Motorbike accident - Need help!

[Covid19Everywhere]

2 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Looks like you are being scammed with that long list. Maybe try contacting one of the news outlets like "Pattaya News" good story, "somchai tries to scam foreigner with sky high bill"

 

Get a second and third quote. It looks road worthy. Even if you rent it for another day. Then offer the average of the two

He took the bike already long time ago.

i said nothing because after the accident at the police station they told me don’t worry I don’t need to pay anything 

[jackdd]

The expensive items on the bill:

Front wheel

Headlight unit

Front suspension

Front brake disc

 

I can't judge if these things are indeed damaged or not. 6500THB for a front wheel sounds quite expensive for a 150k bike, i would start by checking if the prices which they quoted are even correct.

The bill is also padded. For example why is there a valve for the front wheel or so many screws on this list? I suspect the old things can still be reused.

It also looks quite odd that the front section (headlight) still looks ok, but he charges you for brake and clutch levers, as well as both mirrors, also many fairing parts are for both sides of the bike. How could both sides become damaged, unless the motorbike made a complete roll, in which case it would probably look way worse.

He is also charging you for an oil change.

3200 for labor also sounds quite expensive, considering that such a 3rd party garage is probably charging less than 200THB per hour.

Edited May 17, 2020 by jackdd

[19DL86]

14 minutes ago, Covid19Everywhere said:

I offered 40.

He said sure I can pay 40 and then later the other 34 and then I get the passport

If you intend hangin round that area or you have any long term plans with the Gf, then I d let this fool try take you down the legal route in a court of law.  Meanwhile I d begin a counter claim for damages against the motorbike driver who caused the accident.

This won't come cheap, and that's what these parasites prey on.  You ll need to get all your ducks lined up.  The police onboard and copies of all documents etc.

Next step for me would be local tambon leader Puyi Baan or anyone from the Tessaban to go with you.  Withdraw your other offers, make a new one as full and final settlement of 10-20,000Bt have a letter drafted up ready and the money in cash.  Take plenty of photos and record it in your phone.

 

These people are sneaky and cowardly they prey on the weak and scared.  Don't be afraid stand up to them.  I would be very surprised if this fails.

[Covid19Everywhere]

8 minutes ago, taninthai said:

He has a new headlight on his list 5360bht is headlight smashed

He has a lot on this list that was not damaged.

And as I mentioned before, all the parts on this fake bill for Ninja250, while the machine was a Z300.

 

But again, what should I do when the Police do not care?!

[scubascuba3]

10 minutes ago, Covid19Everywhere said:

He took the bike already long time ago.

i said nothing because after the accident at the police station they told me don’t worry I don’t need to pay anything 

Like I've said twice already, get another 2 quotes elsewhere. Go to the police and file a report he is trying to scam you

[19DL86]

Yes the discrepant bills are because he's had another motorbike the Z300 crashed and the bill he has provided is for that one, most possibly.  You need help up there from someone with clout and on the ground.

I m gathering from all this palaver you're new to Thailand relatively young and sorry naive too probably.

Learn from this tell all your friends post on Facebook, this is what we who,live here dispose about Thais and Thailand.  The corruption and blatant theft.  Hope you can convince 10 people never come back here again.

[EricTh]

If you punch anyone in Thailand, it won't be just a fine or prison, you will probably have a bad record in your passport that will ban you from entering Thailand for x years.

 

I always ride slow (less than 60 kph in highway) in Thailand because I know from past experience that Thai just love to come out from a small lane into your road.

 

I see a lot of foreigners just zoom like there is no tomorrow at traffic light junctions.

 

 

Edited May 17, 2020 by EricTh

[Covid19Everywhere]

I think this discussion show one thing:

 

The legal system in Thailand is not like in our home country, this bill would be smashed by any police officer.

But nothing we or I can do about that.

Any negotiations with the rental guy failed. The police don’t want to help me to get my passport back. Most likely they will get some tea money from the rental guy.

The guy who made the accident will never ever pay me one Baht.

 

So I am just <deleted>, because I made several mistakes:

1. Giving him my passport just because the longlivinghere Farang girl owner of my rental place told me she never had problems.

2. Not asking the police to document the damages on the bike, because they told me I don’t need to pay anything.

3. Let the rental guy picking up the bike, again just because police told me I don’t need to pay anything.

 

So lessons learned:

1. Never ever handout your passport

2. After accident even if I am shocked let Police document everything of the damages.

3. Don’t trust the police guys know what they are talking about.

 

Expensive lesson. Don’t care too much about the money, more about that this scammer will get it. I still have a lot of hate against him, but again what should I do?

 

 

Thanks for all answers, you can leave this thread open for further discussion but I lost any hope that something happen will get me around these <deleted> 74.000 Baht.

[taninthai]

8 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Like I've said twice already, get another 2 quotes elsewhere. Go to the police and file a report he is trying to scam you

 

11 minutes ago, Covid19Everywhere said:

He has a lot on this list that was not damaged.

And as I mentioned before, all the parts on this fake bill for Ninja250, while the machine was a Z300.

 

But again, what should I do when the Police do not care?!

When the police don’t care or will not take any interest it really does make things difficult/impossible ,,,been in a similar situation with the police my self recently trying to get them to arrest somebody who stabbed me-and the only option I could see was to get a lawyer to accompany you to the police station to get them to take it more seriously,,,,,,this obviously costs you more money and I decided it’s not worth the cost and hassle. I could not be bothered and just gave up.

[Covid19Everywhere]

12 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Like I've said twice already, get another 2 quotes elsewhere. Go to the police and file a report he is trying to scam you

How should I get a quote based on two pictures?

He claimed the bike was repaired already.

 

When I was at Police Station, I told everyone he is a scammer and a criminal and Police should care about this.

They did not care. What should I do more? I feel helpless.

 

And yes I am pretty young. Travelled a lot and always took care, but this time I just put trust because the rental guy was recommended

to me and police told me I don’t need to pay anything.

[time2093]

If I were OP I would try the tourist police and tell them your story as they are more falang friendly then the normal city cops. It wouldn't hurt.

[Covid19Everywhere]

1 minute ago, taninthai said:

 

When the police don’t care or will not take any interest it really does make things difficult/impossible ,,,been in a similar situation with the police my self recently trying to get them to arrest somebody who stabbed me-and the only option I could see was to get a lawyer to accompany you to the police station to get them to take it more seriously,,,,,,this obviously costs you more money and I decided it’s not worth the cost and hassle. I could not be bothered and just gave up.

 

And this is why I will leave Thailand and will recommend anyone to not come here.

You get stabbed and police do not care.

If it would be other way around, Farang stabbing Thai, the Thai Media would be all over it, the Farang going to jail and probably get killed there.

 

I knew before they have some racism going on against Europeans, but now after I seen that even the Police participate in that and show no heart, I can’t stand supporting this country anymore.

I am sick of all the fake smiles too. I hate fake people.

 

So I will leave asap and will never come back. Story already shared with many friends, they will not come back to Thailand, too.

And my bad rating really looks ugly on his google page. I hope at least he will lose customers because of that and will maybe learn that honest longterm business is more profitable in the end.

 

[Covid19Everywhere]

5 minutes ago, time2093 said:

If I were OP I would try the tourist police and tell them your story as they are more falang friendly then the normal city cops. It wouldn't hurt.

I had Tourist police contacted before everything.

It was a small boy, afraid to talk to the real police and to the rental guy. He never really translated what I said to them, too scared!

[2long]

Can't you just get a new passport? Tell your embassy that yours has been lost/stolen, and if necessary give them details of where it is and why.

Sorry if that has been suggested and answered already.

Edited May 17, 2020 by 2long

[moontang]

17 minutes ago, EricTh said:

If you punch anyone in Thailand, it won't be just a fine or prison, you will probably have a bad record in your passport that will ban you from entering Thailand for x years.

 

I always ride slow (less than 60 kph in highway) in Thailand because I know from past experience that Thai just love to come out from a small lane into your road.

 

I see a lot of foreigners just zoom like there is no tomorrow at traffic light junctions.

 

 

yes, farang on big bikes never drive defensively..kind of like the jackass  that gunned it around d a car stopping in front of him...permanently damaging a baby in a buggy...gofundme time..pathetic, loser.

[Covid19Everywhere]

7 minutes ago, 2long said:

Can't you just get a new passport? Tell your embassy that yours has been lost/stolen, and if necessary give them details of where it is and why.

Sorry if that has been suggested and answered already.

I am in contact with them.

My last straw.

But not much hope.

[scubascuba3]

26 minutes ago, Covid19Everywhere said:

How should I get a quote based on two pictures?

He claimed the bike was repaired already.

 

When I was at Police Station, I told everyone he is a scammer and a criminal and Police should care about this.

They did not care. What should I do more? I feel helpless.

 

And yes I am pretty young. Travelled a lot and always took care, but this time I just put trust because the rental guy was recommended

to me and police told me I don’t need to pay anything.

No way he would get those repairs done already for 70k+

[Covid19Everywhere]

4 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

No way he would get those repairs done already for 70k+

I know.

many „no ways“ in this situation

 

but again, if police do not care, nothing I can do.

[time2093]

9 minutes ago, Covid19Everywhere said:

I am in contact with them.

My last straw.

But not much hope.

Doing that will not solve your problem unless your able to get a new passport and leave the country immediately and not come back as the bike owner eventually will realize your pulling a runner and not going to pay as he more likely will file a report with the cops and immigration and if you get caught it will be another can or worm that you will open that wont be in your favor.

[KhaoYai]

On 5/11/2020 at 10:12 AM, Covid19Everywhere said:

I don’t have any claim against the Thai accident guy, the owner of the rental store has. He need to get the money from him, not me.

Why do you believe that to be the case. The accident was between you and the other motorcyclist - why should the rental company clear up the mess? You may not be at fault but you can't simply walk away.

[19DL86]

37 minutes ago, EricTh said:

If you punch anyone in Thailand, it won't be just a fine or prison, you will probably have a bad record in your passport that will ban you from entering Thailand for x years.

Absolute nonsense and pure conjecture.  Amazing where certain people find these facts.  Three fights with both Thai and Farang in my 14 years here. Once pleaded guilty, fines. Two Court cases one found not guilty, other told to paid fine, I'm  still here.

I always ride slow (less than 60 kph in highway) in Thailand because I know from past experience that Thai just love to come out from a small lane into your road.

 

 

I see a lot of foreigners just zoom like there is no tomorrow at traffic light junctions.

So now you're judge and jury, were you there in Pai when this happened? No!  Just assuming again that this was the case.

 

 

[19DL86]

12 minutes ago, Covid19Everywhere said:

I know.

many „no ways“ in this situation

 

but again, if police do not care, nothing I can do.

Grow a pair or stop whinging, everything that everyone' has said to you by means of help you've found some reason to reject it dispute it or turn it around.  You sure you're ready to live away from home Timothy.?

 

Lets put this into Room 101 yeah?

[jackdd]

1 hour ago, jackdd said:

3200 for labor also sounds quite expensive, considering that such a 3rd party garage is probably charging less than 200THB per hour.

I just googled the name on the quote, and saw that this is the official Kawasaki dealer in Chiang Mai. So unless he faked this quote, the prices are probably the official prices and the labor is maybe 400 THB an hour, so could be correct.

Of course i doubt that he really got all these parts exchanged as shown on the repair quote. Probably he didn't get anything repaired yet.

Now it's basically down to negotiation. You could just hand over the 75k and be done with it, or you can negotiate it down. Depends on how much time you want to invest and how good your negotiation skills are.

 

I would start by calling the Kawasaki dealer and ask if the bike is still there, because this can very well be the case. Maybe nothing has been done with it yet. Then the first step would be to go there and document all damages in detail. You could also ask the mechanics there if they think the wheel or forks are bent.

 

[Agusts]

Good info about origin of the quote, you need a Thai translator to do some investigation as mentioned. The fact that Kawasaki dealer says the bike is Ninja 250 is very odd, if that goes to court it will be thrown out,  that is if it says Z300 in the copy of your rental contract that you hopefully have. (Z300 is a parallel twin cylinder, sure it wasn't Z250...? That is a one cylinder....)

 

The police are definitely in on this scam, and it is a scam for sure, so not helping you. I also don't believe he has fixed it yet. You can see how old this bike is and how much it is worth, maybe offer to buy the bike, fix and sell, just to twist his corrupt mind, he might just get worried a bit. If bike this age is say 140k, needs 75k repair, then say, okay, I buy the bike for 65k, see what he says...! lol. 

 

Maybe try to find and pay a junior lawyer 5k to go along with you to him and police and tell all the discrepancies in this quote and negotiate, I can go to any dealer and get them to list a lot of components and give a price, it doesn't mean they have even seen the bike. Maybe he can bring the price down and this lawyer worth his fee..., take your girlfriend too, so they don't corrupt the lawyer and get it on their side.

 

Don't rush to anything, if you have time, negotiate and haggle and haggle some more, they are used to it here, say you have no money, corona, no work , blah blah....., play victim and not confrontational,  play their game..., like the guilty Thai guy !

 

And relax, calm down, it's just money, you still have both legs and arms and can walk around, and healthy, not the end of the world. Yes in Thailand they scam you out of your money, but they are less violent, I know some other so called tourist friendly countries they could stab you a few times just for what you have in your pocket...

 

You get passed this and come here many a times more and enjoy yourself, just will be more careful and more experience....????

 

 

[EricTh]

5 hours ago, 19DL86 said:

 

I remember that during visa application, one of the criteria was no criminal records.

 

I wonder whether punching people constitute a criminal act in Thailand?

[Agusts]

Not sure how old the bike is, but I just checked a Z300 2017 goes for about 80k-90k..., just look and take snapshot on Facebook marketplace, good way to start your negotiation...! Say give me this damaged bike and I buy you a secondhand one just like it...????????

 

[geriatrickid]

1. If you rent a vehicle in Thailand, you are responsible for the damage and injury arising from its use. Yes, the rental agency firm has a liability because of the ownership, but the contract used typically transfers responsibility to the customer. The contract itself does not excuse the  rental agency as the ultimate responsible party, but what it does do is oblige the renter to pay for damages unless the collision damage waiver options was taken.

 

2. Refusing to pay will not end the problem. The rental agency will seek to enforce its rental contract. All it has to do is to file a complaint and the burden of proof falls upon the renter until the dispute gets to court. What this means is that immigration can stop you from leaving the country, Assets/property can be subject to lien. 

 

3. It is an offense to hand over the passport to the rental agency. the passport is not your property, but is the property of the issuing country. You may find that it is not so easy to replace the passport under the circumstances. A statement of loss  must be filed etc. if there were Thai visas attached, good luck on having the documentation replaced as it will be a time consuming affair.

 

This event is a should have, could have affair and to be blunt no one on here  is in a position to assist. You have 3 options;

1.  Try and do a runner, and risk losing everything

2. Ignore the  rental agency and run the risk of  being detained and hassled for a civil dispute.

3. Retain legal counsel and have the lawyer file the complaint against the responsible Thai driver and file the legal complaint against the rental agency for  the alleged violations of the business regulations. Give the Thais a dose of their own medicine. 

 

In Thailand  the most important negotiating rule is to never ever negotiate as a foreigner. One must  negotiate  from what the Thai parties perceive as a position of strength. It's all about power here.

Edited May 17, 2020 by geriatrickid

[daveAustin]

My advice, op; just pay up and move on as drawing it out in the vain attempt of saving a few bucks will do your head in. This guy has you over a barrel and knows it, and likely won't discount 1 baht - there's face in it now. Cops are probably in on it now (Pai is not known for its upstanding police) and thus too late to pay them to get your passport back. As noted, first price is always the best and haggle it down fast pleading bankruptcy etc.

 

After the fact I know, but always ask for first class insurance and pay extra and read the policy. And yes, you shouldn't have handed your passport over, but you could still have ended up in strife when trying to leave the country.

 

Sad (but understandable) that you will probably blame all of Thailand for this and won't be back. Thais get scammed by Thais all the time, too, but it's not all like that.

 

At the end of the day, just thank your lucky stars you weren't hurt. All this other tat is small fry in comparison.

 

All the best.

[samsensam]

19 minutes ago, daveAustin said:

My advice, op; just pay up and move on as drawing it out in the vain attempt of saving a few bucks will do your head in. This guy has you over a barrel and knows it, and likely won't discount 1 baht - there's face in it now. Cops are probably in on it now (Pai is not known for its upstanding police) and thus too late to pay them to get your passport back. As noted, first price is always the best and haggle it down fast pleading bankruptcy etc.

 

After the fact I know, but always ask for first class insurance and pay extra and read the policy. And yes, you shouldn't have handed your passport over, but you could still have ended up in strife when trying to leave the country.

 

Sad (but understandable) that you will probably blame all of Thailand for this and won't be back. Thais get scammed by Thais all the time, too, but it's not all like that.

 

At the end of the day, just thank your lucky stars you weren't hurt. All this other tat is small fry in comparison.

 

All the best.

 

agree, and there's a lesson for us all here, experiences like this and the likelihood of having a serious accident, due to the behaviour of other drivers on the road, make it highly unlikely i'd go anywhere near a motorcycle in this country.

[19DL86]

7 hours ago, EricTh said:

I remember that during visa application, one of the criteria was no criminal records.

 

I wonder whether punching people constitute a criminal act in Thailand?

During one of my cases I was on bail set at 120,000Bt a flag was placed in my passport, whereby I couldn't leave Thailand.  It took 16 months my 'Retirement' visa expired I was put ion a "Defendant Visa status".

When all finished, judgement issued, fine paid, bail returned, I.O checked with courts data base, and flag removed 2017.  Every year since I sail through the Retirement visa application....and will continue to do so.  Wrong again!