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How strong do you need to be?


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1 hour ago, elgenon said:

I have a friend who trains Muay Thai fighters and he says banana trees is correct. Doesn't matter to me so don't hate on me.

Well, you can simply go to any of the top muay thai gyms in thailand, pay the day rate of about 300-500 baht, get trained there right besides the best in the world, and simply count the number of chopped down banana trees in the area. I've been to several of the top gyms (15+ years ago when things were done even more the "old fashioned way"), and absolutely nowhere do they kick banana trees. And why would they? What would a banana tree have to offer over the heavy bag? Why grow banana trees for months so they can just be kicked down? Every gym has a heavy bag that you can used for years (use some duct tape to keep it from braking down), why start a banana tree farm next to it just for kicking trees? It absolutely makes no sense at all. Do they brng the banana trees into the gym first or they go kick them in the middle of the field with nobody around? How do they do that with urban gyms, like Kaewsamrit which has produced several Lumpinee champions? There is not a patch of land there, its all residential houses in Pinklao. Do they ship in banana trees from miles away?

 

But hey, if your friend tells you that, then you go with that. 

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  • 1 month later...
On 4/21/2021 at 1:12 PM, Bob12345 said:

The kicking banana trees is a nice story, but complete BS. I guess he watched "Kickboxer" with Jeanclaude van Damme a time too many. 

Real Thai fighters don't kick trees to toughen their legs up, they kick the heavy bag, pads, and fight in the ring from a young age onwards. Kicking a tree would only get you in trouble with the farmer who owns that tree. There is a clip of Buakaw (I guess it was him) kicking over a banana tree on youtube, but that was just for show based on the JVD movie. 

And yes, I enjoyed that movie for the comedic value of it (Van Damme dancing in his tight shirt and jeans, for example, one of the most unintentionally funny scenes I've ever seen).

 

Not everyone does it. You can also condition it simply by kicking pads and heavy bags. Some people will do stupid <deleted> like roll bottles over their shins (I don't recommend it). But some people do it. It's more of an old school thing, and obviously only in THailand and places where these trees actually grow...

 

And yes, I know you weren't talking about me (at least I think so, since I merely said it wasn't palm trees), but there ARE people and gyms who do this. Some might only do it as a gag for paying non-serious tourists, but it came from somewhere...

 

Edited by FarangULong
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Most Thai fighters train twice a day, except for Sunday, with a training lasting 2-3 hours: they don't need extra conditioning for their shins as they kick the heavy bag for 2 times 30 minutes already and do 3-5 rounds of 3-5 minutes on the pads. 

 

Where it comes from? Probably Muay Boran (pre-1930s). But its normally not used anymore, even though some people might think its real and still do it. 

Its like thinking that bodybuilders blow up rubber hot water bottles (Pumping Iron - 1977) or tear up phonebooks (feature of strength in 50s bodybuilding contests): it is shown sometimes as a sign of strength for an audience, but they dont have piles of phonebooks in a regular commercial gym for their members to tear up. 

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On 5/25/2021 at 10:55 AM, Bob12345 said:

Most Thai fighters train twice a day, except for Sunday, with a training lasting 2-3 hours: they don't need extra conditioning for their shins as they kick the heavy bag for 2 times 30 minutes already and do 3-5 rounds of 3-5 minutes on the pads. 

 

Where it comes from? Probably Muay Boran (pre-1930s). But its normally not used anymore, even though some people might think its real and still do it. 

Its like thinking that bodybuilders blow up rubber hot water bottles (Pumping Iron - 1977) or tear up phonebooks (feature of strength in 50s bodybuilding contests): it is shown sometimes as a sign of strength for an audience, but they dont have piles of phonebooks in a regular commercial gym for their members to tear up. 

 Yeah, as I said I have no idea where it comes from. I've never done it myself either.

 

I've just heard of people doing it + seen stuff on youtube (other than Buakaw) of people doing it. And heard stories from some of the people from the gym(s) back home, who went on Thailand trips.

 

I'd assume it had it's uses way back when there was no bags. I've also seen pads fashioned from pieces of banana tree.

 

People do all sorts of crazy  and stupid <deleted>, like some old school Okinawan schools for Kyokushin still use hard boards dug into the earth, with some hemp rope around it, and beat that s%&% to "toughen" the knuckles/hands, or smacking their hands against rocks (where you can SEE the wear and tear from years and years of use).

 

Imo that's just as stupid, though,  as some people who do bareknuckle workouts on the heavy bag. It doesn't "toughen" your hand as much as it ends up hurting it in the long run. Brittle hands is the worst thing you can have in combat sports, esp. if you're a half decent puncher. Plus good chance of getting arthritis.

 

I wouldn't say kicking banana trees is in the same category as that though.

 

Anyway, I doubt they do it in the city gyms in and around Bangkok like Fairtex (what's that like these days anyway? I know there's more than one, so asking about the Bangkok one - Bang Plee or whatever it's called)... maybe it's just used as a gag for tourists only, ie for show (like they sometimes do show fights/exhibitions) and maybe for a bit of extra pay some farang can then also kick the trees.. I have no idea.

 

I can't wait for Pfizer-Biontech to become available in my area, and travel restrictions being loosened. I really wanted to do a training "vacation" (like some relaxation, but also get back into the sport... my prime is gone, but whatever, it's more about my mental and physical health, than any aspirations). Could you recommend a particular gym, that isn't touristy (esp. not one, where they offer "fights" for tourists who never trained except for their stay there, and a tuk tuk driver willing to lay down so they can have a "win" on their record..), but also not too on your ass? I do need coaches, that WILL whip me into shape, but not the type that will not let up at all. So basically an inbetween thing between "relaxed" and "if you don't show up every day and train until you puke and hten some", since that also varies from gym to gym.

 

And preferably where you do get decent sparring, but not "I take joy in smashing hte farang to bits" type of sparring... I haven't trained in a long, long time, and I haven't had any scraps in a while either, so I'd probably crawl on all fours to the nearest spit bucket (if I make it that far..) from a medium bodyshot... Obv I know that if I go hard, I will get the same in return... Just looking for a place, where people are a bit more chill about it, and don't try to prove their the hardest and show the new guy who's boss, unless he asks for it (always one, who shows up and does, either through word or deed)...

 

Any suggestions?

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On 5/27/2021 at 4:30 AM, FarangULong said:

 Yeah, as I said I have no idea where it comes from. I've never done it myself either.

 

I've just heard of people doing it + seen stuff on youtube (other than Buakaw) of people doing it. And heard stories from some of the people from the gym(s) back home, who went on Thailand trips.

 

I'd assume it had it's uses way back when there was no bags. I've also seen pads fashioned from pieces of banana tree.

 

People do all sorts of crazy  and stupid <deleted>, like some old school Okinawan schools for Kyokushin still use hard boards dug into the earth, with some hemp rope around it, and beat that s%&% to "toughen" the knuckles/hands, or smacking their hands against rocks (where you can SEE the wear and tear from years and years of use).

 

Imo that's just as stupid, though,  as some people who do bareknuckle workouts on the heavy bag. It doesn't "toughen" your hand as much as it ends up hurting it in the long run. Brittle hands is the worst thing you can have in combat sports, esp. if you're a half decent puncher. Plus good chance of getting arthritis.

 

I wouldn't say kicking banana trees is in the same category as that though.

 

 

 

I can't wait for Pfizer-Biontech to become available in my area, and travel restrictions being loosened. I really wanted to do a training "vacation" (like some relaxation, but also get back into the sport... my prime is gone, but whatever, it's more about my mental and physical health, than any aspirations). Could you recommend a particular gym, that isn't touristy (esp. not one, where they offer "fights" for tourists who never trained except for their stay there, and a tuk tuk driver willing to lay down so they can have a "win" on their record..), but also not too on your ass? I do need coaches, that WILL whip me into shape, but not the type that will not let up at all. So basically an inbetween thing between "relaxed" and "if you don't show up every day and train until you puke and hten some", since that also varies from gym to gym.

 

This place would fit that bill exactly:

 

https://www.tigermuaythaichiangmai.com/

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  • 2 months later...
On 5/27/2021 at 10:46 AM, Bob12345 said:

In what area?

I'd really be open to anything, except too deep in the provinces, or Pattaya. That's not meant to be a jab towards anyone who likes Pattaya, but it just isn't for me. Kinda effed that I even have to write that disclaimer, nowadays...

 

Tiger Muay Thai looks great, they have a really great international pro team as well (seems like the way Fairtex used to be, before it became super commercialized), not that  the pro team should matter to me... but it is neat, to maybe sometimes get a chance to work with guys like that, can learn a lot from that.

 

I watched their try out episodes. Thing is often with gyms like that, they have people come in for more than usual in training fees, due to the big name fighters and coaches, but then the coaches don't give you a lot of their time (as in individual time), so if they do, then that sounds like the place to be.

 

Thanks, further suggestions would be appreciated. Gonna have to wait until they lift the 14 day quarantine though.

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  • 1 year later...
On 2/23/2021 at 7:42 AM, rcuthbert said:

According to Larry, a Prison Emergency Response Team leader, four to five inches above the knee, on the outside of the thigh, is a zone that - if kicked - will render the leg practically useless. Unlike the shins, this zone cannot, other than building the surrounding muscle, be toughened up. I wonder how the Thai boxers defend the zone?

With their shins.

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