Which UPS should I buy?

[Mutt Daeng]

I'm looking for advice/guidance/comments to determine the specification of a UPS to protect my (oldish) main desktop pc. It has an i5-7400 cpu, 1 M.2 SSD on the M/B, 1 sata3 SSD and 1 mechanical sata3 HDD. Intel UHD graphics on the cpu. O/S is Win 11 pro 64 bit. It has a 650 watt Thermaltake PSU. It connects to a 40inch Skyworth TV. I just bought a power meter plug from Lazada to see what power was being used. I plugged the PC , TV, external USB HDD and an 8 port USB hub into a 4-gang power strip, which was plugged into the mains via the power meter plug. I then played a video on the pc, started word, excel and outlook. The power meter showed that less than 100 watts was being used. Does this seem right? 

 

Edited March 17 by Mutt Daeng

[GammaGlobulin]

If it were I, then I would just buy a FLUKE, such as one of the following, and then I would test the multimeter that you purchased on Lazada.

What brand did you buy, and which type.

If you purchase one with the clamps, then you can test anything....including testing to see how many amps the power-strip is drawing.

 

 

I like the looks of a FLUKE...

 

CONCERNING UPS:  I have always used APC brand.  JIB has them for about 3500 Bt.

I  purchased two, about 9 years ago.  When the battery wears out, then I buy an aftermarket battery replacement and replace it myself for about Bt.800, or so.

 

Careful when replacing the battery, or it's easy to fry oneself. I wear rubber gloves. When you short a terminal, then....  Sparks will fly BIG TIME, so don't try this yourself unless....you are experienced, or so old that you are ready to go.

 

Note:  Why not just test your Lazada brand multimeter with some known resistance, such as a light bulb from a reputable manufacturer.  Or, it's better to buy the Fluke, maybe....

 

 

Edited March 17 by GammaGlobulin

[Moonlover]

56 minutes ago, Mutt Daeng said:

The power meter showed that less than 100 watts was being used. Does this seem right? 

Why do you ask, don't you trust it?

[GammaGlobulin]

You don't need to worry overly much about the rating on the APC   UPS.

 

Unless it might be an online UPS, which is more expensive.

 

The offline UPS will supply power from the mains, and will only cut in a very small fraction of a second after abnormal power conditions from the mains supply.

 

So, if you have 500 watts connected to an offline UPS, even one with a small battery, then no problem.

But, when the power from the mains fails, then you won't have much time available to turn off your equipment.

 

The advantage of the offline UPS is that it protects against short fluctuations in power, or very short power outages.

 

I would always go with an online UPS, but not in Thailand where they are so much more costly than most places like the USA or Taiwan, or HK, or.....so many other places.

 

I used to have an online APC UPS which I really loved.   That model would connect to the computer to monitor and record power conditions.

 

A crazy price in Thailand, IMHO.

 

Therefore, I use only offline UPS in Thailand, where, maybe, one needs the online UPS....most.

 

 

 

[Mutt Daeng]

30 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

Why do you ask, don't you trust it?

I was expecting more than 100 watts. I contacted the shop where I bought all the components for the pc and they said I would need to have a UPS capable of supplying more than 650 watts (the psu I chose to install was 650 watts). I didn't think that was correct, so I bought the power meter plug to do some investigating of my own.

[Mutt Daeng]

46 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

If it were I, then I would just buy a FLUKE, such as one of the following, and then I would test the multimeter that you purchased on Lazada.

What brand did you buy, and which type.

If you purchase one with the clamps, then you can test anything....including testing to see how many amps the power-strip is drawing.

 

 

I like the looks of a FLUKE...

 

CONCERNING UPS:  I have always used APC brand.  JIB has them for about 3500 Bt.

I  purchased two, about 9 years ago.  When the battery wears out, then I buy an aftermarket battery replacement and replace it myself for about Bt.800, or so.

 

Careful when replacing the battery, or it's easy to fry oneself. I wear rubber gloves. When you short a terminal, then....  Sparks will fly BIG TIME, so don't try this yourself unless....you are experienced, or so old that you are ready to go.

 

Note:  Why not just test your Lazada brand multimeter with some known resistance, such as a light bulb from a reputable manufacturer.  Or, it's better to buy the Fluke, maybe....

 

 

I haven't bought a multimeter.

This is what I bought. It plugs into the mains and my 4 gang power strip plugs into the universal socket shown in the image.

 

Edited March 17 by Mutt Daeng

[Moonlover]

16 minutes ago, Mutt Daeng said:

I was expecting more than 100 watts. I contacted the shop where I bought all the components for the pc and they said I would need to have a UPS capable of supplying more than 650 watts (the psu I chose to install was 650 watts). I didn't think that was correct, so I bought the power meter plug to do some investigating of my own.

Ok, so it's either it's the shop that's got it wrong, or your power monitor is telling porkie pies. Which one to trust.

 

The simplest way to establish which is to find out the current flow. Can your monitor display the voltage and the current drawn? If it does then it's a simple matter to calculate the power yourself. Volts x Amps (P=V x A) 

 

Let's know how how it goes.

[Mutt Daeng]

3 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

Ok, so it's either it's the shop that's got it wrong, or your power monitor is telling porkie pies. Which one to trust.

 

The simplest way to establish which is to find out the current flow. Can your monitor display the voltage and the current drawn? If it does then it's a simple matter to calculate the power yourself. Volts x Amps (P=V x A) 

 

Let's know how how it goes.

I think the monitor can display voltage, current and power. That's a job for tomorrow as my degree of compos mentisness is currently disadvantaged by the number of Changs that I've swallowed so far today. Thanks for your assistance so far.

[Moonlover]

2 minutes ago, Mutt Daeng said:

I think the monitor can display voltage, current and power. That's a job for tomorrow as my degree of compos mentisness is currently disadvantaged by the number of Changs that I've swallowed so far today. Thanks for your assistance so far.

Wise decision. 

[GammaGlobulin]

1 hour ago, Mutt Daeng said:

I haven't bought a multimeter.

This is what I bought. It plugs into the mains and my 4 gang power strip plugs into the universal socket shown in the image.

 

 

So then, why not just plug several light bulbs into the socket and see if it add up, approximately, to the resistance you have connected.  If you attach four 25-watt bulbs, then the meter should read approximately 100 watts, or measure AMPs, and then do the calculation.

 

Or, just hook up a large fan turned to max, and see if the power consumption is close to the rated power on the fan.

 

Or, maybe hook up a toaster.  Or, I would hook up three microwave ovens and then check the meter.

 

(My guess is that the meter on that plug is not accurate.  And accurate meter, like the FLUKE, will cost several hundred...USD.)

 

But, you do not need to so accurately measure your power use in order to select a suitable UPS.  You just need to approximately estimate what you intend to plug into the UPS.

 

 

Edited March 17 by GammaGlobulin

[pasathai]

if you plan on  depending on it a lot,  get a system that you can add a large external  battery

 

Edited March 17 by pasathai

[OneMoreFarang]

3 hours ago, Mutt Daeng said:

The power meter showed that less than 100 watts was being used. Does this seem right?

Sounds about right.

 

I didn't see any advertisement with realistic battery running times. 

With the APC brand you can go to their website and download documents for each UPS. They include graphs for how long they will supply power under which load.

All devices which I checked are best case good for maybe 30min. If you want more, you need a BIG and expensive UPS.

 

 

[OneMoreFarang]

This is what PowerChute, the APC software, shows me.

My PC was off for most of the day.

 

[JetsetBkk]

I buy APC UPSs. They are now fairly old models: "Back-UPS Pro 1500/1600".

I have them on my 2 TVs and 3 on my computers etc.

[Mutt Daeng]

8 hours ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

So then, why not just plug several light bulbs into the socket and see if it add up, approximately, to the resistance you have connected.  If you attach four 25-watt bulbs, then the meter should read approximately 100 watts, or measure AMPs, and then do the calculation.

 

Or, just hook up a large fan turned to max, and see if the power consumption is close to the rated power on the fan.

 

Or, maybe hook up a toaster.  Or, I would hook up three microwave ovens and then check the meter.

 

(My guess is that the meter on that plug is not accurate.  And accurate meter, like the FLUKE, will cost several hundred...USD.)

 

But, you do not need to so accurately measure your power use in order to select a suitable UPS.  You just need to approximately estimate what you intend to plug into the UPS.

 

 

Measuring a bulb of known wattage is exactly what I am going to do. Thanks for your help.

[Mutt Daeng]

5 hours ago, JetsetBkk said:

I buy APC UPSs. They are now fairly old models: "Back-UPS Pro 1500/1600".

I have them on my 2 TVs and 3 on my computers etc.

Thanks for your reply @JetsetBkk.

[Mutt Daeng]

7 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

This is what PowerChute, the APC software, shows me.

My PC was off for most of the day.

 

Thanks for your reply @OneMoreFarang.

[Mutt Daeng]

8 hours ago, pasathai said:

if you plan on  depending on it a lot,  get a system that you can add a large external  battery

 

Thanks for the advice @pasathai.

[Mutt Daeng]

12 hours ago, Moonlover said:

Ok, so it's either it's the shop that's got it wrong, or your power monitor is telling porkie pies. Which one to trust.

 

The simplest way to establish which is to find out the current flow. Can your monitor display the voltage and the current drawn? If it does then it's a simple matter to calculate the power yourself. Volts x Amps (P=V x A) 

 

Let's know how how it goes.

I've done a bit of research on the power meter plugs and measuring power on small AC devices.

This is my source: https://brian-candler.medium.com/rediscovering-the-power-factor-9dbf4187c311

Power = Voltage x Current works for Direct Current (DC). But as it turns out, it doesn’t necessarily work for Alternating Current (AC). For AC, the real formula is: Power = Voltage x Current x Power Factor.

So, with my PC, TV, USB Hub plugged into a 4 gang socket connected to the mains via the power meter plug:

Voltage reading (fluctuating) = 222V

Current Reading (Fluctuating) = 551mA

Power Factor (Fluctuating) = 0.714

Power reading Fluctuating) = 88.04W

Calculated power = V * A * PF = 87.34 W

Only a difference of 0.7 watts between calculated power and the reading from the meter. That's good enough for me.

Edited March 18 by Mutt Daeng
remove whitespace

[Mutt Daeng]

12 hours ago, pasathai said:

if you plan on  depending on it a lot,  get a system that you can add a large external  battery

 

TBH it's to protect me from the ever increasing number of brownouts and 1-5 second blackouts that i have experienced recently, so I don't really need a belt & braces solution, but I appreciate the advice. Thanks

[Moonlover]

19 minutes ago, Mutt Daeng said:

I've done a bit of research on the power meter plugs and measuring power on small AC devices.

This is my source: https://brian-candler.medium.com/rediscovering-the-power-factor-9dbf4187c311

Power = Voltage x Current works for Direct Current (DC). But as it turns out, it doesn’t necessarily work for Alternating Current (AC). For AC, the real formula is: Power = Voltage x Current x Power Factor.

So, with my PC, TV, USB Hub plugged into a 4 gang socket connected to the mains via the power meter plug:

Voltage reading (fluctuating) = 222V

Current Reading (Fluctuating) = 551mA

Power Factor (Fluctuating) = 0.714

Power reading Fluctuating) = 88.04W

Calculated power = V * A * PF = 87.34 W

Only a difference of 0.7 watts between calculated power and the reading from the meter. That's good enough for me.

Yep that's in accord with my own ball park assessment. I run my laptop plus the modem/router and a small desk top lamp off my Zircon 840 watt UPS. With a new battery it will run for about 30 minutes, although it's aging now and will need replacing soon. Batteries are readily available through Lazada.

 

6 minutes ago, Mutt Daeng said:

TBH it's to protect me from the ever increasing number of brownouts and 1-5 second blackouts that i have experienced recently, so I don't really need a belt & braces solution, but I appreciate the advice. Thanks

This is the main reason that I use a UPS. I was getting fed up with the short blackouts knocking my internet connection off-line.

[Mutt Daeng]

I am now in a position to purchase a UPS (Most likely APC or Zircon). Thanks to all who took the trouble to respond to my post(s). Mods please close.

Edited March 18 by Mutt Daeng

[CharlieH]

CLOSED on request OP