Russia planning ‘to test article 5’, with an attack on Nato

[Mike_Hunt]

8 hours ago, Tug said:

This may explain tulsi gabbard almost verbatim speaking Russian propaganda today.if that happens you can be sure trump will taco,furthermore he may try to sabotage US weapon systems owned by nato countries wouldn’t surprise me one bit.don’t count on him for sure!they are also withdrawing personnel from the Middle East something may indeed be brewing.

Can someone translate this babble? 

[Mike_Hunt]

4 hours ago, Tug said:

I think trump will taco he’s scared of putin I think it’s more likely he will try to pull us out of nato.The Europeans will kick putins rear end Ukraine has allready bled putin down.if Putin is foolish enough to do it it just might be Ukraines salvation.

If Europe has the ability to kick the rear end of Putin, why would the USA be involved? 

[transam]

Just now, Mike_Hunt said:

If Europe has the ability to kick the rear end of Putin, why would the USA be involved? 

Because they like to be, you should know that....🙄

[Mike_Hunt]

1 hour ago, FlorC said:

Russia's red lines are not about invading.

Russia's red lines are a joke. 

[RayC]

3 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

Why oh why, in any conceivable universe would Russia attack Finland or any other NATO country? For what?

 

So the German intelligence services think Russia will invade Finland because......why? Russia would incur the risk of nuclear war to get sauna know-how or for what reason?

 

There are any number of POSSIBLE reasons, e.g as this article suggests to test NATO's resolve.

 

Is it likely to happen? Hopefully not - and nowhere I have suggested that it will - but if it were to happen, I am convinced that some on this forum would seek to justify Putin's actions.

[Mike_Hunt]

3 minutes ago, RayC said:

 

There are any number of POSSIBLE reasons, e.g as this article suggests to test NATO's resolve.

 

Is it likely to happen? Hopefully not - and nowhere I have suggested that it will - but if it were to happen, I am convinced that some on this forum would seek to justify Putin's actions.

They will claim that Putin was provoked. 

[Cameroni]

9 minutes ago, RayC said:

There are any number of POSSIBLE reasons, e.g as this article suggests to test NATO's resolve.

 

Lol, yeah, Russia will attack a NATO member just to see if NATO will unleash nuclear hell on Russia or not. Sure. sounds totally plausible.

 

There is no way that Putin would risk nuclear war with NATO just to see if NATO will wage war. Completely insane.

 

 

[johng]

25 minutes ago, Mike_Hunt said:

They will claim that Putin was provoked. 

He was and is   NATO proxy war right on his doorstep.

[Mike_Hunt]

1 minute ago, johng said:

He was and is   NATO proxy war right on his doorstep.

They joined NATO because Russian is on their doorstep. 

[RayC]

29 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

Lol, yeah, Russia will attack a NATO member just to see if NATO will unleash nuclear hell on Russia or not. Sure. sounds totally plausible.

 

There is no way that Putin would risk nuclear war with NATO just to see if NATO will wage war. Completely insane.

 

 

 

I tend to agree with you. I don't think that either Putin, Trump, Macron or Starmer is insane, however, there are posters who believe otherwise, and there are certainly those who will excuse Putin for anything.

[johng]

Ukraine never joined NATO officially   NATO has advanced towards Russia since the fall of the Berlin wall    Russia has not advanced,well until recently  due to the provocations. 

[johng]

1 minute ago, RayC said:

there are certainly those who will excuse Putin for anything

 

Putin is the rational and reserved party  he tries not to escalate

its often seen as weakness or inability  ( no washing machines)

[Mike_Hunt]

2 minutes ago, johng said:

Ukraine never joined NATO officially   NATO has advanced towards Russia since the fall of the Berlin wall    Russia has not advanced,well until recently  due to the provocations. 

You have this backwards.   Former counties of the USSR want nothing to do with Russia, so they ran to NATO.  They are just not into Putin. 

[Mike_Hunt]

1 minute ago, johng said:

 

Putin is the rational and reserved party  he tries not to escalate

its often seen as weakness or inability  ( no washing machines)

It was not rational to invade Ukraine. 

[freedomnow]

Ka-ching for their armament buddies.

[candide]

12 minutes ago, Mike_Hunt said:

It was not rational to invade Ukraine. 

It was rational from his perspective.

 

Having said that, if he had anticipated correctly the difficulty of conquering Ukraine, he may not have done it.

[DezLez]

1 hour ago, CanadaSam said:

You can not include China in this, their only small discretions were directed towards Taiwan which was always "Chinese" territory.

No it has not.

The island was annexed in 1683 by the Qing dynasty of China and ceded to the Empire of Japan in 1895. The Republic of China, which had overthrown the Qing in 1912 under the leadership of Sun Yat-sen, took control following the surrender of Japan in World War II.

 The immediate resumption of the Chinese Civil War resulted in the loss of the Chinese mainland to Communist forces, who established the People's Republic of China, and the flight of the ROC central government to Taiwan in 1949. The effective jurisdiction of the ROC has since been limited to Taiwan, Penghu, and smaller islands.

[johng]

12 minutes ago, Mike_Hunt said:

You have this backwards.   Former counties of the USSR want nothing to do with Russia, so they ran to NATO.  They are just not into Putin. 

The eastern part of Ukraine and Crimea say otherwise.

Russia was "promised" no NATO expansion   yes we see it was in fact a "pinky promise"  and the expansion happened  until Russia could stand it no more..they kept saying this is a red line  and then "everyone" is surprised when they carried out their threat to take back the Russian speaking  eastern parts.

[Lacessit]

14 minutes ago, johng said:

 

Putin is the rational and reserved party  he tries not to escalate

its often seen as weakness or inability  ( no washing machines)

Putin was told what he wanted to hear by his FSB buddies, he thought Ukraine would be a pushover.

 

It's a common occurrence with dictators, to surround themselves with yes-men.

 

Something Americans should take note of.

 

Invading Crimea (2014) and the Donbas (2022) was not an escalation? Stop posting BS.

[johng]

2 minutes ago, candide said:

It was rational from his perspective.

 

 

Yes there was already an agreement on the table  and probably Putin expected that Ukraine would agree to terms quickly after a show of force however he didn't reckon on the  Boris  sent to scupper the deal.

[johng]

2 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Invading Crimea (2014) and the Donbas (2022) was not an escalation? Stop posting BS.

 

he tries not to escalate   but yes it was  after much provocation

stop posting BS.

[Mike_Hunt]

7 minutes ago, johng said:

The eastern part of Ukraine and Crimea say otherwise.

Russia was "promised" no NATO expansion   yes we see it was in fact a "pinky promise"  and the expansion happened  until Russia could stand it no more..they kept saying this is a red line  and then "everyone" is surprised when they carried out their threat to take back the Russian speaking  eastern parts.

Russia singed an agreement to respect the sovereignty of Ukraine.  

[Mike_Hunt]

2 minutes ago, johng said:

 

he tries not to escalate   but yes it was  after much provocation

stop posting BS.

I'm so tired of this dumb Russian propaganda.  

[candide]

Putin's problem is a problem of timing.

 

If he wants to invade some Baltic states (that's the obvious strategic target), he has a strategic window corresponding to Trump's mandate. He has no certainty that the next U.S. government will have the same complacency, so the strategic window will likely close at the end of Trump's mandate. Relatedly, European Countries are (akbait too slowly) increasing their military resources, so the more he waits, the higher their ability to counter him.

 

However, because of the war in Ukraine, Russia is too weak and exhausted to finance another war during Trump's mandate. So he may not be able to take this opportunity.

[Eric Loh]

5 minutes ago, candide said:

It was rational from his perspective.

 

Having said that, if he had anticipated correctly the difficulty of conquering Ukraine, he may not have done it.

Ukraine war is Putin's nightmare. It is estimated that Russia military modernisation efforts are being set back by nearly 2 decades as resources and attention are diverted to the invasion. Russia lost an estimate of 100,000 soldiers killed or injured and up to 8,000 armoured vehicles including 2,700 tanks. The invasion is at a stalemate and Russia losses are accumulating.

[johng]

31 minutes ago, Mike_Hunt said:

I'm so tired of this dumb Russian propaganda.  

I'm so tired of this dumb NATO/Ukrainian/MIC  propaganda.

[johng]

32 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

It is estimated that Russia military modernisation efforts are being set back by nearly 2 decades

Yeah no washing machines again.

From the MSM

 https://news.sky.com/author/dominic-waghorn-528

 

Russia's economy is 1/25th that of NATO's combined economic might and crippled by sanctions and yet every three months pumps out more shells than the entire NATO bloc manages in a year.

[johng]

39 minutes ago, candide said:

If he wants to invade some Baltic states

That was never on the cards but if you keep pushing who knows.. seems  some are just itching for war.

[freedomnow]

1 hour ago, Cameroni said:

 

Lol, yeah, Russia will attack a NATO member just to see if NATO will unleash nuclear hell on Russia or not. Sure. sounds totally plausible.

 

There is no way that Putin would risk nuclear war with NATO just to see if NATO will wage war. Completely insane.

 

 

You've changed your tune....turncoat ?

[Cameroni]

5 minutes ago, freedomnow said:

You've changed your tune....turncoat ?

 

Not even a little. I have been iron clad consistent.