annual tax form as a non resident, and they still send me a new Medicare card to our family home. Just got a new set last month.

Edited March 25, 2020 by samran