I'm glad that I have clarified myself and thanks for all your supporting and understanding posts. There's a said, something like "what goes around, comes around" So maybe when we can more mindful and sensitive to each other the world will be a better place to live in. Am I sound like...... Ok anyway, CHEERS ladies! or perhaps I should include men as well (don't want to have another misunderstanding again).

Thanks Belle.

Mod here now, sorry kat, gotta sleep sometime Use the report button next time, it alerts a mod on duty.

Let me remind some new male posters out there that the Ladies forum has rules. please read them before posting and remember to mind your manners. Further such posts will result in warnings and possible suspension of posting rights.

Belle,

The most puzzling thing to me in your post is: why on earth do you describe this woman as "cultured"? Obviously, she is not.

It is of course possible that she suffers some mental illness or severe PMS, in which case she is to be pitied...along with the poor stylist who was on the receiving end of her tirade.

And why the "shame to her country men" part? If countries have to feel ashamed on account of the action of isolated individual citizens then there isn't a country on earth that can hold its head up. People are individuals.

Belle,

The most puzzling thing to me in your post is: why on earth do you describe this woman as "cultured"? Obviously, she is not.

It is of course possible that she suffers some mental illness or severe PMS, in which case she is to be pitied...along with the poor stylist who was on the receiving end of her tirade.

And why the "shame to her country men" part? If countries have to feel ashamed on account of the action of isolated individual citizens then there isn't a country on earth that can hold its head up. People are individuals.

I fully agree with your post.

But would like to add a few things.

1) The OP thinks the woman came from one of the most advanced countries on earth which makes her a representative of the "cultured".

2) It is obvious the OP had not thought of the possibilities of mental illness or severe PMS. But her post was just a quick reaction to what her saw.

3) Very true! But unfortunately average people do not go into depth enough to realize it and do tend to generalize the whole country. Especially if they come across a few additional similar cases.

westerners do have reputations for behaviour that the thais find insensitive at least and downright appaling at other times , and whereas the brits are known for their excessive drinking , thuggish no neck appearance , and propensity for brawling , the french for their aloofness and soap allergies , and the germans have their fussiness and endless complaining , it is the verbal aggression and its associated high decibel levels that are the mark of the american abroad.

i think the original poster was merely pointing this out , although her lack of tact clearly marks her out as either a belgian or a spaniard.

LOL- but never criticise a Belgian they do not take it well as my boss pointed out the other week

Just another reminder to never judge somebody purely by the way they look...

Belle,

The most puzzling thing to me in your post is: why on earth do you describe this woman as "cultured"? Obviously, she is not.

It is of course possible that she suffers some mental illness or severe PMS, in which case she is to be pitied...along with the poor stylist who was on the receiving end of her tirade.

And why the "shame to her country men" part? If countries have to feel ashamed on account of the action of isolated individual citizens then there isn't a country on earth that can hold its head up. People are individuals.

I fully agree with your post.

But would like to add a few things.

1) The OP thinks the woman came from one of the most advanced countries on earth which makes her a representative of the "cultured".

2) It is obvious the OP had not thought of the possibilities of mental illness or severe PMS. But her post was just a quick reaction to what her saw.

3) Very true! But unfortunately average people do not go into depth enough to realize it and do tend to generalize the whole country. Especially if they come across a few additional similar cases.

Very true that we can't judge a book by its cover. Perhaps a lot of time we ourselves through our good and bad experiences have already created a judgmental mind. Whatever it was the third party was innocent to be belittled or insulted by ones craziness. By the way, I overheard she had finished reading the latest harry potter book, without sleep, by the 2nd day of launched just to return to the store for a refund. Based on that action I'm not going to sympathize with any of her pms or even mental illness excuses.

Just another reminder to never judge somebody purely by the way they look...

Belle,

The most puzzling thing to me in your post is: why on earth do you describe this woman as "cultured"? Obviously, she is not.

It is of course possible that she suffers some mental illness or severe PMS, in which case she is to be pitied...along with the poor stylist who was on the receiving end of her tirade.

And why the "shame to her country men" part? If countries have to feel ashamed on account of the action of isolated individual citizens then there isn't a country on earth that can hold its head up. People are individuals.

I fully agree with your post.

But would like to add a few things.

1) The OP thinks the woman came from one of the most advanced countries on earth which makes her a representative of the "cultured".

2) It is obvious the OP had not thought of the possibilities of mental illness or severe PMS. But her post was just a quick reaction to what her saw.

3) Very true! But unfortunately average people do not go into depth enough to realize it and do tend to generalize the whole country. Especially if they come across a few additional similar cases.

Very true that we can't judge a book by its cover. Perhaps a lot of time we ourselves through our good and bad experiences have already created a judgmental mind. Whatever it was the third party was innocent to be belittled or insulted by ones craziness. By the way, I overheard she had finished reading the latest harry potter book, without sleep, by the 2nd day of launched just to return to the store for a refund. Based on that action I'm not going to sympathize with any of her pms or even mental illness excuses.

Mental illness does not deprive people of the ability to reading books.

I can tell coz I grew up with my single mother who in my opinion suffers from mental illness(of course she doesn't think so) and she reads a lot. But you will understand if you see how a big scene she makes in public.

Just another reminder to never judge somebody purely by the way they look...

Belle,

The most puzzling thing to me in your post is: why on earth do you describe this woman as "cultured"? Obviously, she is not.

It is of course possible that she suffers some mental illness or severe PMS, in which case she is to be pitied...along with the poor stylist who was on the receiving end of her tirade.

And why the "shame to her country men" part? If countries have to feel ashamed on account of the action of isolated individual citizens then there isn't a country on earth that can hold its head up. People are individuals.

I fully agree with your post.

But would like to add a few things.

1) The OP thinks the woman came from one of the most advanced countries on earth which makes her a representative of the "cultured".

2) It is obvious the OP had not thought of the possibilities of mental illness or severe PMS. But her post was just a quick reaction to what her saw.

3) Very true! But unfortunately average people do not go into depth enough to realize it and do tend to generalize the whole country. Especially if they come across a few additional similar cases.

Very true that we can't judge a book by its cover. Perhaps a lot of time we ourselves through our good and bad experiences have already created a judgmental mind. Whatever it was the third party was innocent to be belittled or insulted by ones craziness. By the way, I overheard she had finished reading the latest harry potter book, without sleep, by the 2nd day of launched just to return to the store for a refund. Based on that action I'm not going to sympathize with any of her pms or even mental illness excuses.

Mental illness does not deprive people of the ability to reading books.

I can tell coz I grew up with my single mother who in my opinion suffers from mental illness(of course she doesn't think so) and she reads a lot. But you will understand if you see how a big scene she makes in public.

hum! just wondering..... meemaithai, are you on her side? you seem to be supporting her action a lot, always finding reasons for her behavior. Just my personal interpretation so don't attack if I am wrong

My mother taught me something that I hope I can someday have the wisdom to follow myself.

When she saw someone behaving badly she always said, "I wonder what happened in their day (or life) to make them feel this way". Sometimes empathy is better on oneself than a quick rush to judgment and condemnation.

My mother taught me something that I hope I can someday have the wisdom to follow myself.

When she saw someone behaving badly she always said, "I wonder what happened in their day (or life) to make them feel this way". Sometimes empathy is better on oneself than a quick rush to judgment and condemnation.

Maybe you are right. When someone slapped your right face, turn to your left for them to slap your left face.

My mother taught me something that I hope I can someday have the wisdom to follow myself.

When she saw someone behaving badly she always said, "I wonder what happened in their day (or life) to make them feel this way". Sometimes empathy is better on oneself than a quick rush to judgment and condemnation.

Maybe you are right. When someone slapped your right face, turn to your left for them to slap your left face.

Read what you will out of what I said, as that is most certainly not the point I was trying to make. Please don't translate my words into your own opinions of what you think I am saying. I find it offensive.

My mother taught me something that I hope I can someday have the wisdom to follow myself.

When she saw someone behaving badly she always said, "I wonder what happened in their day (or life) to make them feel this way". Sometimes empathy is better on oneself than a quick rush to judgment and condemnation.

Maybe you are right. When someone slapped your right face, turn to your left for them to slap your left face.

Read what you will out of what I said, as that is most certainly not the point I was trying to make. Please don't translate my words into your own opinions of what you think I am saying. I find it offensive.

relax relax! sorry sbk if that offended you. same here i am just expressing my view and quote a said. to me is so strange , why are we defending someone with that behaviour and in actual fact she was not the victim, at least that very incident? again no intention to pick on you

Just another reminder to never judge somebody purely by the way they look...

Belle,

The most puzzling thing to me in your post is: why on earth do you describe this woman as "cultured"? Obviously, she is not.

It is of course possible that she suffers some mental illness or severe PMS, in which case she is to be pitied...along with the poor stylist who was on the receiving end of her tirade.

And why the "shame to her country men" part? If countries have to feel ashamed on account of the action of isolated individual citizens then there isn't a country on earth that can hold its head up. People are individuals.

I fully agree with your post.

But would like to add a few things.

1) The OP thinks the woman came from one of the most advanced countries on earth which makes her a representative of the "cultured".

2) It is obvious the OP had not thought of the possibilities of mental illness or severe PMS. But her post was just a quick reaction to what her saw.

3) Very true! But unfortunately average people do not go into depth enough to realize it and do tend to generalize the whole country. Especially if they come across a few additional similar cases.

Very true that we can't judge a book by its cover. Perhaps a lot of time we ourselves through our good and bad experiences have already created a judgmental mind. Whatever it was the third party was innocent to be belittled or insulted by ones craziness. By the way, I overheard she had finished reading the latest harry potter book, without sleep, by the 2nd day of launched just to return to the store for a refund. Based on that action I'm not going to sympathize with any of her pms or even mental illness excuses.

Perhaps she had just received a text message that her husband was in the massage parlour !

My mother taught me something that I hope I can someday have the wisdom to follow myself.

When she saw someone behaving badly she always said, "I wonder what happened in their day (or life) to make them feel this way". Sometimes empathy is better on oneself than a quick rush to judgment and condemnation.

Hi SBK, I like that. Your mother sounds like a wise lady. I believe the world could probably use a little more empathy, and I certainly would do well to try to keep words like hers in mind. Brings to mind a supposed Native American prayer posted in my bedroom as a child: "Grant that I may not criticize my neighbor until I have walked a mile in his moccasins."

I don't think either of these are intended to excuse anyone from behaving badly. In the case the OP has posted it's possible there is no excuse for the person's poor behaviour. But they do help us understand where someone is coming from, which is always a good thing. This is because if you truly understand, you can respond more appropriately/effectively than if you're making assumptions.

Misty

Why can such a cultured lady behave like a barbarian?

because quite obviously she was NOT a cultured lady. as simple as that.

My mother taught me something that I hope I can someday have the wisdom to follow myself.

When she saw someone behaving badly she always said, "I wonder what happened in their day (or life) to make them feel this way". Sometimes empathy is better on oneself than a quick rush to judgment and condemnation.

Hi SBK, I like that. Your mother sounds like a wise lady. I believe the world could probably use a little more empathy, and I certainly would do well to try to keep words like hers in mind. Brings to mind a supposed Native American prayer posted in my bedroom as a child: "Grant that I may not criticize my neighbor until I have walked a mile in his moccasins."

I don't think either of these are intended to excuse anyone from behaving badly. In the case the OP has posted it's possible there is no excuse for the person's poor behaviour. But they do help us understand where someone is coming from, which is always a good thing. This is because if you truly understand, you can respond more appropriately/effectively than if you're making assumptions.

Misty

Thanks Misty, you have it exactly right.

Perhaps you didn't mean to offend, moxhan, but see how easy it is to do without necessarily intending to do so?

Hummm! seem like the whole discussion is about what position you prefer to stand - the mentioned stylist side or the mentioned customer side. of coz with this 2 options we can again permute into 2 long lists;

1. stylist perfect and professional or stylish had given actually what she wanted or stylist lousy or stylish made the customer angry or stylist face was unlikeable or stylist seem easy to bully and take advantage on or stylist said something wrong or salon decor made customer gone crazy, ......

2. customer had a lousy day, customer have mental problem, customer trying to take back as someone taken her advantage, somebody died, customer hungry (hungry man is a angry man, guess goes same to lady), customer read harry poter book caused her change in behavior ( as mentioned she can finished one whole book wthin a day) or customer just simply suck, customer putting an act to get free service, customer realized no money or forgot to bring money, customer think she is superior, customer feel is an achievement to get something for free or customer's nobody to teach and guide while growing up....

the lists go on and on. whatever reasons we have, we can empathize but we cannot encourage or approve such behavior. everyone has our set of reasons, does it mean we can go around and do what we wanted. if someone needed money under life and death situation, he or she can and approve to rob someone and worst if ended hurting other?

Who says understanding that someone may have had a bad day is taking their side? Who says there needs to be a side taken? There are two people involved in this interaction and one bystander who assumed that the bad behavior was caused because the foreign woman was rude.

Who knows what the history is between the two? Nobody. I just prefer not to leap in judgment of either party involved since I don't know anything at all about the situation except what the OP chose to infer.

Who says understanding that someone may have had a bad day is taking their side? Who says there needs to be a side taken? There are two people involved in this interaction and one bystander who assumed that the bad behavior was caused because the foreign woman was rude.

Who knows what the history is between the two? Nobody. I just prefer not to leap in judgment of either party involved since I don't know anything at all about the situation except what the OP chose to infer.

Bad behaviour is bad behaviour and when you excuse it you side with the aggressor not the victim. As long as you keep looking for reasons to justify rudeness people will keep being rude and abusing others.

People like that come from all countries and cultures. I've seen British, Canadian, German etc etc all act in a similarly abusive manner over my years in Thailand. Its not surprising that Thai people are beginning to get sick of it.

Incidentally, one advantage of "country living" over "city living."

Out here in the sticks, you know you better not act like a jerk with the people you see every day, or life will become unlivable. (Does "tar and feather" paint a picture?).

In the "anonymous" city, you can get away with it.

"tar and feather" haven't heard that term in many years...

Who says understanding that someone may have had a bad day is taking their side? Who says there needs to be a side taken? There are two people involved in this interaction and one bystander who assumed that the bad behavior was caused because the foreign woman was rude.

Who knows what the history is between the two? Nobody. I just prefer not to leap in judgment of either party involved since I don't know anything at all about the situation except what the OP chose to infer.

Bad behaviour is bad behaviour and when you excuse it you side with the aggressor not the victim. As long as you keep looking for reasons to justify rudeness people will keep being rude and abusing others.

You think your way, I try to think mine. I don't always succeed, but I hope I can tame the worst of my judgmental holier than thou attitude most of the time

Like I said, we don't know the whole story --perhaps the woman was a nasty, rude person. Perhaps this was her third time back with this stylist and had again had it screwed up. We don't know, the OP doesn't know.

Not sure why we are now going into four pages about the rude behavior of a woman none of us know.

when 2 persons meet, there are 6 persons involved. "I see who I am, u see who u r, i think who u r, u think who am i, who i really am and who u really r."

as long as we can be more mindful, be more considerate and honest to ourselves, all others r secondary. is a good thing that this run into 4 pages, as sometime we need it to reflect and review not on others but ourselves. many a time we r blinded by our very own action.

when 2 persons meet, there are 6 persons involved. "I see who I am, u see who u r, i think who u r, u think who am i, who i really am and who u really r."

as long as we can be more mindful, be more considerate and honest to ourselves, all others r secondary. is a good thing that this run into 4 pages, as sometime we need it to reflect and review not on others but ourselves. many a time we r blinded by our very own action.

I like your analogy but how many persons are there as now involved so many of us

when 2 persons meet, there are 6 persons involved. "I see who I am, u see who u r, i think who u r, u think who am i, who i really am and who u really r."

as long as we can be more mindful, be more considerate and honest to ourselves, all others r secondary. is a good thing that this run into 4 pages, as sometime we need it to reflect and review not on others but ourselves. many a time we r blinded by our very own action.

I like your analogy but how many persons are there as now involved so many of us

good question but let me complete my advanced mathematics course before answer u

I don't see how someone being a <deleted> is also acting as a representative of their country? IMO they are just a <deleted>.

Another time I saw a bunch of Italians on the sky train talking so loudly, as to intrude on the space and good will of everyone in the same car. I told them nicely that the volume of their voices was considered rude in Thai culture. They looked at me and actually said they didn't care.

Even though I too would have found their behaviour annoying, I will admit that their response is quite funny

Whenever I come across some loud or fussy Italians I blush and hide..

PS: I'm Italian...

cleaned up the thread SBK but then realised they were all old posts and that you'd made a warning!!

Anyway, not to come this womans defence (behaviour sounded disgusting), next time suggest she takes my wifes approach:

1 - Get hair done

2 - Get blond highlights

3 - Smile nicely and pay the vast amounts of money

4 - Come home and cry that the hairdo is a crime against humanity

5 - Go through the process of grieving. Anger, Denial,....,every thing bad you can direct at a loving hubby,....,acceptance. Repeat the next day.

6 - Ask hubby for 4000 more baht to go somewhere else to try to get it fixed....

7- See 1.

I've seen these "4000B+ prices listed at the fancy salons... no way the costs are commensurate! A friend of mine knows one of these "fancy" shops where the main guy charges foreigners almost the same prices as in London, Paris, etc.- but much lower for the locals, of course. To his credit, he gets trained abroad and has whatever the top "industry" licenses and products are.

Anyway, not to come this womans defence (behaviour sounded disgusting), next time suggest she takes my wifes approach:

1 - Get hair done

2 - Get blond highlights

3 - Smile nicely and pay the vast amounts of money

4 - Come home and cry that the hairdo is a crime against humanity

5 - Go through the process of grieving. Anger, Denial,....,every thing bad you can direct at a loving hubby,....,acceptance. Repeat the next day.

6 - Ask hubby for 4000 more baht to go somewhere else to try to get it fixed....

7- See 1.

I've seen these "4000B+ prices listed at the fancy salons... no way the costs are commensurate! A friend of mine knows one of these "fancy" shops where the main guy charges foreigners almost the same prices as in London, Paris, etc.- but much lower for the locals, of course. To his credit, he gets trained abroad and has whatever the top "industry" licenses and products are.

I'm used to DIY since I lived in expensive London on low wages, I now live in Pattaya which has a lot of those fancy salons run by people who have not a clue about hair and use the cheapest products. I might as well go to the cheap salons in the countryside, at least there I get charged the same as the Thais and they seem to be friendlier than the city girls.

cleaned up the thread SBK but then realised they were all old posts and that you'd made a warning!!

Anyway, not to come this womans defence (behaviour sounded disgusting), next time suggest she takes my wifes approach:

1 - Get hair done

2 - Get blond highlights

3 - Smile nicely and pay the vast amounts of money

4 - Come home and cry that the hairdo is a crime against humanity

5 - Go through the process of grieving. Anger, Denial,....,every thing bad you can direct at a loving hubby,....,acceptance. Repeat the next day.

6 - Ask hubby for 4000 more baht to go somewhere else to try to get it fixed....

7- See 1.

Yep, that's about right, but you missed 4A, personal configuration of SWAT team attack on hairdresser and methods of torture commensurate for the misery I will live through for the next six months from the sh*te cut.