4:3 Content On A 16:9 Screen

[Crossy]

I think I have a solution to this problem, but other thoughts are welcome.

OK, I have my 16:9 TV plugged in to the DVI output of a fairly old PC. The PC does not do any of the 16:9 resolutions but 1024x768 displays just fine.

The TV will do 16:9 or 4:3 AR on the DVI input, it does NOT do letterbox crop or 'wide' expansion of 4:3 content from this input.

So when I watch 4:3 content I either have to put up with black side bars or short-fat people, neither of which I like. What I need is a player (preferably free) that will letterbox my 4:3 content and fill my 16:9 screen.

Easy eh??

[Tywais]

VLC Media Player can do it or at least re-adjust your aspect ratios. Probably need to play with it to see what combinations work. > http://www.videolan.org/vlc/

[Crossy]

VLC Media Player can do it or at least re-adjust your aspect ratios. Probably need to play with it to see what combinations work. > http://www.videolan.org/vlc/

I expected it could (seems to be able to do almost anything), already using VLC so looks like some playing with the advanced settings is in order

[Veazer]

I think I have a solution to this problem, but other thoughts are welcome.

OK, I have my 16:9 TV plugged in to the DVI output of a fairly old PC. The PC does not do any of the 16:9 resolutions but 1024x768 displays just fine.

The TV will do 16:9 or 4:3 AR on the DVI input, it does NOT do letterbox crop or 'wide' expansion of 4:3 content from this input.

So when I watch 4:3 content I either have to put up with black side bars or short-fat people, neither of which I like. What I need is a player (preferably free) that will letterbox my 4:3 content and fill my 16:9 screen.

Easy eh??

First, I would see if you can create a custom resolution on the PC to perfectly match the specs of your TV. Depending on your video card, you should be able to do this. Most ATI and nVidia cards can do this in my experience. You might be able to do it via the driver, some newer drivers support advanced custom resolutions. If not, you can hopefully use Powerstrip by Entech to create a custom resolution. Search the forums at entech and you should be able to find the specs for your tv. Getting an LCD TV to display a 'pixel perfect' image can be tricky, especially on the DVI connector, but it's worth it to get the best image possible. You may find that the analog input is easier to setup than the DVI input, i've had situations where this was the case.

After you have a correct resolution, you can use a DVD package that supports some of the wide expansion methods. WinDVD calls it "Smartstretch". You could probably configure WinDVD to due this with a 4:3 resolution stretched to fit your TV and skip the first step, but I would highly encourage you to take the time to try getting a working custom rez first. It's worth it.

[pattyboy]

I used VLC Media Player for quite a while and liked it, but there's a better freebie out there called KMPlayer (Korean Media Player, I believe). It's packed with loads of features and allows you to custom adjust the aspect ratio (CNTL - num pad arrow keys). Press the right mouse button on the main screen to get an idea of all the tweaks and features available.

I've got a 22 inch 16:10 monitor with the native resolution (1680x1050) supported by my video card, and when playing 4:3 ratio video, of course I see the black bars at the sides. To get the full height of the picture, there has to be when playing a 4:3 video on a 16:10 monitor. The only way to avoid that is to stretch the picture and make everybody fat, or to zoom the picture and clip the top and/or bottom, both of which can be done with KMPLlayer

Edited July 20, 2007 by pattyboy

[Gumballl]

The only way to avoid that is to stretch the picture and make everybody fat, or to zoom the picture and clip the top and/or bottom, both of which can be done with KMPLlayer

I have to agree with this statement. What the OP is asking for is going to be impossible without sacrificing something of the original video content. There isn't any software applications, magic wands, pixy dust, or anything else that is going to be able to convert video recorded in 4:3 ratio to a 16:9 ratio without doing a stretch or a zoom, both of which will not provide true representations of the original video. Suffice to say, it is impossible to create additional video content from the video available from the original source, unless there happens to be some extrapolation video tool that I am unaware of.

Some TVs (for instance my Samsung DLP) offer a setting that allows one to display SDTV (standard-definition TV, or 4:3) on the entire screen by stretching (supposedly) only the sides. Images in the center of the video image are not stretched (as much as the sides), thus persons appearing in the middle of the video image tend to appear normal. However, when a video containing two or more persons is shown, inevitably one or more persons will look bloated.

Before one ever buys a widescreen TV, they should always examine what SDTV video (or recordings) will look like on that TV. Many people are disappointed when they return home with a shiny new (and expensive) TV and find that their favourite videos or shows from yesteryear are displayed with side-bars, or that DVDs are displayed in letterbox.

[Cyberstar]

A video isn't but a huge number of still photos. So, since you'll have to either crop, add "blanks" or distort a photo to alter its width/height ratio (without manual edit), you 'll only have those three options (unless you want to manually edit each frame).

Edited July 20, 2007 by Cyberstar

[Crossy]

Thanks everyone. VLC is doing the job just fine now, advanced settings allow you to crop and squash so that the video looks right on the 16:9 display.

I am fully aware that I'm losing some of the content by letterboxing, that's one reason the BBC produces its new programming in 15:9 (yes fifteen to nine) so that it has only a relatively small black bar top and bottom on a 4:3 display and doesn't lose vast quantites of picture area on a 16:9 screen (the top and bottom of the image are deemed as out-of-bounds to important content), actually a pretty good compromise.

Older programming doesn't respect the safe areas and really only looks right on a full 4:3 display, just have to put up with the side bars in these cases.

[LivinLOS]

Also your wasting a lot of resolution.. If you feed a 1024x768 signal out.. Then letter box that signal (using the TV's crop to fill the screen) then your only using 1024.576 of data.. I assume your TV is more rez than that ??

Much better is to install powerstrip (has a free trial) isntall a custom resolution to the driver.. Then run the exact rez of the panel.. This is known as driving the panel at its native rez and provides a much cleaner video experience thanks to less scaling conversions being done.

Now you have the full panel being utilized without scaling you can work on how the display should look. Do you want to pillar box 4:3 with sidebars.. Crop the top and bottom of 4:3 for widescreen letterboxing.. Stretch 4:3 to 16:9.. Or employ a non linear stretch (think of S__T_RET_C__H ) where the middle which is the focal point has less stretch than the edges.. Finally you can combine many of these techniques at once to say crop 5% of the image and non linear stretch the rest (this looks very good for 4:3 to fill a 16:9 panel)..

The best in class applications for aspect ratio work would be TheaterTek DVD soft, Zoom Player. (both for DVD and WMVHD) and dSacler (to which I hold the domains) for TV sources.

This is a big topic that can be done many way.. If you want to get interested the HTPC section on AVSForum has been working on these topics for years.

[Crossy]

Also your wasting a lot of resolution.. If you feed a 1024x768 signal out.. Then letter box that signal (using the TV's crop to fill the screen) then your only using 1024.576 of data.. I assume your TV is more rez than that ??

I understand. BUT. IF you read my OP you'll notice that the TV does not do 'crop to fill' on the DVI input, only 16:9 or 4:3 (pillarbox).

I'm feeding the best rez from my (old) PC which is 1024x768 and this is what is being displayed (no cropping of the Windows desktop it's just elongated to the full screen width), not the native rez of the panel but the best the box can do.

VLC is cropping the top and bottom of the video to give 16:9, up-rezzing to 1024x768, and then outputting at 1024x768 to the TV. Since most of my material is a. old and b. DivX it's not exactly HD, it's certainly 100% watchable (better than UBC).

One bonus of VLC is that it has a Thai language option, means the Missus can use it although I'm not sure she's going to want to watch Corrie without sub-titles

EDIT I'm really not interested is mucking about with even more software to tweek the look, although I may try the 'crop and stretch a bit' route. Trouble is then I'm probably going to have to upgrade the PC (it's a PIII 800).

Edited July 21, 2007 by Crossy

[LivinLOS]

OK, sorry i missed that point.. But your still performing multiple scaling operations..

Use powerstrip to set the actual panel rez of your device and you A) get 1:1 pixel mapping for native panel rez, B ) cut out scaling steps C) have more accurate control of aspect ratio for the image output your trying to display. All of this will still work on a PIII 800 (DVD and low end dscaler filters)..

People dont realize it but PC video work still compares favorably with the highest end (think 10k plus) video scalers.. This becomes far less important with the amount of HiDef software thats now on the market but I have been involved with HTPC stuff since the early days when we needed hardware decoders for just DVD and I still say that the PC can provide the best DVD image I have ever seen, each time hardware improves so does software (but far more cheaply) FFDShow filters, DeNoise, Sharpen etc.. Can really make even DVD source exceptionally clear.

The most important hing is enjoy your system and what you watch.. Video like audio guys can sometimes end up only seeing the problems not enjoying the movie.

[Crossy]

The most important hing is enjoy your system and what you watch.. Video like audio guys can sometimes end up only seeing the problems not enjoying the movie.

5555, too bl00dy right mate. Knew a few audio chaps in the UK, spent all their time getting the sound 'right' and never actually listening to the content

You got a download link for Powerstrip?

[LivinLOS]

http://entechtaiwan.com/util/ps.shtm

You can use its trial to install a custom resolution into your GFX driver and then not use the application.. If it runs at startup each time (performing many many other functions) its on a trial basis..

If you need detailed instructions on customs resolutions (its a powerful application) theres guides on AVSForum.

[Crossy]

Got it

Looks like it could be a very handy utility, unfortunately my ancient video card doesn't support custom resolutions so I'm stuck with using 1024x768 which does actually work pretty well

[LivinLOS]

wow how ancient.. I havent come across a ATI or nVidia that wouldnt take customs res's for like 5 - 6 years !!

[Crossy]

wow how ancient.. I havent come across a ATI or nVidia that wouldnt take customs res's for like 5 - 6 years !!

555 It's an Intel card (integrated) in an NEC DeskMate, gotta be 7 years old. Intel are specifically mentioned as un-supported in the Powerstrip documentation.

The PC works just fine and plays the content without missing a beat, running W2k in 256MB. Like I said it's really a non-issue