UK PR - will Lib Dems honour their pledge?

[BobBKK]

Reform 5 seats  4.1m votes

Lib Dems 71 seats  3.5m votes

Green 4 seats  1.9m votes


No comment - above says it ALL



 

[retarius]

5 hours ago, BobBKK said:

Reform 5 seats  4.1m votes

Lib Dems 71 seats  3.5m votes

Green 4 seats  1.9m votes


No comment - above says it ALL



 

Strange not think that if all of those reform voters had stuck with Tory there would be no landslide. Indeed the switch to Labour from 2019 (adjusted to reflect changed boundaries) was only 1.7% in the latest election. Hardly a landslide switch.

What I think is that 4 million voters voted for Tories in the past but then changed to Reform this town. Tories were down 19.9%. Think if Reform didn't exist and those 4 million vote went to Tories, then they would have increased there share vs 2019. What does it all mean. 1) UK has a very unrepresentative system with the appointed HoL and the FPTP system that totally robs millions of their say in the running of the country 2) the Tories still have the problem of the renegade tories (the Brexiteers), I tend to feel that the people who voted for Reform and those that voted Tory cannot be held within one party. 3) Lib Dems as usual did nothing, yet got 71 seats from a handful of voters.....ridiculous. These are clowns that were pushing for proportional representation in the coalition government. 

[BobBKK]

16 hours ago, retarius said:

Strange not think that if all of those reform voters had stuck with Tory there would be no landslide. Indeed the switch to Labour from 2019 (adjusted to reflect changed boundaries) was only 1.7% in the latest election. Hardly a landslide switch.

What I think is that 4 million voters voted for Tories in the past but then changed to Reform this town. Tories were down 19.9%. Think if Reform didn't exist and those 4 million vote went to Tories, then they would have increased there share vs 2019. What does it all mean. 1) UK has a very unrepresentative system with the appointed HoL and the FPTP system that totally robs millions of their say in the running of the country 2) the Tories still have the problem of the renegade tories (the Brexiteers), I tend to feel that the people who voted for Reform and those that voted Tory cannot be held within one party. 3) Lib Dems as usual did nothing, yet got 71 seats from a handful of voters.....ridiculous. These are clowns that were pushing for proportional representation in the coalition government. 

 I agree, but the Tories needed to be challenged for their total stupidity - the system is absurd, but now Labour has got this, they won't want a change.

The idea that a candidate gets 10,000, the loser 9,500, and the 9,500 are unrepresented is madness.

[Pickwick]

19 hours ago, retarius said:

I tend to feel that the people who voted for Reform and those that voted Tory cannot be held within one party

I agree and think this is a very important point. I tend to think there are many people in the centre/moderate right who would not vote for Reform; and many in Reform who view the Conservatives as being too close to the centre. We could be seeing a real fracture in the right, not dissimilar to the Republicans and RN in France. The Conservative Party needs to be very careful with its next move. The nightmare for them is Nigel Farage now being in the House. He doesn't need to cosy up to the Conservatives, it's the other way around.

 

19 hours ago, retarius said:

Lib Dems as usual did nothing, yet got 71 seats from a handful of voters.....ridiculous. These are clowns that were pushing for proportional representation in the coalition government. 

I don't understand your point. You wrote above that the FPTP system is not fit for purpose, yet then call the Lib Dems clowns for being the party who has called for and campaigned for electoral reform for many years. I appreciate you may not agree with their politics, but on this issue surely they deserve credit. It is unfortunate that people only take notice of issues when their party is suddenly affected, but credit to Nigel Farage, he is also on record as wanting electoral reform going back at least a decade.

 

I also don't know how Reform can be lauded for their support but at the same time the 'Lib Dems did nothing' - the LIb Dems had a very clear strategy (like Reform) under the current rules and it was an unqualified success, hence the 71 seats. I don't recall a single critique of this strategy before the election. Odd that, given the opprobrium now.

 

2 hours ago, BobBKK said:

The idea that a candidate gets 10,000, the loser 9,500, and the 9,500 are unrepresented is madness.

Well, yes, but it has been that way since 1950!

 

The Lib Dems - seemingly the target of some voters' ire - have campaigned for this system to be replaced for a very long time (as has Nigel Farage, though I can't recall this being discussed as a major issue in the last six weeks among Reform supporters - until the result of course). The Conservative Party, in power more than the Labour party during this time, has had zero interest in changing the rules.

 

Your quote above, which I agree with, also shines light on another problem. We have accepted a divide and conquer style of politics where large sections of our society are routinely ignored. Those sections are branded 'losers' or 'whiners' or some other such insult when an election or referendum result does not go their way. 

 

Until we stop this incessant trade of insults and start taking our society seriously as a whole then those orchestrating the divide and rule will continue to prosper, whilst the rest of us shout at each other as we race to the bottom.

 

[Will B Good]

On 7/6/2024 at 10:22 AM, BobBKK said:

Reform 5 seats  4.1m votes

Lib Dems 71 seats  3.5m votes

Green 4 seats  1.9m votes


No comment - above says it ALL



 

 

Thank God for FPTP