In recent history, the French revolution and the "introduction" of communism is being considered as the major "sociological events".

As the French revolution left it's marks, communism failed.

Many theories. Russian focus on military hardware, neglecting "consumer needs". Logistic problems. One town had an oversupply of shoes, an other (100KM's away) had no shoes for sale, as an example, etc etc etc............ Production and logistic problems. Next to an emerging "Party Aristocracy". Rivalling French Kings.

With the help of AI, could those production/logistic problems be resolved? Heaven forbid, giving communism a second chance? AI making communist party leaders unnececcary?

Giving thaught, that there are a few individuals having billions, whyle about 2 billions of people live on less than 2 Dollars a day.

Has there possibly gone something wrong?

Perhaps we can start all over again with Cuba ?

7 hours ago, swissie said:

In recent history, the French revolution and the "introduction" of communism is being considered as the major "sociological events".

As the French revolution left it's marks, communism failed.

Many theories. Russian focus on military hardware, neglecting "consumer needs". Logistic problems. One town had an oversupply of shoes, an other (100KM's away) had no shoes for sale, as an example, etc etc etc............ Production and logistic problems. Next to an emerging "Party Aristocracy". Rivalling French Kings.

With the help of AI, could those production/logistic problems be resolved? Heaven forbid, giving communism a second chance? AI making communist party leaders unnececcary?

Giving thaught, that there are a few individuals having billions, whyle about 2 billions of people live on less than 2 Dollars a day.

Has there possibly gone something wrong?

Communism sucks. That's why.

I used to spend a lot of time in Cuba and we would have these discussions about communism. I also have a friend from the Czech Republic back when it was Czechoslovakia. Every communist person I know, or should I say every person I know who comes from a communist country or lives in a communist country utterly despises communism, and is acutely aware of the extreme failure of communism every time it's been attempted in the history of mankind.

Stripped agrarian systems that have completely collapsed in the case of Cuba, very greedy leaders like Stalin with 40,000 bottle wine cellars, cockroaches like Fidel Castro with tens of billions of dollars socked away somewhere, from allowing Cuba to be used for drug transiting and stealing from the people. Kim depriving his people of a decent life and sucking the blood of his nation to the very last pint. The list goes on and on of communist atrocities.

Some might say the same thing about democracy, but I would certainly prefer it to Communism without exception.

Communism sucks! Communism has always failed its people.

Edited June 3Jun 3 by spidermike007

There are currently five officially recognized communist countries in the world: China, Cuba, Laos, North Korea, and Vietnam.

Russia is not, The country transitioned to a multi-party system and a capitalist, market-based economy following the collapse of the Soviet Union in 1991

12 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

I used to spend a lot of time in Cuba and we would have these discussions about communism. I also have a friend from the Czech Republic back when it was Czechoslovakia. Every communist person I know, or should I say every person I know who comes from a communist country or lives in a communist country utterly despises communism, and is acutely aware of the extreme failure of communism every time it's been attempted in the history of mankind.

Some might say the same thing about democracy, but I would certainly prefer it to Communism without exception.

Communism sucks!

To say Communism sucks! is a personnel opinion, the ideology that advocates for the abolition of private property and the establishment of a classless society IMHO is a good thing ! would it work NO !!

Communism as an ideology in its purest form has never existed. The closest one can or could get is maybe a kibbutz.

Russia was never really communist it was a dictatorship clothed in communism.

Look at Laos. Got ride of the king and put in his place the leader of the "communist" party who now live in a big <deleted> of house with 3 cars etc. and has or will create a new dynasty like N. Korea. None of the ranking "communist" officials live in a 3 bedroom duplex/semi the same as the proletariat.

We need to invents a new word for that kind of governance.

China seems to work by separating governance from business but has strayed from the ideal as all of the party congress members are millionaires.

1 hour ago, MikeandDow said:

To say Communism sucks! is a personnel opinion, the ideology that advocates for the abolition of private property and the establishment of a classless society IMHO is a good thing ! would it work NO !!

If you're talking about the ideology and the philosophy that's a whole different thing, but what I'm talking about is communism put into action and put into practice. And that sucks big time. Every time it's been tried it had failed miserably and caused tremendous pain to the citizens. If you're willing to show me an example of a successful communist experiment I am all ears.

Communism ... all people are equal ,but some people are more equal than others.

Democracy ... Churchill said , "the worst form of government except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time" trouble is one of the largest democracies in the World ,a dictator like figure is doing everything to try

and destroy what it stands for....guess who ?

regards Worgeordie

1.4 billion people live under Communist rule and they are rapidly excelling to a new Chinese middle class as the middle classes in "capitalist" West are in serious decline.
Communism hasn't failed, it has morphed into a form of free market Communism that no one envisioned 50 years ago. In the meanwhile, the "freedom loving" capitalist countries (US, UK, EU) go out of their way to sanction smaller, weaker Communist countries like Cuba and the DPRK, then after the West economically gangs up on these countries to destroy them economically, the Western MSM will declare that, "Communism and Socialism is a failure."
It's Predatory Capitalism that is becoming a complete societal failure for all but the 1% of millionaires and billionaires who siphon the wealth of capitalist countries into their own pockets leaving the average citizens unable to afford food, shelter, and god forbid actually buying a home.

44 minutes ago, connda said:

It's Predatory Capitalism that is becoming a complete societal failure for all but the 1% of millionaires and billionaires who siphon the wealth of capitalist countries into their own pockets leaving the average citizens unable to afford food, shelter, and god forbid actually buying a home.

Agree with your post, even more so with this part.

To the topic ... probably because it has never worked. There is no successful, wholly communist country or economy that has worked.

As long as humans are corrupt, there will never be, an 'all for one and one for all' society.

I certainly would never want one, as I want more than most folks seem to want, so I create more for myself.

Edited June 4Jun 4 by KhunLA

12 hours ago, swissie said:

Has there possibly gone something wrong?

Of course, state run communism is simply inconvenient and oppressive for human nature. Capitalism is one of the most freest expressions known to mankind.

On 6/4/2026 at 11:06 AM, KhunLA said:

To the topic ... probably because it has never worked. There is no successful, wholly communist country or economy that has worked.

Uh - China. 🙄 <eye-roll>

On 6/4/2026 at 11:18 AM, novacova said:

Of course, state run communism is simply inconvenient and oppressive for human nature. Capitalism is one of the most freest expressions known to mankind.

For the 1% who hoover-up all of the wealth of the nation into their own pockets. This isn't even worth debating. Westerner's insist Capitalism is "one of the most freest expressions known to mankind" as the majority of citizens in Western capitalistic countries are barely scraping by month to month, or even day to day, and most Gen Z kids are well and truly f***ed and will never own a home, many will be saddled with debt for a lifetime, many can't afford transportation or even basic healthcare. Yes! The Capitalistic Utopia!

If I was in my 20's I'd be looking to immigrate to Asia as opposed to retired in Thailand, perhaps even China or Russia, where Western proponents of Capitalism insist that these countries economies are destitute. I don't buy the rhetoric that countries like China or Russia are hell-hole pits of inhumanity while I look around the country of my birth and see first-hand what a utopia that capitalism has brought to the United States.

👇🏼👇👇🏻👇🏽👇🏾👇🏿 Here is reality in the Capitalist Utopia of America 👇🏼👇👇🏻👇🏽👇🏾👇🏿

Welcome To The Capitalist Utopia Of The United States of America

ALL HAIL CAPITALISM!!!

30 minutes ago, connda said:

Uh - China. 🙄 <eye-roll>

Far from a wholly communist country / economy. Capitalism exists side by side, along with plenty of capitalist Billionaires. And that might not even include Taiwan.

... "China is home to between 539 and 1,110 billionaires, depending on the specific ranking criteria and whether Hong Kong is included." ... - G AI

Not exactly the 'all for one, one for all' communist doctrine.

17 minutes ago, connda said:

For the 1% who hoover-up all of the wealth of the nation into their own pockets. This isn't even worth debating. Westerner's insist Capitalism is "one of the most freest expressions known to mankind" as the majority of citizens in Western capitalistic countries are barely scraping by month to month, or even day to day, and most Gen Z kids are well and truly f***ed and will never own a home, many will be saddled with debt for a lifetime, many can't afford transportation or even basic healthcare. Yes! The Capitalistic Utopia!

If I was in my 20's I'd be looking to immigrate to Asia as opposed to retired in Thailand, perhaps even China or Russia, where Western proponents of Capitalism insist that these countries economies are destitute. I don't buy the rhetoric that countries like China or Russia are hell-hole pits of inhumanity while I look around the country of my birth and see first-hand what a utopia that capitalism has brought to the United States.

👇🏼👇👇🏻👇🏽👇🏾👇🏿 Here is reality in the Capitalist Utopia of America 👇🏼👇👇🏻👇🏽👇🏾👇🏿

Welcome To The Capitalist Utopia Of The United States of America

ALL HAIL CAPITALISM!!!

Capitalism is the best, but one has to exercise the opportunities it offers. Quite a few do, and then some ...

... "There are approximately 23.8 million to 25.4 million millionaires living in the United States." ... - G AI

Almost 1000 Billionaires. Yea, capitalism sucks ... for those that don't take advantage of it.

I retired at 45, and don't think that would have been possible if say, I lived in Cuba, unless a drug runner.

On 6/4/2026 at 3:47 AM, connda said:

1.4 billion people live under Communist rule and they are rapidly excelling to a new Chinese middle class as the middle classes in "capitalist" West are in serious decline.
Communism hasn't failed, it has morphed into a form of free market Communism that no one envisioned 50 years ago. In the meanwhile, the "freedom loving" capitalist countries (US, UK, EU) go out of their way to sanction smaller, weaker Communist countries like Cuba and the DPRK, then after the West economically gangs up on these countries to destroy them economically, the Western MSM will declare that, "Communism and Socialism is a failure."
It's Predatory Capitalism that is becoming a complete societal failure for all but the 1% of millionaires and billionaires who siphon the wealth of capitalist countries into their own pockets leaving the average citizens unable to afford food, shelter, and god forbid actually buying a home.

China isn't communist and western countries aren't genuinely capitalist or 'freedom loving'.

UK Government is made up of former(?) marxists and current fabian socialists.
US Government is made up of a clique of insiders only working for themselves, their sponsers and israel.
Hardly capitalist

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Wi_zQX--wE&t=2395s

Edited June 5Jun 5 by Tourist2

its not dead, its disguised as climate change action

1 hour ago, Tourist2 said:

China isn't communist and western countries aren't genuinely capitalist or 'freedom loving'.

Bingo! Well stated and spot on.

On 6/3/2026 at 6:14 PM, swissie said:

In recent history, the French revolution and the "introduction" of communism is being considered as the major "sociological events".

As the French revolution left it's marks, communism failed.

Many theories. Russian focus on military hardware, neglecting "consumer needs". Logistic problems. One town had an oversupply of shoes, an other (100KM's away) had no shoes for sale, as an example, etc etc etc............ Production and logistic problems. Next to an emerging "Party Aristocracy". Rivalling French Kings.

With the help of AI, could those production/logistic problems be resolved? Heaven forbid, giving communism a second chance? AI making communist party leaders unnececcary?

Giving thaught, that there are a few individuals having billions, whyle about 2 billions of people live on less than 2 Dollars a day.

Has there possibly gone something wrong?

AI can further bring improvements, but the key point is big data.

As you mentioned one of the main causes of the failure of communism, was its centralized command economy system, which was unable to cope with the actual complexity and unpredictability of the economy, leading to the kind of situation you mentioned. A more decentralised market economy was better able to cope with this complexity and unpredictability.

To use your example, with the help of big data, a centralized system would have been able to follow up shoes consumption and its drivers, and predict the right quantity of shoes by size and location.

Would it be enough to allow efficient communist regimes nowadays? That's another story. Even China is not a centralized command economy, it's more like a centralized economic policy system.

1 hour ago, connda said:

For the 1% who hoover-up all of the wealth of the nation into their own pockets. This isn't even worth debating. Westerner's insist Capitalism is "one of the most freest expressions known to mankind" as the majority of citizens in Western capitalistic countries are barely scraping by month to month, or even day to day, and most Gen Z kids are well and truly f***ed and will never own a home, many will be saddled with debt for a lifetime, many can't afford transportation or even basic healthcare. Yes! The Capitalistic Utopia!

If I was in my 20's I'd be looking to immigrate to Asia as opposed to retired in Thailand, perhaps even China or Russia, where Western proponents of Capitalism insist that these countries economies are destitute. I don't buy the rhetoric that countries like China or Russia are hell-hole pits of inhumanity while I look around the country of my birth and see first-hand what a utopia that capitalism has brought to the United States.

👇🏼👇👇🏻👇🏽👇🏾👇🏿 Here is reality in the Capitalist Utopia of America 👇🏼👇👇🏻👇🏽👇🏾👇🏿

Welcome To The Capitalist Utopia Of The United States of America

ALL HAIL CAPITALISM!!!

Your lack of ambition to excel and take advantage of capitalism is the epitome of capitalism. You deliberately failed solely on your own. Success isn’t about handouts, though a beggar wouldn’t know this.

1 hour ago, KhunLA said:

Capitalism is the best, but one has to exercise the opportunities it offers. Quite a few do, and then some ...

A procrastinating pacifist wouldn’t understand this until it’s too late, then they start complaining about how unfair the system is, yet the system in the US offered the opportunity on a silver platter. In the US it’s not uncommon for dirt poor people study hard in school, get a student loan and/or scholarship or start a business from nothing and go on to be successful, that’s what tenacious determination and ambition is about. Though the flunkies offer nothing but complaints and blaming others for their failures.

Edited June 5Jun 5 by novacova

3 hours ago, candide said:

AI can further bring improvements, but the key point is big data.

As you mentioned one of the main causes of the failure of communism, was its centralized command economy system, which was unable to cope with the actual complexity and unpredictability of the economy, leading to the kind of situation you mentioned. A more decentralised market economy was better able to cope with this complexity and unpredictability.

To use your example, with the help of big data, a centralized system would have been able to follow up shoes consumption and its drivers, and predict the right quantity of shoes by size and location.

Would it be enough to allow efficient communist regimes nowadays? That's another story. Even China is not a centralized command economy, it's more like a centralized economic policy system.

Thanks for replying directly to my question. The "weaknessess" of communism are known. According to promesses by AI developpers, those weaknesses (production/distribution/logistics) can be solved in seconds. No need for thousands of "Apparatschicks" in the "planning bureau's", planning the economy for the next 5 years. Failure predicable.

AI the solution?

13 minutes ago, swissie said:

Thanks for replying directly to my question. The "weaknessess" of communism are known. According to promesses by AI developpers, those weaknesses (production/distribution/logistics) can be solved in seconds. No need for thousands of "Apparatschicks" in the "planning bureau's", planning the economy for the next 5 years. Failure predicable.

AI the solution?

Probably not in terms of comparative advantage. AI can solve plenty of problems, but likely doesn't help more centralised systems than decentralised systems (I may be wrong, but I don't see how it would). So a communist system using AI would still be less competitive, compared to a capitalist system using AI.

On the other hand, big data tends to benefit large centralized structures, so it would benefit centralized economic systems more than decentralized systems. Of course, it doesn't mean that it would make a communist system competitive enough, for several other reasons.

16 minutes ago, candide said:

Probably not in terms of comparative advantage. AI can solve plenty of problems, but likely doesn't help more centralised systems than decentralised systems (I may be wrong, but I don't see how it would). So a communist system using AI would still be less competitive, compared to a capitalist system using AI.

On the other hand, big data tends to benefit large centralized structures, so it would benefit centralized economic systems more than decentralized systems. Of course, it doesn't mean that it would make a communist system competitive enough, for several other reasons.

Thanks, makes sense. Next time I drink a cup of coffee with Elon, I will casually mention such things.🙂

4 hours ago, novacova said:

A procrastinating pacifist wouldn’t understand this until it’s too late, then they start complaining about how unfair the system is, yet the system in the US offered the opportunity on a silver platter. In the US it’s not uncommon for dirt poor people study hard in school, get a student loan and/or scholarship or start a business from nothing and go on to be successful, that’s what tenacious determination and ambition is about. Though the flunkies offer nothing but complaints and blaming others for their failures.

Most Americans want to become millionaires. It's the gospel. But, compared to the population, relatively few make it. Most remain "middle class" all their lives. Keeping up with mortgage payements and hoping not to lose their jobs, once past 45 years old. This is being considered as basically a "successful life path" for most Americans these days.

The millions of US citizens living on the street or in tents (if privileged), you consider as people that simply diden't understand the opportunities that capitalism offers. In other words: "If you live in a tent, it's your damm own fault as you have not understood the capitalist system".

Fine. Understood. Let's keep going. Past history shows, that we have always found a way to dispose of "useless people".

6 hours ago, connda said:

Uh - China. 🙄 <eye-roll>

China struggled until it embraced capitalism. While communism aims for a classless society, the ruling class always retains a higher status.

2 minutes ago, swissie said:

Most Americans want to become millionaires. It's the gospel. But, compared to the population, relatively few make it. Most remain "middle class" all their lives. Keeping up with mortgage payements and hoping not to lose their jobs, once past 45 years old. This is being considered as basically a "successful life path" for most Americans these days.

The millions of US citizens living on the street or in tents (if privileged), you consider as people that simply diden't understand the opportunities that capitalism offers. In other words: "If you live in a tent, it's your damm own fault as you have not understood the capitalist system".

Fine. Understood. Let's keep going. Past history shows, that we have always found a way to dispose of "useless people".

The number of homeless people in the USA is 770,000, which represents 0.22 percent of the population. In comparison, there are 1.3 million homeless individuals in the EU, accounting for 0.28 percent.

4 minutes ago, Effective altruism said:

The number of homeless people in the USA is 770,000, which represents 0.22 percent of the population. In comparison, there are 1.3 million homeless individuals in the EU, accounting for 0.28 percent.

Statistics. By whom? Especially in the US, most will never make it in any "statistics".