sriracha john Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 (edited) Again a bit premature but he faces criminal charges not political charges. The body that investigated him was not set up by the junta and existed while Thaksin was PM. As I said he faces a dilemma. If the government has a solid case on Thaksin, and as appearance is everything in Thailand, they will give him a fair trial. In the long run it is better for Thailand to do it that way. That and several other points made here: Is the name of the game now moving to an extradition charge against ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra? Edited June 26, 2007 by sriracha john Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
younghusband Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Again a bit premature but he faces criminal charges not political charges. The body that investigated him was not set up by the junta and existed while Thaksin was PM. As I said he faces a dilemma. If the government has a solid case on Thaksin, and as appearance is everything in Thailand, they will give him a fair trial. In the long run it is better for Thailand to do it that way. That and several other points made here: Is the name of the game now moving to an extradition charge against ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra? It's probably not a very good idea to place reliance on Nation editorial pieces.The reality is that extradition proceedings would be laughed out of court in any civilised jurisdiction.The joke is that the Thai Governmrnt knows it, Thaksin knows it, indeed the whole world knows it except one or two regular posters on this forum.Now if Thaksin decided to return voluntarily to face his charges under a democratic Thailand, that is another matter.I have no idea whether he would or not but it's a possibility. But this talk of enforced extradition is just fantasy I'm afraid a top class British QC would have a field day defending a man fairly elected as PM, still holding the support of most Thais and deposed by a miltary junta.OK we know that there are shades and nuances here but the chances of a succesful extradition are effectively nil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammered Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Again a bit premature but he faces criminal charges not political charges. The body that investigated him was not set up by the junta and existed while Thaksin was PM. As I said he faces a dilemma. If the government has a solid case on Thaksin, and as appearance is everything in Thailand, they will give him a fair trial. In the long run it is better for Thailand to do it that way. That and several other points made here: Is the name of the game now moving to an extradition charge against ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra? It's probably not a very good idea to place reliance on Nation editorial pieces.The reality is that extradition proceedings would be laughed out of court in any civilised jurisdiction.The joke is that the Thai Governmrnt knows it, Thaksin knows it, indeed the whole world knows it except one or two regular posters on this forum.Now if Thaksin decided to return voluntarily to face his charges under a democratic Thailand, that is another matter.I have no idea whether he would or not but it's a possibility. But this talk of enforced extradition is just fantasy I'm afraid a top class British QC would have a field day defending a man fairly elected as PM, still holding the support of most Thais and deposed by a miltary junta.OK we know that there are shades and nuances here but the chances of a succesful extradition are effectively nil. I tend to agree. Actually I have always thought that most statements made by this, or for that matter the previous government, were more for domestic consumption. Every time a charge is made, every time an account is frozen, every time extradition is talked about it emphasies that the idea (meme if you like ) that Mr. Thaksin has done something wrong. This works two ways. It keeps the Thaksin opponents happy that something is being done. It also creates doubt and turns away Mr. Thaksin's previous softer supporters. Personally I dont doubt that he has done a few things that will result in convictions. However, a number of the cases will fall and some of the frozen money will also be released as cases progress. He will not be extradited and personally I dont see him being given a jail sentence or at least not one that will ever happen after a few appeals. However, by the time this is all dealt with there will be a new elected government in place, and it will probably have been in place for a fair while. Then the deals will occur and Mr. Thaksin may even return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinthee Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Again a bit premature but he faces criminal charges not political charges. The body that investigated him was not set up by the junta and existed while Thaksin was PM. As I said he faces a dilemma. If the government has a solid case on Thaksin, and as appearance is everything in Thailand, they will give him a fair trial. In the long run it is better for Thailand to do it that way. That and several other points made here: Is the name of the game now moving to an extradition charge against ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra? It's probably not a very good idea to place reliance on Nation editorial pieces.The reality is that extradition proceedings would be laughed out of court in any civilised jurisdiction.The joke is that the Thai Governmrnt knows it, Thaksin knows it, indeed the whole world knows it except one or two regular posters on this forum.Now if Thaksin decided to return voluntarily to face his charges under a democratic Thailand, that is another matter.I have no idea whether he would or not but it's a possibility. But this talk of enforced extradition is just fantasy I'm afraid a top class British QC would have a field day defending a man fairly elected as PM, still holding the support of most Thais and deposed by a miltary junta.OK we know that there are shades and nuances here but the chances of a succesful extradition are effectively nil. I tend to agree. Actually I have always thought that most statements made by this, or for that matter the previous government, were more for domestic consumption. Every time a charge is made, every time an account is frozen, every time extradition is talked about it emphasies that the idea (meme if you like ) that Mr. Thaksin has done something wrong. This works two ways. It keeps the Thaksin opponents happy that something is being done. It also creates doubt and turns away Mr. Thaksin's previous softer supporters. Personally I dont doubt that he has done a few things that will result in convictions. However, a number of the cases will fall and some of the frozen money will also be released as cases progress. He will not be extradited and personally I dont see him being given a jail sentence or at least not one that will ever happen after a few appeals. However, by the time this is all dealt with there will be a new elected government in place, and it will probably have been in place for a fair while. Then the deals will occur and Mr. Thaksin may even return. I agree with Hammered. In the end, this comes down to whatever criminal charges can be leveled, and then defended. Extradition may or may not be a part of that. I agree a good QC would gain several years employment from this before Mr. T would have to extradited likely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 I'm not so sure about "certain" things anymore.... It's been an amazing 15 months full of "impossible" things that have certainly happened. Thaksin Resigns as Prime Minister Thai court rejects April elections Constitutional court calls for new parliamentary poll Thaksin Resigns As Thai Rak Thai Leader Thai Rak Thai Party Dissolved Thaksin Banned From Politics For Five Years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
younghusband Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 I'm not so sure about "certain" things anymore.... It's been an amazing 15 months full of "impossible" things that have certainly happened. Thaksin Resigns as Prime Minister Thai court rejects April elections Constitutional court calls for new parliamentary poll Thaksin Resigns As Thai Rak Thai Leader Thai Rak Thai Party Dissolved Thaksin Banned From Politics For Five Years I tend to agree that nothing can be reliably predicted now.Given that the Bangkok old guard probably realises that it overstepped and in a spirit of enlightened self interest, I wouldn't be entirely surprised to see a deal patched up with Thaksin, as would be consistent with Thai political culture (witness the acceptance in hiso Bangkok of the mass murderer Suchinda).I would not be surprised to see Thaksin's voluntary return to Thailand in a year or so, charges against him suspended for one reason or another and his emergence as an eminence grise on the political scene.Who knows. Clearly the junta is now generally seen as far worse than the previous government.The skullduggery of General Saprang at TOT and elsewhere is typical of the unaccountability of the present illegal and incompetent administration.Most Thais yearn for a return of democracy. if not for Thaksin.What we need to get to is a more mature political landscape where there is less of a pro-junta pro-Thaksin polarity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jai Dee Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 CNS tells Foreign Ministry to clarify cases of Dr. Thaksin to international community The Council for National Security (CNS) Chairman, Gen. Sonthi Boonyaratglin, will propose for the Ministry of Foreign Affairs to be responsible for clarifying the cases of deposed Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra to foreign cases. Prime Minister Surayud Chulanont has assigned Deputy Prime Minister and Industry Minister Kosit Panpiemras to chair the Cabinet meeting today (Jun 26) as Gen. Surayud is on an official visit to India from today to tomorrow. At the Cabinet meeting today, Mr. Kosit will propose the drafted Petroleum Act and the Income Tax for Petroleum Act. In addition, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs will discuss the work progress to suppress terrorism under the resolution of the CNS. The Ministry of Interior will put forward the drafted Identification Card Act while the National Economic and Social Advisory Council will propose for the establishment of an independent entity responsible for looking after consumers. Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 26 June 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 CNS hatches U-tapao plan for Thaksin return The CNS plans to use U-tapao airport in Rayong for the return of deposed PM Thaksin Shinawatra, who is to face criminal charges. Preparations for the possible comeback of Mr Thaksin, who is in London, were key items on the agenda at the CNS meeting yesterday. A CNS source said the coup-makers wanted Mr Thaksin's flight to land at U-tapao instead of Suvarnabhumi airport due to security concerns. The CNS is concerned about the safety of the former premier and about his supporters who might show up to greet him on his return, the source added. The DSI has set a timetable from today until Friday for him to meet the investigators. Mr Thaksin can postpone the meeting three times, and after that he will face an arrest warrant or possible extradition from the country he is in. Continued here: http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/26Jun2007_news12.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mid Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 going to come to a head with the currently proposed elections ............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaoPo Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 CNS tells Foreign Ministry to clarify cases of Dr. Thaksin to international community Does the CNS think the 'international community' are dummies...? Meaning: "Clarify to the international community what WE think and feel about Dr. Thaksin..." I think the 'International Community' is intelligent enough to leave all 'Thaksin' cases to the Thai courts. LaoPo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mid Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Lawyer: Thaksin won't return until after election (BangkokPost.com) - Noppadon Pattama, legal adviser of ousted premier Thaksin Shinawatra, said Tuesday Mr Thaksin will not return to hear police charges nor will he come back to fight court cases until after election.Mr Noppadon cited four reasons behind the decision. The Post Publishing Public Co Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Clifton Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 He's planning to interfere with the coming elections then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jai Dee Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Mr Noppadon cited four reasons behind the decision. They make interesting reading too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilyushin Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Doc Tox will not make it! Too much! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opothai Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 taxin will never go back to thailand unless it is under his own steam. do you not think that respective governments are going to forget about all the wrong doings that the thai authorities have let pass unpunished, and just thrown aside, then after consideration just give the thais what they want. me thinks that issue like the killing of the two lovers by a copper will still be sour in the mouths of the british powers that be. or at least it should be. and thier are plenty more issues that have been swept under the carpet, no doubt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammered Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 So from the statement we can assume he wont return until he thinks he can manipulate the courts or have them stacked with his friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plus Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 In the end it would also reflect badly on the UK itself - people are alerady joking about their "fit and proper" tests, wait until charges of share manipulation and fraud are brought up to public view. I have absolutely no faith in the UK's supposedly democratic system when it comes to dealing with big time crooks - just wait and see that money there talks even louder than here. When drug war deaths eventually come up it will be downright embarassing and swept under the carpet even faster than here. Just wait and see how selective the UK's self professed love of human rights is. It doesn't cover victims of owners of football clubs with lots of cash. I'd love to be proven wrong but there's little hope after ten years of Blairism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
younghusband Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 (edited) In the end it would also reflect badly on the UK itself - people are alerady joking about their "fit and proper" tests, wait until charges of share manipulation and fraud are brought up to public view.I have absolutely no faith in the UK's supposedly democratic system when it comes to dealing with big time crooks - just wait and see that money there talks even louder than here. When drug war deaths eventually come up it will be downright embarassing and swept under the carpet even faster than here. Just wait and see how selective the UK's self professed love of human rights is. It doesn't cover victims of owners of football clubs with lots of cash. I'd love to be proven wrong but there's little hope after ten years of Blairism. Putting aside the hyperbole and "Blairism" comments,may I suggest that Thailand makes an official request to the UK for the extradition of Thaksin for responsibility for drug war deaths?This is the the most severe and easily proved of his crimes, and I think the human rights lobby in the UK would get behind it. Most of the other crimes are obviously trumped up political charges which any competent lawyer could kick into touch with his eyes shut.But the drugs war charges would I think stick. So why doesn't the Thai government invoke the drug war murders which would have Thaksin back in Thailand under Scotland Yard custody fairly promptly?? Answers on a postcard please. Edited June 26, 2007 by younghusband Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mid Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Thaksin defies Thai graftbusters' order to return Tue Jun 26, 2007 4:14AM EDT BANGKOK (Reuters) - Ousted Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra will not return from exile to the "killing zone" of Thailand despite being ordered back to face charges of hiding assets illegally, his lawyer said on Tuesday.Thaksin, who had until Friday to respond in person to charges of violating stock regulations and anti-corruption laws, would return to Thailand only after "democracy is fully restored," lawyer Noppadon Pattama told reporters. Reuters.com: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinthee Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Thaksin defies Thai graftbusters' order to returnTue Jun 26, 2007 4:14AM EDT BANGKOK (Reuters) - Ousted Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra will not return from exile to the "killing zone" of Thailand despite being ordered back to face charges of hiding assets illegally, his lawyer said on Tuesday.Thaksin, who had until Friday to respond in person to charges of violating stock regulations and anti-corruption laws, would return to Thailand only after "democracy is fully restored," lawyer Noppadon Pattama told reporters. Reuters.com: I thought only Pattaya was the killing zone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 A mere 12 days ago.... Lawyer says toppled Thai PM won't return home until security is guaranteedBANGKOK -- Ousted Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra will not return to Thailand in the immediate future to fight for the return of his frozen assets because of concern for his safety, his lawyer said Thursday. Thaksin's lawyer and de facto spokesman Noppadol Pattama -- who Tuesday indicated that the former prime minister might return soon -- said Thursday he would not be back at least until the end of this month. "Mr. Thaksin will not risk his life and will not return until this government guarantees his safety," Noppadol said. and today, after the guarantee he demanded, was met.... Thirdly, there is no safety for him in the country, even though Prime Minister Surayud Chulanont and Council for National Security chairman Sonthi Boonyaratkalin have told the media they will guarantee Mr Thaksin's safety."Even with tight security, Mr Thaksin had almost been attacked by a car bomb," he said, referring to an incident when Mr Thaksin was premier. "Now there cannot be a guarantee that he will be safe." As much as Noppadope enjoys changing the goal posts so much, he could easily find work with the Immigration department. But then again... as much as enjoys lying.... (going back to the post from 12 days ago): Noppadol insisted, however, that Thaksin is ready to return if summoned by a court to face charges. Perhaps he's best-suited (pun intended) for his present occupation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinthee Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 A mere 12 days ago.... Lawyer says toppled Thai PM won't return home until security is guaranteedBANGKOK -- Ousted Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra will not return to Thailand in the immediate future to fight for the return of his frozen assets because of concern for his safety, his lawyer said Thursday. Thaksin's lawyer and de facto spokesman Noppadol Pattama -- who Tuesday indicated that the former prime minister might return soon -- said Thursday he would not be back at least until the end of this month. "Mr. Thaksin will not risk his life and will not return until this government guarantees his safety," Noppadol said. and today, after the guarantee he demanded, was met.... Thirdly, there is no safety for him in the country, even though Prime Minister Surayud Chulanont and Council for National Security chairman Sonthi Boonyaratkalin have told the media they will guarantee Mr Thaksin's safety."Even with tight security, Mr Thaksin had almost been attacked by a car bomb," he said, referring to an incident when Mr Thaksin was premier. "Now there cannot be a guarantee that he will be safe." As much as Noppadope enjoys changing the goal posts so much, he could easily find work with the Immigration department. But then again... as much as enjoys lying.... (going back to the post from 12 days ago): Noppadol insisted, however, that Thaksin is ready to return if summoned by a court to face charges. Perhaps he's best-suited (pun intended) for his present occupation. I need to lie down. I'm really getting dizzy now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mid Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 I need to lie down. I'm really getting dizzy now. , here's the domestic version ..................... Exiled prime minister will not return home this week : lawyer Tue, June 26, 2007 : Last updated 15:49 pm (Thai local time) Exiled prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra will not return to Thailand to face charges this week as ordered by police as he fears for his safety, his lawyer said Tuesday. Public prosecutors said they'll seek Thaksin's extradition if he fails to meet a Friday deadline set by police to face charges on sales of Shin Corp stocks to Temesak Holdings. "He will not return to answer the charges because of safety concerns,'' Noppadol Pattama said. Thaksin has claimed that he feared of his safety if he returns home, while the military junta that ousted him last year and the Thai government guranteed his safety. The Nation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John K Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ratcatcher Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 This is becoming a pi$$ing contest. Any bets on who will win? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mid Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 (edited) This is becoming a pi$$ing contest. Any bets on who will win? no idea , however in early running .......................... Shinawatra delays return to face charges in Thailand 26/06/2007 - 12:13:47 PM Deposed prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, currently involved in a £81.6m (€121.2m) deal to buy Premier League club Manchester City, will not return to Thailand to face corruption charges because he fears for his safety.Prosecutors said they would seek seek Thaksin's extradition if he failed to meet a Friday deadline set by police to face charges that he concealed his ownership of millions of dollars worth of shares from the Thai stock exchange. snip The military has consistently told Thaksin that he should not return until after the polls, saying his presence could trigger political instability. Earlier this month, army commander Gen. Sonthi Boonyaratglin - who led the coup against Thaksin - said the former prime minister might be harmed by his enemies if he returned to Thailand now. But Prime Minister Surayud Chulanont told reporters that the government would ensure Thaksin's safety if he returned. Echo Publications (Cork) Limited, Edited June 26, 2007 by Mid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cclub75 Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 (edited) Et voila. The latest episode. Enjoy. The Saga Shall Continue. DSI extends deadline for Thaksin by one month The Department of Special Investigation (DSI) Tuesday extended the deadline by a month for ousted premier Thaksin Shinawatra and other four suspects to report themselves for the indictment session relating to alleged asset concealment. "The deadline extension for every suspect was deemed necessary after two suspects sought and received permission for more time as they could not return from abroad in time," DSI director-general Sunai Manomaiudom said. The new deadline is July 26 in lieu of this Friday. Sunai said two suspects, Yingluck Shinawatra and Penchom Damapong, applied for the delay as they had conflicting business engagements abroad. Yingluck and Penchom are executives of SC Asset, the listed company at the centre of the asset concealment case. The Nation http://www.nationmultimedia.com/breakingne...newsid=30037846 Edited June 26, 2007 by cclub75 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mid Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 had to be done ................. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cclub75 Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 had to be done ................. Very accurate "visual" resume of the situation. Day after day, the comedy is getting more... tragic and pathetic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sriracha john Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 Bangkok Thais Want Thaksin to Face Justice Most adults in Thailand’s capital would like deposed Thai prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra to return to the country and face charges of corruption, according to a poll by Bangkok University Research Institute. 71.4 per cent of respondents in Bangkok agree with the current interim government’s decision to order Thaksin to go back to Thailand. Polling Data Do you agree or disagree with the government’s decision to order Thaksin Shinawatra to return to Thailand to face charges in court over share transaction concealment and on assets frozen by the Assets Examination Committee? Agree 71.4% Disagree 28.6% Source: Bangkok University Research Institute Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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