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AEC Decides To Prosecute Former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra


sriracha john

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Okay, so let's think this one through.

Most likely almost all of Thaksin's money is out of Thailand, although I remember his wife applying to get some of it out a while ago, right? So, his billions are safe.

His children are still in Thailand, right? They were served with a tax bill recently. That ties up some or all of the remaining money here, but again, I'm sure just a small fraction of the money is even in Thailand. Maybe just enough for his children. So, the government knows they won't get much or any money from him.

There are rumors he may return to run for office again. Let's say he does, do these new legal proceedings prevent that from hapening or at least dimish his reputation? Possible reasons to file these charges.

What else? To prevent Thaksin from even coming back to Thailand in the first place and ward off any attempts of him thinking of returning.

Not sure any of this applies, but maybe a combination of the above.

Your thoughts????

Toxin's power base is North and Northeast Thailand and these people still believe in Toxin...I was in

Udon Thani 2 weeks ago and friends told me that the drugs are back and that they missed Toxin...He still has a huge support base and I still feel there is a real chance that he will come back and resume his politics with massive support from the North...

And I think that the junta also has this same idea.. To bring charges against Toxin and then not get a conviction is almost the same thing as signing your death warrant(politically speaking).. It is simple to indict, but to convict, win all the appeals and place him in jail is a very large undertaking.

IMHO, the day Toxin returns, there will be thousands of people at the airport to welcome his return...

OR.... perhaps not:

Low Support for Thaksin's Return to Thailand

(Angus Reid) Global Monitor - Very few people in Thailand would welcome Thaksin Shinawatra’s return to the country, according to a poll by ABAC. Only 16 per cent of respondents think the deposed prime minister should go back immediately to help solve problems, such as the current the economic slowdown.

Conversely, 24 per cent of respondents believe Thaksin should not return because this could spark episodes of violence in the unstable nation, while 23 per cent think the deposed prime minister should wait at least a couple of years before considering going back to his country.

Polling Data

Should former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra return to Thailand?

No, because peace has not been achieved in the country and

his return could spark further divisions among the people

24%

Thaksin should wait for up to two years after a general

election to be held in December before returning

23%

Thaksin should return immediately to help solve problems,

such as the current the economic slowdown

16%

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Was wondering when a thread was going to appear about his matter.

This issue was broadcast by ITV on May 7 but oddly not too much coverage in either The Post or The Nation..

If mr. T doesnt return by him self, maybe the UK would extradite him.

Exciting times ahead.

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Thaksin's entire cabinet faces indictment over controversial telecom fees decision

The Assets Examination Committee will today discuss indicting the Thaksin Shinawatra cabinet over its controversial decision in 2003 to convert telecom concession fees to excise tax, an AEC source said yesterday.

The source, who did not want to be named, revealed that the AEC committee meeting last week had seriously discussed whether to indict the whole Cabinet as suggested by some members. "The labour unions of CAT Telecom and TOT asked us to investigate the exercise of power, not the increase in Thaksin Shinawatra's assets, after the Cabinet decision [to convert telecom concession fees to excise tax]. But the AEC decided to indict only Thaksin as we can indict the others later," the AEC source said.

The source also said the entire Cabinet should be held accountable, especially former information and communication technology minister Surapong Suebwonglee as he was the one who had proposed the idea to the Cabinet.

An AEC fact-finding committee chaired by Kaewsan Atibhodi found probable cause to suspect graft violations stemming from the 2003 move. The panel recommended the AEC launch an indictment hearing to name the culprits and spell out charges - a mandatory pre-trial step.

Last Tuesday, the AEC agreed that Thaksin should be charged with malfeasance. The Cabinet's decision, which was recently revoked by the current government, allowed all private telecom operators to deduct part of their concession fees to be paid as excise before sharing the remaining concession fees with the state concession owners.

The AEC had earlier indicted the whole cabinet for its resolution in the rubber sapling project.

In a separate case, the AEC is scheduled to consider appointing an investigation panel for alleged irregularities related to the Airport Link project.

Kaewsan, who chairs the fact-finding panel, said the committee found the State Railway of Thailand had a contract to pay Bt1.6 billion to the contractor but actually paid only Bt400 million while Bt1.2 billion was missing.

The AEC is also scheduled today to consider its fact-finding committee's proposal to indict Thaksin and his wife Pojaman for her Ratchadaphisek land purchase.

However, chairman of the fact-finding committee, Udom Fuangfung, said the AEC must first consider whether to accept their rebuttals. Thaksin and his wife Pojaman let their lawyer, Pichit Chuenban, rebut the sub-committee's conclusion and Udom's remark that the land could be seized.

Pichit said Udom's statement that the panel would recommend the court seize the land was "unlawful and lacked morality".

Udom said the AEC did not force the Financial Institutions Development Fund, a branch of the Bank of Thailand (BOT) that sold the land to Pojaman, to file a complaint against the accused people but the BOT governor had agreed to file a complaint based on the panel's conclusion.

He said Thaksin did watch over the FIDF when he was in the post. If he didn't, he would not have claimed many of his accomplishments by praising the FIDF in his weekly radio programmes.

Bancha Khaengkhan

The Nation

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Was wondering when a thread was going to appear about his matter.

This issue was broadcast by ITV on May 7 but oddly not too much coverage in either The Post or The Nation..

If mr. T doesnt return by him self, maybe the UK would extradite him.

Exciting times ahead.

I am not sure a propos the possibility of UK extradition whether you are (A) joking (B)UK has an extradition treaty with Thailand.

Anyway rest assured that there is no possibility of Thaksin being extradited from the UK to Thailand.Reason is of course that it would be laughably easy for any capable lawyer to demonstrate the proposed action was politically motivated, regardless of Thaksin's alleged offences.Add to this the perception in the civilised world, in my view a correct one, that this government is illegal and undemocratic and the prospect of extradition vanishes altogether.

If Thaksin decides to come and face his accusers voluntarily that is another matter.However I would lay money on a compromise deal being struck at some point in which Thaksin could return and not face charges.

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As Thaksin is an honorable man of his word, there should be no need to extradite him:

Thaksin Willing To Stand Trial

When he does stand trial and IF he is found not guilty, then once again, as a moral and righteous man whose word is his bond, there should be no need to worry about him re-entering the political arena:

Former Thai PM Thaksin: "I'm Calling It Quits"

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UK probably won't extradite Thaksin but he might be detained from some other countries he frequently travels to.

Judging by Rakesh Saksena case, life in exile fighting extradition requests for years with no end in sight is not how Thaksin wants to spend his retirement.

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UK probably won't extradite Thaksin but he might be detained from some other countries he frequently travels to.

Judging by Rakesh Saksena case, life in exile fighting extradition requests for years with no end in sight is not how Thaksin wants to spend his retirement.

I disagree completely.Lets's assume China,US,Australia,Japan,EEC,Indonesia,Singapore,Malaysia are the main countries he travels to.Not one of these countries would dream of detaining Thaksin let alone extraditing him -for the same reasons the UK wouldn't.Have you become so blinded by prejudice that you can't recognise that legitimate governments with a popular mandate don't respond to extradition requests fom unelected juntas like Burma or Thailand?Can't you understand that most of these governments, while accepting the current status quo, regard Thaksin as having more legitimacy than the current bunch.

The comparison with Rakesh Saksena is inappropriate as you well know.He was a small time crook:Thaksin,whatever his faults, was a popularly elected Prime Minister.

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There's a popular pressure on the junta to prosecute Thaksin, besides it has never been about the money in the first place.

Surely Thaksin will find lots of willing help, even among the judiciary, with his generous offers but in post Thaksin Thailand most people would not want to be seen as his supporters (or undercurrents) with the junta breathing down their necks and mobs outside hungering for blood.

Thaksin has not other options, though. If he doesnt' put up a legal fight he can say good bye to his assets.

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Was wondering when a thread was going to appear about his matter.

This issue was broadcast by ITV on May 7 but oddly not too much coverage in either The Post or The Nation..

If mr. T doesnt return by him self, maybe the UK would extradite him.

Exciting times ahead.

I am not sure a propos the possibility of UK extradition whether you are (A) joking (B)UK has an extradition treaty with Thailand.

Anyway rest assured that there is no possibility of Thaksin being extradited from the UK to Thailand.Reason is of course that it would be laughably easy for any capable lawyer to demonstrate the proposed action was politically motivated, regardless of Thaksin's alleged offences.Add to this the perception in the civilised world, in my view a correct one, that this government is illegal and undemocratic and the prospect of extradition vanishes altogether.

If Thaksin decides to come and face his accusers voluntarily that is another matter.However I would lay money on a compromise deal being struck at some point in which Thaksin could return and not face charges.

He always was a coward when it came to face to face situations. Never accepted a live debate with opposing leaders, too many questions he did not want to answer. He ran away from journalists and even resorted to running his government by teleconference when in a squeeze and hiding. Sometimes he simply refused to talk to journalists for a whole week or came up with that insulting little X sign he held up when drilled with questions, only answering to what he could and liked. The man had the courage of a shivering chihuahua with legal action to compensate for teeth and a bite.

A deal would render the coup and all lengthy legal procedures meaningless. He'd better not wager his fortune on that and come home standing up like a man instead of crawling around like a snake.

UK probably won't extradite Thaksin but he might be detained from some other countries he frequently travels to.

Judging by Rakesh Saksena case, life in exile fighting extradition requests for years with no end in sight is not how Thaksin wants to spend his retirement.

I disagree completely.Lets's assume China,US,Australia,Japan,EEC,Indonesia,Singapore,Malaysia are the main countries he travels to.Not one of these countries would dream of detaining Thaksin let alone extraditing him -for the same reasons the UK wouldn't.Have you become so blinded by prejudice that you can't recognise that legitimate governments with a popular mandate don't respond to extradition requests fom unelected juntas like Burma or Thailand?Can't you understand that most of these governments, while accepting the current status quo, regard Thaksin as having more legitimacy than the current bunch.

The comparison with Rakesh Saksena is inappropriate as you well know.He was a small time crook:Thaksin,whatever his faults, was a popularly elected Prime Minister.

Until he dissolved parliament, hastily declared elections which were invalidated and saw it's Election Commissioners jailed, pre-coup.

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Thaksin has not other options, though. If he doesnt' put up a legal fight he can say good bye to his assets.

Before he says goodbye to his assets, the government must prove that they are his assets. The shares sold to Temasek were transferred to his adult children. They are the ones paying the taxes and assuming they do, it will be difficult for the government to take their assets away because of the actions of their father. Legally, they should be able to move their money wherever they wish.

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Assets examiners to press for charges against ex-PM, wife

p29390.peg

Thailand's Assets Examination Committee (AEC) resolved Monday to ask the Office of the Attorney General to file a criminal charge against former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra and his wife for allegedly abusing powers to purchase a plot of land in Bangkok's Ratchadaphisek area at a favourable price several years ago.

AEC secretary Kaewsan Atibodhi said the deposed prime minister and his wife had allegedly breached the Criminal Code by buying the tract of land for Bt772 million whereas neither Mr. Thaksin, who was then a government official, nor his spouse were legally permitted to engage in commercial transactions with any state agency, which in this case was referred to the Financial Institutions Development Fund (FIDF).

The AEC suggested that the Office of the Attorney General proceed to have the land as well as the funds used for its purchase to be confiscated by court order, he said.

The asset examiners also resolved that the Department of Special Investigation and the National Counter-Corruption Commission probe whether or not any officials of the FIDF may be charged as accessories and face criminal or disciplinary charges.

Meanwhile, the AEC also endorsed malfeasance charges launched against former transport minister Suriya Jungrungreangkit and former State Railway of Thailand (SRT) governor Chitsanti Thanasophon involving the SRT's so-called Airport Rail Link project.

AEC spokesman Sak Korsaengruang said the committee had endorsed the charges following a probe by a subcommittee of the former transport minister, the former railway chief and two officials of the state enterprise for allegedly abusing their powers in providing Bt1.2 billion in what the SRT called an interest payment to a firm contracted to build a mass transit system linking Suvarnabhumi Airport with downtown Bangkok.

The AEC said the parties had allegedly breached the Criminal Code by circumventing a cabinet resolution involving the Airport Link project and altering the bidding terms for the contractor by exempting lending fees which would otherwise have benefited the SRT.

Source: TNA - 15 May 2007

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China,US,Australia,Japan,EEC,Indonesia,Singapore,Malaysia are the main countries he travels to.Not one of these countries would dream of detaining Thaksin let alone extraditing him -for the same reasons the UK wouldn't.Have you become so blinded by prejudice that you can't recognise that legitimate governments with a popular mandate don't respond to extradition requests fom unelected juntas like Burma or Thailand?Can't you understand that most of these governments, while accepting the current status quo, regard Thaksin as having more legitimacy than the current bunch.

China, Malaysia, and Singapore will be the first ones to serve him with a warrant. Thaksin doesn't have any legitimacy anywhere, he is not running a government in exile. There's not a country in the world that does not recognise Thailand's government and would refuse to honor any mutually signed laws, including extradition laws (if they exist).

The comparison with Rakesh Saksena is inappropriate as you well know.He was a small time crook:Thaksin,whatever his faults, was a popularly elected Prime Minister.
Rakesh is fighting extradition charges from Canada and his freedom of movement is severely restricted. Thaksin would be fighting extradition on the same grounds as Saxena against roughly the same charges.

At the time of the coup Thaksin was NOT a populary elected Prime Minister, have you forgotten?

Before he says goodbye to his assets, the government must prove that they are his assets. The shares sold to Temasek were transferred to his adult children.

The government does not need to prove anything - it will confiscate the assets from whoever's holding them. It's up to Thaksin to decide whether they were really his or he said good bye to them already, when he transferred the shares.

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The government does not need to prove anything - it will confiscate the assets from whoever's holding them. It's up to Thaksin to decide whether they were really his or he said good bye to them already, when he transferred the shares.

I was referring to Thailand, not Burma. If the junta in Thailand is going to follow the rule of law as they have said, then they must prove in a court of law that an illegal share transfer occurred.

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China, Malaysia, and Singapore will be the first ones to serve him with a warrant. Thaksin doesn't have any legitimacy anywhere, he is not running a government in exile. There's not a country in the world that does not recognise Thailand's government and would refuse to honor any mutually signed laws, including extradition laws (if they exist).

That might be true under a legitimate government in a future Thailand. But right at the moment I dont think foreign governments are quite ready to jump in bed with the current ruling ruling military junta in Thailand.

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China, Malaysia, and Singapore will be the first ones to serve him with a warrant. Thaksin doesn't have any legitimacy anywhere, he is not running a government in exile. There's not a country in the world that does not recognise Thailand's government and would refuse to honor any mutually signed laws, including extradition laws (if they exist).

That might be true under a legitimate government in a future Thailand. But right at the moment I dont think foreign governments are quite ready to jump in bed with the current ruling ruling military junta in Thailand.

From what I have read recently the USA I starting to soften it’s stance on the junta as it does appear the promise and timetable for elections seems more likely. But certainly Thaksin may still try or continue to try to put a bad taste in the mouth with misinformation with his hired hands.

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China,US,Australia,Japan,EEC,Indonesia,Singapore,Malaysia are the main countries he travels to.Not one of these countries would dream of detaining Thaksin let alone extraditing him -for the same reasons the UK wouldn't.Have you become so blinded by prejudice that you can't recognise that legitimate governments with a popular mandate don't respond to extradition requests fom unelected juntas like Burma or Thailand?Can't you understand that most of these governments, while accepting the current status quo, regard Thaksin as having more legitimacy than the current bunch.

China, Malaysia, and Singapore will be the first ones to serve him with a warrant. Thaksin doesn't have any legitimacy anywhere, he is not running a government in exile. There's not a country in the world that does not recognise Thailand's government and would refuse to honor any mutually signed laws, including extradition laws (if they exist).

You are right that Thaksin is no longer Prime Minister, nor does he head any kind of government in exile.However this is beside the point on the extradition question.

You have however no evidence at all that China,Malaysia and Singapore would take the action you suggest not because they are well disposed to Thaksin (although I suspect they might be) but because the current Thai government -like that of Burma- is in a wretched kind of half life and lacks any kind of international respect given its deplorable record.Nevertheless it is unlikely that even this slow witted government would seek extradition given the almost certain refusal (probably in the form of endless prevarication) any demand would entail.As de Gaulle pointed many years ago, out the state is a cold monster and these countries are dictated by their own self interest.As far as they are concerned, a popularly elected leader was deposed by an undemocratic military coup.

China for example is indifferent to the democratic element but is well aware that say in five years time the feudalists, dead beat generals and assorted dinosaurs could be scattered and a Thaksinite party back in power again (remember TRT was a very broad coalition).They are not fools.

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I believe any country with extradition treaty with Thailand has certain domestic provisions that need to be satisfied. In case of the EU, for example, they won't extradite anyone anywhere if that person faces the possibility of a death penalty.

Saxena argues that his life will be under threat in Thailand. That worked well for a while as there were lots of calls for his blood in Thai society. Just before the coup, however, it had become increasingly difficult to argue anymore. The coup saved him. That's Canadian rules.

Thaksin might have some measure of goodwill in some countries, but it's not the goodwill that counts, it's country's legal provisions and legal system. I doubt he will have lots of avenues to appeal in China or Singapore and generally no ASEAN country will harbour him against Thailand's extradition requests.

He'll be safer in the UK. If, however, he decides to travel he might get caught somewhere, released on bail, and not allowed to leave until his legal status is cleared by local authorities.

I'm not sure he'd be allowed to leave the UK in the first place, for the rest of his life.

What a dreadful predicament!!!

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Thaksin might have some measure of goodwill in some countries, but it's not the goodwill that counts, it's country's legal provisions and legal system. I doubt he will have lots of avenues to appeal in China or Singapore and generally no ASEAN country will harbour him against Thailand's extradition requests.

We will simply have to disagree on this then.My view is that you don't have a shred of evidence for this, and in any event what you suggest is politically out of the question.I suspect you know this.

In any event I don't think the question will arise.My guess is that at some point Thaksin will return to face the music or will patch up a deal of some sort.

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In any event I don't think the question will arise.My guess is that at some point Thaksin will return to face the music or will patch up a deal of some sort.

If some sort of deal is arranged, it will almost certainly involve castration of his political balls, once and for all.

But my preference is to see him given a fair trial and then put behind bars. :o

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In any event I don't think the question will arise.My guess is that at some point Thaksin will return to face the music or will patch up a deal of some sort.

If some sort of deal is arranged, it will almost certainly involve castration of his political balls, once and for all.

But my preference is to see him given a fair trial and then put behind bars. :o

A fair trial is not possible in Thaksin's case.

Just read up who else was shareholder in Shincorp, which was the major bank that facilitated the Temmasek deal, and you know why a major part of the evidence cannot be presented at a Thai court. Which then excludes a fair trial.

A deal will have to be arranged. And at best the castration will only be temporarily. Thaksin is not that old yet.

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Thaksin might have some measure of goodwill in some countries, but it's not the goodwill that counts, it's country's legal provisions and legal system. I doubt he will have lots of avenues to appeal in China or Singapore and generally no ASEAN country will harbour him against Thailand's extradition requests.

We will simply have to disagree on this then.My view is that you don't have a shred of evidence for this, and in any event what you suggest is politically out of the question.I suspect you know this.

Faced with a legal request from Thailand any country would have to give a legal reason not to honor it, they can't just compare Thailand to Burma and tell them to ###### off, it's not an anonimous internet discussion board out there.

I think it's common understanding that EU countries would offer better legal protection than any Asian country, except, maybe, Japan.

There must be a reason why Saxena is relying on Canadian laws and not on Malaysian or Singaporean.

It's a moot question anyway, so far it doesn't look like a jail time for Thaksin for any of the alleged offences.

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Thaksin might have some measure of goodwill in some countries, but it's not the goodwill that counts, it's country's legal provisions and legal system. I doubt he will have lots of avenues to appeal in China or Singapore and generally no ASEAN country will harbour him against Thailand's extradition requests.

We will simply have to disagree on this then.My view is that you don't have a shred of evidence for this, and in any event what you suggest is politically out of the question.I suspect you know this.

Faced with a legal request from Thailand any country would have to give a legal reason not to honor it, they can't just compare Thailand to Burma and tell them to ###### off, it's not an anonimous internet discussion board out there.

I think it's common understanding that EU countries would offer better legal protection than any Asian country, except, maybe, Japan.

There must be a reason why Saxena is relying on Canadian laws and not on Malaysian or Singaporean.

It's a moot question anyway, so far it doesn't look like a jail time for Thaksin for any of the alleged offences.

On relection, I'd like to add a few extra points.

1.If it could be demonstrated that the charges were prima facie credible,of a very seriou nature and that Thaksin would get a fair trial, extradition might in theory be considered by all the countries mentioned.I think it would be possible to demonstrate credible charges (though see 2 below) but a fair trial would be almost impossible to guarantee.In which case, and taking the political considerations I mentioned in previous post into account, i think the possibility of extradition in practice falls at the first fence.

2.Nevertheless the world is changing in some ways and there is a general feeling that cruel and arbitrary action by former rulers cannot remain unpunished.This works against Thaksin since there are two episodes for which he holds responsibility, and thus remains vulnerable.I refer of course to the Tak Bai massacre and the illegal drugs war killings.(The corruption charges and the ridiculous lese majeste accusations -which I correctly predicted would be quietly buried-won't be enough.)I suspect the abuses in the South will rightly or wrongly be linked to the so called war against terror, so Thaksin would probably get away with this.Thus we are left with the drugs killings:if a proper case could be documented and a fair trial (perhaps in a neutral jurisdiction) procured, I feel Thaksin could be brought to trial.There is a slight problem however, see 3 below.

3.The drug war killings were in general supported by the great mass of Thais, though of course police and military excesses resulting in collateral damage were regretted.However there are statements of support for the campaign on record from the very top, last two words chosen carefully.I guarantee that the Thais will never allow an open trial on charges relating to the drugs war.

4.Therefore on balance extradition is a non starter.All theoretical anyway as I think we agreed.

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a)Thaksin can theoretically mount legal defence against extradition in any country in the world.

b)Asian understanding of what a fair trial is different from the UKs.

c)I exect that Chinese legal system, for example, will not offer him indefinite protection and appeals.

d)He won't be allowed to leave the country while fighting extradition charges.

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a)Thaksin can theoretically mount legal defence against extradition in any country in the world.

b)Asian understanding of what a fair trial is different from the UKs.

c)I exect that Chinese legal system, for example, will not offer him indefinite protection and appeals.

d)He won't be allowed to leave the country while fighting extradition charges.

Oh dear, you haven't been listening and not one of my points has been addressed.Ah well.

Anyway to deal with yours.

a) Agreed

:o Nonsense.It's exactly the same notably in Malaysia and Singapore.China doesn't have a credible rule of law, and will be guided by the politics.What is this "Asian understanding" anyway? Apart from Mahathir it's a phrase usually used by the more prickly denizens of the Indian sub-continent.Come to think of it didn't Mahathir's dad come from India?

c) See :D above.The politics actually work in Thaksin's favour for reasons previously explained.

d) Irrelevant because extradition charges will never be filed.

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CNS Chairman says court will decide whether the ousted PM should show up in court

CNS Chairman denies to give a clear-cut answer whether to allow the deposed PM to return home for clarification in court.

The Army Commander in Chief and Chairman of the Council for National Security, Gen Sonthi Boonyaratklin (สนธิ บุญยรัตกลิน) says the court will make a decision whether the ousted premier and former TRT party leader Mr. Thaksin Shinawatra need to be present in person to fight corruption charges. However, the General noted, there are several alternative ways of presenting evidence to a court hearing.

Referring to the power gel found in an apartment on Charansanitwong Soi 53 Rd., CNS Chairman says that the material may not link to a relative of a key member in the Popular Campaign for Democracy. He has instructed the military and police forces to investigation the fact.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 17 May 2007

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NLA Chairman says PM and CNS have no authority to stop former PM Taksin return to Thailand

National Legislative Assembly indicates the government and CNS have no authority to seize former PM Taksin Shinanwatre return to Thailand.

The National Legislative Assembly Chairman Mr. Meechai Ruchupan (มีชัย ฤชุพันธุ์) says the interim government and Council for National Security (CNS) have no rights to reject the former premier Taksin Shinnawatre to travel back to the country as to acknowledges the lawsuit against him unless Mr.Taksin express his intention to the court and proceeds without his appearance.

NLA Chairman mentions the members of National Legislative Assembly plead to open the discussion with the interim government due to unsatisfied the government works during the past six months that the government will make clarification to the National Legislative Assembly meeting on May 24th.

The Chairman believes the political situations will be back to normal although there are demonstrations and the political party dissolution on May 30th.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 17 May 2007

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