Trump keeps up false claims of widespread fraud at Georgia rally for U.S. senators

[Jeffr2]

https://apnews.com/article/how-trump-supporters-spread-false-claims-8cf62c15893c4e8878a471e99ee81459

Dangerously viral: How Trump, supporters spread false claims

"The cellphone video shot in the dark by a woman in a parked car appeared to show something ominous: a man closing the doors of a white van and then rolling a wagon with a large box into a Detroit election center.

 

Within hours, the 90-second clip was being shared on news sites and conservative YouTube accounts, offered as apparent proof that illegal votes were being smuggled in after polls closed. Prominent Republicans, including Eric Trump, one of the president’s sons, amplified the falsehoods on social media. Within a day, views of the video shot up past a million.

 

That single video serves as a powerful emblem of the trafficking in false information that has plagued the presidential election won by Joe Biden. In other videos, photos and social media posts, supporters of President Donald Trump, and most notably the incumbent himself, have raised doubts about the outcome based on problems that did not occur."

Edited December 7, 2020 by onthedarkside
quote of hidden post removed

[newatthis]

https://www.clickondetroit.com/news/politics/2020/12/04/evidence-hearsay-voter-fraud-claims-in-affidavits-explained/

Edited December 7, 2020 by onthedarkside
quote of hidden post removed

[Isaan sailor]

Let the Supremes have at it.

[onthedarkside]

Numerous post have been removed:  unsubstantiated claims, personal comments, trolling, bickering, etc etc. And replies to the preceding.

 

In dozens of legal cases filed around the country by the Trump campaign and surrogates, not one thus far has produced any evidence found credible by a judge of significant fraud that would change any state's presidential election results.

[Sujo]

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

He has the right, IMO, to say whatever he likes ( freedom of speech ) and to pursue legal redress as far as he can. Surely you don't deny that?

 

If it was illegal for politicians to lie, not many would be outside jail, IMO.

He has provided no evidence in any of his court cases so yes he should be denied use of the courts by being declared a vexatious litigant.

[placeholder]

2 hours ago, Tippaporn said:

The GA Senators have concluded that fraud was indeed, in their words, not mine, systemic after listening to testimonies and other evidence.  And as this is now their conviction then hence the call for a special session.

 

If fraud was indeed systemic, as they believe the evidence was sufficient in proof, then the argument of "overturning the will if the people" cannot apply since allowing said fraud would be overturning the will of the people who voted for Trump and won.

 

If have no dog in this race.  My interest is only in what's right and truthful.  I'm apolitical.  I do support Trump though.  I feel no shame and am not apologetic for seeing Trump in a much different light than many of the posters here see him.

You sure about that. One of them at least seems to have some misgivings:

Loeffler sidesteps debate question on Trump's claims of 'rigged' election

Sen. Kelly Loeffler (R-Ga.) declined on Sunday to say whether she supports President Trump's claims that the 2020 presidential election was rigged against him.

"It's vitally important that Georgians trust our elections process, and the president has every right to every legal recourse, and that's what's taking place," Loeffler said during a televised debate against her Democratic opponent, the Rev. Raphael Warnock, when asked whether she backs Trump's claims that the election results had been marred by widespread fraud and malfeasance.

Loeffler also did not say whether she supports Trump's demand that Georgia Gov. Brian Kemp (R) call a special session of the state's General Assembly in an effort to overturn the results of the election.

Loeffler sidesteps debate question on Trump's claims of 'rigged' election (msn.com)

Edited December 7, 2020 by placeholder

[Sujo]

21 minutes ago, Isaan sailor said:

Let the Supremes have at it.

They wont take it.

[onthedarkside]

A name calling post regarding Trump has been removed along with an off-topic music reference post. And an extremely long quotation post that violated forum "fair use" posting rules.

 

Folks, let's stay ON TOPIC here, avoid derogatory name calling, avoid bickering, avoid posting unsubstantiated claims and info.

 

[Walker88]

2 hours ago, Neeranam said:

I thought unsubstantiated claims were not allowed here. 

 

 

Do you not find the irony in your statement, where you seem to be holding an obscure forum to a higher standard than the President of the United States?

[JulesMad]

He is only capable of lying and his lies are also very bad! Only idiots believe him... It says a lot about usa that there are 70 million of them ????

[candide]

5 hours ago, Tippaporn said:

Uhm, please point out the BS in my post.  Specifically.

 

Also, if you haven't noticed this special session could result in the State legislature reclaiming their power to choose electors.  So courts at this point are not in play any longer.  If the GA legislature decides that there was sufficient fraud, which they've obviously recognized as this emergency session evidences, then they will appoint electors to vote for Trump.

 

What potentially happens here could very well set a precedent for other states to follow.  The first one is always the hardest.

 

Please, please tell me what part of my post is BS.  I'd love to hear your valid points.

And that would be cheating by overturning democratic vote in the absence of legally recognized evidence.

[Kelsall]

There appears to be no way at this point Trump will be able to prove fraud in the time frame required to keep him in the White House.  IMO the best he can do is appoint a special prosecutor to investigate the alleged fraud after he, Trump, is out.  A proper investigation will need subpoena powers and will take years.

[candide]

10 minutes ago, Kelsall said:

There appears to be no way at this point Trump will be able to prove fraud in the time frame required to keep him in the White House.  IMO the best he can do is appoint a special prosecutor to investigate the alleged fraud after he, Trump, is out.  A proper investigation will need subpoena powers and will take years.

A proper investigation needs to be properly predicated. You should know as Barr insisted enough on this point. There's nothing to properly predicate an investigation. Trump's lies are not enough!

Edited December 7, 2020 by candide

[Tounge Thaied]

7 minutes ago, Kelsall said:

There appears to be no way at this point Trump will be able to prove fraud in the time frame required to keep him in the White House.  IMO the best he can do is appoint a special prosecutor to investigate the alleged fraud after he, Trump, is out.  A proper investigation will need subpoena powers and will take years.

You are likely right... the reality is getting to the truth within the next week before the electoral college meets on the 14th is pretty slim. I can tell you however, 70 million people have just lost all faith in any semblance of a legitimate "democracy" in America. I personally would never vote for Trump or Biden and have seen the writing on the wall with this now defunct left vs. right, divide and rule, duopoly for many years now. But, this event solidifies my sentiment here for millions now. It was a great run... right up until America shot its own benevolent President and his brother. 

[Berkshire]

21 minutes ago, Kelsall said:

There appears to be no way at this point Trump will be able to prove fraud in the time frame required to keep him in the White House.  IMO the best he can do is appoint a special prosecutor to investigate the alleged fraud after he, Trump, is out.  A proper investigation will need subpoena powers and will take years.

I'm glad that you're finally seeing the light.  As for your recommendations of an investigation post-Trump....I would welcome that.  Investigate away.  The problem is that elections are largely a state function.  The federal government really isn't involved.  For states to devote significant time and resources trying to find fraud when they know none exist....will be a hard sell. 

[Sujo]

14 minutes ago, Tounge Thaied said:

You are likely right... the reality is getting to the truth within the next week before the electoral college meets on the 14th is pretty slim. I can tell you however, 70 million people have just lost all faith in any semblance of a legitimate "democracy" in America. I personally would never vote for Trump or Biden and have seen the writing on the wall with this now defunct left vs. right, divide and rule, duopoly for many years now. But, this event solidifies my sentiment here for millions now. It was a great run... right up until America shot its own benevolent President and his brother. 

But thete already is evidence of widespread fraud. Isnt there?

 

Trump said it. Is he lying?

[Berkshire]

22 minutes ago, Tounge Thaied said:

You are likely right... the reality is getting to the truth within the next week before the electoral college meets on the 14th is pretty slim. I can tell you however, 70 million people have just lost all faith in any semblance of a legitimate "democracy" in America. I personally would never vote for Trump or Biden and have seen the writing on the wall with this now defunct left vs. right, divide and rule, duopoly for many years now. But, this event solidifies my sentiment here for millions now. It was a great run... right up until America shot its own benevolent President and his brother. 

I keep hearing about this "70 million" who voted for Trump and are all bummed-out.  Firstly, over 80 million voted for Biden...which is why he won.  But in EVERY election, there will be millions who voted for the losing candidate.  Clinton, Romney, McCain, Kerry, Gore, and now Trump voters, yeah, that's the way a democracy works.  But if Trump voters don't ever want to vote again....well, that would be fine by me.

[Kelsall]

1 hour ago, Berkshire said:

I'm glad that you're finally seeing the light.  As for your recommendations of an investigation post-Trump....I would welcome that.  Investigate away.  The problem is that elections are largely a state function.  The federal government really isn't involved.  For states to devote significant time and resources trying to find fraud when they know none exist....will be a hard sell. 

Mueller.  Russian.  Collusion.  

[Sujo]

Just now, Kelsall said:

Mueller.  Russian.  Collusion.  

Which was found to be true. Even the republican led inquiry found it true. The russians interfered.

 

Don jnr and his friends colluded with them but mueller considered them too stupid to elevate it to a conspiracy which is a crime.

 

Perhaps read more.

[Somchai Jackson]

7 hours ago, Jeffr2 said:

Jeez.  Ya just don't give up.  Time to catch up.  It's over. 

 

Please, stop posting this BS stuff.  Every legal petition brought up by Team Trump has been shot down.  You do realize this, don't you?  I'm guessing not....

The fraudster should be removed from office immediately and his supporters outed and publicly ridiculed.  He makes a mockery of true blue democracy.

[J Town]

I used to work for a guy who defended Micro$oft OS this way:

You just keep chipping away, fixing what doesn't work, and you're left with a good product.  The election process is working as it should. The weaknesses are being identified due to an attack by a ruthless dictator wannabe. After the dust has settled from Biden swearing in on 20 January, lawmakers need to pull together and fix what doesn't work.

[J Town]

15 minutes ago, Somchai Jackson said:

The fraudster should be removed from office immediately and his supporters outed and publicly ridiculed.  He makes a mockery of true blue democracy.

It's too late at this point. The gutless Republican Senate blindly backed him. Let this comedy/tragedy play out. He will be removed willingly or not noon 20 Jan 2021.

[newatthis]

1 hour ago, Berkshire said:

I keep hearing about this "70 million" who voted for Trump and are all bummed-out.  Firstly, over 80 million voted for Biden...which is why he won.  But in EVERY election, there will be millions who voted for the losing candidate.  Clinton, Romney, McCain, Kerry, Gore, and now Trump voters, yeah, that's the way a democracy works.  But if Trump voters don't ever want to vote again....well, that would be fine by me.

Didn’t Lin Wood tell them not to vote in the Senate run offs in Georgia. Hallelujah! Do as Lin said, GOPs.

[Purdey]

While debate on Thai Visa is hot on this issue, I have a minor legal question that perhaps someone who knows could clarify. I noticed that Trump keeps referring to the election being "rigged"  or the "rigged election". Meanwhile, scribes on Thai Visa refers to it as a "fraudulent election".

Is it true that Trump's advisors have told him not to use the term "fraud" because that is a specific legal term used by courts and he could be in trouble later for making false accusations? I dont think the word "rigged" is used by American courts but feel free to correct me.

And please be polite. I genuinely want to know.

[PatOngo]

2 hours ago, Sujo said:

Trump said it. Is he lying?

Did his lips move?

[PatOngo]

1 hour ago, Kelsall said:

Mueller.  Russian.  Collusion.  

Biden. Election. Winner! 

[Walker88]

1 hour ago, candide said:

A proper investigation needs to be properly predicated. You should know as Barr insisted enough on this point. There's nothing to properly predicate an investigation. Trump's lies are not enough!

That is the key. The AG, who is as sympathetic to the POTUS as any AG ever, including Bobby Kennedy, stated that "there is insufficient evidence of fraud to overturn the results of the election". Since it would be the AG who appoints a Special Prosecutor, it's unlikely it will ever happen.

 

There is equal evidence Martians stuffed ballots, and the AG is unlikely to begin a probe of Mars. Silly allegations, with no basis in fact or reality, do not deserve additional investigation. The courts have so far ruled 1-49 against even entertaining a hearing, and some of the judges handing 45 his defeats were appointed by him.

 

Though it was touch and go for a while, the institutions seem to be holding despite the wild and bizarre onslaught by 45.

[Sujo]

22 minutes ago, Purdey said:

While debate on Thai Visa is hot on this issue, I have a minor legal question that perhaps someone who knows could clarify. I noticed that Trump keeps referring to the election being "rigged"  or the "rigged election". Meanwhile, scribes on Thai Visa refers to it as a "fraudulent election".

Is it true that Trump's advisors have told him not to use the term "fraud" because that is a specific legal term used by courts and he could be in trouble later for making false accusations? I dont think the word "rigged" is used by American courts but feel free to correct me.

And please be polite. I genuinely want to know.

No, he cant be prosecuted as president. No prosecutor would waste time on that anyway. Its an opinion. Dont worry yourself on such things. They dont really matter.

 

What is significant is if his legal team go to court with fraud allegations and produce nothing. That has ramifications on them. As legal practitioners they can be sanctioned or barred for making false claims to a court.

[Walker88]

1 hour ago, Kelsall said:

Mueller.  Russian.  Collusion.  

True that, though 'collusion' is a made up term. Willful cooperation is more accurate.

 

That willful cooperation was detailed not only in Mueller's Report, but much more in depth by the Republican-led SSCI, which issued a 1000 page report that noted 147 instances of contacts with Russians and Russian operatives that every single person on 45's team failed to note on their SF86 clearance applications.

 

The SSCI report also noted that stone had kept 45 abreast of what Wikileaks had and when it was going to be announced. 45 had perjured himself in his written Mueller testimony by denying that fact. barr chose not to pursue that perjury, despite what SSCI published. The next AG may well pursue it, which is another reason 45 keeps talking about a pardon, because that perjury is a Federal crime.

 

SSCI also detailed the manafort flight to Spain where he gave Russian asset Konstantin Kilimnik detailed internal polling data, which was subsequently forwarded to the GRU-led Internet Research Agency, who then microtargeted voters in key swing States with false material on HRC. manafort did not fly to Spain for the tapas and Rioja, so that is more willful cooperation.

 

The SSCI report is long, but worth reading and particularly damning.

[Isaan sailor]

For Americans to come together, vote harvesting, blocking observers, and sending ballots out to everyone, unrequested will have to have a hard look.