Trump’s Middle East Challenge: Balancing Crisis and Strategy in a Region on Edge

[candide]

4 hours ago, illisdean said:

Thats one derivative, countries like China exploit climate reforms in the West to their economic advantage. The priorities in the west are HSE, quality and cost in that order. In China, the exact opposite is true, Cost is number 1 priority, dead people and polluted streams are normal there and no cause for concern. 

Complete B.S. 😆

 

China has implemented significant programs to reduce pollution. That's why it's now the leader for products such as solar panels and electric cars.  Because they had policies to diffuse their use in China.

 

Oh, and of course, you forgot to 'notice' the differences in population between countries. Per capita, Americans are polluting much more than Chinese or Indians. 😆

 

"China and India have huge populations, though — more than 1.4 billion people each, or four times the U.S. population of 345 million people. That means on a per person basis, the Chinese produce 9.8 metric tons of CO2 equivalent each year and Indians produce 2.9 metric tons of CO2 equivalent in 2022. Americans produced 17.7 metric tons per person."

https://www.ciphernews.com/articles/china-qatar-and-u-s-lead-depending-on-how-you-judge-emissions/

[simple1]

On 12/6/2024 at 10:40 AM, RichardColeman said:

Pretty sure Islam has been causing instability in the region - and every other one - for like 700 years up. Unless you ban Islam from the area, there will always be islamic nutters causing more problems. It will not end no matter who is president. 

 

Most of the lack of stability in M.E. has been created by the dictatorships aggressively supressing the Arab Spring. Plus of course the US invasion or Iraq thoroughly upset the apple cart.

 

Syrian "liberation" forces who were channelled to Idlib Province during the civil war have now defeated Assad forces within a ten day period and occupied Damascus (you will want not to be an Alawite or Christian enabler of Assad still in Syria). Have to see if the so called rebels are able to keep their word and not transition from the oppressed to the oppressor. The Russian military bases on the coast appear to have yet to be overrun, though it has been reported Russian navy ships have departed Tartus, have to see if Russia withdraws all it's forces or fights.

 

Interesting days ahead to see if trump is actually able to bring some stability and peace to current conflicts. Personally I don't believe just waving the big stick will be effective.

[nauseus]

On 12/6/2024 at 2:49 PM, candide said:

Not really. The old  Caliphates or the Ottoman empire have been quite stable and prosperous.

Of course, nothing to compare with the stability in Europe during this period, with no major war, no bloody religious persecution, etc...

Oh wait! 😆

 

Oh wait what? Stable no. Prosperous yes, for themselves maybe but nobody else.

 

Islam invaded the Caucasus (Persia) via Muslim expansion into the Caucasus in the 7th century and the Umayyad conquest of Iberia after that meant that much of the Iberian Peninsula was occupied until the 15th century. The Ottoman Empire also conquered and occupied the Balkans and remnants of the Byzantine Empire. After stalling at the Gates of Vienna  in 1529, the Ottoman Empire then declined, until it was defeated and eventually collapsed, relatively recently. in 1922. All of these invasions and occupations featured multiple battles, deaths, significant slavery and instability.

[candide]

1 hour ago, nauseus said:

 

Oh wait what? Stable no. Prosperous yes, for themselves maybe but nobody else.

 

Islam invaded the Caucasus (Persia) via Muslim expansion into the Caucasus in the 7th century and the Umayyad conquest of Iberia after that meant that much of the Iberian Peninsula was occupied until the 15th century. The Ottoman Empire also conquered and occupied the Balkans and remnants of the Byzantine Empire. After stalling at the Gates of Vienna  in 1529, the Ottoman Empire then declined, until it was defeated and eventually collapsed, relatively recently. in 1922. All of these invasions and occupations featured multiple battles, deaths, significant slavery and instability.

Ok

[thaibeachlovers]

12 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Indeed. It's only the oil. 

Trump said he will get of of Syria, despite all the oil the US has been stealing for years. 

 

Going to be interesting to see what he does now Assad is gone.

[thaibeachlovers]

12 hours ago, simple1 said:

Interesting days ahead to see if trump is actually able to bring some stability and peace to current conflicts. Personally I don't believe just waving the big stick will be effective.

Trump and every crusader nation should keep their sticky beaks out of Syria, as they'll just make it worse. I doubt the west will be able to resist the temptation to interfere though. Cue the next western war in the M E that will cause untold death and destruction followed by an ignominious retreat after years of wasted treasure and lives.

 

I suspect that in a year or so, if it goes fundamentalist, we will wish that Assad had remained in charge. He may be a very bad man, but under him Syria wasn't a force attacking western interests. Same as when Iranian fundamentalists overthrew the Shah.

[simple1]

5 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Trump and every crusader nation should keep their sticky beaks out of Syria, as they'll just make it worse. I doubt the west will be able to resist the temptation to interfere though. Cue the next western war in the M E that will cause untold death and destruction followed by an ignominious retreat after years of wasted treasure and lives.

 

I suspect that in a year or so, if it goes fundamentalist, we will wish that Assad had remained in charge. He may be a very bad man, but under him Syria wasn't a force attacking western interests. Same as when Iranian fundamentalists overthrew the Shah.

 

US currently supports the Kurds in the NE who were effective in taking on ISIS. Syria, plus some SF dealing with ISIS who are still present in Syrian desert. Personally no way I'd define trump as a Crusader

[thaibeachlovers]

16 hours ago, simple1 said:

 

US currently supports the Kurds in the NE who were effective in taking on ISIS. Syria, plus some SF dealing with ISIS who are still present in Syrian desert. Personally no way I'd define trump as a Crusader

If it comes down to supporting Turkey, a NATO member, which IMO wants to destroy the Kurds, or the Kurds, who do you think he will support?

 

While the US didn't exist during the crusades, the original Euro immigrants came from crusader countries and I believe Trumps origins are German, and Germany or whatever that region was called back then certainly were in the crusades.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusade_of_1197

The Crusade of 1197, also known as the Crusade of Henry VI (German: Kreuzzug Heinrichs VI.) or the German Crusade (Deutscher Kreuzzug), was a crusade launched by the Hohenstaufen emperor Henry VI in response to the aborted attempt of his father, Emperor Frederick I, during the Third Crusade in 1189–90. Thus the military campaign is also known as the "Emperor's Crusade" (echoing the name "Kings' Crusade" given to the Third Crusade).[2]

[simple1]

7 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

If it comes down to supporting Turkey, a NATO member, which IMO wants to destroy the Kurds, or the Kurds, who do you think he will support?

 

Probably neither, though trump did previously tried to stab the Kurds in the back after they had 10,000 casualties fighting ISIS. US military persuaded him not to do so.

 

https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump-syria-ap-top-news-international-news-politics-ac3115b4eb564288a03a5b8be868d2e5

[thaibeachlovers]

On 12/10/2024 at 4:19 PM, simple1 said:

 

Probably neither, though trump did previously tried to stab the Kurds in the back after they had 10,000 casualties fighting ISIS. US military persuaded him not to do so.

 

https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump-syria-ap-top-news-international-news-politics-ac3115b4eb564288a03a5b8be868d2e5

I get the impression that Trump doesn't care much about anyone not an American. Perhaps that is a good thing for Americans. I doubt the average American is in favour of being the world's policeman.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 12/10/2024 at 4:19 PM, simple1 said:

 

Probably neither, though trump did previously tried to stab the Kurds in the back after they had 10,000 casualties fighting ISIS. US military persuaded him not to do so.

 

https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump-syria-ap-top-news-international-news-politics-ac3115b4eb564288a03a5b8be868d2e5

Seems to be a US/ Kurd thing, if we remember how Bush stabbed them in the back after encouraging them to rebel against Saddam and then abandoning them to Saddam's revenge.

[simple1]

5 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Seems to be a US/ Kurd thing, if we remember how Bush stabbed them in the back after encouraging them to rebel against Saddam and then abandoning them to Saddam's revenge.

 

With Bush it was the Kurds and Shiites who suffered, with approx 50,000 deaths. Plus US military error to permit Iraqi military helicopters in Southern Iraq.