Benzene fuel stabilizer for Honda Phantom

[LNKDES1]

Is there a product I can buy on Lazada similar to Sta-Bil, a fuel stabilizer I can get in the U.S. I've got an older Phantom that I hardly ever ride any more, but I like to keep it around for guests, and want the fuel to keep as long as possible. Am I dreaming, or should I just drain the tank and refill with fresh gas as needed? I buy quite a bunch of stuff on Lazada, so a link would be appreciated. Thanks

[ozimoron]

Fill the tank with diesel to keep the inside rust free and the carby free of oxidation and crud. Drain the tank and drop the carby bowl and rinse out with gasoline before use. Diesel will keep for a long time.

[papa al]

Use pure gasoline/ benzene

rather than the 10% Etol / gasohol.

&

https://www.lazada.co.th/products/amsoil-gasoline-stabilizer-16-oz-i2285279189-s7680535355.html?search=1.

 

 

[VocalNeal]

If you are a bit of a tinkerer you can make your own Seafoam. Recipe is on Interweb.

[papa al]

12 hours ago, ozimoron said:

Fill the tank with diesel to keep the inside rust free and the carby free of oxidation and crud. Drain the tank and drop the carby bowl and rinse out with gasoline before use. Diesel will keep for a long time.

Why bother.

This is way too much hassle.

Just add a little 2T oil to the gas if this rust thing is a concern.

Or even some 4T oil.

[papa al]

Actually benzine [gasoline]

not benzene [aromatic hydrocarbon].

[VocalNeal]

23 minutes ago, papa al said:

Just add a little 2T oil to the gas

I run my 4T scoot @ 640:1 roughly. It is similar to adding upper cylinder lubricant like the old Redex. I just bung a small capful into the tank.

[Lacessit]

It sounds to me the OP wants a rust inhibitor and dewatering agent, IMO barium dinonylnapthalene sulphonate may be what he is looking for.

I don't know if it is available here, this is a link to a supplier:

 

https://www.parchem.com/chemical-supplier-distributor/Barium-dinonylnaphthalene-sulfonate-039957.aspx

 

It would need to be premixed with some gasoline, as it is quite viscous. Also drained and flushed, probably not too good if it gets into the combustion chamber.

[papa al]

17 hours ago, Lacessit said:

It sounds to me the OP wants a rust inhibitor and dewatering agent, IMO barium dinonylnapthalene sulphonate may be what he is looking for.

I don't know if it is available here, this is a link to a supplier:

 

https://www.parchem.com/chemical-supplier-distributor/Barium-dinonylnaphthalene-sulfonate-039957.aspx

 

It would need to be premixed with some gasoline, as it is quite viscous. Also drained and flushed, probably not too good if it gets into the combustion chamber.

This idea is worse than the diesel fuel one.

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, papa al said:

This idea is worse than the diesel fuel one.

You have some facts to support that assertion, or is that an opinion?

[papa al]

5 hours ago, Lacessit said:

You have some facts to support that assertion, or is that an opinion?

The referenced article certainly didn't suggest it

for anything like motorcycle gas tanks.

Guessing you have had good luck with that?

[Lacessit]

7 minutes ago, papa al said:

The referenced article certainly didn't suggest it

for anything like motorcycle gas tanks.

Guessing you have had good luck with that?

Using my knowledge of rust preventive/dewatering compounds acquired in my years of being a research scientist.

Manufacturers don't necessarily know all the applications their products can be used for, Viagra was originally developed to treat hypertension.

[papa al]

1 hour ago, Lacessit said:

Using my knowledge of rust preventive/dewatering compounds acquired in my years of being a research scientist.

Manufacturers don't necessarily know all the applications their products can be used for, Viagra was originally developed to treat hypertension.

... so ...

you have good luck using this process

on your motorcycle tanks,

or not?

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, papa al said:

... so ...

you have good luck using this process

on your motorcycle tanks,

or not?

Fuel tank of a 1973 Ford I used as a paddock vehicle when I would go shooting in the backblocks of New South Wales about once every six months. I left it mothballed on the station property in the meantime.

I'm assuming the fuel tanks of cars and motorcycles are the same metal, unless two-wheeled transport has started using plastic in place of steel.

[papa al]

11 hours ago, Lacessit said:

New South Wales about once every six months

So you applied this process every 6 months.?

Or once and done,

forever.

Any data.?

Seems pretty random for a 

12 hours ago, papa al said:

research scientist

 

22 hours ago, papa al said:

Also drained and flushed,

Sounds like a real hassle,

compare to squirting a little 2T oil or additive

into tank of gasoline/benzine.

But hey, go for it 

mate.

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, papa al said:

So you applied this process every 6 months.?

Or once and done,

forever.

Any data.?

Seems pretty random for a 

 

Sounds like a real hassle,

compare to squirting a little 2T oil or additive

into tank of gasoline/benzine.

But hey, go for it 

mate.

Six months or a year, depending on what frequency I went there.

What data do you want? What I did worked for about ten years. After the station was sold, I gave the Ford to a kid on another station, who drove it off as I had been doing each time I restarted for that ten years.

Yes, 2T oil is simpler. What I read of its composition says to me it has none of the rust prevention or dewatering properties of BDNS, which makes your suggestion worse than mine. "Worse" was the adjective you applied to my first post, right?

[papa al]

21 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Six months or a year, depending on what frequency I went there.

What data do you want? What I did worked for about ten years. After the station was sold, I gave the Ford to a kid on another station, who drove it off as I had been doing each time I restarted for that ten years.

Yes, 2T oil is simpler. What I read of its composition says to me it has none of the rust prevention or dewatering properties of BDNS, which makes your suggestion worse than mine. "Worse" was the adjective you applied to my first post, right?

Draining and flushing your truck's gasolene tank

1 or 2x a year for 10 years.!

You are a far braver man than papa.

///////

Good 2T oils contain good amounts of certain esters,

which, we know

are produced by the reduction of an alcohol with a carboxylic acid,

and releasing a HOH.

These esters are highly polar.

 strongly attracted to ferris metals.

[rust prevention]

Also, when HOH condenses in a gas tank under a storage situation.

the chemical reaction [esterfication] is reversed

and the HOH is sequestered,

[dewatering]

and the alcohol and carboxylic acid are burned as fuel.

Fuel stabilizers [Stabil, Amsoil's product, &c.] are the same, esters.

 

Honestly, your scheme seems ridiculous.

 

 

Edited April 24, 2022 by papa al

[Lacessit]

1 minute ago, papa al said:

Draining and flushing your truck's gasolene tank

1 or 2x a year for 10 years.!

You are a far braver man than papa.

///////

Good 2T oils contain good amounts of certain esters,

which, we know

are produced by the reduction of an alcohol with a carboxylic acid,

and releasing a HOH.

These esters are highly polar.

 strongly attracted to ferris metals.

[rust prevention]

Also, when HOH condenses in a gas tank under a storage situation.

the chemical reaction [esterfication] is reversed

and the HOH is sequestered,

[dewatering]

and the alcohol and carboxylic acid are burned as fuel.

Fuel stabilizers [Stabil, Amsoil's product, &c.] are the same, esters.

 

Honestly, your scheme seems ridiculous.

 

 

BS

[Lacessit]

I was a research chemist in the steel industry for 25 years. One of my first briefs was to understand what was causing a steel corrosion problem that was costing the company millions of dollars in customer claims every year. That led to a world patent, and also invitations to the annual NACE conferences as a speaker. NACE is the US National Association of Corrosion Engineers, the world's leading organization in that field.

 

There is a process in steelmaking called cold-rolling, where 2.5 mm hot rolled is reduced down to mostly 0.4 mm sheet. A coolant is used in that process, basically a mixture of water, emulsifier, and esters.

The end product has a surface coating of 100 - 200 mg/sqm of ester.

 

Cold rolled steel must be put into downstream processes such as annealing or metal coating within 48 hours of production, otherwise surface corrosion ( rusting ) will make the steel unfit for use. If esters prevent rusting, they fail to do so in this case.

 

Which is why I am calling papa al's post BS. Also a demonstration of the adage a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

[LNKDES1]

On 4/21/2022 at 7:16 AM, papa al said:

Use pure gasoline/ benzene

rather than the 10% Etol / gasohol.

&

https://www.lazada.co.th/products/amsoil-gasoline-stabilizer-16-oz-i2285279189-s7680535355.html?search=1.

 

 

This is exactly what I was looking for, a fuel stabilizer.

[papa al]

On 4/24/2022 at 7:54 AM, Lacessit said:

If esters prevent rusting, they fail to do so in this case.

Generalizing from one application and one ester

[among the hundreds/thousands of esters that can be synthesized]

may not be too wise.

The literature is replete with esters used for rust prevention.

Give up dog.

On 4/24/2022 at 7:54 AM, Lacessit said:

a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

Bingo !!

[Lacessit]

5 hours ago, papa al said:

Generalizing from one application and one ester

[among the hundreds/thousands of esters that can be synthesized]

may not be too wise.

The literature is replete with esters used for rust prevention.

Give up dog.

Bingo !!

Esters such as lanolin have been used (unsuccessfully) as rust preventitives. They only function as a barrier. Their ability to prevent rusting via chemical inhibition is zero, in the presence of water and oxygen they are useless. Which is why, way back when, I found all Japanese steel mills were using metal sulphonates as corrosion inhibitors on the steel they were shipping to Australia.

 

Esters do a great job in lubrication, that is their function in oils.

 

If you care to look up "Proceedings of the International Corrosion Conference on Corrosion Inhibition" Dallas, Texas 1983 ( Edited R H Hausler ) you'll find three of my peer-reviewed papers there, on the subject of steel protection. I'm part of the literature as well.

 

You're just a guy pretending to know something of the chemistry and function of oils, an area where I was doing successful research for about 5 years. AFAIK, the systems I developed are still in use today.

 

Perhaps you could post your own academic and experience qualifications in the field. I'm all ears.