To America In 3 Weeks

[BlackArtemis]

OK don't worry I am not asking to get a visa in 3 weeks!

I just want to make sure I have everything I could possibly need so my wife and I have no hang ups.

I am a U.S. Citizen so it's easy for me.

We received a 10 year visa for my wife a few months ago.

We are visiting for about 29-30 days to visit family, sight see etc etc.

Because we are looking at getting her a greencard next year we are bringing other documents like birth certificate, ID, etc.

With her 10 year it should just be a quick "Hi, how are you, welcome to America, have a nice stay" and they give a 30day or 6 month stay to her correct?

As the days grow closer I just have an unwarrented fear of her being not allowed in for some random reason. So tell me if I am missing anything or just getting paranoid when I should be excited

[jaiyenjohn]

OK don't worry I am not asking to get a visa in 3 weeks!

I just want to make sure I have everything I could possibly need so my wife and I have no hang ups.

I am a U.S. Citizen so it's easy for me.

We received a 10 year visa for my wife a few months ago.

We are visiting for about 29-30 days to visit family, sight see etc etc.

Because we are looking at getting her a greencard next year we are bringing other documents like birth certificate, ID, etc.

With her 10 year it should just be a quick "Hi, how are you, welcome to America, have a nice stay" and they give a 30day or 6 month stay to her correct?

As the days grow closer I just have an unwarrented fear of her being not allowed in for some random reason. So tell me if I am missing anything or just getting paranoid when I should be excited

Paranoid I think. If she's got that visa in her passport, there's no reason they won't let her in.

I waited at the San Francisco airport for my wife to come in on her first trip to the US and her brand new permanent resident visa. I was waiting with copies of all our records, my passport, endless reams of immigration documentation (from my visa experiences in Thailand). Turns out she walked right through, three minutes. They just took a look in her passport, took her documents, and said welcome to the USA. Kind of a let down really

JB

[Thanyaburi Mac]

OK don't worry I am not asking to get a visa in 3 weeks!

I just want to make sure I have everything I could possibly need so my wife and I have no hang ups.

I am a U.S. Citizen so it's easy for me.

We received a 10 year visa for my wife a few months ago.

We are visiting for about 29-30 days to visit family, sight see etc etc.

Because we are looking at getting her a greencard next year we are bringing other documents like birth certificate, ID, etc.

With her 10 year it should just be a quick "Hi, how are you, welcome to America, have a nice stay" and they give a 30day or 6 month stay to her correct?

As the days grow closer I just have an unwarrented fear of her being not allowed in for some random reason. So tell me if I am missing anything or just getting paranoid when I should be excited

NOT TO WORRY!!

The last few times we've gone on vacation to the U.S. I've gone with my wife through the "foreigner's" line.  A few times we've gone through the AmCit line but been questioned about that by the U.S. Immigration folks.

DO NOT say anything about:  "Because we are looking at getting her a greencard next year we are bringing other documents like birth certificate, ID, etc."  That's irrelevant to your purpose of the trip and mentioning such might just make the Immigration dude worry that you're trying to jump the IV queue.

Mac

[steelepulse]

OK don't worry I am not asking to get a visa in 3 weeks!

I just want to make sure I have everything I could possibly need so my wife and I have no hang ups.

I am a U.S. Citizen so it's easy for me.

We received a 10 year visa for my wife a few months ago.

We are visiting for about 29-30 days to visit family, sight see etc etc.

Because we are looking at getting her a greencard next year we are bringing other documents like birth certificate, ID, etc.

With her 10 year it should just be a quick "Hi, how are you, welcome to America, have a nice stay" and they give a 30day or 6 month stay to her correct?

As the days grow closer I just have an unwarrented fear of her being not allowed in for some random reason. So tell me if I am missing anything or just getting paranoid when I should be excited

NOT TO WORRY!!

The last few times we've gone on vacation to the U.S. I've gone with my wife through the "foreigner's" line.  A few times we've gone through the AmCit line but been questioned about that by the U.S. Immigration folks.

DO NOT say anything about:  "Because we are looking at getting her a greencard next year we are bringing other documents like birth certificate, ID, etc."  That's irrelevant to your purpose of the trip and mentioning such might just make the Immigration dude worry that you're trying to jump the IV queue.

Mac

Your wife can go through with you at the US citizens line. It'll be fine.

[ilyushin]

The duration of the initial stamp to stay is entirely up to th Immigration Officer on arrival. Usually 3 -6 months depending on purpose of visit. You can always go to Bahamas on a Visa run or Canada. As the 10 year visa is multiple entry.

[BlackArtemis]

Thanks all, and don't worry the only one hearing the words greencard are some lawyer friends and once we return in November. Great news about the lines, she has only ever visited Singapore with me, she wasn't looking forward to standing in a separate line and then have one of use wait for the other.

[Thanyaburi Mac]

Thanks all, and don't worry the only one hearing the words greencard are some lawyer friends and once we return in November. Great news about the lines, she has only ever visited Singapore with me, she wasn't looking forward to standing in a separate line and then have one of use wait for the other.

Not a separate line, you go with your wife through which ever one you go through, an AmCit going through the foreigner line is OK.

Mac

[gorshar]

As the others. Took my Thai wife to the US last year on a 10-year visa. We were waved over to the AmCit line at JFK, took about a minute and a half and she was given a six-month entry stamp and that was that.

[AJARNJACK]

As my wife and I are awaiting her October 3rd interview at the U.S. Embassy for a K3 Visa, this thread is of intrest to me. Reading that there is such a thing as a 10 year visa really intrests me. What kind of visa is that? I've retained a law firm in Bangkok to assist me with prenuptial agreement, marriage (married in Thailand) and visa application. They never mentioned a 10 year visa, only the K3 which is only good for 2 years.

After we married we started the paperwork for her visa in December of last year and "what a long, strange trip it's been"! Anyone who has done this understands the amount of documents and expense of filing fees involved. From what our lawyer tells us, the K3 visa will allow her time in the States to complete her Permanent Resident (Green Card) Application as well as mutiple entries into the U.S. for two years.

I've lived in Thailand for the past five years, but have kept my home in the States and she wants a chance at a better life there. It seems that we've gone through more paperwork than others I've read about and wonder if it's because I live here in Thailand instead of back at my home in the States.

Any advice from someone more knowledgable than me would be much apprecitated.

[jmurch]

I don't understand my wife has tried three times to get a tourist visa to the states. The best excuse the interviewer could come up with after her presenting all her documents was " I don't think you'll come back". We not only have a six million baht home but a business, bank accounts, land and her nine year old daughter. If someone can tell me what we're doing wrong I'd appreciate it.

Thanks,

John

[tallthai]

WATCH OUT!!!!!!!

I accepted a position in Malaysia in 2001 cccompanied by my Thai wife who had resided in the US for 21 years paying social security and income tax for those years. We decided that she would not apply for citizenship because I wanted to use her for retirement purposes when I retired (stupid I know because Thailand allows dual citizenship). After two years of returning to the US on her green card, on her third trip she was pulled over by ICE (immigration and Customs Enforcement) and asked where she lived. The answer, Malaysia. Their answer, You are under arrest, we will let you go under your own recognisance (SIC?), but give us your green card. You are no longer authorized to live in the US. This after paying taxes and social security for a period of over 20 years. Watch out for those a--holes!!! The individual interrogating my wife could not speak English as well as my wife and I identified 50+ spelling mistakes in the documentation he issued her.

Pi--ed off, never to go back ex-American.

[BlackArtemis]

the 10 year visa is a tourist visa in a sense. She can for the next 10 years come and visit America for 30days or six months. Since we are only visiting this is great. But if you want to move there and get her a greencard and begin naturalization the K3 is the way to go.

It took two times for us to get the visa. The second time we has

Her passport and all the documents asked for

75,000 Baht in HER account

Her teacher's license

A letter from our work stating her salary and my salary

A copy of my Passport

A copy of my Thai work permit

A letter from my Father's medical doctor stating the reason we wanted to visit was because due to his health he is unable to fly and could not come to the wedding.

A letter from my state congressmen also inviting and restating the doctors note. This was also faxed ahead of time to the head of the CM consulate.

I also took her to Singapore to show that she has left and come back.

The first time she failed was because she was single (engaged), educated and spoke English a little too well for never leaving the country. (she has been studying for over 18 years, inter programs etc etc)

We were told it''s nearly impossible for single females to travel to America, Australia, Japan, and the U.K without a work or student visa :/

I suggest to write to you congressman and try to get an invite or something, I mean our tax dollars pay them, so get something back. It's kinda nice to have a letter with the heading "From the Congress of the United States of America"

up the road from the consulate is a little translation shop etc, they are a great help and even consult for free.

[thaihome]

As my wife and I are awaiting her October 3rd interview at the U.S. Embassy for a K3 Visa, this thread is of intrest to me. Reading that there is such a thing as a 10 year visa really intrests me. What kind of visa is that? I've retained a law firm in Bangkok to assist me with prenuptial agreement, marriage (married in Thailand) and visa application. They never mentioned a 10 year visa, only the K3 which is only good for 2 years.

After we married we started the paperwork for her visa in December of last year and "what a long, strange trip it's been"! Anyone who has done this understands the amount of documents and expense of filing fees involved. From what our lawyer tells us, the K3 visa will allow her time in the States to complete her Permanent Resident (Green Card) Application as well as mutiple entries into the U.S. for two years.

I've lived in Thailand for the past five years, but have kept my home in the States and she wants a chance at a better life there. It seems that we've gone through more paperwork than others I've read about and wonder if it's because I live here in Thailand instead of back at my home in the States.

Any advice from someone more knowledgable than me would be much apprecitated.

I'm curious as to why if you have lived in Thailand for 5 years you did not apply directly with the USCIS in Bangkok for the spouse immigrant (CR1 ?) visa. That only takes a couple of months (about a year faster than applying in the US) and she gets the green card on her first entry to the US.

TH

[jmurch]

the 10 year visa is a tourist visa in a sense. She can for the next 10 years come and visit America for 30days or six months. Since we are only visiting this is great. But if you want to move there and get her a greencard and begin naturalization the K3 is the way to go.

It took two times for us to get the visa. The second time we has

Her passport and all the documents asked for

75,000 Baht in HER account

Her teacher's license

A letter from our work stating her salary and my salary

A copy of my Passport

A copy of my Thai work permit

A letter from my Father's medical doctor stating the reason we wanted to visit was because due to his health he is unable to fly and could not come to the wedding.

A letter from my state congressmen also inviting and restating the doctors note. This was also faxed ahead of time to the head of the CM consulate.

I also took her to Singapore to show that she has left and come back.

The first time she failed was because she was single (engaged), educated and spoke English a little too well for never leaving the country. (she has been studying for over 18 years, inter programs etc etc)

We were told it''s nearly impossible for single females to travel to America, Australia, Japan, and the U.K without a work or student visa :/

I suggest to write to you congressman and try to get an invite or something, I mean our tax dollars pay them, so get something back. It's kinda nice to have a letter with the heading "From the Congress of the United States of America"

up the road from the consulate is a little translation shop etc, they are a great help and even consult for free.

My wife had all the papers you say. She had been to Malaysia, China and Australia with no problems but three different interviewers said no. They wouldn't give a reason except for "they didn't think she'd come back". I had a letter from my company requesting they issue her a visa so she could travel with me on my business trip to Houston. If she tried to ask why she couldn't get a visa they would just close the window.

John

[BlackArtemis]

Did you try on different days and times of the month? My wife went the second time at the begining of the month and said it seemed everyone was getting accepted.

And I agree, they are some of the rudest people who work there. My wife had proof of a house, car, 3 year steady job, and an ongoing education (masters). When I questioned them about that, they told me everyone has a house and a car...

[jmurch]

Did you try on different days and times of the month? My wife went the second time at the begining of the month and said it seemed everyone was getting accepted.

And I agree, they are some of the rudest people who work there. My wife had proof of a house, car, 3 year steady job, and an ongoing education (masters). When I questioned them about that, they told me everyone has a house and a car...

All I know is we used the pin number system they have which tells you when your appointment is. She went at different times and dates. How many Thais though have six million baht homes, two cars, a business, land, bank accounts and a nine year old daughter to come back to?

[BlackArtemis]

Did you try on different days and times of the month? My wife went the second time at the begining of the month and said it seemed everyone was getting accepted.

And I agree, they are some of the rudest people who work there. My wife had proof of a house, car, 3 year steady job, and an ongoing education (masters). When I questioned them about that, they told me everyone has a house and a car...

All I know is we used the pin number system they have which tells you when your appointment is. She went at different times and dates. How many Thais though have six million baht homes, two cars, a business, land, bank accounts and a nine year old daughter to come back to?

Wait, they denied even though her daughter was staying in Thailand? I would really suggest writing a letter and state that you feel you are being discriminated against and perhaps ask to be given the chance to try again in BKK. To these people interviewing they seem to get pissy, I don't know if jealousy gets in the way or what, but they seems to not give adequate reasons and as you stated before, shut the door in your face when asked.

[legag]

I don't understand my wife has tried three times to get a tourist visa to the states. The best excuse the interviewer could come up with after her presenting all her documents was " I don't think you'll come back". We not only have a six million baht home but a business, bank accounts, land and her nine year old daughter. If someone can tell me what we're doing wrong I'd appreciate it.

Thanks,

John

Something is up with your wife's doc./paper. Are you two married with paper? She has any jobs? Shouldn't have any prob. for tourist visa if you two are spouse. Most def. the officer smells some' aint right.

[legag]

WATCH OUT!!!!!!!

I accepted a position in Malaysia in 2001 cccompanied by my Thai wife who had resided in the US for 21 years paying social security and income tax for those years. We decided that she would not apply for citizenship because I wanted to use her for retirement purposes when I retired (stupid I know because Thailand allows dual citizenship). After two years of returning to the US on her green card, on her third trip she was pulled over by ICE (immigration and Customs Enforcement) and asked where she lived. The answer, Malaysia. Their answer, You are under arrest, we will let you go under your own recognisance (SIC?), but give us your green card. You are no longer authorized to live in the US. This after paying taxes and social security for a period of over 20 years. Watch out for those a--holes!!! The individual interrogating my wife could not speak English as well as my wife and I identified 50+ spelling mistakes in the documentation he issued her.

Pi--ed off, never to go back ex-American.

Get good lawyer and prepare to get your tax back!! This ain't FAIR

[AJARNJACK]

Reading about 'horror stories' at the U.S. Embassy concerning issuing visas is quite nerve wracking. With my wife's visa interview on the morning of October 3rd "just around the corner" we are not as sure as we were before about everything being okay. The the fact that one writer's wife was rejected twice is unbelievable, given the amount of security she has shown she has in Thailand.

Concerning one writers comments about why, if I've lived here almost five years, I hadn't filed for a CR1 Spouse visa: Although I've lived here that long, I only married a Thai lady last November. I too, questioned my Bangkok attorney why we weren't filing for the CR1 Immigrant visa instead of the K3 Non-Immigrant visa they had us file for. The explanation we got was that the CR1 visa was for couples married at least two years. If anyone knows something to the contrary, I'd appreciate hearing from you.

I've got a pension and have maintained a home in the States, she has a clean background with a college degree but no bank account. If that aint good enough we can always live comfortably here in Thailand.

[legag]

Reading about 'horror stories' at the U.S. Embassy concerning issuing visas is quite nerve wracking. With my wife's visa interview on the morning of October 3rd "just around the corner" we are not as sure as we were before about everything being okay. The the fact that one writer's wife was rejected twice is unbelievable, given the amount of security she has shown she has in Thailand.

Take a deep breath and tell you wife relax, attitude counts when it comes to interview. I am worried about your wife has not have any finacial statement or eve bank account for saving at all?

[jmurch]

Reading about 'horror stories' at the U.S. Embassy concerning issuing visas is quite nerve wracking. With my wife's visa interview on the morning of October 3rd "just around the corner" we are not as sure as we were before about everything being okay. The the fact that one writer's wife was rejected twice is unbelievable, given the amount of security she has shown she has in Thailand.

Take a deep breath and tell you wife relax, attitude counts when it comes to interview. I am worried about your wife has not have any finacial statement or eve bank account for saving at all?

My wife took a deep breath after the first and second interviews only to be told on the third one they weren't go to give her a visa. She did an attitude and that was she thought she wasn't good enough to go to America. My attitude is America isn't good enough for her and I'm an American. The only reason for her going is to meet my family and friends. A have little use for people that are supposed to represent the "greatest" nation in the world but can only see through rose colored glasses. My wife presented bank accounts, a letter from her job, proof of owning land and a house plus her daughter's birth certificate who lives with us. The letter from the bank showed her with a steady income. I wrote a letter to the consulate only to be told by him in a letter(since he wouldn't see me) that he couldn't see anything to overturn the interviewer's decision.

[AJARNJACK]

I realize that being at the mercy of any government's bias is a threatening situation. Dealing with a small Thai immigration office up-country serves up the same type of public servants that the U.S. does. They are complete and seperate "kingdoms" with their own interpitations of the laws. They are the masters of your fate when dealing in their "kingdom" and most of the time their superiors support them. I understand this better than most, having worked for the U.S. Postal Service for twenty years. It was a small, very rural office and I happend to get on the "bad side" of one of the locals that worked there for years. The postmaster supported this person because he was unable to do all the paperwork himself and needed their assistance. That was early in my career there and I endured unbelievable harrasment, but being that it was one of the few jobs that offered a pension in that area, I endured it until I could finally retire. I used the union contract to defend me against this predjudice, but the postmaster always interpited it differently than I did and so I had to always go through a long grievance procedure.

When I hear about similar bureacrats working at the U.S. Embassy in Bangkok, I picture that abusive long term postal worker and a postmaster who turned a 'blind eye'. We are stuck with them in charge of our fate and our only hope is finding someone in a superior positition to give us a fair deal if they won't. If anyone in this forum knows of such an individual, it would be much appreciated if you shared their name with us.

My wife's visa application is a K3 so that she'll be able to live in our home in the States with me. Hopefully the fact that I do have a home there to return to instead of just taking her there to visit will be favorable for her application. The fact that she doesn't have any bank account is very common for an up-country rural Thai that lived with her family before marriage. At 30 years old and an having earned a college degree, when she married me the only belonging she brought to our household was a bag of cloths! She worked baking 'kanome jeeb' with her sister and all of the money went to her family's needs. I did however, include in a form she submitted, the money I have in a bank account here as money she has - since we are legally married. There is another requirment to show receipts for items I'd purchased for her. In the five years I've lived in Thailand the only places which gave me a receipt were large stores, or hotels in the big cities or 7/11s. Thais don't want to pay taxes and don't want any records, but the U.S. government requirments for receipts don't acknowledge this fact either.

[daveh]

WATCH OUT!!!!!!!

I accepted a position in Malaysia in 2001 cccompanied by my Thai wife who had resided in the US for 21 years paying social security and income tax for those years. We decided that she would not apply for citizenship because I wanted to use her for retirement purposes when I retired (stupid I know because Thailand allows dual citizenship). After two years of returning to the US on her green card, on her third trip she was pulled over by ICE (immigration and Customs Enforcement) and asked where she lived. The answer, Malaysia. Their answer, You are under arrest, we will let you go under your own recognisance (SIC?), but give us your green card. You are no longer authorized to live in the US. This after paying taxes and social security for a period of over 20 years. Watch out for those a--holes!!! The individual interrogating my wife could not speak English as well as my wife and I identified 50+ spelling mistakes in the documentation he issued her.

Pi--ed off, never to go back ex-American.

I'm surprised that after living in the US for so long as a PR, you never mentioned to your wife that she was not allowed to reside in another country and retain her permanent residence. I'm sorry that this happened to your wife, but they don't keep this requirement a secret at all. I'd be surprised at any other outcome given this information.

[thaihome]

...Concerning one writers comments about why, if I've lived here almost five years, I hadn't filed for a CR1 Spouse visa: Although I've lived here that long, I only married a Thai lady last November. I too, questioned my Bangkok attorney why we weren't filing for the CR1 Immigrant visa instead of the K3 Non-Immigrant visa they had us file for. The explanation we got was that the CR1 visa was for couples married at least two years. If anyone knows something to the contrary, I'd appreciate hearing from you.

...

You need to fire your Bangkok attorney.

Have personal knowledge of a couple that registered marriage in Thailand on Wednesday, submitted the I-130 to USCIS in Bangkok on Friday, had interview 6 weeks later and was issued visa 5 days later. 2 months, start to finish. This was within the past 4 months, so very current information. Oh, and this was done without an attorney as it was simply filing out forms and gathering paperwork, stuff the attorney would have you do anyway...

The 2 year thing is about if she gets a conditional green card or not when she enters the US.

TH

[thaihome]

WATCH OUT!!!!!!!

I accepted a position in Malaysia in 2001 cccompanied by my Thai wife who had resided in the US for 21 years paying social security and income tax for those years. We decided that she would not apply for citizenship because I wanted to use her for retirement purposes when I retired (stupid I know because Thailand allows dual citizenship). After two years of returning to the US on her green card, on her third trip she was pulled over by ICE (immigration and Customs Enforcement) and asked where she lived. The answer, Malaysia. Their answer, You are under arrest, we will let you go under your own recognisance (SIC?), but give us your green card. You are no longer authorized to live in the US. This after paying taxes and social security for a period of over 20 years. Watch out for those a--holes!!! The individual interrogating my wife could not speak English as well as my wife and I identified 50+ spelling mistakes in the documentation he issued her.

Pi--ed off, never to go back ex-American.

Get good lawyer and prepare to get your tax back!! This ain't FAIR

Appears she failed to obtain the required re-entry permit that would have allowed her to stay out of the country while you were working overseas. Hate to be harsh, but it is your fault for not knowing the rules, not the people whose job it is to enforce them.

TH

Edited September 19, 2007 by thaihome

[AJARNJACK]

Thank you, TH, for your comment. Getting married to a foreign national and wanting a prenuptial agreement that was binding in both my country and hers was the reason I searched for an international law firm to make sure it was done correctly. I chose Siam Legal because of their web site information. They also offered a money back guarantee if she didn't get a visa to the States. I was told from the beginning that the K3 Visa was the best option, but that it could take from 6 - 8 months. They never mentioned the CR1 Immigrant Visa and they knew exactly what our intentions were. Why they didn't is disturbing, because now we'll have to pay more filing fees and go through more paperwork once again after we move back to the States. It has now been 9 months and her interview is scheduled on October 3rd. The lawyer assisting us said that she was surprised how quickly everything processed! There was a long waiting period between the Dept. of Homeland Security's review and the National Visa Center's processing.

It is truly amazing to hear that the couple you mentioned had everything accomplished within 2 months! You are correct that we did have to fill out forms ourselves and gather the required paperwork ourselves, but the benefit was that we lived in Southern Thailand and going to Bangkok to run around and get things done would be time consuming (I was teaching at the time) and expensive for travel, room and board. The lawyer accomplished all that for us and had contacts at the U.S. Embassy and Thai government offices to expidite things (supposedly).

It's too late to do anything but "take the ride" that we already paid for to the law firm we retained. Others reading this should take your information into consideration if they plan go through the visa process for their spouse. Living in Bangkok would make it easier to accomplish this yourself too.

[thaihome]

... I chose Siam Legal because of their web site information. They also offered a money back guarantee if she didn't get a visa to the States. I was told from the beginning that the K3 Visa was the best option, but that it could take from 6 - 8 months. They never mentioned the CR1 Immigrant Visa and they knew exactly what our intentions were. Why they didn't is disturbing, because now we'll have to pay more filing fees and go through more paperwork once again after we move back to the States. It has now been 9 months and her interview is scheduled on October 3rd. The lawyer assisting us said that she was surprised how quickly everything processed! There was a long waiting period between the Dept. of Homeland Security's review and the National Visa Center's processing.

It is truly amazing to hear that the couple you mentioned had everything accomplished within 2 months! You are correct that we did have to fill out forms ourselves and gather the required paperwork ourselves, but the benefit was that we lived in Southern Thailand and going to Bangkok to run around and get things done would be time consuming (I was teaching at the time) and expensive for travel, room and board. The lawyer accomplished all that for us and had contacts at the U.S. Embassy and Thai government offices to expidite things (supposedly).

It's too late to do anything but "take the ride" that we already paid for to the law firm we retained. Others reading this should take your information into consideration if they plan go through the visa process for their spouse. Living in Bangkok would make it easier to accomplish this yourself too.

Siam Legal is a member and advertiser here and post what are usually informative and insightful analyses. I wonder if they would respond as to why you were not advised to submit an I-130 petition to the Bangkok USCIS office and instead went through a US service center. The only reason I can think of is a problem proving your residency in Thailand.

Most people don’t know it but the KL embassy will do Direct Consular Filings (DCF) of the I-130 without proving residency in Malaysia. Living in Southern Thailand, KL might have even been closer then Bangkok.

But as you say, it is too late for you, but I hope that others will do some work on their own and not expect, just because they are paying someone who is suppose to know, that person knows all the routes available.

TH

Edited September 22, 2007 by thaihome