Are Isaan Farmers 'poor'?

[Andrew Hicks]

If you really want to help, get down to the local school and ofer your services free to teach them English - better than giving them money.

It was when I was doing some English teaching in the afternoon at my local village school in Surin that I felt the children were listless and had poor concentration.

I asked the teachers and they told me that alf the kids were below the recommended weight limit and that funds for feeding them were inadequate.

Our 'Adopt a Village School' programme raising funds through our website now is beginning to provide books, uniforms and food for the children. It's a modest start but with more donations, it'll really help the kids.

Andrew Hicks

[en184]

At least they got a home, land, and food on the table. Some got cars too.Not what I would call poor. Maybe cash poor, but not poor.

How many people back in Europe/US do not have thier own home ? Quite alot, me thinks.

So, whose poor?

[Thaicoon]

Last week i visited my Wifes uncle and aunt, they have a lot of land boardering the main Buriram - Surin road, i gave them both 200 baht as a jesture of goodwilll, they were so happy, next day another relative told my wife they were so happy as i had just paid there electric, they were due to be cut off, they had no money, but got land worth 80 million baht, live in a traditional thai stilt house which is falling apart, they live very poor and day by day, but are rich in assets.

I know these people are very lucky to have assets, a lot of thai farmers now have nothing, lots of land gone to the chinese money lender etc. for loans and high interest they cannot pay.

[meemiathai]

You would then see that maybe I have been pretty much the only one who actually offered ideas.

So as a previous poster noticed, it's all about YOU.

I can see that now.

Ah, Maigo6, my dear friend, I am emotionally shattered because I have to disagree (again!) with your unsubstantiated and hasty claims. He did ask specifically me while being at the same time too lazy to simply hit the back button once.

So instead of attacking me, why are you not so good to help this poor soul to achieve this difficult task? Maybe some research into my old posts, summarizing them for clarity? Counter-displaying them with #your# suggestions on how to lighten the plight of the poor, that are, from my memory, so much more distinctive and productive?

You see, for me this is not so easy with my hands bound in a straight-jacket, but you shall have my permission to do so at your leisure...

From what I remember I don't recall anything of your posts that suits my sister in law. So are you too lazy to just post one more time to help me this lazy bugger to help my sister in law? Please don't tell me that if she had studied hard when she was younger she would have graduated from oxford uni! Not all people are the material that could learn anything as long as they try.

[jts-khorat]

From what I remember I don't recall anything of your posts that suits my sister in law. So are you too lazy to just post one more time to help me this lazy bugger to help my sister in law? Please don't tell me that if she had studied hard when she was younger she would have graduated from oxford uni! Not all people are the material that could learn anything as long as they try.

As I said before, as long as nothing is clinically wrong with her -- and you have not said to the contrary -- this is indeed the only way your sister in law has to better herself. The day has only 24 hours, so you can put only that many hours in as a minimum wage laborer. Educating yourself makes for better salaries for the same amount of time working.

Also, it is actually true that human brain capacity does allow that all our fellow brothers and sisters pretty much can learn all they want if they just feel enough commitment to the cause. My argument would be not going very far if your sister in law would be mentally retarded, but this discussion so far centered around healthy individuals.

Not everybody will become a rocket scientist, but this is not really needed here, is it -- and would still not be impossible, ignoring the bureaucratic and procedural hurdles in between fir the sake of this argument. Maybe a little more trust in the abilities of the Isaan farmers we are talking about here would be in order, they are by definition of being human just as capable as you and me -- or even Maigo6!

So indeed, she would be better off now if she would have studied hard when she was younger; as most likely would be you or me as well.

Nothing wrong actually to start RIGHT NOW if she was off to a slow start, it is never to late. This is not a competition with her peers, this is about her own life moving forward.

I do recognize that options in Thailand are very limited and in the West we are better off, so we might have been able to choose more freely what 'suits us'.

Your sister in law does not have that option, and all her choices obviously do not suit her. Being picky makes her a hard nut to crack. However, fighting her unlucky life circumstances is neither a beauty contest nor a fun game; I do say this without condescending intentions, really.

It is all up to her in the end and I am sure she has achieved things in her life that she is rather proud of, like a family, that might have taken up all the time she had.

Coming back to self-betterment, she has options, but she must choose what is more important for her.

And maybe, just maybe, what I just cannot believe might actually be true: there is the off chance that she is happy even though she is poor, or at least not unhappy enough to really do something about it to change as it would mean leaving her family, her known life and obviously her comfort sphere behind.

[jts-khorat]

meemiathai, the case of your sister in law intrigues me quite a bit, so I actually thought about it seriously on my way home. She is a riddle to me and you will have to offer a little bit more information to help solving it.

So far I will assume the following:

- your sister in law comes from the same social background as the rest of her family

- your sister in law was given the same chances and choices as the rest of her family

- your sister in law in theory could have reached the same level of financial security or happiness as any other member of her family.

So far we know:

- she has never complained of being poor, or her circumstances, but you state that she is unhappy (else there would be no need to change her situation)

- her work ethic is actually good, she works very hard

- still she has chosen not to learn in her youth or now, either for medical or other reasons.

# Maybe you could elaborate what prevented her.

'Member of her family' as mentioned above would in this case be her own sister, eg your wife.

So, to further my assumptions:

- I assume that your wife is neither financially insecure nor abjectly unhappy, rather the opposite, that she is actually financially secure and happy to stay with you; that by defasult she does not actually share the 'poor farmers plight' we are discussing here, eg she successfully has chosen a way out of the problem that can be repeated by other indivduals

- I also assume that your own social status is comparably higher then hers, eg you not being a subsistence farmer; this is neither an attack on you nor your wife or one of those 'where did you meet her' questions, I would not care less. I just try to get a picture on relative wealth distribution and the social status attached to it

I stated as one of the options of your sister in law to 'find a guy like you' and marry him, a suggestion you curiously never commented on.

- if your wife was able to meet you, so it should have been possible for your sister in law to meet a comparable male person as life circumstances are assumed similar; she did not pursue this path or chose not to for unknown reasons.

# Maybe you could elaborate what prevented her.

After we have understood what prevented your sister in law to choose all of those absolutely valid paths of bettering herself (learning or marrying socially upwards), maybe then other members of this forum can chime in to give more substantial advice.

[Neeranam]

Last week i visited my Wifes uncle and aunt, they have a lot of land boardering the main Buriram - Surin road, i gave them both 200 baht as a jesture of goodwilll, they were so happy, next day another relative told my wife they were so happy as i had just paid there electric, they were due to be cut off, they had no money, but got land worth 80 million baht, live in a traditional thai stilt house which is falling apart, they live very poor and day by day, but are rich in assets.

I know these people are very lucky to have assets, a lot of thai farmers now have nothing, lots of land gone to the chinese money lender etc. for loans and high interest they cannot pay.

Unbelievable - how stingy can you get - must be Chinese immigrants.

What a mug.

[Thaicoon]

Last week i visited my Wifes uncle and aunt, they have a lot of land boardering the main Buriram - Surin road, i gave them both 200 baht as a jesture of goodwilll, they were so happy, next day another relative told my wife they were so happy as i had just paid there electric, they were due to be cut off, they had no money, but got land worth 80 million baht, live in a traditional thai stilt house which is falling apart, they live very poor and day by day, but are rich in assets.

I know these people are very lucky to have assets, a lot of thai farmers now have nothing, lots of land gone to the chinese money lender etc. for loans and high interest they cannot pay.

Unbelievable - how stingy can you get - must be Chinese immigrants.

What a mug.

Thai, through and through, no family just my wife & sister, whos the mug mate........... , maybe you could do with the 400 baht.

[Neeranam]

Last week i visited my Wifes uncle and aunt, they have a lot of land boardering the main Buriram - Surin road, i gave them both 200 baht as a jesture of goodwilll, they were so happy, next day another relative told my wife they were so happy as i had just paid there electric, they were due to be cut off, they had no money, but got land worth 80 million baht, live in a traditional thai stilt house which is falling apart, they live very poor and day by day, but are rich in assets.

I know these people are very lucky to have assets, a lot of thai farmers now have nothing, lots of land gone to the chinese money lender etc. for loans and high interest they cannot pay.

Unbelievable - how stingy can you get - must be Chinese immigrants.

What a mug.

Thai, through and through, no family just my wife & sister, whos the mug mate........... , maybe you could do with the 400 baht.

I remember your posts boasting about how much land you bought the family, all the farm machinery, pick-ups, orchards, mansions. They're accepting all this from you whilst keeping their land, worth millions. Is it just me that sees MUG?

[coldcrush]

Poor as <deleted>, if your trying to work it out....

<deleted> all the poor cos you are rich and have so much...

Maths = Work it out so you feel rich....

Bye.

S

A

D

ps. I am poor...giz a quid

[Neeranam]

Poor as <deleted>, if your trying to work it out....

<deleted> all the poor cos you are rich and have so much...

Maths = Work it out so you feel rich....

Bye.

S

A

D

ps. I am poor...giz a quid

Ask a rich Tycoon who makes his cash from selling fake fotball shirts by the container.

[ozzydom]

It was when I was doing some English teaching in the afternoon at my local village school in Surin that I felt the children were listless and had poor concentration.

Or maybe it was as in our village,the kids cant wait to rush off to the local video game and karaoke place where they stay until dark.

[Heng]

Last week i visited my Wifes uncle and aunt, they have a lot of land boardering the main Buriram - Surin road, i gave them both 200 baht as a jesture of goodwilll, they were so happy, next day another relative told my wife they were so happy as i had just paid there electric, they were due to be cut off, they had no money, but got land worth 80 million baht, live in a traditional thai stilt house which is falling apart, they live very poor and day by day, but are rich in assets.

I know these people are very lucky to have assets, a lot of thai farmers now have nothing, lots of land gone to the chinese money lender etc. for loans and high interest they cannot pay.

By and large most indigenous Thais (with valuable property... not relatively low value property... still plenty of the latter about) have sold out a long time ago. I'd be happy to facilitate if they wanted a medium interest loan (say, 20 mill on that 80 mill chanote at 1.5% per month) to speed up the process. Would have to see the location and chanote though (so as to line up a possible long term renter or perhaps a buyer) as a lot of folks just make up values for their land. I'll even print out an extra page for the contract saying "this is the worst financial decision you could probably make... why can't you think long term for a change?" but it won't make a bit of difference. All they see is *big bag of cash! big bag of cash! must have big bag of cash!*

[Thaicoon]

Poor as <deleted>, if your trying to work it out....

<deleted> all the poor cos you are rich and have so much...

Maths = Work it out so you feel rich....

Bye.

S

A

D

ps. I am poor...giz a quid

Ask a rich Tycoon who makes his cash from selling fake fotball shirts by the container.

Yes i have bought a lot of land etc, not for myself but my wife, who is as straight as a dye, and the kids will benifit in the future, also i have sent containers back to the UK, with handicrafts from Hang Don, and yes i was selling footie shirts, why not ,made in the same place as the real mccoy, get your facts right mate,

You want one, Number 13 with <deleted> on the back,

[Thaicoon]

Last week i visited my Wifes uncle and aunt, they have a lot of land boardering the main Buriram - Surin road, i gave them both 200 baht as a jesture of goodwilll, they were so happy, next day another relative told my wife they were so happy as i had just paid there electric, they were due to be cut off, they had no money, but got land worth 80 million baht, live in a traditional thai stilt house which is falling apart, they live very poor and day by day, but are rich in assets.

I know these people are very lucky to have assets, a lot of thai farmers now have nothing, lots of land gone to the chinese money lender etc. for loans and high interest they cannot pay.

By and large most indigenous Thais (with valuable property... not relatively low value property... still plenty of the latter about) have sold out a long time ago. I'd be happy to facilitate if they wanted a medium interest loan (say, 20 mill on that 80 mill chanote at 1.5% per month) to speed up the process. Would have to see the location and chanote though (so as to line up a possible long term renter or perhaps a buyer) as a lot of folks just make up values for their land. I'll even print out an extra page for the contract saying "this is the worst financial decision you could probably make... why can't you think long term for a change?" but it won't make a bit of difference. All they see is *big bag of cash! big bag of cash! must have big bag of cash!*

This is property that has been in there family for years, passed down etc, i could not beleive how much it is worth, but it is true, they have over 100 rai on the main surin buriram road, just outside the city, that is why the price is so high, land on the highway is for sale at between 500 and i million a rai, crazy. they are both in there 70s, money to them has no real value, what would they do with it, i could not see a rice farmer moving into a life of luxury they would rather live day by day as they have done for years.

[Heng]

Nothing crazy about those prices, land is forever so it's just a question of how long term you are planning for. Just saw less than 6 rai in Pattaya sell for 301 million this morning at the weekly LED auction.

[Thaicoon]

Nothing crazy about those prices, land is forever so it's just a question of how long term you are planning for. Just saw less than 6 rai in Pattaya sell for 301 million this morning at the weekly LED auction.

Crikey, that is some sort of doe for 6 rai, i remember about 15 years ago in pattaya you could buy a nice condo for about 400 quid, and land cheap, how times change, it is now getting like this in the sticks, i went to look at a property by speed in Buriram last week, the Chinese/Thai wanted 25 Million Baht, to much for what i wanted it for, and to big, it was the old 20 bar, so still looking.

[Maigo6]

Nothing crazy about those prices, land is forever so it's just a question of how long term you are planning for. Just saw less than 6 rai in Pattaya sell for 301 million this morning at the weekly LED auction.

Insane price.

[Andrew Hicks]

'It was when I was doing some English teaching in the afternoon at my local village school in Surin that I felt the children were listless and had poor concentration.'

Or maybe it was as in our village, the kids cant wait to rush off to the local video game and karaoke place where they stay until dark.

Your cynical view could have been valid but in this case it wasn't. This is a primary school in a village far from the nearest bright lights. The children are tiny, far tinier than they ought to be.

The fact is that almost half the children are undernourished and underweight and better nutrition might liven their brains up a bit. That's why our Adopt a Village School scheme is focussing on a feeding programme for the kids.

Today I was at the school and handed over 750 notebooks and a climbing frame for the playground... a bit of a luxury but why not!

Adults are sometimes answerable in part for their own poverty but children are not. Helping them is efficient and appropriate and I hope our fund raising for this project will be successful.

Andrew Hicks

[macb]

T think I need to add some input here :

Firstly I have been chatting to Thaicoon on here for I don't know how long, I met him just before the Forum BBQ at his home, in my opinion a straight up and down guy.

I then met him and his lovely wife at the Forum BBQ a very nice couple :

Neeranman:

Have you met Thaicoon : in my opinion provocative comments like calling people a mug is out of order .

Which unfortunately prompted a retort from Thaicoon.

Andrew Hicks has started a debatable Topic here lets keep it on track and stop being personnel. Go PM if you want to pursue it together but I think it is not becoming of this Forum.

Edited September 12, 2007 by macb

[siam-i-am]

Explain that in the real world folk get money and success from hard work, coupled with recognising opportunities and NOT from simply just waiting for luck and sitting on one's ar#e.

How many people in the glorious west are on welfare, Social Security, sickness benefits, State Pensions, disability allowance, in Jail, addicted to drugs, pregnant at 15, etc etc etc...................

It's the way of the world, it's just that in the west, you can be a lazy good for nothing, and you can get taken care of by the state.

In countries like Thailand, it ain't that simple.

My younger sis is at Khon Kaen School of Technology, I want her to stay at school, fair enough, what will she do whe she has finished her education, get a great job with a high salary that enables her to have a lifestyle equal to what a person from the west can have? yeah right..............

Work 10 Hours a day serving food in MK Suki for 6000 Baht a month, maybe. 7 Eleven 4000 Baht per month, maybe.

Meet some Thai guy who also has the same prospects, she gets married, has a kid, stays at home, he gets a job in Bangkok in a Factory earning a pittance for long hours, I'm sure they'll prosper as a Family but it will take years and years of hard work, leaving the kid with her Mother and going to work in the Factory herself to try to get out of the poverty trap.

You can't begin to compare what is available in the west with what is available in other countries, go preach in Cambodia, Burma,Nepal, Laos, North Korea, Africa etc etc, are all those people lazy and stupid, I'm sure YOU could survive like they do....yeah right. You wouldn't survive a Month, they have to spend a lifetime surviving.

Having that British Passport of yours is your Security, you can fork up big style and all you need is a return ticket home to the welfare state, many of the worlds population don't have that same security.

Even the UK unemployed can afford overseas holidays, I used to know loads of guys that used to come to Thailand who are on Benefits back in UK, they used to claim for everything, rent out their house or flat that was being paid for by the government and come to Thailand, their money was paid directly into a bank account they never even had to sign on.

I just wonder how people in the west would get on with low wages and no benefits or welfare state to fall back on .

Spot on, I agree 100% In fact I've met several brits in Chiang mai having there Giro paid into the bank while they stay out here. I'm told in Aus they have there passports scanned if they are claiming benifit it stops when they leave the country. I take my hat off to the Thais that struggle for 28 days a month if their lucky. We in the west don't know were born.

[Neeranam]

Neeranman:

Have you met Thaicoon : in my opinion provocative comments like calling people a mug is out of order .

Which unfortunately prompted a retort from Thaicoon.

Andrew Hicks has started a debatable Topic here lets keep it on track and stop being personnel. Go PM if you want to pursue it together but I think it is not becoming of this Forum.

MacB, no I haven't, and you are right.

If I was out of order(OK, I was out of order, or got my facts mixed up) I apologise.

[Thaicoon]

Neeranman:

Have you met Thaicoon : in my opinion provocative comments like calling people a mug is out of order .

Which unfortunately prompted a retort from Thaicoon.

Andrew Hicks has started a debatable Topic here lets keep it on track and stop being personnel. Go PM if you want to pursue it together but I think it is not becoming of this Forum.

MacB, no I haven't, and you are right.

If I was out of order(OK, I was out of order, or got my facts mixed up) I apologise.

Neeranam,

As i say i am not a mug, i just like helping the family from time to time, they have all been good to myself and i trust them 100%, my wife has been with me for 12 years and we have 2 daughters, yes, when i first met them they were very poor, i bought some land, now they are a thai middle class family, doing ok, if you try to help people it will bring you good karma, i am well respected in the Village, and my respect also go's out to them 100%, and the other locals

I apologise about the little comments i have left, hope you accept, but you did touch a nurve.

[macb]

Neeranman:

Have you met Thaicoon : in my opinion provocative comments like calling people a mug is out of order .

Which unfortunately prompted a retort from Thaicoon.

Andrew Hicks has started a debatable Topic here lets keep it on track and stop being personnel. Go PM if you want to pursue it together but I think it is not becoming of this Forum.

MacB, no I haven't, and you are right.

If I was out of order(OK, I was out of order, or got my facts mixed up) I apologise.

Neeranman:

Have you met Thaicoon : in my opinion provocative comments like calling people a mug is out of order .

Which unfortunately prompted a retort from Thaicoon.

Andrew Hicks has started a debatable Topic here lets keep it on track and stop being personnel. Go PM if you want to pursue it together but I think it is not becoming of this Forum.

MacB, no I haven't, and you are right.

If I was out of order(OK, I was out of order, or got my facts mixed up) I apologise.

Neeranam,

As i say i am not a mug, i just like helping the family from time to time, they have all been good to myself and i trust them 100%, my wife has been with me for 12 years and we have 2 daughters, yes, when i first met them they were very poor, i bought some land, now they are a thai middle class family, doing ok, if you try to help people it will bring you good karma, i am well respected in the Village, and my respect also go's out to them 100%, and the other locals

I apologise about the little comments i have left, hope you accept, but you did touch a nurve.

Well done guys, one day maybe we will all have beer and a laugh, life is too short to fall out bless you both

[meemiathai]

meemiathai, the case of your sister in law intrigues me quite a bit, so I actually thought about it seriously on my way home. She is a riddle to me and you will have to offer a little bit more information to help solving it.

So far I will assume the following:

- your sister in law comes from the same social background as the rest of her family yes

- your sister in law was given the same chances and choices as the rest of her family yes

- your sister in law in theory could have reached the same level of financial security or happiness as any other member of her family. The whole family in law has not reached a level of financial security

So far we know:

- she has never complained of being poor, or her circumstances, but you state that she is unhappy (else there would be no need to change her situation) I did not state she is unhappy. But that does not mean she does not want to improve.

- her work ethic is actually good, she works very hard

- still she has chosen not to learn in her youth or now, either for medical or other reasons.

just exactly what you mean that she has chosen not to learn. Learn what? Chosen what?

# Maybe you could elaborate what prevented her.

'Member of her family' as mentioned above would in this case be her own sister, eg your wife.

So, to further my assumptions:

- I assume that your wife is neither financially insecure nor abjectly unhappy, rather the opposite, that she is actually financially secure and happy to stay with you; that by defasult she does not actually share the 'poor farmers plight' we are discussing here, eg she successfully has chosen a way out of the problem that can be repeated by other indivduals

- I also assume that your own social status is comparably higher then hers, eg you not being a subsistence farmer; this is neither an attack on you nor your wife or one of those 'where did you meet her' questions, I would not care less. I just try to get a picture on relative wealth distribution and the social status attached to it

my wife has not chosen a way out of the problem, she just met me and that is it. Do you say people have chosen their way if they won a lottery? Sorry I was talking about myself!

I stated as one of the options of your sister in law to 'find a guy like you' and marry him, a suggestion you curiously never commented on. She is married to a thai guy. And even if she is not, you don't find it insulting to suggest something like that to a woman?

- if your wife was able to meet you, so it should have been possible for your sister in law to meet a comparable male person as life circumstances are assumed similar; she did not pursue this path or chose not to for unknown reasons.I really want to know if you view women as property? And are you suggesting all Isaan women who lives a hard life to look for a farang husband?

# Maybe you could elaborate what prevented her.

After we have understood what prevented your sister in law to choose all of those absolutely valid paths of bettering herself (learning or marrying socially upwards), maybe then other members of this forum can chime in to give more substantial advice.

I don't see you offering any choices. You keep saying bettering themselves, HOW?

[esbobes]

Last week i visited my Wifes uncle and aunt, they have a lot of land boardering the main Buriram - Surin road, i gave them both 200 baht as a jesture of goodwilll, they were so happy, next day another relative told my wife they were so happy as i had just paid there electric, they were due to be cut off, they had no money, but got land worth 80 million baht, live in a traditional thai stilt house which is falling apart, they live very poor and day by day, but are rich in assets.

I know these people are very lucky to have assets, a lot of thai farmers now have nothing, lots of land gone to the chinese money lender etc. for loans and high interest they cannot pay.

They are poor their land is worth nothing if they really own it. The only person who will buy the land for 8 million baht is some farang who reads Thai Visa and has a Thai wife.

Show me what Thai will buy his land for anything

[Jersey_UK]

I don't see you offering any choices. You keep saying bettering themselves, HOW?

Given the limited info provided about her / her circumstances it is simply not practical to provide advice / suggestions.

Maybe start another thread........yer never know - you / folk may learn something.........

[canadiangirl]

Your cynical view could have been valid but in this case it wasn't. This is a primary school in a village far from the nearest bright lights. The children are tiny, far tinier than they ought to be.

The fact is that almost half the children are undernourished and underweight and better nutrition might liven their brains up a bit. That's why our Adopt a Village School scheme is focussing on a feeding programme for the kids.

Today I was at the school and handed over 750 notebooks and a climbing frame for the playground... a bit of a luxury but why not!

Adults are sometimes answerable in part for their own poverty but children are not. Helping them is efficient and appropriate and I hope our fund raising for this project will be successful.

Andrew Hicks

Hi Andrew,

good luck with your project! I once came across a great book called "when there is no doctor" -- it's basically aimed at people dealing with health issues (doctors, nurses, the village medic, etc) in developing countries, with a focus on simple things a village can do for itself to improve health among its people. In the absence of sophisticated care and drugs, they focus on small things that can make a big difference. There's a big bit on sanitation (digging a proper latrine, washing hands after going to the bathroom) which applies a bit less in Thailand, but there was also a big section on nutrition, encouraging parents who have a bit of money to spend on their kids to buy healthy foods like eggs, fruits, etc instead of soft drinks, candy -- and also trying to convince village men to spend a bit less on alcohol and cigarettes and instead to spend it on proper food for the family . What I liked the most was the respectful, not condescending tone, and the idea that everyone could do something to improve their health and situation, even with limited means.

I have no idea how well something like this would go down in an Isaan village, but I thought it was pretty good.

One thing some schools are doing, even some very progressive ones in farang land trying to combat junk food -- is having a "school garden" tended by the students and teachers -- which provides healthy food for school lunches, and a feeling of involvement and pride in school life for everyone there. If you live in an agricultural area, it might be easier to get local parents involved with donating seeds, crops, time and expertise -- than money, which they might not have a lot of. I don't really know about Thai kids, but around here, many kids can really get into cooking and eating healthy food if they feel involved in the whole process.

[jts-khorat]

just exactly what you mean that she has chosen not to learn. Learn what? Chosen what?

my wife has not chosen a way out of the problem, she just met me and that is it.

She is married to a thai guy. And even if she is not, you don't find it insulting to suggest something like that to a woman?

I really want to know if you view women as property? And are you suggesting all Isaan women who lives a hard life to look for a farang husband?

memiathai; sorry to say but the situation is exactly as I thought. But fact is, your sister in law married a poor Thai guy. A bad choice for self-betterment and if financial riches would be the only thing driving us. There are other motivations that might be given priority (love etc) but then nobody should come running back crying: if you marry a have-nothing, and you yourself got nothing, well the end result will be most likely also nothing.

And you are absolutely wrong: poeple 'do not just meet'; as I read before you are working in Singapore, so you should be a little bit more world-wise than producing such a statement. Maybe the world would look like this from the romantic perspective of a 16-year-old. This then really would be a lottery (or Russian roulette?).

Instead, people do make a lot of choices in their selection of a partner, some of them selfish. Even in the west financial security tops the list, health and mutual interests coming behind. Dating a guy who has the financial means to better heris surely not such a bad thing, while hiding behind the bush in the rice field will not get you such top material for sure.

Your wife definitely has chosen a way out, with maybe luck giving her a little nudge; this does not make her property (yours or anybodys), this makes her clever (in the sense of self-betterment)!

Therefore I do not find it insulting to suggest to any woman (Thai or otherwise) to be wise when choosing their partner; getting knocked up at 16 because hormones surged or marrying the crazy drunk village clown on his hot motorbike are not top choices, you would agree; they are guaranteed tickets into abject poverty and it will be that much harder to overcome such a bad life choice later on.

Well, with regard to the learning; finishing her school degree (if she does not have one already) absolutely tops the list; no prospects at all with only an M3 -- besides maybe the hospitality industry -- it would have to be an M6.

From there on, languages (not that useful, if you are bound to a local guy who is unwilling/unable to move from his useless piece of field, too small to live and too big to die, I agree), accounting, etc.

It can be done remotely, or in evening/weekend courses. It does take determination and commitment, but is well within the financial means of even the poorest farmer. But we have covered that before.

[Thaicoon]

Last week i visited my Wifes uncle and aunt, they have a lot of land boardering the main Buriram - Surin road, i gave them both 200 baht as a jesture of goodwilll, they were so happy, next day another relative told my wife they were so happy as i had just paid there electric, they were due to be cut off, they had no money, but got land worth 80 million baht, live in a traditional thai stilt house which is falling apart, they live very poor and day by day, but are rich in assets.

I know these people are very lucky to have assets, a lot of thai farmers now have nothing, lots of land gone to the chinese money lender etc. for loans and high interest they cannot pay.

They are poor their land is worth nothing if they really own it. The only person who will buy the land for 8 million baht is some farang who reads Thai Visa and has a Thai wife.

Show me what Thai will buy his land for anything

They have had an offer on this land about 3 years ago, not a ferang, not a true thai, a chinese/thai, as most know these are the guys with the money, the family do own the land i have actually seen the Chanote, and its worth 80 million not 8,

This is so expensive as it is on the main highway, if it was 1 KM down a track it would be worth 100,000 per rai, as the saying go's Location, Location, a chinese/thai i know from Buriram, has just bought 3 Rai on the main highway to Prackonchi, he paid 4 million Baht.