up2you2 Posted January 4, 2022 Share Posted January 4, 2022 What is the best sand media for a Emaux filtration unit please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banglay Posted January 4, 2022 Share Posted January 4, 2022 (edited) I changed from using sand to EcoClear glass filter media....best move I did the water has never been so clear . EcoClear Coarse is a new 100% recycled, environmentally friendly media that lasts up to 3 times longer than traditional Silica sand, great benefits keeping the pool water crystal clear & environmentally friendly Saves up to 25% of water through quicker back-washing. Greater filtration capacity, longer time between back-washing. Filters down to 3 micron. Cleanest, clearest water available. Reduces bacteria growth in filter, saves on chemical usage. Electrostatic mechanical Filtering. Allows Higher flow, this improves filtration. Improves flow and reduces electrical costs. Ultra low carbon footprint Edited January 4, 2022 by banglay 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sappersrest Posted January 4, 2022 Share Posted January 4, 2022 The best silica sand is that supplied by astral or certikin, if you get sand supplied in old rice sacks you will just be getting low grade river sand that will wear out in no time at all. If your budget will run to it both of the above mentioned companies sell top quality graded recycled glass as used in many olympic facilities. Your third choice is recycled plate glass which by its nature is strong and long lasting, and should outlast sand and bottled glass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagwain Posted January 4, 2022 Share Posted January 4, 2022 I have used "Eco Clear" recycled plate glass extensively for yrs now! Best move I ever did for my pool & house side of the filtration business ! I used Zeolite for yrs however it has its pitfalls with heavy metals in the water. "Eco" doesn't have these issues! See attached brochure! However big difference between "Eco" & recycled bottle glass which I recommend to stay away from! Eco Clear.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unheard Posted January 4, 2022 Share Posted January 4, 2022 (edited) 3 hours ago, sappersrest said: If your budget will run to it both of the above mentioned companies sell top quality graded recycled glass as used in many olympic facilities. Can you provide any reference to the brand of the glass media used by olympic facilities? Recycled bottle glass media (loaded with bacteria) must be properly processed to clear up the bacterial load. Also, the olympic facilities use the "industrial" type of equipment, which is not even remotely comparable to the average private swimming pool setup. Edited January 4, 2022 by unheard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unheard Posted January 4, 2022 Share Posted January 4, 2022 2 hours ago, Bagwain said: I have used "Eco Clear" recycled plate glass extensively for yrs now! Best move I ever did for my pool & house side of the filtration business ! And what's your experience with backwashing? Even the linked brochure mentions the ecoglass' media high angularity which would be a huge impediment to proper backwashing - the angular properties of the glass don't allow the media to be lifted by the flow of the water which leads to reduced media expansion which in turn prevents proper cleaning. The sand particles don't have that problem (being well rounded in comparison). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unheard Posted January 4, 2022 Share Posted January 4, 2022 "What is the best sand media for a Emaux filtration unit please?" The following looks like a reasonably priced quality silica sand: https://www.winwinpoolshop.com/en/product/15004-11286/silica-sand-25-kgbag As for the best filtration media? The following product seems to be clicking all the right boxes, at least judging by the provided info. Don't know anything about its price or availability. https://www.waterco.com.au/pool-spa/filter-media/glass-pearls Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sappersrest Posted January 4, 2022 Share Posted January 4, 2022 1 hour ago, unheard said: Can you provide any reference to the brand of the glass media used by olympic facilities? Recycled bottle glass media (loaded with bacteria) must be properly processed to clear up the bacterial load. Also, the olympic facilities use the "industrial" type of equipment, which is not even remotely comparable to the average private swimming pool setup. Yes Astral london olympics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sappersrest Posted January 4, 2022 Share Posted January 4, 2022 1 hour ago, unheard said: And what's your experience with backwashing? Even the linked brochure mentions the ecoglass' media high angularity which would be a huge impediment to proper backwashing - the angular properties of the glass don't allow the media to be lifted by the flow of the water which leads to reduced media expansion which in turn prevents proper cleaning. The sand particles don't have that problem (being well rounded in comparison). That is the point angular filter media is better once sand gets rounded it is u/s 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sappersrest Posted January 4, 2022 Share Posted January 4, 2022 Prime brands such as astral and certikin are properly graded for filtration and are first class products , i have used many hundreds of tonnes of each, doing a rough ang ready calculation I have been responsible for a good few thousand tonnes of filter media in my working life 9 tonnes on average per filter vessel Comercial and domestic pool filtration work on exactly the same principles save for flow rates, I have been in the industry for 30 years now retired . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagwain Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 (edited) 15 hours ago, unheard said: And what's your experience with backwashing? Even the linked brochure mentions the ecoglass' media high angularity which would be a huge impediment to proper backwashing - the angular properties of the glass don't allow the media to be lifted by the flow of the water which leads to reduced media expansion which in turn prevents proper cleaning. The sand particles don't have that problem (being well rounded in comparison). Backwashing is reduced so are chemicals and salt depending on how you sanitise your pool. Your thinking is opposite to how it really works. You need angles for better filtration. "Eco Clear" doesn't hold on to biofilm so it's flushed out. Read the brochure I attached in previou reply. I also have 30 yrs in the industry but only been using "Eco Clear" glass for 6 yrs. sappersrest is corect in his replies. Edited January 5, 2022 by Bagwain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unheard Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 14 hours ago, sappersrest said: That is the point angular filter media is better once sand gets rounded it is u/s ??? I don't think I get your point. I have specifically mentioned back washing since the angular media doesn't allow the proper implementation of the process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unheard Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Bagwain said: Backwashing is reduced so are chemicals and salt depending on how you sanitise your pool. Your thinking is opposite to how it really works. You need angles for better filtration. "Eco Clear" doesn't hold on to biofilm so it's flushed out. Backwashing is related to the process of removal of trapped solid or semi-solid particles suspended in the filtering media. Backwashing requires a generally much higher water flow/pressure condition allowing the media to raise and expand, as to allow the suspended particles to dislodge from the filtering media. But the angular media won't allow to achieve the same rates of the media raise/expansion as compared to a more rounded media due to the shape of the particles, thus preventing full flushing. Glass media companies usually claim that they provide better filtration, and bio-film build-up resistance. Are there any tests to prove that (better filtration in particular)? I've seen one such test that shows otherwise - glass media providing worse than sand filtration properties. Edited January 5, 2022 by unheard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unheard Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 15 hours ago, sappersrest said: Prime brands such as astral and certikin are properly graded for filtration and are first class products , i have used many hundreds of tonnes of each, doing a rough ang ready calculation I have been responsible for a good few thousand tonnes of filter media in my working life 9 tonnes on average per filter vessel Comercial and domestic pool filtration work on exactly the same principles save for flow rates, I have been in the industry for 30 years now retired . Commercial and domestic work on the same principles but in vastly different configuration setups, with different priorities. Private and commercial pools can not be easily compared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagwain Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 22 minutes ago, unheard said: Backwashing is related to the process of removal of trapped solid or semi-solid particles suspended in the filtering media. Backwashing requires a generally much higher water flow/pressure condition allowing the media to raise and expand, as to allow the suspended particles to dislodge from the filtering media. But the angular media won't allow to achieve the same rates of the media raise/expansion as compared to a more rounded media due to the shape of the particles, thus preventing full flushing. Glass media companies usually claim that they provide better filtration, and bio-film build-up resistance. Are there any tests to prove that (better filtration in particular)? I've seen one such test that shows otherwise - glass media providing worse than sand filtration properties. I bet that was recycled bottle glass and not recycled plate glass! As sand breaks down and looses its sharp edges it is stuffed. End of story! I will stick with my experience with "Eco Clear" recycled plate glass with many dozens of happey customers! These are some results of "Eco" which filters dwon to 4-5 microns on par but actually better than DE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unheard Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 15 hours ago, sappersrest said: Yes Astral london olympics Astral doesn't seem to be anything special as glass media. And according to the test below doesn't filter as good as sand (filtration velocity: 20m/h) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagwain Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 1 minute ago, unheard said: Commercial and domestic work on the same principles but in vastly different configuration setups, with different priorities. Private and commercial pools can not be easily compared. No they don't! I have been involved with hudreds of municiple, resorts & 5 star hotel pools in 3 countries. The basically are the same however there is obviously different systems. However in most cases filtration is the same concept and proccess including backwashing. I also was involve with a project that involved Griifth University & Qld Education 's 400 + school pools! Also 2 yr project with Griffith university when the Cryptosporidium outbreak accured! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Speedhump Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 I understand that it doesn't answer the question, but I changed from a sand filter to a cartridge filter a couple of years ago. Easy to clean, water is always clear, and there's really no need to replace the paper filter every year so long your pool doesn't get very heavy use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagwain Posted January 5, 2022 Share Posted January 5, 2022 4 hours ago, unheard said: Astral doesn't seem to be anything special as glass media. And according to the test below doesn't filter as good as sand (filtration velocity: 20m/h) Make me laugh! Another Google expert! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
up2you2 Posted January 7, 2022 Author Share Posted January 7, 2022 What interest me due to the substantial difference of cost between these filter mediums, let alone the inconvenience of having to change them, is that nobody is referring to an independent review and comparison, whereby these medias have been tested under the same conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagwain Posted January 8, 2022 Share Posted January 8, 2022 21 hours ago, up2you2 said: What interest me due to the substantial difference of cost between these filter mediums, let alone the inconvenience of having to change them, is that nobody is referring to an independent review and comparison, whereby these medias have been tested under the same conditions. Well my dozens of happy customers and the obvious much better results are enough for me! I am sure sappersrest would agree with me on this with his experience! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unheard Posted January 8, 2022 Share Posted January 8, 2022 On 1/7/2022 at 10:08 AM, up2you2 said: What interest me due to the substantial difference of cost between these filter mediums, let alone the inconvenience of having to change them, is that nobody is referring to an independent review and comparison, whereby these medias have been tested under the same conditions. Most of the glass media is shown to be inferior compared to quality sand in both filtering and backwashing tests (test date: 2014) https://www.drydenaqua.com/files/pools/resources/pdf/test_results/IFTS_Report_E_Print.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagwain Posted January 9, 2022 Share Posted January 9, 2022 (edited) 15 hours ago, unheard said: Most of the glass media is shown to be inferior compared to quality sand in both filtering and backwashing tests (test date: 2014) https://www.drydenaqua.com/files/pools/resources/pdf/test_results/IFTS_Report_E_Print.pdf You obviously didn't read the article!! AFM is not sand! Bahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha Edited January 9, 2022 by Bagwain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unheard Posted January 9, 2022 Share Posted January 9, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Bagwain said: You obviously didn't read the article!! AFM is not sand! Bahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha And you obviously failed to understand or just chose to ignore the results of the test. AFM is the only glass media, out of five others, that was capable to best sand. The other five were shown to be inferior. Besides, can you tell us where in Thailand you can buy AFM, what is its cost and how many customers of yours have been benefiting from it? AFM is a completely different beast and has nothing to do with the heavily promoted by you EcoClear. And it's not being advertised as such (similaraty to AFM) in your sale brochures. EcoClear is just a "normal" glass media very similar to other 5 inferior glass medias presented in the test. Edited January 9, 2022 by unheard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagwain Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 22 hours ago, unheard said: And you obviously failed to understand or just chose to ignore the results of the test. AFM is the only glass media, out of five others, that was capable to best sand. The other five were shown to be inferior. Besides, can you tell us where in Thailand you can buy AFM, what is its cost and how many customers of yours have been benefiting from it? AFM is a completely different beast and has nothing to do with the heavily promoted by you EcoClear. And it's not being advertised as such (similaraty to AFM) in your sale brochures. EcoClear is just a "normal" glass media very similar to other 5 inferior glass medias presented in the test. It is not normal glass media. You comment shows your ignorance. I will stick with my 6 yrs of experience with the product and many dozens of happy customers! Rather than debate with a Google ex pert! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saanim Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 2 hours ago, Bagwain said: It is not normal glass media. You comment shows your ignorance. I will stick with my 6 yrs of experience with the product and many dozens of happy customers! Rather than debate with a Google ex pert! Why not to start a thread about experience? How many years and how many stars? Then, no need any arguments... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saanim Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 I did not study any report about that or other filter media. However, with my common sense - and backyard experience - I wonder whether any study/report can provide a plausible comparison of sand, glass, or anything. How can it be compared? Running 2 pools of the same size and atmospheric conditions over long time frame? Measuring various values? And even if something like this will show some different measurements, how much is the difference? How many percent of what? How much will it influence our swimming? How much will it influence the maintenance of our MickeyMouse pools? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granit Posted July 25, 2022 Share Posted July 25, 2022 Where can I buy this eco clear plate glass version? All glass media from eco clear I seem to be able to find is the recycled bottle glass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bagwain Posted July 26, 2022 Share Posted July 26, 2022 21 hours ago, Granit said: Where can I buy this eco clear plate glass version? All glass media from eco clear I seem to be able to find is the recycled bottle glass. Where are you situated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granit Posted July 26, 2022 Share Posted July 26, 2022 3 hours ago, Bagwain said: Where are you situated? I'm in BKK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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