Amnesty question

[JackThompson]

26 minutes ago, john terry1001 said:

You don't have to prove anything. The Amphur will confirm on the Kor Ror 2 that you are legally married and haven't been divorced. That's it.

 

Why would you be held to ransom?

Ransom / Extortion: "Pay $1100+ cash to our pocket through an agent, or we will disqualify your valid extension to continue living with your wife, with proven income well above the minimum required."

 

Quote

...

The only people who might be worried are the clever(?) ones who, despite being married, have chosen to remain long term in Thailand using a visa system designed for tourists. I wonder how many now regret the path they chose and with they had chosen the extension route instead? 

 

I realise there is a minority who will say they can't get a marriage extension (Jack Thomson will post on here shortly) but for most they have a choice and chose the tourist option. 

Yes - misinformation is a Bad Thing, so I correct it.  I haven't had a Tourist Visa in years. 

 

Visas can be issued for many cases (business, Thai-family, diplomatic, retirement, etc).  Tourists cannot get Non-Imm Visas.  Those on Non-OA 1-year-stamp Visas would also be surprised to learn they are "tourists."

[Bangkok Barry]

18 minutes ago, john terry1001 said:

You don't have to prove anything. The Amphur will confirm on the Kor Ror 2 that you are legally married and haven't been divorced. That's it.

 

Why would you be held to ransom? Surely, like most of us who are married, have a twelve month marriage extension to confirm our permission to stay in Thailand. Other than not having to complete a 90 day report at the moment, nothing at all has changed for us, we still renew our marriage extension as required in the normal way and still just pay the same 1900 baht each year. The current amnesty is irrelevant to our situation.

 

The only people who might be worried are the clever(?) ones who, despite being married, have chosen to remain long term in Thailand using a visa system designed for tourists. I wonder how many now regret the path they chose and with they had chosen the extension route instead? 

 

I realise there is a minority who will say they can't get a marriage extension (Jack Thomson will post on here shortly) but for most they have a choice and chose the tourist option. 

You assume too much. Do you have anything to back up your assertion that most of us who are married have a 12 month marriage extension? I could equally claim that most of us make 90-day border runs, perhaps combined with a 60-day extension.

And those married to Thais mis-using a visa system designed for tourists (most of whom do not need a visa anyway)? What nonsense is this? There is in place a visa system for those married which allows multiple entries, which many use either because they leave often for business or pleasure or because they prefer, as the rules legitimately allow, to pop over a border every 90 days. They also allow, for those who want it and don't mind tying money up in the bank, a one-year visa.

Those with multi-entry visas have been granted an amnesty because leaving and returning has not been possible for the very vast majority. That exact same situation, as of today, still exists. If, despite that, the amnesty is not extended, then the government will indeed be holding the many tens of thousands with multi-entry visas to ransom and they, despite being unable to leave, will have to pay up or face arrest and deportation.

To claim that those married to Thais use the tourist option is simply garbage. What they do is abide by the rules in place for those who have been granted a marriage visa.

[john terry1001]

4 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

Ransom / Extortion: "Pay $1100+ cash to our pocket through an agent, or we will disqualify your valid extension to continue living with your wife, with proven income well above the minimum required."

 

I haven't had a Tourist Visa in years.  Visas can be issued for many cases (business, Thai-family, diplomatic, retirement, etc).  Tourists cannot get Non-Imm Visas.  Those on Non-OA 1-year-stamp Visas would also be surprised to learn they are "tourists."

 

Hi Jack, I knew you would be the first to respond ????.

 

First, apologies. As well as Tourist Visa, I should have added short term (90 day) non O visas. 

 

I'm really talking about those who continually renew short term visas instead of changing to longer term (renewable)  marriage extensions. And I do understand the issues you've had in the past but others have been able to resolve them without paying a fortune to agents.

[JackThompson]

9 minutes ago, john terry1001 said:

Hi Jack, I knew you would be the first to respond ????.

 

First, apologies. As well as Tourist Visa, I should have added short term (90 day) non O visas. 

 

I'm really talking about those who continually renew short term visas instead of changing to longer term (renewable)  marriage extensions. And I do understand the issues you've had in the past but others have been able to resolve them without paying a fortune to agents.

The fact that some have applications which do not fall into Immigration's many "agent only" filters, doesn't solve the problem.  "Most" drunk-drivers drive home from the bar successfully.

 

All those who are told "go out for a visa" (Non-B, Non-Ed, etc) or have Non-B multis are in a similar situation to us Non-O-ME folks - "Pay us off or else."

[innosiem]

9 minutes ago, john terry1001 said:

Hi Jack, I knew you would be the first to respond ????.

 

First, apologies. As well as Tourist Visa, I should have added short term (90 day) non O visas. 

 

I'm really talking about those who continually renew short term visas instead of changing to longer term (renewable)  marriage extensions. And I do understand the issues you've had in the past but others have been able to resolve them without paying a fortune to agents.

i am on ME marriage visa
have been for years
the one and only reason i use this visa
and not apply for 1 year extensions
is simple
usually i am never here for 90 days
usually i am barely here for 2 months before i need a break and take a trip somewhere
i travel frequently,
so why would i need to bother going through the hassle for a 1 year extension ?

obviously many people are here on pensions and such
and do not have funds to travel so frequently
so 1 year extensions are suitable for them
not everyone is in the same boat

[clorox]

multiple re-entry permit would let you go in and out as much as you please

[john terry1001]

2 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

The fact that some have applications which do not fall into Immigration's many "agent only" filters, doesn't solve the problem.  "Most" drunk-drivers drive home from the bar successfully.

 

All those who are told "go out for a visa" (Non-B, Non-Ed, etc) or have Non-B multis are in a similar situation to us Non-O-ME folks - "Pay us off or else."

Are you suggesting that it's perfectly OK and safe for a drunk driver to continue to drive if they don't get caught???????

 

That STINKS. A drunk driver is never ever safe driving on any road!!!!!

 

 

You can get any extension (Non-B, Non-Ed, etc) or have Non-B multis) as long as you qualify.

[john terry1001]

9 minutes ago, innosiem said:

i am on ME marriage visa
have been for years
the one and only reason i use this visa
and not apply for 1 year extensions
is simple
usually i am never here for 90 days
usually i am barely here for 2 months before i need a break and take a trip somewhere
i travel frequently,
so why would i need to bother going through the hassle for a 1 year extension ?

obviously many people are here on pensions and such
and do not have funds to travel so frequently
so 1 year extensions are suitable for them
not everyone is in the same boat

Just who are you trying to con convince?

 

A one year marriage extension (1900 baht) plus a multi re-entry permit (3800 baht) takes less than two hours to complete once per year. Adding the time it takes to put all the documentation together would still take less than a day.  That's cheaper and less hassle than getting a ME marriage non O.

 

Getting a marriage extension has got absolutely nothing to do with (not?) being a pensioner or being rich enough to travel wherever in the world we want to. Because of course, being pensioners, we have all the time on our hands.

[innosiem]

28 minutes ago, john terry1001 said:

Just who are you trying to con convince?

 

A one year marriage extension (1900 baht) plus a multi re-entry permit (3800 baht) takes less than two hours to complete once per year. Adding the time it takes to put all the documentation together would still take less than a day.  That's cheaper and less hassle than getting a ME marriage non O.

 

Getting a marriage extension has got absolutely nothing to do with (not?) being a pensioner or being rich enough to travel wherever in the world we want to. Because of course, being pensioners, we have all the time on our hands.

which part of "i travel frequently" did you not get?
i am never here for 90 days (current situation excluded)
i have no need to go to immigration, hold funds in a bank indefinitely, wait in for a home visit etc.
or buy a re-entry stamp
when i can just as easily grab a visa in savannakhet or other countries depending where i am
(have also got from Sri Lanka, Vietnam)
while i am "taking a break" from here (kill 2 birds with 1 stone)

The fact that you mention costs, shows you have clearly worked out the costs of both options
"That's cheaper and less hassle"
i never mentioned cost, as it is not a concern
each to their own

and a trip to immigration can take longer than 2 hours on the best of days
not to mention home visit, and 90 day reporting
Just who are you trying to con convince?

[john terry1001]

20 minutes ago, innosiem said:

which part of "i travel frequently" did you not get?
i am never here for 90 days (current situation excluded)
i have no need to go to immigration, hold funds in a bank indefinitely, wait in for a home visit etc.
or buy a re-entry stamp
when i can just as easily grab a visa in savannakhet or other countries depending where i am
(have also got from Sri Lanka, Vietnam)
while i am "taking a break" from here (kill 2 birds with 1 stone)

The fact that you mention costs, shows you have clearly worked out the costs of both options
"That's cheaper and less hassle"
i never mentioned cost, as it is not a concern
each to their own

and a trip to immigration can take longer than 2 hours on the best of days
not to mention home visit, and 90 day reporting
Just who are you trying to con convince?

You can travel as often as you like using a multi re-entry permit.

Home visits are not every year, they're rare after the first year.

Cost does not just mean financial.Time and convenience are usually more important.

 

In almost twenty years of doing extensions in Chonburi I have only ever been in immigration for more than two hours on one occasion, and that was this year when the income option changed from an Embassy letter to the new income transferred from abroad system. The IO wasn't sure of the new system and had to involve her boss to clarify it.

[checkered flag]

Best to have a plan B in case Thai Immigration says no. I feel for those who were doing the in and out to avoid putting money in a Thai bank or doing regular transfers, but the border closures stopped that. The US embassy has repeatedly advised citizen on how to leave and I assume other embassies do the same.

So a plan B is needed: 1) pray amnesty is granted, OK for duration; 2) get a 60 day extension if available; 3) money to agent; 4) elite visa ; 5) go home. Only #5 is a sure thing. 

Those on ME tourist or ED visa are SOL because no border runs.

Many of us in spite of the amnesty did our regular extensions and 90 day reports. It was very  easy because the offices weren't busy. I'm glad I did.

[john terry1001]

1 hour ago, Bangkok Barry said:

You assume too much. Do you have anything to back up your assertion that most of us who are married have a 12 month marriage extension? I could equally claim that most of us make 90-day border runs, perhaps combined with a 60-day extension.

Do you have any evidence?

 

1 hour ago, Bangkok Barry said:

And those married to Thais mis-using a visa system designed for tourists (most of whom do not need a visa anyway)? What nonsense is this? There is in place a visa system for those married which allows multiple entries, which many use either because they leave often for business or pleasure or because they prefer, as the rules legitimately allow, to pop over a border every 90 days

There is also a system in place where people with a 30 day exempt entry can convert at immigration within Thailand to a 90 day non O…..but……that is only part of the process that has to end with obtaining a marriage extension. You can’t simply keep getting 90 day non O’s at immigration. I wonder why that is??

 

1 hour ago, Bangkok Barry said:

Those with multi-entry visas have been granted an amnesty because leaving and returning has not been possible for the very vast majority. That exact same situation, as of today, still exists. If, despite that, the amnesty is not extended, then the government will indeed be holding the many tens of thousands with multi-entry visas to ransom and they, despite being unable to leave, will have to pay up or face arrest and deportation.

To claim that those married to Thais use the tourist option is simply garbage. What they do is abide by the rules in place for those who have been granted a marriage visa.

As I understood it the prime reason for the Amnesty was to accommodate those tourists who, because of lockdown and closed borders, temporarily could not return home/continue their onward journey. And it was organized so as to mimimise any disruption caused.

 

Also, for those of us using twelve month extensions, from a permission of stay angle, absolutely nothing has changed, it was as if amnesty didn’t exist, we even got flexibility on 90 day reports.

 

But for those doing border hops, etc, from the countless posts on this forum, you are all panicking about when the amnesty will finish and what you will be able to do, how you will be able to manipulate the rules. For somebody who believes that the system you use is similar to the extension system we use and think the Thai Government treats your system equal, in what way have done anything to reduce your stress and keep you happy.

[innosiem]

8 minutes ago, john terry1001 said:

You can travel as often as you like using a multi re-entry permit.

Home visits are not every year, they're rare after the first year.

Cost does not just mean financial.Time and convenience are usually more important.

 

In almost twenty years of doing extensions in Chonburi I have only ever been in immigration for more than two hours on one occasion, and that was this year when the income option changed from an Embassy letter to the new income transferred from abroad system. The IO wasn't sure of the new system and had to involve her boss to clarify it.

i have been here long enough to know exactly what Jomtien immigration is like
something i would myself prefer to avoid

each to their own
what you fail at understanding is
not everyone is you
what may work best for you
is not preferred by others
i do ALWAYS STILL HAVE THE 1 YEAR OPTION
if i choose to go that route

[sandyf]

14 minutes ago, innosiem said:

which part of "i travel frequently" did you not get?
i am never here for 90 days (current situation excluded)
i have no need to go to immigration, hold funds in a bank indefinitely, wait in for a home visit etc.
or buy a re-entry stamp
when i can just as easily grab a visa in savannakhet or other countries depending where i am
(have also got from Sri Lanka, Vietnam)
while i am "taking a break" from here (kill 2 birds with 1 stone)

The fact that you mention costs, shows you have clearly worked out the costs of both options
"That's cheaper and less hassle"
i never mentioned cost, as it is not a concern
each to their own

and a trip to immigration can take longer than 2 hours on the best of days
Just who are you trying to con convince?

"each to their own"

You are exactly right, it is an individual choice but unfortunately there are some that take a bit of an elitist view over extensions and will put forward any argument they can.

I spent the first 6 years here on ME and only changed to marriage extension when I got caught up in the 2014 UK passport fiasco. 

Whichever method you chose you have to live with the consequences of your decision should any changes come about. Changes to the extension requirements resulted in me going back to a ME visa. Ironically the rule that prevented extension renewal is not applicable now I have a visa.

When it comes to the extension requirements I am on what would be seen as a borderline income and the 'superior than thou' brigade are of the opinion that I shouldn't be here. I have had my own home for over 10 years, other than my wife no dependents, and do not have a vehicle. My disposable income is probably greater than many on a higher income but unfortunately it is not something that is taken into account.

[john terry1001]

2 minutes ago, innosiem said:

i have been here long enough to know exactly what Jomtien immigration is like
something i would myself prefer to avoid

Who mentioned Jomtien (who actually have been good everytime I've been there). I mentioned Chonburi but my local IO is actually Si Racha and I've split between the two IO's over the years.. 

 

[innosiem]

1 minute ago, sandyf said:

"each to their own"

You are exactly right, it is an individual choice but unfortunately there are some that take a bit of an elitist view over extensions and will put forward any argument they can.

I spent the first 6 years here on ME and only changed to marriage extension when I got caught up in the 2014 UK passport fiasco. 

Whichever method you chose you have to live with the consequences of your decision should any changes come about. Changes to the extension requirements resulted in me going back to a ME visa. Ironically the rule that prevented extension renewal is not applicable now I have a visa.

When it comes to the extension requirements I am on what would be seen as a borderline income and the 'superior than thou' brigade are of the opinion that I shouldn't be here. I have had my own home for over 10 years, other than my wife no dependents, and do not have a vehicle. My disposable income is probably greater than many on a higher income but unfortunately it is not something that is taken into account.

Agreed,
the 'superior than thou' brigade are usually living off pensions and savings

for myself, the only fiat i hold is for spending 
my money is all tied up in investments (property, stocks etc)
although i can
i also have no desire to tie up funds, just for the sake of tying up funds
i know its only 400k, but the act of doing this is illogical to myself
especially when i can get by without doing it
and i travel so frequently, a day in Laos is not an issue and much preferred over a day at immigration

however if i do need to get a one year extension due to the current situation
i can easily do so
if i have a choice (awaiting announcement), i will choose not too.

[innosiem]

10 minutes ago, john terry1001 said:

Who mentioned Jomtien (who actually have been good everytime I've been there). I mentioned Chonburi but my local IO is actually Si Racha and I've split between the two IO's over the years.. 

 

why would i state anything about any immigration office i CANNOT use ?

i mentioned Jomtien as that would be the office i would need to visit
i then proceeded to state
"something i would MYSELF prefer to avoid"

Every other office is of no concern to myself
the same applies when i consider what visa i want to use etc.
(not forgetting the reports on TVF of Jomtien IO being problematic for 1 year marriage extensions if not through an agent)
i will take a week away relaxing over a day at Jomtien immigration, any day.
 

[checkered flag]

14 minutes ago, innosiem said:

i have been here long enough to know exactly what Jomtien immigration is like
something i would myself prefer to avoid

each to their own
what you fail at understanding is
not everyone is you
what may work best for you
is not preferred by others
i do ALWAYS STILL HAVE THE 1 YEAR OPTION
if i choose to go that route

People that are prepared have little problem with Immigration. For those who can't handle paperwork an agent is probably a better choice. 

I believe many using border bumps were just trying to avoid the money in the Thai bank. Sorry so now you sweat and aren't so clever after all. 

[checkered flag]

6 minutes ago, innosiem said:

why would i state anything about any immigration office i CANNOT use ?

i mentioned Jomtien as that would be the office i would need to visit
i then proceeded to state
"something i would MYSELF prefer to avoid"

Every other office is of no concern to myself
the same applies when i consider what visa i want to use etc.
(not forgetting the reports on TVF of Jomtien IO being problematic for 1 year marriage extensions if not through an agent)
i will take a week away relaxing over a day at Jomtien immigration, any day.
 

OK but change the tenses to past or past perfect.

[innosiem]

1 minute ago, checkered flag said:

People that are prepared have little problem with Immigration. For those who can't handle paperwork an agent is probably a better choice. 

I believe many using border bumps were just trying to avoid the money in the Thai bank. Sorry so now you sweat and aren't so clever after all. 

i got the funds in the bank
i never do border bounces
i am not "sweating"
and printing off a few sheets of paper is nothing
do you think you get ME by just turning up without any documents ?

maybe you and your observations are not as clever as you think

see the big bold letters

i do still have the option to get 60 day extension and then a 1 year extension
absolutely nothing stopping me doing so
i also have the option of catching a biz class flight somewhere
and sitting on the beach until things get back to normal (if they ever will)
IF I CHOOSE
 

[innosiem]

3 minutes ago, checkered flag said:

OK but change the tenses to past or past perfect.

how about you change your ignorant naive attitude ????

[sandyf]

8 minutes ago, checkered flag said:

People that are prepared have little problem with Immigration. For those who can't handle paperwork an agent is probably a better choice. 

I believe many using border bumps were just trying to avoid the money in the Thai bank. Sorry so now you sweat and aren't so clever after all. 

What an insulting comment, obviously a paid up member of the 'superior than thou brigade'.

[innosiem]

1 minute ago, sandyf said:

What an insulting comment, obviously a paid up member of the 'superior than thou brigade'.

it is always funny when you read comments from pensioners
who think they are minted and everyone else must be skint????
 

[innosiem]

For those yet to see the glimmer of hope

https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/1173359-cabinet-to-consider-extending-visas-beyond-july-31-for-stranded-foreigners/

[checkered flag]

2 minutes ago, innosiem said:

i got the funds in the bank
i never do border bounces
i am not "sweating"
and printing off a few sheets of paper is nothing
do you think you get ME by just turning up without any documents ?

maybe you and your observations are not as clever as you think

see the big bold letters

i do still have the option to get 60 day extension and then a 1 year extension
absolutely nothing stopping me doing so
i also have the option of catching a biz class flight somewhere
and sitting on the beach until things get back to normal (if they ever will)
IF I CHOOSE
 

I also fly business or first class and keep about 2M baht in the Thai bank. I also do a US SS transfer monthly that more than covers the required foreign transfers. It's very easy pleasey. I can easily pay an agent but can do it myself without a problem. I make a point on doing things correctly the first time and rarely need help, but I speak proper Thai and the IO show me respect. My wife who is fluent in English might go with me but doesn't need to help. Once the IO was trying to translate something into English my wife sat down and helped and the IO has asked her to help explain to applicants, if they are having trouble with the IO's English. The IO officers refer to my wife respectfully as auntie. 

Always had positive experiences at Immigration and wonder why some don't.

[checkered flag]

14 minutes ago, sandyf said:

What an insulting comment, obviously a paid up member of the 'superior than thou brigade'.

If that's what you say it OK? At least superior to the complainers and malcontents.

[innosiem]

42 minutes ago, checkered flag said:

I also fly business or first class and keep about 2M baht in the Thai bank. I also do a US SS transfer monthly that more than covers the required foreign transfers. It's very easy pleasey. I can easily pay an agent but can do it myself without a problem. I make a point on doing things correctly the first time and rarely need help, but I speak proper Thai and the IO show me respect. My wife who is fluent in English might go with me but doesn't need to help. Once the IO was trying to translate something into English my wife sat down and helped and the IO has asked her to help explain to applicants, if they are having trouble with the IO's English. The IO officers refer to my wife respectfully as auntie. 

Always had positive experiences at Immigration and wonder why some don't.

you made a comment replying to mine
stating i was not clever for being on ME visa, an insult 
yet you know nothing about me or others

"I make a point on doing things correctly the first time "
so are the people with ME visas
there is nothing incorrect about them

i am not really sure what the rest of your post is about
we can drop shorts if you like
i never made any assumptions about you
but yet you are quick to assume about others

Not everyone with ME visa is "avoiding money in bank" 
some of us just choose to use ME visa
there is nothing inferior about it, it is just a preference
just as i prefer to not visit immigration, not due to negative experiences from immigration officers
but i don't queue whenever possible
so would much prefer a week away, than a half day at immigration
surrounded by moany old buggers
who think they are better than everyone else????
 

[john terry1001]

24 minutes ago, innosiem said:

you made a comment replying to mine
stating i was not clever for being on ME visa, an insult 
yet you know nothing about me or others

"I make a point on doing things correctly the first time "
so are the people with ME visas
there is nothing incorrect about them

i am not really sure what the rest of your post is about
we can drop shorts if you like
i never made any assumptions about you
but yet you are quick to assume about others

Not everyone with ME visa is "avoiding money in bank" 
some of us just choose to use ME visa
there is nothing inferior about it, it is just a preference
just as i prefer to not visit immigration, not due to negative experiences from immigration officers
but i don't queue whenever possible
so would much prefer a week away, than a half day at immigration
surrounded by moany old buggers
who think they are better than everyone else????
 

Obviously no good for you because you keep stating you choose not to have an extension and don't want to be part of the 'superior' set, but suggestions are that's the way the Government want to go.????

 

Meanwhile, Reuters is reporting that the government would offer foreigners a “grace period” until September to apply for visa extensions as it continued to ease restrictions.

 

 

“The situation in the country and overseas has improved,” Immigration Bureau Commissioner Sompong Chingduong told Reuters.

 

“So we do not propose to extend visas after July 31, but allow for visa requests from August 1 to September 26,” adding the grace period would be proposed to cabinet for approval. After which, if a request isn’t made and the visa expired, “over-staying will be considered illegal”.

 

 

[checkered flag]

10 minutes ago, john terry1001 said:

Obviously no good for you because you keep stating you choose not to have an extension and don't want to be part of the 'superior' set, but suggestions are that's the way the Government want to go.????

 

Meanwhile, Reuters is reporting that the government would offer foreigners a “grace period” until September to apply for visa extensions as it continued to ease restrictions

 

 

Same time will happen in September if this is true, but Reuters isn't the Thai government so who knows. Better be prepared.

The Superior "know it all elite" will face the music now or in September. y extension is good until April 2021 so I'm good.

[clorox]

the people that have the fund will alway gos for yearly extension, its a win win all around, you can't beat that

people that does not have the fund always go for visa and thats the facts

nobody would want to waste their time going around to getting visa and do border run

 

amnesty incoming cheer up people, just get your act together this is your last chance, hopefully everything will go back to normal in 2 month and everybody do what they do best