Thailand Hits Bottom Of Regional Economies

[sceadugenga]

Wish I knew something about economics so I could join in the argument, still that hasn't stopped some of the others.

[highdiver]

yes the econmy is slowing a bit but it is doing so nearly all over the world. and its bound to affect thailand.

the huge capital flow by forign hedge funds and speculators is what realy killing the economy.

Ah yes. It's the foreigners fault

THAT, is third world thinking at it's best.

Wow what an intlectual reply. please share with your knowledge what exactly are you saying? what is a third world ? who is the first and second?? and who initialy named tose countries as third world?

is the first and second world better then the third? and what exactly nakes them "better"

[solo siam]

You do not need to be an economist to understand that Thailand is doomed if it continues in the current direction. It suffices to ask

the following question: What Thailand can produce that China cannot?

The answer is nothing. China can produce anything that Thailand does but cheaper, much cheaper...

Thaksin tried to put Thailand in the direction of Japan, Singapore, South Korea etc. Did he have a chance? I do not know but the mentality of present leadreship of Thailand simply leave no room for successful future...

Excellent post Mr Blam..

Thats a very weak argument, you could say that every other economy apart from China is doomed according to your statement.

Japan, South Korean and Singapore didn't start out the hard graft to success through corruption, croneyism, backhanders and the leaders certainly didn't swindle their way out of paying billions of dollars of taxes - I'm sure that hasn't been particularly useful to the economy.

This last high season here in Phuket was the biggest ever, Some massive names are taking a stake in Phuket and Thailand, including some of the Asian, Arab and European big boys, an economy isn't solely about manufacturing - else China would already be massively richer than the USA.

Here is some data from the World Bank for exports, Thailand most often shows the second biggest growth after China.

and for GDP in E.Asia, Thailand has one of the most stable GDP's

I fail to see how this data corresponds to the death of the Thai economy, quite the opposite it is shown to be perhaps the most stable economy in the region.

Edited April 21, 2007 by Ben@H3-Digital

[LaoPo]

Here is some data from the World Bank for exports, Thailand most often shows the second biggest growth after China.

and for GDP in E.Asia, Thailand has one of the most stable GDP's

I fail to see how this data corresponds to the death of the Thai economy, quite the opposite it is shown to be perhaps the most stable economy in the region.

Nice statistics about export growth and GDP, Ben.

What's worrying me a lot more than nice statistics are the 'people' of Thailand. You know as well as I do that 50% (!!!) of the Labor Force in Thailand work in Agriculture, raising just about 9 or 10% of GDP.

In the past months I have read some alarming articles about farmers who hardly can manage to survive because of drastic drops in prices for all kind of goods, including meat products.

That worries me !

Let's see what the statistics bring us during 2007 and beyond but I fear big problems for that 50% of the Labor Force; these are poor people !

LaoPo

[solo siam]

Farmers always have a fairly rough ride of it, unless they are heavily subsidised like back in the UK (my local farmer was paid a lot of money NOT to farm his land).

However for every variety of crop that is virtually worthless, theres another variety of crop that has moved the opposite way and is expensive and profitable, supply and demand.

For example last time I was in Issan, there was a 2 rai cucumber field opposite us, I believe the daily take was 2,500 baht a day which 5 people picked and sold, apparently cucumber had quadrupled in price over the last two weeks or so. I hate to use the term but subsistance farming should really show a balanced portfolio (?) of crops, and it seems this would alleviate the pressure from individual crop price fluctuations.

The village life was typically the same, a few new Tv's, Tractors, pickups etc... but nothing changed drastically from last year or the year before.

[Mid]

Japan, South Korean and Singapore didn't start out the hard graft to success through corruption, croneyism, backhanders and the leaders certainly didn't swindle their way out of paying billions of dollars of taxes

wouldn't be so fast with throwing that statement about ............................

[Flysiam]

yes the econmy is slowing a bit but it is doing so nearly all over the world. and its bound to affect thailand.

the huge capital flow by forign hedge funds and speculators is what realy killing the economy.

Ah yes. It's the foreigners fault

THAT, is third world thinking at it's best.

Wow what an intlectual reply. please share with your knowledge what exactly are you saying? what is a third world ? who is the first and second?? and who initialy named tose countries as third world?

is the first and second world better then the third? and what exactly nakes them "better"

Don't think he was particularly naming any particlular country 'third world' - just the contents of the post he was refering to indicated the writer may have the level of thought of someone from a 'third world country.'

I do believe I have seen third world thought from people from many countries - developed and not - but I do agree with cdnvic's assessment on this one.

[LaoPo]

Farmers always have a fairly rough ride of it, unless they are heavily subsidised like back in the UK (my local farmer was paid a lot of money NOT to farm his land).

However for every variety of crop that is virtually worthless, theres another variety of crop that has moved the opposite way and is expensive and profitable, supply and demand.

For example last time I was in Issan, there was a 2 rai cucumber field opposite us, I believe the daily take was 2,500 baht a day which 5 people picked and sold, apparently cucumber had quadrupled in price over the last two weeks or so. I hate to use the term but subsistance farming should really show a balanced portfolio (?) of crops, and it seems this would alleviate the pressure from individual crop price fluctuations.

The village life was typically the same, a few new Tv's, Tractors, pickups etc... but nothing changed drastically from last year or the year before.

Well, it's easy talking in just one sentence HOW farmers should change crops and make a better living, isn't it ?

I am talking about more than 18 Million workers in agriculture

If it was so easy as you say, why are there so many poor ?

Don't you think the farmers are clever? I think they are more clever than we realize and if it was SO easy to change into profit making crops, why is rural Thailand still so poor ?

Wouldn't they have changed already ?

Easy said.....difficult to accomplish.

LaoPo

[Dakhar]

I have referenced the Economist on the subject of GDP records for the year 2006 which show that Malaysia generated 148.9 bn whereas Thailand achieved a paltry 206.2 bn.

From the economist: Malaysia's GDP per head (US$; market exchange rate) is 5,591, while Thailand's is 3,120.

And by the way, 206.2-148.9 is about 58bn. Seems like your rough estimates of anything Thail are significantly lower than the actual numbers. I know you badly and desperately want to put Thailand down, but this is a pretty sad and pathetic attempt.

Ok lets say it is a massive 6000 USD just to end the bickering.... WHHOOOOWEEE 6,000USD

[bingobongo]

hello highdiver and thaigoon,

here is some more "in country analysis", so if everything was peachy, why do they need "7 measures" (see below),i shudder to think what the other 6 measures will be

flooding the market with liquidity will only increase inflation and do nothing except make the general population poorer

GHB to reduce interest rates to stimulate home purchases

KANANA KATHARANGSIPORN

The Government Housing Bank (GHB) will reduce interest rates by between 0.25 and 0.5 percentage points by the end of April to stimulate the property market, president Khan Prachuabmoh said yesterday. The decreases would apply to both deposit accounts and housing loans as the government wants financial institutions to reduce interest rates to stimulate the country's lagging economy, he said.

''We're waiting for government policy to support soft loans of about 30 billion baht by offering three-year fixed rates for homebuyers,'' he said yesterday.

The support would be one of seven measures that real estate associations proposed to the government to stimulate the property market and help homebuyers.

''I told the Finance Minister that if the government is to launch any measures to support the property market, it should hurry up or the measures would not be fully effective,'' said Mr Khan.

He said the government's announcement of property measures would be good news following the reduction in interest rates, which are likely to fall further in the coming months.

The Bank of Thailand last week reduced its benchmark rate by a half-point to 4%.

The property market has slowed as consumer confidence drops in light of many negative factors. As a result, competition in the housing market has increased.

According to the Real Estate Information Centre (REIC), total spending for TV commercials by property developers in the first quarter of the year almost doubled from last year, from 55 million baht to 90 million baht. (WHY almost DOUBLE spending if property is supposedly selling themselves)?

Print ad spending dropped to 215 million baht in the first quarter from 314 million in the same period last year.

In 2006, property firms spent 1.2 billion baht on both print and TV ads, accounting for 0.8% of the total advertising market worth around 94 billion baht. It's expected to rise to 100 billion baht this year. .

http://www.bangkokpost.com/190407_Business...r2007_biz40.php

Edited April 21, 2007 by bingobongo

[highdiver]

Here is some data from the World Bank for exports, Thailand most often shows the second biggest growth after China.

and for GDP in E.Asia, Thailand has one of the most stable GDP's

I fail to see how this data corresponds to the death of the Thai economy, quite the opposite it is shown to be perhaps the most stable economy in the region.

Nice statistics about export growth and GDP, Ben.

What's worrying me a lot more than nice statistics are the 'people' of Thailand. You know as well as I do that 50% (!!!) of the Labor Force in Thailand work in Agriculture, raising just about 9 or 10% of GDP.

In the past months I have read some alarming articles about farmers who hardly can manage to survive because of drastic drops in prices for all kind of goods, including meat products.

That worries me !

Let's see what the statistics bring us during 2007 and beyond but I fear big problems for that 50% of the Labor Force; these are poor people !

LaoPo

I agree with you. it is alarming. and I hope that the new policy by the govermant will in the future make amendmants to care for those that are not as fortunate as others.

[highdiver]

hello highdiver and thaigoon,

here is some more "in country analysis", so if everything was peachy, why do they need "7 measures" (see below),i shudder to think what the other 6 measures will be

flooding the market with liquidity will only increase inflation and do nothing except make the general population poorer

GHB to reduce interest rates to stimulate home purchases

KANANA KATHARANGSIPORN

The Government Housing Bank (GHB) will reduce interest rates by between 0.25 and 0.5 percentage points by the end of April to stimulate the property market, president Khan Prachuabmoh said yesterday. The decreases would apply to both deposit accounts and housing loans as the government wants financial institutions to reduce interest rates to stimulate the country's lagging economy, he said.

''We're waiting for government policy to support soft loans of about 30 billion baht by offering three-year fixed rates for homebuyers,'' he said yesterday.

The support would be one of seven measures that real estate associations proposed to the government to stimulate the property market and help homebuyers.

''I told the Finance Minister that if the government is to launch any measures to support the property market, it should hurry up or the measures would not be fully effective,'' said Mr Khan.

He said the government's announcement of property measures would be good news following the reduction in interest rates, which are likely to fall further in the coming months.

The Bank of Thailand last week reduced its benchmark rate by a half-point to 4%.

The property market has slowed as consumer confidence drops in light of many negative factors. As a result, competition in the housing market has increased.

According to the Real Estate Information Centre (REIC), total spending for TV commercials by property developers in the first quarter of the year almost doubled from last year, from 55 million baht to 90 million baht. (WHY almost DOUBLE spending if property is supposedly selling themselves)?

Print ad spending dropped to 215 million baht in the first quarter from 314 million in the same period last year.

In 2006, property firms spent 1.2 billion baht on both print and TV ads, accounting for 0.8% of the total advertising market worth around 94 billion baht. It's expected to rise to 100 billion baht this year. .

http://www.bangkokpost.com/190407_Business...r2007_biz40.php

Dear friend.

The topic was started with a statement that Thailand is hits bottom of regional economies.

after debating the issue if you look at the posts by ben (vey good one by the way) it seems that headlines in news papers are not realy reflcting the real situation.

thailand is stable and doing great. there are many social issues to confront as the "lion " has ponited out but econmy wise thailand is doing pretty well and better then most western countries.

on your previous post you attepted to show the decline in econmy through the state of banks.

on this one you present facts about the media expenses of adertisers.

look on the bright side.. at thsi moment living in Thailand is great. and thats why so many forigners want to be here.

[JR Texas]

hello highdiver and thaigoon,

here is some more "in country analysis", so if everything was peachy, why do they need "7 measures" (see below),i shudder to think what the other 6 measures will be

flooding the market with liquidity will only increase inflation and do nothing except make the general population poorer

GHB to reduce interest rates to stimulate home purchases

KANANA KATHARANGSIPORN

The Government Housing Bank (GHB) will reduce interest rates by between 0.25 and 0.5 percentage points by the end of April to stimulate the property market, president Khan Prachuabmoh said yesterday. The decreases would apply to both deposit accounts and housing loans as the government wants financial institutions to reduce interest rates to stimulate the country's lagging economy, he said.

''We're waiting for government policy to support soft loans of about 30 billion baht by offering three-year fixed rates for homebuyers,'' he said yesterday.

The support would be one of seven measures that real estate associations proposed to the government to stimulate the property market and help homebuyers.

''I told the Finance Minister that if the government is to launch any measures to support the property market, it should hurry up or the measures would not be fully effective,'' said Mr Khan.

He said the government's announcement of property measures would be good news following the reduction in interest rates, which are likely to fall further in the coming months.

The Bank of Thailand last week reduced its benchmark rate by a half-point to 4%.

The property market has slowed as consumer confidence drops in light of many negative factors. As a result, competition in the housing market has increased.

According to the Real Estate Information Centre (REIC), total spending for TV commercials by property developers in the first quarter of the year almost doubled from last year, from 55 million baht to 90 million baht. (WHY almost DOUBLE spending if property is supposedly selling themselves)?

Print ad spending dropped to 215 million baht in the first quarter from 314 million in the same period last year.

In 2006, property firms spent 1.2 billion baht on both print and TV ads, accounting for 0.8% of the total advertising market worth around 94 billion baht. It's expected to rise to 100 billion baht this year. .

http://www.bangkokpost.com/190407_Business...r2007_biz40.php

Dear friend.

The topic was started with a statement that Thailand is hits bottom of regional economies.

after debating the issue if you look at the posts by ben (vey good one by the way) it seems that headlines in news papers are not realy reflcting the real situation.

thailand is stable and doing great. there are many social issues to confront as the "lion " has ponited out but econmy wise thailand is doing pretty well and better then most western countries.

on your previous post you attepted to show the decline in econmy through the state of banks.

on this one you present facts about the media expenses of adertisers.

look on the bright side.. at thsi moment living in Thailand is great. and thats why so many forigners want to be here.

JR Texas: Thailand is not stable and is not doing great. The real estate market is showing signs of an initial collapse. Foreign invest dollars are flowing to other places....even Thais are putting more investment dollars offshore. Tourism is down. The visa and business rules and regulations are hurting farangs and Thais (mostly Thais). People are getting angry. The situation is volatile.

[solo siam]

Well, it's easy talking in just one sentence HOW farmers should change crops and make a better living, isn't it ?

I am talking about more than 18 Million workers in agriculture

If it was so easy as you say, why are there so many poor ?

Don't you think the farmers are clever? I think they are more clever than we realize and if it was SO easy to change into profit making crops, why is rural Thailand still so poor ?

Wouldn't they have changed already ?

Easy said.....difficult to accomplish.

LaoPo

Farming in developing countries is the same anywhere, unless you believe that farmers in Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, Malaysia, China etc... are faring significantly better than their Thai counterparts - Which I don't believe is the case. Then its a different subject, yes farmers are typically poor in poorer countries can you name a country where the contrary is true?

[solo siam]

JR Texas: Thailand is not stable and is not doing great. The real estate market is showing signs of an initial collapse. Foreign invest dollars are flowing to other places....even Thais are putting more investment dollars offshore. Tourism is down. The visa and business rules and regulations are hurting farangs and Thais (mostly Thais). People are getting angry. The situation is volatile.

Surely the signs of the real estate market collapsing would be high interest rates and/or a large devaluation of the currency, of which the opposite is true in both cases. It would be a good move for Thais to be investing in dollars offshore whilst their currency is so strong against the dollar.

[vermin on arrival]

I'm no expert on economics, but it really seems to me that Thailand is not doing great and that in the future things will get worse. Thailand is a regional leader, but look at the competition-Kampuchea, Burma and Laos. My understanding is that Malaysia is doing better and that the future of Vietnam's economy is much stronger. It really has the feel that something bad (both economically and socially) will happen here soon. Although there has been evidence given in support of the strength of the Thai economy, it appears that the evidence against this is more compelling.

On thing that does disturb though is the desire by some people on the forum to tell people who have negative opinions or criticisms to either shut up or leave. I think that this attittude is counterproductive to an understanding of events. I remember that this also bothered me when I first came to Thailand when talking to many long time residents in the the kingdom(their many critiques of the nation). However, now after being here almost 10 years, I realize that most of what they said was true; I was just too green to know. I don't want to call anyone names or make assumptions about people, but that was the case with me.

[jumnien]

I'm curious, if Thailand is at the bottom of regional economies - is Burma, Laos or Cambodia on top? Me thinks the people who think too much are thinking too hard.

[bingobongo]

I'm no expert on economics, but it really seems to me that Thailand is not doing great and that in the future things will get worse. Thailand is a regional leader, but look at the competition-Kampuchea, Burma and Laos. My understanding is that Malaysia is doing better and that the future of Vietnam's economy is much stronger. It really has the feel that something bad (both economically and socially) will happen here soon. Although there has been evidence given in support of the strength of the Thai economy, it appears that the evidence against this is more compelling.

On thing that does disturb though is the desire by some people on the forum to tell people who have negative opinions or criticisms to either shut up or leave. I think that this attittude is counterproductive to an understanding of events. I remember that this also bothered me when I first came to Thailand when talking to many long time residents in the the kingdom(their many critiques of the nation). However, now after being here almost 10 years, I realize that most of what they said was true; I was just too green to know. I don't want to call anyone names or make assumptions about people, but that was the case with me.

Vermin,

thank you for your candor. it is refreshing to see someone who has been in Thailand for a while, who is able to remove the rose colored glasses and give an honest assessment (unlike others). Objectivity is sometimes lacking here even with resounding evidence pointing to Thailand's poor situation at the moment.

[jumnien]

So called "economies" go up and down and in and out. The Thai people that I am close to are doing better today than they were doing 5 years ago, ten years ago. and fifteen years ago.

[Morty]

In regards to currency fluctuations, GDP is measured purely in $ terms, the Thai baht has increased 15% or so against the dollar, do you really fail to see the relevance? If so I'm intrigued at the reasoning behind that, especially when you are trying to measure it agianst an economy whos currency hasn't gained a similar amount.

Since the Thai economy is based on 70% exports (including tourism) the GDP for those sectors should be up by 15% only to be on level with last years volume so 4.5% is actually 10.5% down for 70% of Thai businesses. This would have a direct impact on Thai "buying power" add to that the amount of the inland Thai economy that is financed by loans, witch is dependent on foreign capital. With all the uncertainty of the investment climate in Thailand it would take a long time to regain investor confidence in this country.

Explain to me how this would not be a problem to the Thai society?

PS!

I don't have any business or investments in Thailand and I will not have any in the foreseeable future either, but I'm worried about my family who have to face these realities in their daily struggle.

[somtaamgaiyang]

The only way to really get ahead in bangkok is to have a rich dad or have corrupt connections.

I have to say this is a really ignorant and extremely stupid statement to make. Plenty of Thais have become successful through hard work and honesty. It's really disrespectful to those people for some farang idiot to say things like this.

When was the last time you saw a self made millionaire in Thailand. Everyone is always someone's son with ready capital coming from daddy.

By ahead I am talking about 100,000 USD a year earnings as an employee. I know lots of them, they are all part of the network of certain families and hold down the jobs at the large multinational companies. I know those who work for dad who is well off, they are in the family company and normally break their teeth in the family company running the envelopes to the local govt office to keep the planning office quiet for daddie's property businesses.

I also know plenty of smart kids trying to get ahead as employees in Bkk earnign 15,000 baht a month whilst they have graduated from Thammasat, Chula and the such. The point was more that to be an employee without connections puts you at the bottom of the ladder no matter how smart you are.

I have no doubt there are lots of honest people out there, it is just that business in Thailand is so inextricably linked to paying off people to get the business ahead.

[BAF]

what is a third world ? who is the first and second?? and who initialy named tose countries as third world?

Is Thailand A 3rd World Country Still?

Enjoy.

is the first and second world better then the third? and what exactly nakes them "better"

You should ask all those 2nd, 3rd and 4th world countries which desperately want to become 1st world...

(You can start from Thailand and one of its former PM who proclaimed that Thailand would have reached 1st world status by the year 2xxx ...)

Edited April 22, 2007 by BAF

[puyaidon]

Can anyone explain the difference in the on-shore exchange rate versus the off-shore exchange rate? Somehow, the exchange rate seems to change by 2 baht from morning to afternoon on MSNBC. Does anyone have any idea what is going on? Seems to be confusing at best.

[mesohappy314]

Some posters call people like myself, 'doomsayers'. That's a wrong word and misperception.

Critics about the Thai economy (and to a certain point also the political system) like myself, are NOT doomsayers but merely critics with an open eye what's happening in Thailand and the World, as well as the Asian region in general.

99% of the members here on TV are Thailand lovers and it hurts when critics like 'Blam' are told: "if you don't like it..just leave".

The posters who say so, don't understand that we have a good heart for Thailand, feel for the country and it's people but feel sad when we see so many things go wrong in the past period in this lovely country.

That's not called 'doomsaying' but just realizing and noticing facts. Nothing more nothing less.

I've been coming and going, doing business, as well as holidays to Thailand, China and other Far East countries for more than 30 years so I know a little bit what I'm talking about.

If I see, notice and know about the enormous difference in working and moral attitude between Thailand and China, for instance, I can only conclude that Thailand is slipping away, down the hill, and losing track with it's regional competitor countries.

Knowing that most of the important businesses in Thailand are owned and/or controlled by Thai/Chinese I really can't figure out why there is such a big difference in attitude between Thai/Chinese- and mainland Chinese business people.

The only thing I can think of is that mainland Chinese are still very 'hungry' to succeed and trying to fight for every buck and work day-and-night, literally!

The Thai/Chinese are maybe too comfortable with their wealth (built up in many decades and generations) already and just sailed along with rising demand from the West in the past 2 or 3 decades and forgot to watch what was happening in the neighbouring region and rest of the world.

Contrary to the above is the fact that I know that quite a few Thai/Chinese businesses already set foot in mainland China with their companies and/or factories. Those are the ones that realized something was happening around them and had to adjust to the changing circumstances.

But also Western companies saw and realized that, maybe earlier than Thai businessmen. Don't forget that Western business people have access to large and clever Global Accountant/Lawyer companies AND advising Banks who have their offices all around Asia, not just Thailand...

When I set foot for the first time in Hong Kong I was surprised, shocked and amazed by the working attitude of the business people. No matter if it was 6.00AM in the morning or 12.00 at night, everywhere in the lobbies of the hotels you saw and still see hundreds of business people, already or still working with their Western counterparts...

In the same period I worked with, and was buying from medium & large BKK companies...the difference in attitude was enormous and I realized very soon I couldn't go on with them anymore and left doing business with Thailand, but not for holidays

The same attitude like HK I found also in mainland China, in cities like Guangzhou, Shanghai, Hangzhou, Shenzhen, Beijing and the like; I can make appointments in evenings, on Saturdays, Sundays, phone them late at night; no problem....EVERYTHING is possible.

They have still a lot to learn, but they learn fast, willing to climb up the ladder.

Maybe Thailand thought they were already high up the ladder, or hill, whatever you like.

They're not -anymore-.

It's the difference in working and moral attitude; it's probably in the Thai genes; I don't know, maybe you do ?

LaoPo

I think it's important to realize that mai pen rai attitudes are likely correlated to the fact that so many people want to live here. Hong Kong, China, Singapore, etc. are all shocking in their industriousness when you go there from Thailand. But still you return.

I just mean to say that the "ignorance" is a big part of what gives these people their bliss. Perhaps we shouldn't try so hard to change them into the hard-working Chinese. God knows, what a bore it would be to live there.

[mesohappy314]

Some posters call people like myself, 'doomsayers'. That's a wrong word and misperception.

Critics about the Thai economy (and to a certain point also the political system) like myself, are NOT doomsayers but merely critics with an open eye what's happening in Thailand and the World, as well as the Asian region in general.

99% of the members here on TV are Thailand lovers and it hurts when critics like 'Blam' are told: "if you don't like it..just leave".

The posters who say so, don't understand that we have a good heart for Thailand, feel for the country and it's people but feel sad when we see so many things go wrong in the past period in this lovely country.

That's not called 'doomsaying' but just realizing and noticing facts. Nothing more nothing less.

I've been coming and going, doing business, as well as holidays to Thailand, China and other Far East countries for more than 30 years so I know a little bit what I'm talking about.

If I see, notice and know about the enormous difference in working and moral attitude between Thailand and China, for instance, I can only conclude that Thailand is slipping away, down the hill, and losing track with it's regional competitor countries.

Knowing that most of the important businesses in Thailand are owned and/or controlled by Thai/Chinese I really can't figure out why there is such a big difference in attitude between Thai/Chinese- and mainland Chinese business people.

The only thing I can think of is that mainland Chinese are still very 'hungry' to succeed and trying to fight for every buck and work day-and-night, literally!

The Thai/Chinese are maybe too comfortable with their wealth (built up in many decades and generations) already and just sailed along with rising demand from the West in the past 2 or 3 decades and forgot to watch what was happening in the neighbouring region and rest of the world.

Contrary to the above is the fact that I know that quite a few Thai/Chinese businesses already set foot in mainland China with their companies and/or factories. Those are the ones that realized something was happening around them and had to adjust to the changing circumstances.

But also Western companies saw and realized that, maybe earlier than Thai businessmen. Don't forget that Western business people have access to large and clever Global Accountant/Lawyer companies AND advising Banks who have their offices all around Asia, not just Thailand...

When I set foot for the first time in Hong Kong I was surprised, shocked and amazed by the working attitude of the business people. No matter if it was 6.00AM in the morning or 12.00 at night, everywhere in the lobbies of the hotels you saw and still see hundreds of business people, already or still working with their Western counterparts...

In the same period I worked with, and was buying from medium & large BKK companies...the difference in attitude was enormous and I realized very soon I couldn't go on with them anymore and left doing business with Thailand, but not for holidays

The same attitude like HK I found also in mainland China, in cities like Guangzhou, Shanghai, Hangzhou, Shenzhen, Beijing and the like; I can make appointments in evenings, on Saturdays, Sundays, phone them late at night; no problem....EVERYTHING is possible.

They have still a lot to learn, but they learn fast, willing to climb up the ladder.

Maybe Thailand thought they were already high up the ladder, or hill, whatever you like.

They're not -anymore-.

It's the difference in working and moral attitude; it's probably in the Thai genes; I don't know, maybe you do ?

LaoPo

Maybe its just not that important to the average Thai to be competetive and businesslike, Most of the Thais I know are happy with what they have, whatever it may be - I for one hope and pray that Thailand doesn't turn into another China, I like the laid back style, the "I fancy a sleep at lunchtime" attitude. Its just different, not worse, not better, just different.

I don't ever recall having a conversation with anyone but wealthy Thais where they cared what the exchange rate, GDP etc... was.

I personally wouldn't want to live here if it was all about the work, business and getting ahead - I could go back to the UK if I wanted that.

Well put. Better than I tried above.

[midas]

I'm curious, if Thailand is at the bottom of regional economies - is Burma, Laos or Cambodia on top? Me thinks the people who think too much are thinking too hard.

mdeland dont be so pedantic ! I am sure as a person with 2 planes etc etc you are sufficiently

intelligent to understand what is being said

[Plus]

From that gospel post by Blam:

"Thaksin Shinawatra took down PM Chuan Leekpai for so called 'corrupt activities', in the Sor Por Kor 4-01 land reform corruption scandal, and it was a lie. Thailand continues to live the lie."

What was a lie is Blam's first statement about Thaksin taking down Chuan. I think Blam was pulling everyone's leg or 22 years here turned everything into a blur for him. He wasn't after facts anyway, he wanted to put across an opinion.

Thailand might very well record slowest growth in the region. However no one here pointed to a few obvious reasons for that - for most of the past year the country was without a government and legislature, and when the interim govt took over ALL previous govt projects were put through a corruption check, completely stopped or overhauled. This is not a minor glitch - it takes months to get the projects back on track, and it takes a lot longer to restore business confidence as no one knows what will happen next.

Take a massive investment in infrastructure - the govt is trying its best to get it up and running, yet the process of selecting the projects, getting bidding process underway and securing funding cannot be done overnight. They are desperately trying to start at least one underground line this year as a confidence building measure.

Basically, political instability is the main factor behind slow growth - most investment plans were put on hold in February last year and little has changed since.

PS. Chuan's land scandal and Thaksin were separated by six years and three governments

[nikster]

I don't really understand all the doom and gloom on this forum nowadays, seems theres a lot of people whi just want Thailand to fail at everything, why bother posting here if you hate Thailand so much.

Simple - bad news sell.

I am not going to dwell on that though, don't want to add to the negativity

[Johpa]

Farmers always have a fairly rough ride of it, unless they are heavily subsidised like back in the UK (my local farmer was paid a lot of money NOT to farm his land).

One can not compare farm subsidies to US or UK farmers to the situation in Thailand as the they represent a very small percentage of the populace in those countries. I believe the US farm subsidies go to a mere 25,000 farmers.

Farmers tend to have a rough go of it because the processors and middlemen make great efforts to insure that the producers of raw materials, whether agricultural or other natural resources, are paid little in order for these corporate folks to increase their profits. That is why in the US ADM continuously makes huge profits and farmers becomes destitute. The economy is structured so that poor rural people do not make much profit.

Again, no big social problem in the US or UK where we are talking small numbers, an entirely different story in Thailand where the rural poor make up a far larger percentage of the population.

[LaoPo]

I just mean to say that the "ignorance" is a big part of what gives these people their bliss. Perhaps we shouldn't try so hard to change them into the hard-working Chinese.

God knows, what a bore it would be to live there.

1.3 billion people in China aren't bored.....they work

If just 5% of them would have the money to have a 'peep' in LOS...it would be busy

LaoPo